Skyrim is worse than Oblivion in every way

[Mastermind]

All this would be good if Bethpizda would decide to scrap Instant teleporting for all classes Fast travel and quest Compass. No initiative to pay gold for wagon, run or ride horse with this. But they won't do this cause their consoltared morons target audience could not find Caius Cosades... worst hidden Spy in History (before OBlibion).

You can only fast travel to places you've been to already, so wagon/horse riding is still useful.

 

[DraQ]

No, but you'll learn how to position it to take blows better. For example, quickly moving in when someone is swinging a hammer so that they don't gain full momentum before it hits, shifting slightly so a sword stab that would pierce a weak spot hits a strong spot instead, etc.

I will let any of Codexian medieval warfare experts deal with that.

So is an attack skill, even if your attack skill is mercantile and does damage by hiring mercenaries.

What if you ghost? By that logic almost every skill can potentially be an attack skill, while armour skills are necessarily limited in number.

You can easily build a character in a way that doesn't include one of 2-4 specific skills if you have dozens of them.

In that case it's better to offload this role to attributes or at least separate skill category with separate point budget on chargen.

Plus, running/walking should be resource based too, relying on fatigue/stamina.

Except it's hard to make stamina be so costly to burn in terms of resource management to discourage character from running or jumping when need or opportunity arises.

A wizard would just levitate over it and the merchant can make Andhaira carry him on his back.

Wasting much more valuable magicka and money (on buying and feeding andhaira) respectively.

 

[Mastermind]

I will let any of Codexian medieval warfare experts deal with that.

CRPGs rarely match reality. The opinion of larping faggots is irrelevant.

What if you ghost? By that logic almost every skill can potentially be an attack skill, while armour skills are necessarily limited in number. You can easily build a character in a way that doesn't include one of 2-4 specific skills if you have dozens of them. In that case it's better to offload this role to attributes or at least separate skill category with separate point budget on chargen.

No, armor skills are not necessarily limited in number. Almost every skill can potentially be a defense skill, including attack skills (kill before they touch you is a way of defending yourself). Why is summoning, or hiring others to fight for you, or using invisibility/athletics/acrobatics to perform hit and runs not also defense? The purpose of doing these things is to avoid taking damage, which is also the purpose of wearing armor. Under these circumstances your actual armor skills become the equivalent of a wizard drawing a dagger if he runs out of spells. Your dodge or armor skill might go up if you get hit, but you'll probably die because you have no real skill in any of them. Unless the balance is shit and skills rise quickly to maximum even through trivial use the odd situation where your chose style fails won't have much impact on your skill growth. The point of grow as you use is to more closely emulate reality. Having skills grow slightly even when you don't focus on them because a situation forces you to is a part of a package and I really don't see what the problem is.

If you are in direct combat (like you are in most RPGs) all the time then it's fine with the game force choking a defense skill down your throat. Go through a 100 battles and you're bound to learn something about defending yourself, or at least get used to the heavy plate you're wearing.

Except it's hard to make stamina be so costly to burn in terms of resource management to discourage character from running or jumping when need or opportunity arises.

They don't need to be discouraged from using it when the need arises. They need to be prevented from being as proficient as a character who went out of his way to invest in them. This should be hard coded. If you're using your horse to get you everywhere you should not get from A to B just as fast as a master runner when on foot. If you did not practice jumping until your character bleeds you should not be able to clear 5 meter wide chasms.

Wasting much more valuable magicka and money (on buying and feeding andhaira) respectively.

If using spells/making money is what your character is good at it won't matter. Money/mana exists to be used. That's why you invest in those skills: to efficiently clear obstacles with those resources. It's like an archer using axes in every fight because he doesn't want to use up his arrows. If you're not using your magicka to clear obstacles then you are not a mage, you are a hybrid, which is fine. Let people become hybrids and raise their athletics/acrobatics at the expense of their magic skills. Who cares?

 

[Marsal]

I'm not much of an ES fan, so correct me if I'm wrong.

