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Shogun 2: TW Is On The Way
- Thread starter oldmanpaco
- Start date
oldmanpaco
Master of Siestas
Since I'm apparently the only one awake I'll just say I'm glad they didn't move any further into the modern era. Thought Empire was shit.
That being said I wish they would have chosen a new period like Ancient China or mongol era Asia.
That being said I wish they would have chosen a new period like Ancient China or mongol era Asia.
Good news, but it will probably be broken on release and will wait few patches/mods before getting it. Shogun TW is after MTW the best game in the series, I always found the first two games superior to the rest.
As for the setting, this was to be expected since I cant really see any other time frame put in game, but would like to see an expansion for this something about rise of Mongols.
As for the setting, this was to be expected since I cant really see any other time frame put in game, but would like to see an expansion for this something about rise of Mongols.
ScottishMartialArts
Self-Ejected
I've never played a TW game that I've actually liked. Admittedly, I've never played Shogun or Medieval 1, and from what I've heard those were the best ones. That said, TW has always struck me as an incredibly good concept marred by very poor design.
Despite the tactical battles being the star of the show, you spend the overwhelming majority of your time on the strategic map which is an absolute mess. Diplomacy is worthless, the AI is schizophrenic in its international relations and impotent as opposition, the interface is garbage -- wouldn't it be nice if the game showed you your unmoved units, so that you could move them before ending your turn? -- and the whole thing is bogged down by tedious micromanagement. Games take way too long to play as well. Seeing as how the AI can't put up a fight to begin with, a 100 hour mopping up campaign isn't exactly my idea of fun. As a matter of fact, I've never finished a Total War campaign for that very reason.
The tactical game isn't much better. Pathfinding AI is abysmal, and your units have a remarkable talent for not doing what you tell them to do -- I can't count the number of cavalry charges I ordered in which my men casually trotted up to the enemy's front line and stood there, cowlike and blinking. The enemy tactical AI is as incompetent on the battlefield as on the campaign map. Finally, so many of the battles are small scale and feel like filler. Every couple hours of gameplay nets you an interesting, important battle, but the rest of the time is spent with the monotony of the campaign map punctuated by filler tactical battles.
I like horse and musket warfare and think it's a good fit for the TW concept, but until CA can actually design a good game around their good idea, then I won't be interested no matter what setting.
Despite the tactical battles being the star of the show, you spend the overwhelming majority of your time on the strategic map which is an absolute mess. Diplomacy is worthless, the AI is schizophrenic in its international relations and impotent as opposition, the interface is garbage -- wouldn't it be nice if the game showed you your unmoved units, so that you could move them before ending your turn? -- and the whole thing is bogged down by tedious micromanagement. Games take way too long to play as well. Seeing as how the AI can't put up a fight to begin with, a 100 hour mopping up campaign isn't exactly my idea of fun. As a matter of fact, I've never finished a Total War campaign for that very reason.
The tactical game isn't much better. Pathfinding AI is abysmal, and your units have a remarkable talent for not doing what you tell them to do -- I can't count the number of cavalry charges I ordered in which my men casually trotted up to the enemy's front line and stood there, cowlike and blinking. The enemy tactical AI is as incompetent on the battlefield as on the campaign map. Finally, so many of the battles are small scale and feel like filler. Every couple hours of gameplay nets you an interesting, important battle, but the rest of the time is spent with the monotony of the campaign map punctuated by filler tactical battles.
I like horse and musket warfare and think it's a good fit for the TW concept, but until CA can actually design a good game around their good idea, then I won't be interested no matter what setting.
The last TW game I played was Rome. Never got interested in this Empire and Napoleon shit, but for Shogun 2, I'll make an exception.
Trash
Pointing and laughing.
Problem is that the original Shogun was build by an entirely different CA than the CA that did bring us the shit Empire and its expansion. Expect a lot of bullshit promises followed by an unfinished and uninspired game.
- Joined
- Nov 4, 2007
- Messages
- 14,826
I want to hope but unfortunately I know this is true.Trash said:
Trash
Pointing and laughing.
Stoiv said:
Shogun and Medieval were awesome straight out of the box.
Shannow
Waster of Time
The skyway is strong in this thread.
deshields538
Scholar
I am intrigued. Glad they're going back to sword and shield (although you could still get guns in Shogun 1 they weren't the main focus of the warfare).
I'd like to think that they'll "get it right" this time but after the last two games I don't know. They promised so much for Empire too and it was absolute shit.
Maybe they will get a decent AI, maybe they will make diplomacy worth a damn, maybe they will release mod tools. But after their last two games I'm not going to hold my breath. I hope I am wrong though.
I'd like to think that they'll "get it right" this time but after the last two games I don't know. They promised so much for Empire too and it was absolute shit.
Maybe they will get a decent AI, maybe they will make diplomacy worth a damn, maybe they will release mod tools. But after their last two games I'm not going to hold my breath. I hope I am wrong though.
KalosKagathos
Learned
I hope Rance is playable. 
Carlos' Bitch1
Arcane
Trash said:
ChristofferC
Magister
I'm not hopeful. They lost their touch 10 years ago.
Reject_666_6
Arcane
The scope of Shogun is a lot smaller than any other games released thus far so thy have less room to fuck up in. They will find a way, though.
Watch this be co-released on consoles. That would be the final nail in CA's coffin.
PorkaMorka
Arcane
- Joined
- Feb 19, 2008
- Messages
- 5,090
It wasn't the setting that made the Rome, Medieval 2 and 1700s Total War games suck so badly in comparison to Shogun and Medieval 1.
It was the Next Gen, and that is still alive and well.
So I don't see why we should expect a sudden reversal of decline just because they couldn't think up a new setting.
It was the Next Gen, and that is still alive and well.
So I don't see why we should expect a sudden reversal of decline just because they couldn't think up a new setting.
Forest Dweller
Smoking Dicks
- Joined
- Oct 29, 2008
- Messages
- 12,250
I bet they'll release them eventually for Empire and Napoleon. It was obvious they were just holding them back to make more people buy Napoleon when it came out. So probably around the time that Shogun 2 releases they'll give the modding tools since by then they'll have milked that as much as they can.Stoiv said:
And on topic, I'm a little dissapointed by this announcement. Feudal Japan means a map with much less strategic depth and only nine factions. And this is supposed to be a good thing? I seriously don't get this obsession with Shogun. IMO the worst of the series. I can only expect that people who say it's the best let nostalgia cloud their vision or like the setting so much they overlook how rudimentary it is compared to later iterations.
poocolator
Erudite
Rome: TW was only good because of its originality. When I discovered that the campaign map was extrapolated into the battle map on the fly, I blew my load. (ie., not pre-rendered copypasta bullshit.) Sure, it was still rough and sparse, but fighting multiple battles around the same mountain, and seeing it from different sides, was awesome. Otherwise, I'm just as happy with a battle screen resembling this: (see image)
where the enormity of armies is implied, and not constrained to *gasp* 2500 men per team. (Don't forget the reinforcements-- you know, the ones that never show up.) Hell, if they rendered the terrain in 3D, made the groups of soldiers fluid polygons, and the gameplay real-time, I'd be as happy as I can be. I'm probably alone in my fantasies, since all this shit is not nExGeN enough to sell.
where the enormity of armies is implied, and not constrained to *gasp* 2500 men per team. (Don't forget the reinforcements-- you know, the ones that never show up.) Hell, if they rendered the terrain in 3D, made the groups of soldiers fluid polygons, and the gameplay real-time, I'd be as happy as I can be. I'm probably alone in my fantasies, since all this shit is not nExGeN enough to sell.
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