Codex Review RPG Codex Review: Grimoire: Heralds of the Winged Exemplar

[Rpguy]

Here is my review:

Best game in the universe. I'll bet you if you search other planets for a better game you won't find it.

Sure there are some bugs and Issues but they will all be fixed next Friday.

Uneasy UI? bad graphics? loud sounds? it's all to give you the fabolous retro feeling of the 90s.

Early access? how can you possibly call something that is years late "early"?! ridiculous!

No Manual? You don't need a manual, Hop on to the rpg codex if you need help, we will help you with grimoire and also with your problems in life, it does not matter how dumb you are we have the people to make you feel at home.

600h+? It's true. If you don't believe me make a drow party and see how long it takes to rest between battles.

40$? even if this game had costed 100$ and came with verbal abuse from the developer I would still have purchased it.

Piracy? whoever even consider to pirate a masterpiece like grimoire or fine movies like wonder woman should reflect upon his life and see the line of bad decisions that led him thus far. Years of hard work and you can't spend a few bucks for hours of enjoyment to show your appreciation?

You need to support the genre, Support the INCLINE! BUY GRIMOIRE NOW!

 

[Zorba the Hutt]

Here is my review:

Best game in the universe. I'll bet you if you search other planets for a better game you won't find it.

Sure there are some bugs and Issues but they will all be fixed next Friday.

Uneasy UI? bad graphics? loud sounds? it's all to give you the fabolous retro feeling of the 90s.

Early access? how can you possibly call something that is years late "early"?! ridiculous!

No Manual? You don't need a manual, Hop on to the rpg codex if you need help, we will help you with grimoire and also with your problems in life, it does not matter how dumb you are we have the people to make you feel at home.

600h+? It's true. If you don't believe me make a drow party and see how long it takes to rest between battles.

40$? even if this game had costed 100$ and came with verbal abuse from the developer I would still have purchased it.

Piracy? whoever even consider to pirate a masterpiece like grimoire or fine movies like wonder woman should reflect upon his life and see the line of bad decisions that led him thus far. Years of hard work and you can't spend a few bucks for hours of enjoyment to show your appreciation?

You need to support the genre, Support the INCLINE! BUY GRIMOIRE NOW!

Nice, so that's the Decado review done too

 

[DavidBVal]

even if this game had costed 100$ and came with verbal abuse from the developer I would still have purchased it.

That's exactly how it went for Felipepepe

 

[Rpguy]

even if this game had costed 100$ and came with verbal abuse from the developer I would still have purchased it.

That's exactly how it went for Felipepepe

That's not a coincidence

 

[Viata]

Grimoire: 338 - 24(thread's title on each page) = 314+1 mentions.
Wizardry: 235+1 mentions.

I disagree with your count!
Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry!

I do wonder if quotes count.

I counted quotes, so yeah.

 

[Dorateen]

Grimoire: Heralds of the Winged Exemplar cements its reputation as being uttered in the same breath as the Wizardry franchise.

 

[fantadomat]

Grimoire: 338 - 24(thread's title on each page) = 314+1 mentions.
Wizardry: 235+1 mentions.

I disagree with your count!
Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry,Wizardry!

I do wonder if quotes count.

I counted quotes, so yeah.

WE the people,the proletariat,the revolutionary workers of the world DEMAND a recount!

 

[Iznaliu]

Cleve said he added more vendors in the next patch.

Good to know that he's actually doing something.

 

[Ilintar]

I've been lurking the site for some time but, seeing as this is, after all a thread about Grimoire and since I know how Codex values informed opinions of its highly valued new members, I thought I'd drop my $.02.

The review was informative in the sense that it reinforced my intuition not to buy the game, but that shouldn't come as a suprise seeing as I never really valued Wizardry too much (I like story too much, of the old classics, I'm a huge fan of BoK) and I don't have that much time to play it ATM. However, the discussion here has been pretty crazy, with the balance word being thrown around too many times.

Nobody cares about balance (well, except for PoE designers, apparently, they made a wonderful formula for balance which made PoE combat boring and tedious). What people care about is whether a game is fun. Now, I know that for some here, nostalgia will trump all, but the way I see it, combat is supposed to be fun, not "balanced". If it's true that at some point the game devolves into a prebuff fest, then it's basically the same tedium all over again - cast the same buffs, enter combat, rinse and repeat. The game is reportedly supposed to be smart - well, a smart game will make you learn an increasing number of tactics and options and then throw you scenarios where you're supposed to react with what you've learned. Does Grimoire do that? Because the review seems to suggest otherwise - i.e. that it's either "prebuff and faceroll" or "don't prebuff and instadie". Doesn't seem very fun to me (but again, might be due to me never being a big Wizardry fan).

