Eternity Pillars of Eternity II Beta Thread [GAME RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Sentinel]

Yep. That's what listening to retards who hate RPGs gets you.

 

[Infinitron]

https://www.reddit.com/r/projecteternity/comments/7kga8s/deadfire_dev_stream_on_twitch_and_12_of_a/

Brian: We got some feedback from people about priests, and not feeling that they got enough abilities.

Josh: Yep.

Brian: So one of the things we changed is now you will see at every power level that priests based on their chosen deity get different spells automatically granted to them, and then they can still choose another ability from their remaining priest spells. Lots of priests get spells from wizard or druid spells, they get a lot of additional flavor added in.

Josh: Or occasionally, rogue abilities.

Brian: Yes!

Josh: So whatever feels thematically appropriate. The abilities may come from the priest list, so it might just be like "yep, you got the free thing that's from this level", it might come from outside of it as long as it feels thematic and it doesn't feel weirdly balanced or anything like that. So for example Magranites get a lot of fire stuff, priest of Skaen get access to thief-y murder things and so on. And also the other big thing is because priest spell list are nowhere near the huge thing they was in Pillars 1, the restrictive aspect of it felt really restrictive to a lot of people so we removed a lot of those restrictions so that basically when you pick your priest you have the dispositions which still affect your Holy Radiance and stuff like that, but you are not restricted from what spells you take, it just that you get one spell for free for one per spell level, and then you can pick other ones in addition to that.

Brian: And the same thing is true of paladins as well with this next update, the restrictions you had on paladin orders are also removed.

Josh: Yeah, and those were a thing where I feel like thematically they worked great, and they still do have the disposition restrictions, which is the behavior orientations that they have. But because paladins are all required to pick an order, again people felt like it was too punitive to cut off a significant set of abilities for those characters, or to have some big handicap like the Bleak Walkers healing restrictions, which, thematically appropriate maybe but didn't feel great.

Brian: And also with multiclassing it didn't always work out, you could make a Bleak Walker paladin and druid, you had healing spells.

Josh: You still had access to it, but you were awful with them!

Brian: Yeah.

both laugh

Brian: "Way to go, you suck!". So that were the changes we made for priests.

Priests have a smaller selection of spells available to them now compared to the first game, so taking potential spells away from them on top of that apparently felt too limiting.

 

[Lacrymas]

Not only potential spells, but entire types of spells. They aren't like schools in D&D.

 

[Trashos]

Having classes and subclasses with thematically appropriate bonuses and restrictions is what class-based systems are all about, though. Do those priest and paladin subclasses feel distinct now or do they play the same?

 

[FreeKaner]

I think another rationalisation behind this change was that you have to choose a subclass for priests and paladins, so you can't consent to drawbacks as you can't not have them. It's practically rape.

 

[Neanderthal]

According to Sawyer ship crew and dueling is a whole other crazy new system, do a "how long can I last at sea" self challenge when you have the game

 

[Lacrymas]

We need a "practically rape" button.

Having classes and subclasses with thematically appropriate bonuses and restrictions is what class-based systems are all about, though. Do those priest and paladin subclasses feel distinct now or do they play the same?

Some Priest subclasses were incredibly gimped and almost useless because they didn't have access to the good spells. They do only have bonuses and no drawbacks, however, unlike every other subclass, but that's a consequence from the general design of leveling up. Not only did spellcasters have very few spells per level-up, necessitating picking up very specific spells which you will use every fight and on every playthrough, but Priest subclasses being forced to discard entire type (not school) of spells, making them even weaker and even more railroaded to pick a specific subclass every time to get the good arsenal. Like FreeKaner pointed out, you are forced to pick a subclass, there is no "generalist Priest". Is it overkill to have no drawbacks? Dunno, people should test that. Obs and Larian have been designing by butcher knife lately and basing every decision on a statistical average, so it's not surprising that we are in this situation now.

 

[tripedal]

Why not just give subclasses large enough advantages to make up for their large handicaps? This is such a lazy solution...

 

[Cross]

Updated Priests so that they no longer lose access to spells based on type. IE: Eothas Priests no longer lose access to Protection spells.

Whoever's responsible for writing these patch notes should consider a career in politics. They make the homogenization of (sub)classes sound like it's a beneficial bugfix.

 

[Sentinel]

Why not just give subclasses large enough advantages to make up for their large handicaps? This is such a lazy solution...

'cause then that'd mean you'd have meaningful choices in character building, and sawyer doesn't allow that. You can only have +1% cumulative bonuses/penalties.

 

[Major_Blackhart]

Ok. Paladins and their subclasses and orders and such. What is there, how do they play and who gets what and the play style differences.

 

[Ent]

The Paladins subclasses are pretty underwhelming tbh. The bonuses don't radically change how you play them like how some of the subs for other classes do. Also goldpact knights losing auras as a penalty was pretty brutal and I don't think the powered up enemity came close to being a fair trade off.

