Eternity Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire + DLC Thread - now with turn-based combat!

[Darth Roxor]

i see grunker has discovered the wonders of safav hamon

 

[AwesomeButton]

Llengrath in PoE1

I remember I beat this one on PotD and made a thread about that here, but it was in large part abusing the AI's targeting logic.

 

[Grunker]

I guess I forgive him since he was very helpful when I agonized over party creation

Llengrath in PoE1

I remember I beat this one on PotD and made a thread about that here, but it was in large part abusing the AI's targeting logic.

Well you got to that point, so kudos for that. I gave up. Might talk myself into beating it with the Bleakwalker playthrough I'm doing when I next pick up the game.

 

[111111111]

I hope in the third dlc Minolleta is a smoking hot babe that needs the help of the watcher to deal with all the old farty wizards.

Would be a nice change of pace from all the grandpas and grandmas and weird alien characters in POE.

 

[Safav Hamon]

I didn't call it unfair. I called it stupid and poorly designed.

All I'm saying is that it's stupid to complain about enemies having too high stats when you admit to being underleveled. That's just how RPGs work.

That's the final thing I'll say on the issue, as I don't see it going anywhere.

 

[AwesomeButton]

I hope in the third dlc Minolleta is a smoking hot babe that needs the help of the watcher to deal with all the old farty wizards.

Would be a nice change of pace from all the grandpas and grandmas and weird alien characters in POE.

I have a vague memory that Minoletta is a granny, but I can't remember where in PoE it was mentioned, if it was. In any case, her being a granny will not prohibit some people...

 

[Grunker]

I do understand your argument about the fights not being strategically challenging enough, but I don't understand complaining about enemy stats being too high when you admit to being underlevelled. That's just how RPGs work.

That's the final thing I'll say on the topic though, as I don't see it going anywhere.

FFS it's not about stats being too high. It's about it all being frontloaded on defense and not offense/high-level abilities/etc. Look, it's really simple:

How it should be: enemy is overleveled so I either can't win or have to work REALLY hard to win.

How it is: I win even if I nearly don't do anything but auto-attack but have to wait a longer period of time before that happens relative to if I was higher level.

 

[Grunker]

I hope in the third dlc Minolleta is a smoking hot babe that needs the help of the watcher to deal with all the old farty wizards.

Would be a nice change of pace from all the grandpas and grandmas and weird alien characters in POE.

I have a vague memory that Minoletta is a granny, but I can't remember where in PoE it was mentioned, if it was. In any case, her being a granny will not prohibit some people...

Is there any detailed info on the DLC? I'm really hoping it's some oldschool D&D stuff like Crägholdt.

 

[111111111]

I hope in the third dlc Minolleta is a smoking hot babe that needs the help of the watcher to deal with all the old farty wizards.

Would be a nice change of pace from all the grandpas and grandmas and weird alien characters in POE.

I have a vague memory that Minoletta is a granny, but I can't remember where in PoE it was mentioned, if it was. In any case, her being a granny will not prohibit some people...

Unlucky..

And Berkena the only young wizard that was supposedly powerful is dead( besides aloth and of course yourself).

 

[Safav Hamon]

How it should be: enemy is overleveled so I either can't win or have to work REALLY hard to win.

How it is: I win even if I nearly don't do anything but auto-attack but have to wait a longer period of time before that happens relative to if I was higher level.

Then why rage quit on the final boss if you are capable of winning? That's where you lose me.

If the issue is your party not having enough penetration or damage, there are many synergies that make short work of the boss at low levels. The three allies can do it quickly themselves.

 

[Grunker]

I'm not talking about the final boss, I'm talking about the general encounter-design of the expansion. Which you know, but again, it's easier talking about the boss because as I can't take it down, you're gonna stick to that.

When I beat it in two levels and come back with the exact same argument, I wonder what your excuse is going to be then...

 

[FreeKaner]

It's just the balance of Sawyer. Because the target is high in defences it had to be low on in offence, because we are playing a MOBA.

 

[111111111]

It's just the balance of Sawyer. Because the target is high in defences it had to be low on in offence, because we are playing a MOBA.

How ironic when even mobas don't adhere to this philosophy.

 

[Grunker]

It's just the balance of Sawyer. Because the target is high in defences it had to be low on in offence, because we are playing a MOBA.

1. That's not how MOBA's work
2. That's not how PoE1 or Deadfire work, hence why I'm criticizing the expansion for having worse design relative to the rest of the game

 

[Safav Hamon]

Grunker, you specifically said that enemies (not just the boss) have too high defenses, and then conceded that you're below the recommended level with an unoptimized party.

We both agree there is a problem with encounters not being challenging enough in the DLC. The problem however isn't with high level enemies having high level stats. That's how it should be in an RPG.

 

[FreeKaner]

It's just the balance of Sawyer. Because the target is high in defences it had to be low on in offence, because we are playing a MOBA.