 

[Scruffy]

there's one thing this review didn't tell me

is it possible to totally avoid combat in grimoire?

 

[Rpguy]

there's one thing this review didn't tell me

is it possible to totally avoid combat in grimoire?

No.

Nobody cares about balance. What people care about is whether a game is fun.

http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/inde...e-winged-exemplar.117874/page-15#post-5268061

 

[Lady_Error]

The game is reportedly supposed to be smart - well, a smart game will make you learn an increasing number of tactics and options and then throw you scenarios where you're supposed to react with what you've learned. Does Grimoire do that? Because the review seems to suggest otherwise - i.e. that it's either "prebuff and faceroll" or "don't prebuff and instadie".

One of the major problems was that the resistances of enemies were broken - basically all enemies succumbed to music instruments and certain spells and the party was almost immune to certain spells. In the new version that should come out soonish that will be fixed, as well as the experience gained from combat and multi-classing becoming available much sooner.

 

[Snorkack]

:D :D :D @ forum title change. Has DU already been threatened with a cease and desist letter? Or a revokal of his steam keys maybe?

 

[Iznaliu]

but the way I see it, combat is supposed to be fun, not "balanced"

The point is that if combat is very unbalanced, it is no longer fun.

 

[Mynon]

New forum title is glorious.

 

[Harg Harfardarssen]

but the way I see it, combat is supposed to be fun, not "balanced"

The point is that if combat is very unbalanced, it is no longer fun.

Yeah, I don't get the balance/fun dichotomy. It's not like there's a decision tree where you choose fun or balance. Balancing is just adjusting relative strengths to achieve the desired result, which is usually fun.

 

[fantadomat]

but the way I see it, combat is supposed to be fun, not "balanced"

The point is that if combat is very unbalanced, it is no longer fun.

Yeah, I don't get the balance/fun dichotomy. It's not like there's a decision tree where you choose fun or balance. Balancing is just adjusting relative strengths to achieve the desired result, which is usually fun.

Well you could always chose to be skill oriented character than combat oriented.Also there could always be a shit balance that kills the fun.Good example is AoD,you had to play streamlined character or cheat.

 

[Ilintar]

Well, I'd say combat can be imbalanced and still be fun.

This is, after all, an RPG we're talking about. If combat being imbalanced is due to the fact that you got some obscenely powerful spell / did some grinding and leveled up your character so that the opponents are much below you, then why not? Otherwise, you have all those games with level scaling and "no combat is too hard but no combat is too easy either". That might be balanced, but often is really not that fun - and more than often, a game that sports such mechanics is no longer an RPG.

I'd say what kills fun and balance both is obnoxious RNG, like if a single fight can be a faceroll or a party wipe depending on RPG.

 

[Iznaliu]

Well you could always chose to be skill oriented character than combat oriented.

That sort of dichotomy is stupid; ideally most builds should have a role in and out of combat.

 

[vivec]

I barely played it and even I know that food increases your vit so you don't have to rest every few steps. I guess the biggest indictment of Grimoire is that even someone who needs to learn2play can beat it.

Anyhow, true to my word, I'd like to warn unsuspecting newbs that Felipe pretends to like classic blobbers more then he actually does, never actually having completed one (until Grimoire). Something to keep in mind. I'd also like to congratulate him on finally coming out of the balancefag closet.

When it comes to mechanics, I believe we should design systems that work together to produce challenging gameplay content and a variety of tools players can use to overcome those challenges. If challenges can be easily circumvented by using one skeleton key tactic (whether it's reloading, a singularly overpowering item/ability, or something else), then the gameplay will get boring quickly.

I think gameplay is most enjoyable when there's a balance of frustration and triumph. Without frustration, triumph becomes cheap. Continuous frustration with minimal/infrequent triumph often feels like it isn't worth the effort. Every player has a different balance point for what they enjoy, but if the systems have easy "outs", it can make the challenges trivial.

Nobody cares about balance until they care about balance. I.e., when the game is more or less difficult than they want it to be.

There's also a fundamental question to ask: is balance important at all? If so, then it should be done as well as is reasonably possible.

Figures, don't it, how someone who talked a big game about how much he hated "overbalance" and the Principles of Sawyerism was secretly sucking Sawyer cock all this time.

It is posts like this Roguey, that I can not take you seriously. Nice strawman here. There is a distinction between having balance in the game and putting it before everything else. Sawyer simply lacks the imagination to come up with good mechanics hence he balances old failures. That has been the criticism all along.

 

[Iznaliu]

That has been the criticism all along

I've not seen that criticism for a good while.

 

[Beastro]

Is there a tl;dr on this whole drama and what are the various camps?

