Eternity Pillars of Eternity II Beta Thread [GAME RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Mazisky]

I know that video and that's why i'm saying it's 2d. But now i am confused.

The map is a flat surface on which the characters walk upright on, but the space is 3D. Imagine a rectangular room with no walls in which you are standing up, the edges of the room where the walls are supposed to be are the edges of the painted map. This is what each level in PoE is, a 3D room without walls. The magic comes into play when the camera has a fixed perspective and you are looking from a particular angle at the floor on which the map is painted. Yes, the map itself is obviously 2D, in that it's painted on a flat surface, but the actual game is entirely 3D because of that room. It's kind of hard to explain without the video.

Ok i got it now, so basically most of 3d is empty active space right? Doesn't this make the 2d element (huge map) the biggest and resource consuming part anyway?

 

[Tygrende]

 

[Prime Junta]

Ok i got it now, so basically most of 3d is empty active space right? Doesn't this make the 2d element (huge map) the biggest and resource consuming part anyway?

Only the texture. The size of a polygon has no bearing on its resource consumption; the number does. This technique lets you put in much more complex shapes at the same resource cost, with the trade-off being a fixed camera of course.

 

[Lacrymas]

Ok i got it now, so basically most of 3d is empty active space right? Doesn't this make the 2d element (huge map) the biggest and resource consuming part anyway?

I'd say no, but I don't know for certain. People have performance issues when a lot of characters are on a map, like in Defiance Bay, not when the map is big.

 

[Infinitron]

Cool stuff:

 

[FeelTheRads]

I know that video and that's why i'm saying it's 2d. But now i am confused.

The map is a flat surface on which the characters walk upright on, but the space is 3D. Imagine a rectangular room with no walls in which you are standing up, the edges of the room where the walls are supposed to be are the edges of the painted map. This is what each level in PoE is, a 3D room without walls. The magic comes into play when the camera has a fixed perspective and you are looking from a particular angle at the floor on which the map is painted. Yes, the map itself is obviously 2D, in that it's painted on a flat surface, but the actual game is entirely 3D because of that room. It's kind of hard to explain without the video.

And? What is that even supposed to mean? Other than pretending you know what you're talking about?

The map is 2D. Period. That it's a texture on a plane in 3D space is irrelevant. The objects that make it up are still not 3D, and the lighting is still faked. Therefore: not 3D. Certainly not comparable with an "ultragraphics 3d modern game" to excuse poor performance.

 

[Thonius]

Poe engine is this. All particle emitters and npc are 3d. Map is 2d. Camera is in 3d space.

 

[Lacrymas]

FeelTheRads, how am I pretending when that is exactly what it is? The video showing that is even linked. It's not 2D like the IE games are, it's 2D only from the perspective of the player, but in actuality it's 3D and we only see the floor.

 

[Whisper]

who was the bad guy in POE again/

Some old guy whom you see first 10 mins into game and then you meet him in final fight.

 

[2house2fly]

Which is to say, twice as often as the Master.

 

[Whisper]

Which is to say, twice as often as the Master.

You remember Masters name.

What was name of big bad guy in PoE? Without googling. Pretty sure noone remembers.

 

[Beowulf]

Eee, Talos?

 

[dragonul09]

Which is to say, twice as often as the Master.

You remember Masters name.

What was name of big bad guy in PoE? Without googling. Pretty sure noone remembers.

Pretty sure no one remembers anything about this game beside being the ''successor'' of Baldurs Gate and that it has a lot of fancy writing. I mean tried to replay this dud a few weeks ago to prepare for PoE 2 and holy shit it's boring beyond belief, nothing stands out, everything is generic crap that has been done a thousand times and much better, I don't think they would have done a worse job under a publisher.

 

[Cross]

Which is to say, twice as often as the Master.

The difference is that the Master's presence can be felt throughout Fallout as you investigate the mysterious caravan disappearances and as you learn of the research the Brotherhood has on Super Mutants. Whereas PoE spoonfeeds the player loredumps and flashbacks that spell out everything about Thaos, Fallout leaves it to the player to chase down clues on how to find the Master and what his weakness is.

