Pillars of Eternity Beta Discussion [GAME RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Sizzle]

He's answered that question at the very end.

 

[Sensuki]

And then he talked about the backgrounds when the question was revisited.

(That wasn't the question, Bester was asking about the scene files - not the backgrounds)

 

[aeonsim]

That was a fairly technical question that'd probably have been better directed at one of the programmers working on the engine or level designers rather than the project director who seems focused on mechanics, abilities, writing & balance.

 

[tdphys]

From what I understood about his response to restricting movement in combat:

He thinks combat movement isn't that restricted since engagement attacks are less powerful than they used to be.

 

[Sensuki]

They aren't less powerful than they used to be.

 

[tdphys]

His words, not mine.

 

[aeonsim]

They aren't less powerful than they used to be.

Didn't they reduce the ACC bonus to engagement and increase the time between being able to engage the same char, and possibly a dmg bonus? Either or both do reduce the power of engagement from the earlier betas.

 

[Sensuki]

Another Infinity Engine 'feels' thing I reported got fixed

http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/70...utton-in-the-item-description-for-food-items/

Yay!

They aren't less powerful than they used to be.

Didn't they reduce the ACC bonus to engagement and increase the time between being able to engage the same char, and possibly a dmg bonus? Either or both do reduce the power of engagement from the earlier betas.

I'm not sure exactly what he was referring to as powerful but there is still an accuracy bonus, and the individual attacks are no less powerful - Disengagement attack from a Crystal Eater is pretty much 1 shot kill, for instance (plus a Petrify) and I've had a character hit with a disengagement attack and a regular attack at the same time from one because of that engagement attack exploit thingo. Insta-reload.

death godlike death's usher ability now triggers at 25% instead of 15% endurance #pillarsofeternity #murder #death #skulls

 

[Sensuki]

Josh is tuning down Druid spell damage.

One of the SA guys that posts on the Obs boards has been making accurate-ish graphs, and being a goon ... Roguey knows what I mean

 

[Ninjerk]

Josh is tuning down Druid spell damage.

One of the SA guys that posts on the Obs boards has been making accurate-ish graphs, and being a goon ... Roguey knows what I mean

Taking way too much pride in being one?

 

[Shevek]

Those sound like pretty good changes to me. I wish they would change the nature godlike racial back to what it was though. The new racial sucks.

 

[tdphys]

Another Infinity Engine 'feels' thing I reported got fixed

http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/70...utton-in-the-item-description-for-food-items/

Yay!

They aren't less powerful than they used to be.

Didn't they reduce the ACC bonus to engagement and increase the time between being able to engage the same char, and possibly a dmg bonus? Either or both do reduce the power of engagement from the earlier betas.

I'm not sure exactly what he was referring to as powerful but there is still an accuracy bonus, and the individual attacks are no less powerful - Disengagement attack from a Crystal Eater is pretty much 1 shot kill, for instance (plus a Petrify) and I've had a character hit with a disengagement attack and a regular attack at the same time from one because of that engagement attack exploit thingo. Insta-reload.

death godlike death's usher ability now triggers at 25% instead of 15% endurance #pillarsofeternity #murder #death #skulls

The fact that engagement attacks can be instantaneous with regular attacks is the worst part of the system imho. There should be a minimum cooldown time between any attack, which could, for example, give you a small window to disengage after an engaging combatant's swing. What does the animation do when you get two attacks so close together?

 

[Sensuki]

There is no animation for engagement, it's a VFX.

It's not a bad suggestion to make it so that Disengagement attacks can't occur when you're playing an animation, but I'm not sure they'd go for that.

 

[ushas]

Another Infinity Engine 'feels' thing I reported got fixed

http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/70...utton-in-the-item-description-for-food-items/

Yay!

Good. Mr. Glutton can finally eat all the food at once.

Do they include new features like this into day one patch?

 

[DeepOcean]

http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/71271-slowed-recovery-while-moving-no-thanks/



Fuck you, whoever made that decision

Sensuki, just two questions for you, out of curiosity:

1) So, are you for a 100% copy of how movement was done on the Infinite Engine games or you agree on some sort of limitation just not the engagement system how is done today? I mean, by your post I get the impression you are a twitchy guy but I hate twitch gameplay and like some sort of "battle front".

2)Actually, I identify two playstyles, people who like a twitch always moving playstyle and people like myself that like some sort of "battle front", how is the combat catering for the two playstyles right now?

 

[Sensuki]

DeepOcean

Not a 100% copy, but the game should support both styles. Removing things that hinder movement do not require you to play like that. They don't affect the people who want to play stationary or passive.

You could do both styles in the Infinity Engine games too, especially Icewind Dale Heart of Winter, with it's robust targeting AI.

 

[Hobo Elf]

So what's the word on the streets about Druids?

 

[MicoSelva]

So what's the word on the streets about Druids?

