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Pathfinder Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous - Enhanced Edition - now with A Dance of Masks epilogue DLC

Lambach

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So I am about to start my first playthrough of this. What is the best mythic path content wise? Specially for a first playthrough.

No joke, you can think what I'm about to say is total cringe if you want to, but I would advise you to get on YouTube and listen to every Mythic Path music theme and decide which one to go with based on what clicks most with you there. :M

That Dimitry guy did an absolutely fucking superb job of capturing what each Path is about through the themes he made, it's unreal.
 

scytheavatar

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Sep 22, 2016
Messages
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So without Elemental Barrage what will be the best meta for melee characters in unfair? Thinking of starting my first unfair playthrough as a melee Oracle, but it seems it will be hard to play it without the DPS.
 

Rhobar121

Scholar
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Sep 22, 2022
Messages
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So without Elemental Barrage what will be the best meta for melee characters in unfair? Thinking of starting my first unfair playthrough as a melee Oracle, but it seems it will be hard to play it without the DPS.
If you go oracle you probably choose an angel.
I will just paste my compilation that I posted on reddit once. The only difference is that you should choose something else instead of Seize the Moment. Due to the mechanics implementation by Owlcat, it is quite pointless if you are not playing as Azata with feats sharing.
It may seem like a low AC at the start of the game is a bad idea, but you should always be behind the tank.
Not that the extra AC on Unfair would help you in any way.

My Oracle / Angel build on Unfair was as follows
Feats:
  1. Shake It Off (I recommend this feat for all stupid AOE stuns that the game loves to use)
  2. Combat Reflexes
  3. Seize the Moment
  4. Outflank (Important)
  5. Improved Initiative
  6. Dazzling Display (Never use only needed for Shatter Defenses)
  7. Shatter Defenses (Important)
  8. Metamagic: Extends Spells (Very Important)
  9. Power Attack
  10. Metamagic: Heighten Spells (Allows you to free up valuable slots for level 6 and 8 spells)
As a race I chose Aasimar / Angel-Kin for +2 strength and charisma.
Initial Statistics:
  1. 17 Strength
  2. 8 Dexterity
  3. 14 Constitiution
  4. 8 Intelligence
  5. 10 Wisdom
  6. 20 Charisma
On level 4, I recommend that you upgrade your strength to get an additional +1 bonus and the rest into charisma.

As a curse, I recommend Powerless Prophecy. Stagger is annoying at first, but thanks to the freedom of movement spell, you are immune to it. Which means you get all the bonuses for free. In act 3 you can find shoes that give you freedom of movement permanently. Both Uncanny Dodge and the additional initiative bonus are really good (because it's free).

I recommend Battle as the first mystery, so you will be useful in the early game. As a revelation, the first two choices are simple:
  1. Skill at Arms
  2. Weapon Mastery
The others depend on you. You can choose second mastery nature to unlock pet and nature whispers. One note if you want to play with heavy armor you can ignore nature whispers for quite some time.Pet is also optional personally I don't like having more than one pet because they love to get stuck in rtwp mode.Earlier I gave a pet Seelah so I missed it on the main character.Generally you can choose what you want in any order it will not matter much. I personally chose:
  1. War Sight
  2. Nature's Whispers
  3. Friend to Animals
  4. Iron Skin (I had no idea what to choose and I still didn't want a pet)
As for mythic power, you have little choice. As a bonus feat, always choose the additional Mythic Ability.You should have all Abundant Casting and Second Mystery first (in the order you prefer) and then select Enduring Spells. Alternatively, you can also choose Last Stand early.

As a weapon, Glaive will be best only because of the free +1 damage and attack you can get in Shield Maze.Additionally, you can easily get good copies, I personally recommend Soulshear or Banshee's Heart. Soulshear is the easiest one to get - you get it for the Act 2 boss. The demons it summons are a pretty good shield.

If you have Seelah in your team as a paladin, you can get ridiculously high saves with Bestow Grace (also Mark of Justice is really good)

Honestly, it was even a little too easy. By selecting Battle, the character was quite useful in terms of damage. The extra +1 attack bonus actually makes a difference at low levels. In fact, the only hard fight was the mission with Regill (but it's always hard)
 

Stoned Ape

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So without Elemental Barrage what will be the best meta for melee characters in unfair? Thinking of starting my first unfair playthrough as a melee Oracle, but it seems it will be hard to play it without the DPS.
If you go Oracle/Angel you'll still end up so powerful it won't really matter. If you focus on melee you have Sword of Heaven to help you cut anything nasty up, and numerous effective buff spells which should really help you out.