The lack of direct interaction with the Master is a necessary evil of Fallout's non-linearity and player freedom. PoE doesn't have that excuse.

 

[FreeKaner]

Which is to say, twice as often as the Master.

You remember Masters name.

What was name of big bad guy in PoE? Without googling. Pretty sure noone remembers.

Thaos himself is not that bad of a character, the protagonist's place in the story is misfitting however.

 

[Morkar Left]

Which is to say, twice as often as the Master.

You remember Masters name.

What was name of big bad guy in PoE? Without googling. Pretty sure noone remembers.

Thanos. Thanator or something like that. Some generic typical evil boss name

 

[aweigh]

The Master is a tangible presence in FO1 and even putting aside the impending invasion it is legitimate to claim that the majority of FO1s areas which are visited by the player are direct extensions of The Master both as a plot device AND as a character.

The Masters motivations are extremely clear and the consequences of his machinations are not only directly related to the ongoing plot of FO1 but his plans are literally the fundamental staging ground for almost all player agency in the game; they are an extrapolation of FO1 sophistry and a good example of game writing and game characterization done well but without being overly wrought.

To claim PoEs Thaos antagonist is anywhere near FO1s The Master is laughable and begins to give credence to the notion that PoE apologists exist and apologists are horrible creatures which should be avoided whenever one can.

 

[Infinitron]

Re: tangible presence

In addition to your encounter with Thaos at the beginning of the game in Cilant Lis and at the end of the game in Sun-in-Shadow, he also:

1) Leads a cult of followers in the sewers of Defiance Bay.
2) Personally manipulates the animancy research at the Brackenbury Asylum.
3) Sends his underlings to activate Engwithan machinery at Heritage Hill and Cliaban Rilag.
4) Dispatches assassins to ambush your party after you've foiled some of his schemes.
5) Assassinates the duc and then destroys Dunryd Row.
6) Assaults and kills several Glanfathans in Twin Elms on his way to Sun-in-Shadow.

 

[FeelTheRads]

FeelTheRads, how am I pretending when that is exactly what it is? The video showing that is even linked. It's not 2D like the IE games are, it's 2D only from the perspective of the player, but in actuality it's 3D and we only see the floor.

You're pretending you know because you saw some video and think you understand things you obviously don't.

For all intents and purposes it's a 2D game.
To what exactly is it relevant that the map is a plane in a 3D space? Why would you need to show off your amazing knowledge of seeing a video, just to say that "no dude gaem is totally 3D!!111".

How is it different than, say, ToEE (which also uses 3D characters), except that the map image is mapped on a plane? No, really, what difference does it make to anything?

The guy you were replying to mentioned that it has worse performance than AAA 3D games. The fact that they map a fucking bitmap on a 3D plane doesn't make the game 3D and doesn't excuse poor performance.

 

[aweigh]

well it certainly lacks 3-Dimensional antagonists

 

[Lacrymas]

Why do you think I'm trying to excuse the shitty performance? I'm just giving a bit of trivia I think is interesting, you jumping on me without provocation when I'm not even wrong is strange and pretty pointless.

 

[Mazisky]

Ok i got it now, so basically most of 3d is empty active space right? Doesn't this make the 2d element (huge map) the biggest and resource consuming part anyway?

I'd say no, but I don't know for certain. People have performance issues when a lot of characters are on a map, like in Defiance Bay, not when the map is big.

So if the performance issues happen cause of many characters, does this mean the engine can't hold a few simple 3d models? Isn't that even worse? How a modern Geforce struggle cause of few 3d elements?

 

[aweigh]

How a modern Geforce struggle cause of few 3d elements?

it was a kickstarter goal

 

[Lacrymas]

Shitty engine is shitty. Whether that is because the maps hog a lot of resources and then start to chug when a lot of 3D models are on it or it can't hold many 3D models I don't know. Maybe a combination of both, the moral of the story is you shouldn't expect good performance from PoE2.

 

[Iskramor]

Totally new spells? That's good to know.

Fuck im getting hyped thats excelent to know also abbey of the falled moon is the best area in whole rtwp subgenre imo...