These are not the druids you are looking for.

 

[Sensuki]

So what's the word on the streets about Druids?

They're getting nerfed.

Oh yeah there's a bunch of shit from SA today, 1 sec

I'm really hoping the Druid gets nerfed by release if it's possible. They're pretty ridiculous in comparison to the other casters, as they can do more AoE damage than the Cipher or Wizard, and their healing spells actually outperform anything the Priest can put down

I'm tuning them right now. Thanks for the graph, roguelike.

I tuned down firearms and arbalests (crossbows a little) this morning. I think war bows should be more competitive now. I tuned up Noxious Burst's damage and left Fireball's alone. The main strength of Fireball is that it is extremely fast. Rolling Flame is a great spell, but IME much trickier to use than Fireball. Fan of Flames does great damage but it requires very specific positioning. That's been my experience anyway.

I've tuned up the godlike racial abilities (except for moon godlike -- that's down) and a few other racial abilities that felt lackluster. Helmets can give attribute bonuses, but so can a lot of other items, including mods on armor. Attribute bonuses aren't exclusive to head slot items.

On firearms

Gun ranges also came down. :3

I didn't touch Accuracy. Damage came down. Low RoF weapons are very difficult to tune because of how they can influence the start of combat. They should be appealing as openers, not useless over the course of a fight, but there should still be a good place for standard RoF weapons. It's hard to find that balance.

E: It's one of the reasons the F:NV weapons took so long to balance.

One of the QA guys found some Bleak Walker super combo with a specific magic arquebus and flames of devotion

400 hp Bleak Walker Crits, dude.

You probably know how valuable fast is better than me, but right now fireball kinda feels like a second level spell. Iconic projection does fireball damage with an upside (pierces DR and heals), blizzard does fireball damage with an upside (reduced attack speed), concelahut's siphon has more damage and an upside (drain, ignore DR) at the cost of a much higher positioning requirement. It's possible that fast casting is a really good upside, but it doesn't feel like a really good upside.

IME it's valuable enough that I feel comfortable for leaving it as-is for release. If a lot of people really think it stinks over the course of the game, it's very easy to change.

A lot of those druid spells were among the first implemented and some of them had become crusty/bad with lack of attention. I brought a lot of the insane ones (Hail Storm, Venombloom, Embrace the Earth Talon) down, but they're still tough.

Out of curiosity Ropekid, I've seen other people wonder this as well, does Druid Spiritshift have any kind of scaling in terms of melee damage or whatnot with level? The concern is that it will be a low level gimmick that has less viability as time goes on.

It currently does not, which is unfortunate, but the quick fix is dangerous/error-prone. For the future, we're going to expand the components to handle level-based scaling more easily.

 

[Hobo Elf]

I actually meant to ask what they were like, what the general consensus was and if they are fun to play as. I'm planning on rolling a Druid when PoE is released but I'm still undecided between Caster and Animal form. But from the sounds of it seems like they are (were) pretty damn powerful as casters.

 

[Sensuki]

Hobo Elf

Druids are one of the best classes. They are basically AoE damage dealers / AoE disablers. Their shapeshift is kinda crappy, but it's not terrible anymore - it has a short duration, so you cast a few spells, then go into combat with Shapeshift at the end I guess.

I would rate the classes as current:

Druid, Chanter, Monk - top tier classes, pretty much everything they have is awesome
Fighter, Cipher, Rogue - very good classes - most of their stuff is useful barring a few exceptions, maybe not as powerful as the top 3
Priest, Barbarian, Wizard, Paladin - All of these classes are good, situationally great or even OP but they're all missing a little something, feel wise or progression wise
Ranger - Flat out worst class in the game (surprise!)

 

[Hobo Elf]

Meh. I thought you could be in the animal form permanently for as long as you want. Guess I'll be casting nature magic, then.

 

[Athelas]

I've tuned up the godlike racial abilities

My fire-godlike monk is about to become even deadlier?

except for moon godlike -- that's down

Nooooo - I really liked Silver Tide.

I wonder what they will do about the nature godlike's racial ability. Those +1/+2 stat bonuses (on various buffs and debuffs as well) are largely useless, it's almost like the person who designed them has no knowledge of the attribute system.

 

[Ellef]

What makes monks top tier? Apart from Athelas and his fire combo (which was 6 levels above the encounter iirc) I haven't heard much about them. Didn't see them out-damaging the rogue or outcc'ing the fighter.

 

[Athelas]

What makes monks top tier? Apart from Athelas and his fire combo (which was 6 levels above the encounter iirc)

That build works fine at lower levels as well. Keep in mind that I didn't actually attack anything, which you would be doing during normal play.

I haven't heard much about them. Didn't see them out-damaging the rogue or outcc'ing the fighter.

They are easily capable of that, but they need to be frequently damaged in order to use their abilities.