If you get into trouble, you can always cast Bolt of Justice or Storm of Justice which will dig you out of any holes you fall into late game if melee isn't cutting it. You don't need to invest in DC or spell penetration for them to cause absolutely ridiculous damage (if you pick up empower/maximize rods), either.

I'd take Nature and Battle mysteries, focus on your melee feats, make sure you have good STR & CHA, and you'll be absolutely fine.
 

ArchAngel

Arcane
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Desiderius

Found your egg, Robinett, you sneaky bastard
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Insert Title Here Pathfinder: Wrath
Getting 5d6 extra damage per enemy every two rounds is absolutely not worth spending a Mythic pick on.
Yes, that is almost always the case. Damage is rarely the limiting factor. This isn't a damage-racing MMO with million-HP bulletsponges. By the time you hit 5d6 (Mythic 5) damage shouldn't be an issue unless you're doing something really wrong. Endgame theorycrafting is the bane of "build" design.

Leading strike is one attack per turn
Not in RTwP it isn't. You can interlace attacks and AoOs and get as many as you have attacks on multiple characters. Reg is particularly good at this, with Lann cashing them in.

What the fuck this even means? You what, have no impulse control when you choose character class?
And besides, EA is one of those fiddly classes that could hit some heights in the second part of the game on MR 4+, but most of the time in early chapters will pale in comparison next to zero-imagination pure Fighter doing the same shooting thing.

I would get it if someone blamed Sohei for being bonkers - Rapid Shot working with his Flurry indeed seems to be a bug and he gains full pet and weapon training while not sacrificing anything useful for them.
Nobody likes to nerf themselves, which is why you clowns are always chasing one weird trick instead of just playing your classes. As for EA, let's just say you've only scratched the surface of what it can do, which is another problem with one-weird-trickism in that nobody figures that stuff out so gameplay stagnates. It's the one class where Elemental Barrage shines the most because it has to tools to trigger it on tough targets (with the Arcana abilities) while also spreading it out to AoE (Cleaving Shot) as needed. The combination of Weapon Enchants and Spellstrike lets it apply the most Elements in the fastest time as well.

Sohei... isn't bonkers. It doesn't get Point-Blank Master so you're either triggering a bunch of AoOs if you're trying to use Rapid Shot or your Mount isn't in combat. The Weapon Training doesn't progress (unlike Fighter Weapon Training), it just gives you added Weapon Groups you can Flurry with and I know you clowns hate using more than one weapon so that will be useless for you too. If you've played other Monks I think you'll discover that you're giving up quite a bit. For some reason it doesn't even get Monk Weapon proficiencies, though it can get Weapon Training in them :negative:

You wouldn't be so stuck in theorycrafting hell if you didn't get fall for the "objectively superior" bullshit and actually played some of these classes yourselves.
 
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Desiderius

Found your egg, Robinett, you sneaky bastard
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Insert Title Here Pathfinder: Wrath
Like abused dogs still feeling the (phantom) whip after you've found a new master.

:nocountryforshitposters:

Nigger, it's a fucking video-game, calm your crippling autism, ffs.
And you guys grew up on phone game influenced MMOs from lazy devs who only gave you a couple good abilities with the rest being garbage.

That isn't this ruleset, nor this game.
 

Lambach

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And you guys grew up on phone game influenced MMOs from lazy devs who only gave you a couple good abilities with the rest being garbage.

Funny you should say that, because WotR devs also gave us 30% good abilities and 70% garbage that is either extremely situational at best (as in, it's only useful once or twice throughout an 100+ hour game) or just completely worthless garbage not worth paying attention to at worst. :eek:

Go on King, tell us how you made the Witch offensive Hexes like Slumber or Misfortune viable at level 12+. Or how you made Prestige Classes like Duelist worthwhile, compared to literally any other basic or Prestige Class. Or what's the benefit of using a Mythic Feat to make chugging a Potion a Swift Action (because literally nobody with an IQ above 30 relies on Potions mid-combat in this game, specially not at mid or late Levels).