 

[fantadomat]

From what i read here,i doubt that i will enjoy the new class system. I see no practical reason for anyone to stick with a single class,outside of the roleplay element. It feels like they are trying to be original and failing miserably. People bought PoE because it was return to the infinity engine type of games and not because it give us some new and amazing innovation. I just want to play some new game in old style with competent writing and world building. With this shit i could see going the way of the Tyranny,lets hope that i am wrong. This system seems like shit to me and i hope that it is not.

 

[Ent]

The melee multi-classes I've tried so far have all been pretty fun to play the problem I have is that casters feel kinda bland compared to them now. I do agree that a single class martial character feels underwhelming right now but I'll probably have to withhold judgement until I see the high level abilities and passives. They should probably add some sort of capstone bonus as well for sticking to a single class.

 

[Bonerbill]

From what i read here,i doubt that i will enjoy the new class system. I see no practical reason for anyone to stick with a single class,outside of the roleplay element. It feels like they are trying to be original and failing miserably. People bought PoE because it was return to the infinity engine type of games and not because it give us some new and amazing innovation.

Be original in what way? Subclasses and dual classing were in Baldur's Gate 2.

 

[fantadomat]

From what i read here,i doubt that i will enjoy the new class system. I see no practical reason for anyone to stick with a single class,outside of the roleplay element. It feels like they are trying to be original and failing miserably. People bought PoE because it was return to the infinity engine type of games and not because it give us some new and amazing innovation.

Be original in what way? Subclasses and dual classing were in Baldur's Gate 2.

Original in the way that every creator wants to create something and not only rehash the old thing. Are you saying that PoE2 have the same system as BG games? Sub-classes and dual-classes is pretty normal thing in rpgs and it is frequently met. Now the big question is "How is implemented?". A system where there is no positives of playing single class is not my cup of tea. Obsidian did try to make an unholy mixture of Elder scroll levelling system and D&D system in Tranny. And it was a mess.

 

[santino27]

From what i read here,i doubt that i will enjoy the new class system. I see no practical reason for anyone to stick with a single class,outside of the roleplay element. It feels like they are trying to be original and failing miserably. People bought PoE because it was return to the infinity engine type of games and not because it give us some new and amazing innovation.

Be original in what way? Subclasses and dual classing were in Baldur's Gate 2.

Original in the way that every creator wants to create something and not only rehash the old thing. Are you saying that PoE2 have the same system as BG games? Sub-classes and dual-classes is pretty normal thing in rpgs and it is frequently met. Now the big question is "How is implemented?". A system where there is no positives of playing single class is not my cup of tea. Obsidian did try to make an unholy mixture of Elder scroll levelling system and D&D system in Tranny. And it was a mess.

The system they've proposed does already have a built-in 'positive of playing single class' which is that you get access to the highest level of powers for that class. Whether that will prove sufficient in and of itself is not something we can answer at the moment... but if nothing else, they've already shown in the beta a willingness to change stuff, so if it ends up not being attractive enough, people will raise that concern and Obsidian will adjust accordingly.

 

[jungl]

don't abilities scale in this one similar to tyrannys spell system. Abilities get more penetration, accuracy as you go up in power level. If anything single class characters can get ridiculously op. Why would you settle for a multiclass characters versatility when you can blast a enemy faster and with less with single class character.

 

[Grotesque]

I just want to play some new game in old style with competent writing and world building.

That's what you got ELEX for, the best game in the god damn galaxy.

 

[Frusciante]

don't abilities scale in this one similar to tyrannys spell system. Abilities get more penetration, accuracy as you go up in power level. If anything single class characters can get ridiculously op. Why would you settle for a multiclass characters versatility when you can blast a enemy faster and with less with single class character.

yes this is correct, so you get acces to higher level abilities faster and all your individual abilities will be more powerful compared to a multiclass character. In terms of power I would think single class characters are definitely not gimped. I find multiclass character more fun to play though.

Especially the martial classes are fun to multiclass. Spellcasters are probably best as a single class character. at least in the beta I prefer pure wizard, druid, priest over mutliclass variants.

 

[fantadomat]

I just want to play some new game in old style with competent writing and world building.

That's what you got ELEX for, the best game in the god damn galaxy.

Nah mate,the galaxy is just too small for glorious ELEX. Already did two playthroughs. Great game! Still not in infinity style,i have the scratch for such game.

 

[Lacrymas]

AFAIK, people are saying single-class characters are very weak compared to multi-class, so the intention of them being more powerful in their chosen specialization doesn't seem to be true atm.

 

[Ent]

Multiclassing is a strong choice for martial characters because of damage boosting passives being front loaded into said classes not so much for casters who need the levels to make their spells better.

 

[Abu Antar]

I agree with that. I can make several viable class combos for non-spell casters.

 

[fantadomat]

Can you make a retarded combo classes like thief/barbarian ?