Cleve's camp.
Pepe's camp.
People feeding off the drama for entertainment who don't give a fuck (nothing new).
Those who see the quality in the game and that Pepe's review wasn't a hit piece, but still dislike Cleve's behaviour handling PR and see the flaws in Pepe's review given his unfamiliarity with blobbers, despite his word to the contrary that he's played enough to be knowledgeable in them.

Lesson to be gathered: If the Codex lacks a common enemy they're more than eager to turn on each other, and that Cleve is now more of a Codex member than he is a (in)famous figure in the game development community who also happens post on this site.

Grimoire 2

Please don't

20 years for this gold game. I can wait another 20 years if I get one better than this.

If Cleve's this bad imagine him releasing a game as a senior citizen with a fully degenerated prefrontal cortex that leaves behind what little inhibitions he currently has.

FelipePepe, I wish you had never played Grimoire. Seriously. You have attracted hordes of popamolers who have simply bought the game, played it a few minutes then given it a bad review, bringing me down into "Mixed."

Your "totally broken and totally unbalanced" crap is nothing but detrimental. I would ask you to avoid playing the game in the future, you are doing nothing but hurting it as it gets polished.

You are the worst thing that has happened to Grimoire and I wish you had taken no notice of it. You were never a fan of these sorts of games and did not qualify as a reviewer, being mostly a fan of Pokemon. Not good to run a review from that kind of millennial on the front page.

Pep's become a major part of the Grimoire legend!

He must be so honoured!

 

[Beastro]

If just a few people had been able to move over the years I would not be so bitter over it.

People who are infinite everything but do nothing in thirty years (you think that is crazy Cleve's delusion but you don't know regression analysis by international metrics demonstrated it in 2012) are just reprehensible people.

You work with these guys for 25 years and just once I wish one of them could have pitched in instead of standing there and looking so perfect. Just once. All of these people perfect in every way and not one minute of productive work in decades according to the hard science.

It is Australia and I understand now that the rest of the world is not like this. It couldn't be. Society would collapse overnight.

In this country I really am the world's smartest man but I doubt if that holds true outside it's border. Remember, in the country of the blind, the one-eyed man is king.

So just by showing up in pants and being able to hit keys like a retarded monkey makes you the most productive hominid on Australian soil.

I'd probably be thrown out of Google's offices as a hopeless loafer ... but no joke, here in Australia I am usually the only thing that is not static. Just by trying a little I outstrip them all and most places I am trying not to get much done deliberately.

I can't understand how somebody who literally never does anything can still think that these people they hire (contractors) are just there to "help out" when helping always consists of doing everything they were supposed to be doing over the last ten years.

I call it "Neanderthal Fairy Day" when they are all out sick with the flu. I go through the offices and fix every single system in the building while they are out and repair the entire server. They come in the next morning and for the first time in six years they can log into Sharepoint with the correct permissions. Want to really understand Australians? Most of them don't even notice.

I'll tell you a few other things.

The men aren't safe to leave around women and children. They have the highest rates of domestic abuse and violence in the world against both. I never trust my wife or daughter around them if I can help it. My fears have been demonstrated to be true more than once in this regard.

Most Australian women would rather die old maids than marry Australian males.

Australian managers have the lowest ratings on the entire planet by their own staff. 90% of all Australian managers regarded as grotesquely incompetent by their own people in anonymous surveys.

International investors increasingly describe Oz as an economic "dead zone." Trappings of a first world country but most of them would not touch it with a ten foot pole. The glory days of a better public image and Crocodile Dundee are long in the past. It is said to be a nation that is good at burning up investment capital without producing anything whatsoever in return.

When I got here I got this cliche from them about "being a little behind the U.S. in some ways." 25 years later they are 50 years behind the United States - in fact showing no progress in anything whatsoever. Obviously, the problems are a little more serious here than they are willing to talk about.

Even if I was making a grand a day, it would not be worth it anymore. I may have to do it again and I dread it. I can't stand to look at them being so perfect and arching one eyebrow like Tom Cruise and going into and out of meetings and sitting around smirking at how perfect they are. When does all of this get properly diagnosed as what it is - frontal lobe damage that is clearly present in the entire population? That is what makes them think they are perfect in every way. You can't talk to a person who is perfect, they won't listen and they don't accept there is any room for improvement.

Twice I have worked with immigrants right off the boat, no interference from Australians - and I had such fun teaching them good practice, how to run a source control server, how to build CI process. It was fantastic. A glimpse of how wonderful Australia could really be ... without all those damn Australians.

Too tired, I have to get to bed. I like writing when I am exhausted because I tell the truth and do not censor anything. Truth serum composition.

Have you picked up the accent yet?

 

[Beastro]

You are clearly the one who doesn't belong here given that you constantly post inflammatory crap and insult the forum's membership.

Sounds like typical Codexian behaviour to me.....

 

[aweigh]

Cleve butthurt over a review.

LOL