Come on, you big-brained 300-IQ Chad, tell us all about your secret strategies that make all of that retarded garbage shoved in there by Owlcat/Paizo actually worth picking. What makes your brain so big and smart that it can see the use in objectively garbage, bullshit, useless Abilities that 99,9% of players can't see.

Go on, Pathfinder Jesus, please, we're all waiting with baited breath for you to enlighten us. You absolute fucking retard. :)
 

Daidre

Arcane
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Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture
The Weapon Training doesn't progress (unlike Fighter Weapon Training), it just gives you added Weapon Groups you can Flurry with and I know you clowns hate using more than one weapon so that will be useless for you too.
Sohei's Weapon Training progress as it should. But Vek broke it with one of his components in TT Tweaks, I've wanted to report this but forgot. You once again have absolutely no idea what are you talking about.

And only clown here is you - one who makes shitton of absurd assumptions about other people's playstyles while struggling "oh I can't rest spam need cook thousand of pots!" on Core in Rogue-like. I do not know how other people play it, but my usual approach is to take couple of solid performers into the party and fill out other 4 with some weird build/archetypes I hadn't tried yet. Mostly, they turn out to be as subpar as I expected them to be next to the best archetypes, but there are some pleasant discoveries here and there.
 
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LannTheStupid

Товарищ
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Pathfinder: Wrath
All of that, actually, begs the question: I was going to build Camellia as an Elemental Barrage master; now what is the best (if any) second spirit for a melee Spirit Hunter with a rapier? Will it be Air? Or is it better to forget about the second spirit and concentrate on crits from the rapier and Abundant Casting for more buffs and Magical Vestments?
 

Lambach

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And only clown here is you - one who makes shitton of absurd assumptions about other people's playstyles while struggling "oh I can't rest spam need cook thousand of pots!" on Core in Rogue-like.

I used to value that moron's opinion because, I admit, I was bamboozled by the way he would assert himself and his brain-dead bullshit opinions as absolute truth. I figured "well, he seems quite confident, he must know what's he talking about".

Turns out, he's literally retarded and 95% of things he says are abject dogshit.

All it took was for me to try things out myself, and I very quickly realized how utterly full of shit that mongoloid is and how much he likes to to suck his own micro-cock, with nothing substantial to show for it.

Tl;DR, if you want actually worthwhile advice, ask Haplo for it and tell Desiderius to suck your dick.
 

ArchAngel

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Messages
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And you guys grew up on phone game influenced MMOs from lazy devs who only gave you a couple good abilities with the rest being garbage.

Funny you should say that, because WotR devs also gave us 30% good abilities and 70% garbage that is either extremely situational at best (as in, it's only useful once or twice throughout an 100+ hour game) or just completely worthless garbage not worth paying attention to at worst. :eek:

Go on King, tell us how you made the Witch offensive Hexes like Slumber or Misfortune viable at level 12+. Or how you made Prestige Classes like Duelist worthwhile, compared to literally any other basic or Prestige Class. Or what's the benefit of using a Mythic Feat to make chugging a Potion a Swift Action (because literally nobody with an IQ above 30 relies on Potions mid-combat in this game, specially not at mid or late Levels).

Come on, you big-brained 300-IQ Chad, tell us all about your secret strategies that make all of that retarded garbage shoved in there by Owlcat/Paizo actually worth picking. What makes your brain so big and smart that it can see the use in objectively garbage, bullshit, useless Abilities that 99,9% of players can't see.

Go on, Pathfinder Jesus, please, we're all waiting with baited breath for you to enlighten us. You absolute fucking retard. :)
I could see Vivi with that ability that makes potions used be his level using swift potions to apply different buffs during combat or get some "free" healing during combat. But it is not some ability that is useful generally.
 

Lambach

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Wait, you guys think that providing a choice to spend an entire Mythic Feat on slightly speeding up an action during combat that 99.999% of players will never use anyway is bad design? You think that introducing a choice between this and something like, oh I don't fucking know, Mythic Power Attack that 99.99999% of players will chose because the alternative is useless garbage is anything other than a representation of perfect, brilliant, flawless 300-IQ CRPG design?