1. That's not how MOBA's work
2. That's not how PoE1 or Deadfire work, hence why I'm criticizing the expansion for having worse design relative to the rest of the game

My friend, because of arguing with Safav Hamon your perception seems to be impaired. I was being sarcastic.

How ironic when even mobas don't adhere to this philosophy.

It's MOBA philosophy in broadstrokes. That's the every individual character needs to be balanced self-consistently and for its role, rather than you know balancing whole encounters against possible party compositions.

 

[Grunker]

Grunker, you specifically said that enemies (not just the boss) have too high defenses, and then conceded that you're below the recommended level with an unoptimized party.

We both agree there is a problem with encounters not being challenging enough in the DLC. The problem however isn't with high level enemies having high level stats. That's how it should be in an RPG.

No, you still don't seem to get it. Somehow. If an encounter is too hard for you either because you are underleveled, undergeared, underbuilt or just shit, the encounter should challenge or beat you. Not just take longer to beat but pose the exact same amount of challenge: none.

Now, I'm not sure why I'm still trying, because despite this point being parodically simple you still don't seem to have grasped it. Even though that's how most of PoE encounter design works.

 

[AwesomeButton]

If an encounter is too hard for you either because you are underleveled, undergeared, underbuilt or just shit, the encounter should challenge or beat you. Not just take longer to beat but pose the exact same amount of challenge: none.

I had a similar experience with the "Soul Collector" when I was transported to Rymrgand's realm as part of a quest in the base game. I was level 8 or 9, I took like 4 attempts until I managed to kill him by using every cheese I could come up with. It didn't feel satisfying, but judging by these attempts, I think I was at the bare minimum of Accuracy/HP levels where it was realistically plausible that I could beat him. I was underleveled and I should have been killed, like I was until I managed to cheese- and luck out enough to win. So, I can say that yes, when I'm not up to the encounter it does challenge and beat me.

 

[Prime Junta]

White March was excellent. Better than excellent. Downright fantastic, outshining the main game by A LOT. Beast of Winter... is not. It's not bad, it's just decidedly average and a clear downgrade on the main game.

I liked the writing in BoW more than most of the main game though. It was actually funny in places, and it opened up some of the back story without resorting to massive "let me tell you about my mother" text dumps.

The fights, not so much. It was a let-down.

Edit (caught up with the rest of the thread):

- the expansions weren't designed by Sawyer and it shows, especially in the boss fight designs
- PotD in general needs another going-over, the stat bloat really isn't working out esp. with the PEN mechanic: some of the tougher fights become incredibly grindy because of the very high defences all around
- BoW is a particularly bad offender; in the base game only the Sunken Whatsits is similar and it's not quite as bad

I did one playthrough at PotD and one or two at Hard, and I enjoyed Hard more. I wished it had been a bit harder, but I really did not like the slow tedious grinds PotD introduced with the stat bloat. If I ever do another run it'll be at Hard but with a squishy party: that'll help keep things tense(r) without getting into grinds.

 

[AwesomeButton]

I did one playthrough at PotD and one or two at Hard, and I enjoyed Hard more

Same here, but gods' challenges are only possible on PotD. I wish I could have numbers of enemies from Hard with the defenses and armor buffs from PotD.

 

[Prime Junta]

I did one playthrough at PotD and one or two at Hard, and I enjoyed Hard more

Same here, but gods' challenges are only possible on PotD. I wish I could have numbers of enemies from Hard with the defenses and armor buffs from PotD.

I wish the opposite.

Or, really, I wish PotD buffed enemy attacks and AI but not so much their defences and especially HP. That's where the grind comes from.

 

[AwesomeButton]

Is HP also buffed? I thought it's only defenses and armor.

 

[Grunker]

Prime Junta you thought BoW writing was funny? :O

Maybe I've gotten sour enough on the encounter-design that I don't recall the early parts, but most of what I recall has been serious. SO SERIOUS. THIS IS SERIOUS BUSINESS, MAN.

I actually like the latter half's idea of an evovled Hell Trials from BG2, but I think the execution is lacking. Waidwen puzzle was crippled by some UE-problems and Drowned Kingdom's puzzle was really banal. I kind of liked the inquisitor-stuff.

The writing itself though I don't think is lighthearted at all beyond the initial village, it really, really thinks it's cosmic issues with grave gravity and wants you to know.

 

[Parabalus]

How are the bugs now?

The god challenges disable console so I'm worried a bit. Started a new game and the initial ship battle had my char bugged with perma flanked .

 

[Grunker]

I haven't experienced many game-related bugs, but more performance-issues than I imagined:

- I've crashed 5-6 times (never had a crash in PoE1 that I can remember)

- When I play for a while (3+ hours), I have to quit the game an re-enter due to what I presume is Unity memory leak? (I'm not tech savvy, but the game starts lagging when I play it for more than a couple hours without exiting)

- A few times the game will lag for 2-3 minutes on cutscene-related area transitions