Well, if you think that, I'm sorry to tell you, you're just a dirty pleb and you don't know what you're talking about. So spoketh a 40-IQ non-functioning autist who unironically thought this sentence actually meant.... anything at all:

It kills variety, it's not tons until tons are irrelevant, and people are completely oblivious to the massive opportunity costs of the "easy" damage they're trying to get, as if damage were the thing those "builds" were missing in the first place.
 

Daidre

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Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture
All of that, actually, begs the question: I was going to build Camellia as an Elemental Barrage master; now what is the best (if any) second spirit for a melee Spirit Hunter with a rapier? Will it be Air? Or is it better to forget about the second spirit and concentrate on crits from the rapier and Abundant Casting for more buffs and Magical Vestments?
She can't slot her Spirit's spells into her ordinary spell slots anyway, so she can't have more than one Magical Vestment, but she can get the second cast of Magical Vestment from restoring it with Object Bond.
Air is my choice too for Air Barrier and one Hex that gives 50% miss chance for range attacks. Nature is nice for pet (too late) and 1d6 sound, that is least resisted element. Anyway, she is lvl 1 and got excellent DEX, so multiclassing her is always an option. And she is still one, if not the most, competent tank with Hexes and High Crit Range weapon even if she stays a pure shaman.

Well, as some people have already mentioned, I have a huge dilemma too each time when I need to fill all 5 Mythic Abilities with something not completely useless on the non-spellcasting melees.
 

ArchAngel

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All of that, actually, begs the question: I was going to build Camellia as an Elemental Barrage master; now what is the best (if any) second spirit for a melee Spirit Hunter with a rapier? Will it be Air? Or is it better to forget about the second spirit and concentrate on crits from the rapier and Abundant Casting for more buffs and Magical Vestments?
She can't slot her Spirit's spells into her ordinary spell slots anyway, so she can't have more than one Magical Vestment, but she can get the second cast of Magical Vestment from restoring it with Object Bond.
Air is my choice too for Air Barrier and one Hex that gives 50% miss chance for range attacks. Nature is nice for pet (too late) and 1d6 sound, that is least resisted element. Anyway, she is lvl 1 and got excellent DEX, so multiclassing her is always an option. And she is still one, if not the most, competent tank with Hexes and High Crit Range weapon even if she stays a pure shaman.

Well, as some people have already mentioned, I have a huge dilemma too each time when I need to fill all 5 Mythic Abilities with something not completely useless on the non-spellcasting melees.
I usually give Camelia Heighten Spell and then slot Magical Vestment in higher level domain slots, they are mostly useless anyways with spells from those levels. But now that it no longer stacks with standard enchantment of armor/shields that spell has lost a lot of usefulness and it can mostly be ignored.
 

Stoned Ape

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But now that it no longer stacks with standard enchantment of armor/shields that spell has lost a lot of usefulness and it can mostly be ignored.
With each patch Owlcat seem intent on patching viable things out and breaking half of what's left.

EDIT: For example, after installing the patch when playing my 4th run expansion Last Azlanti run, none of my divine casters were able to cast any spells on the party any more. Run totally bricked. It was fine before the patch.
 
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Desiderius

Found your egg, Robinett, you sneaky bastard
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Insert Title Here Pathfinder: Wrath
All of that, actually, begs the question: I was going to build Camellia as an Elemental Barrage master; now what is the best (if any) second spirit for a melee Spirit Hunter with a rapier? Will it be Air? Or is it better to forget about the second spirit and concentrate on crits from the rapier and Abundant Casting for more buffs and Magical Vestments?
Life is handy for Drezen (early rez and resto plus Channeling) if you’re going to lose her soon. Likewise Frost for big Snowballs on Devarra. The one that gives you Metal Curse and free Trips (I think) is good for long haul.

This is the kind if thing I’m talking about tho - Second Spirit was always better for Cam (she already does a ton of damage and triggers crit chains with Keen Rapier) but people were too obsessed with chasing memes to even look at it.

Call me a poopyhead all you want but I’m the only one who’s actually tried any of this stuff and I’m telling you everything you say you want is already there if you only have the courage to think for yourself and try it.
 

Desiderius

Found your egg, Robinett, you sneaky bastard
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It’s not me or Haplo lol, half of what I’m doing I learned from Haplo. If you apply what he’s doing to multiple attackers that gives you more than enough damage which lets you pick up other abilities instead of blowing your wad eking out a few d6 here and there like InEffective.
 

Desiderius

Found your egg, Robinett, you sneaky bastard
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Insert Title Here Pathfinder: Wrath
The Weapon Training doesn't progress (unlike Fighter Weapon Training), it just gives you added Weapon Groups you can Flurry with and I know you clowns hate using more than one weapon so that will be useless for you too.
Sohei's Weapon Training progress as it should. But Vek broke it with one of his components in TT Tweaks, I've wanted to report this but forgot. You once again have absolutely no idea what are you talking about.

And only clown here is you - one who makes shitton of absurd assumptions about other people's playstyles while struggling "oh I can't rest spam need cook thousand of pots!" on Core in Rogue-like. I do not know how other people play it, but my usual approach is to take couple of solid performers into the party and fill out other 4 with some weird build/archetypes I hadn't tried yet. Mostly, they turn out to be as subpar as I expected them to be next to the best archetypes, but there are some pleasant discoveries here and there.
Same. I’m obviously pulling your chain. You try shit and most of it doesn’t work that great for whatever reason (Vek in this case, glad to hear it works on vanilla, though you still miss out on Advanced WT) but it’s worth it to find the stuff that does.

People get bullied into trying to cram Barrage or whatever into classes entirely unsuited for it so I go over the top in the other direction so they’ll get some practice reacting with the proper revulsion to the con(fidence) men who got them stuck on some meme in the first place.

Looks like it worked.

As for Sohei what do you do for PBM? Also currently playing Nomad and not sure what I think of losing Charge on Ranged Mounted.
 

IllusiveBrian

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Apr 26, 2022
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Does Elemental Assessor trigger EB 3 times? Maybe a character running that could be good with the tailwind that gives crits on 17 for rays.
 

LannTheStupid

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All of that, actually, begs the question: I was going to build Camellia as an Elemental Barrage master; now what is the best (if any) second spirit for a melee Spirit Hunter with a rapier? Will it be Air? Or is it better to forget about the second spirit and concentrate on crits from the rapier and Abundant Casting for more buffs and Magical Vestments?
Life is handy for Drezen (early rez and resto plus Channeling) if you’re going to lose her soon. Likewise Frost for big Snowballs on Devarra. The one that gives you Metal Curse and free Trips (I think) is good for long haul.

This is the kind if thing I’m talking about tho - Second Spirit was always better for Cam (she already does a ton of damage and triggers crit chains with Keen Rapier) but people were too obsessed with chasing memes to even look at it.

Call me a poopyhead all you want but I’m the only one who’s actually tried any of this stuff and I’m telling you everything you say you want is already there if you only have the courage to think for yourself and try it.
See, Mr. Desiderius, you wrote slightly more than Ms. Daidre - but comparing to her you have only one paragraph that is actually useful for me. I understand inspiration for the people, pointing to my stupidity and stuff - but it is really inconvenient way to answer specific questions.

Obviously, when I am asking for a build it means that I do not want to think about it. No amount of your inspiring speeches can sway me if I want a ready-to-use answer which I don't want to look for myself.
 

Desiderius

Found your egg, Robinett, you sneaky bastard
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Insert Title Here Pathfinder: Wrath
Wait, you guys think that providing a choice to spend an entire Mythic Feat on slightly speeding up an action during combat that 99.999% of players will never use anyway is bad design? You think that introducing a choice between this and something like, oh I don't fucking know, Mythic Power Attack that 99.99999% of players will chose because the alternative is useless garbage is anything other than a representation of perfect, brilliant, flawless 300-IQ CRPG design?

Well, if you think that, I'm sorry to tell you, you're just a dirty pleb and you don't know what you're talking about. So spoketh a 40-IQ non-functioning autist who unironically thought this sentence actually meant.... anything at all:

It kills variety, it's not tons until tons are irrelevant, and people are completely oblivious to the massive opportunity costs of the "easy" damage they're trying to get, as if damage were the thing those "builds" were missing in the first place.
I’ll break down specific cases for you tonight. Mythic PA suffers from the same problem as other damage-only abilities like Barrage but like Barrage it can be good for classes that are already built around PA that are leaning heavily on a big 2H for damage output. Not my thing but I’m all for encouraging people to explore multiple angles of attack.

Swift pots isn’t something I’ve looked at yet.

There are other great Mythics you haven’t mentioned and if you play TTT and Dark Codex there’s even more.
 

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