Skills in ES games increase faster at lower levels. The "speed" of increase is not adjusted by starting skill level (someone with lower skill level at character creation will increase skills faster and quickly catch up to a player that made a significant investment in a skill). Starting with 40 skill and 10 skill will only make a relative difference of a couple skill points by the time they both approach the maximum skill level (one will have, let's say, 95, when the second hits 100, for the same "work").

You're essentially buying "cheap" skill levels at the beginning. It would make character creation more "impactful" if you bought the "expensive" skill levels (or bonus skill levels), that is if "work" needed to gain a skill level would be the same for a character starting with 10 skill to increase his skill to 11 and a character starting with 40 skill to increase the skill to 41. This way, it would take the same amount of "work" for the first character to increase the skill to 70, as would for the second to increase the skill to 100 (preserving the initial investment).

I'd couple this change with making the skills (not counting the character creation "bonus") REALLY difficult to advance past a certain point (let's say 50ish) by adjusting the "work needed" curve. You'd reach a soft plateau with your secondary skills and not every character would end with (almost) all skills maxed. Plus it would really piss off the OCD crowd

Am I wrong or am I missing something obvious? Seems like a pretty straightforward way to improve character diversity.

 

[Mastermind]

None of the passive skills grew fast enough that all characters would end up the same in any elder scrolls game I've played. I honestly can't see athletics getitng to 100 in any of them unless you're a sperg attack who plays the same character for hours every day month after month. The bigger problem was getting some of them to raise when I wanted to focus on them. I usually just ragetrained sneak/athletics/acrobaitcs to 100 because they grow too damn slow otherwise.

 

[DraQ]

I will let any of Codexian medieval warfare experts deal with that.

CRPGs rarely match reality. The opinion of larping faggots is irrelevant.

Larping faggots are those who come up with lulzy, nonsensical shit for RPGs, not those who are interested in how stuff actually worked.

No, armor skills are not necessarily limited in number.

If they are defined by what you wear and rise in association with other skillchecks then yes, they are.

Read what you're responding to, for fuck's sake.

They don't need to be discouraged from using it when the need arises.

They do. I'm not speaking of desperate, "do or die" need, but just trying to utilize those skills in right circumstances - trying to get to potential loot or running because you have stamina to burn and it will be quicker.

Compare melee weapon skills - if you're poor at those, then even if you might use them when pressed, you'll avoid using them at all cost, because trying to use them ends up with you getting raped horribly most of the time.

They need to be prevented from being as proficient as a character who went out of his way to invest in them. This should be hard coded. If you're using your horse to get you everywhere you should not get from A to B just as fast as a master runner when on foot. If you did not practice jumping until your character bleeds you should not be able to clear 5 meter wide chasms.

Except you can always practice jumping until your character bleeds regardless of your actual build. That's the whole problem here.

If using spells/making money is what your character is good at it won't matter. Money/mana exists to be used. That's why you invest in those skills: to efficiently clear obstacles with those resources. It's like an archer using axes in every fight because he doesn't want to use up his arrows.

Except archer using axes instead of bow is punished by getting raped. Mage clearing obstacles by bunnyhopping is rewarded by having more mana to spend when he actually needs it *AND* increased ability to jump. See the disparity?

 

[Mastermind]

I will let any of Codexian medieval warfare experts deal with that.

CRPGs rarely match reality. The opinion of larping faggots is irrelevant.

Larping faggots are those who come up with lulzy, nonsensical shit for RPGs, not those who are interested in how stuff actually worked.

There is no requirements for an RPG to stick to "how stuff actually worked". If that was the case there would be no mages, among other things. Plus, you have no fuckign clue what you're talking about which is why you feel the need to cry for medieval larpers to come to your defense.

If they are defined by what you wear and rise in association with other skillchecks then yes, they are.

Read what you're responding to, for fuck's sake.

I did. "You can easily build a character in a way that doesn't include one of 2-4 specific skills if you have dozens of them." No matter what you say, there is a direct parallel between being forced to defend and being forced to attack. Even if we limit skills to explicit attack and explicit defense, a combat character will be forced to raise an offensive skill (sword, bow magic) just like a combat character is forced to raise an armor skill. Most games focus on attack more often than defense but I can just as easily design a game where the skills cover a handful of offense types and a shitton of defense types:

Offense skills:
Melee Combat - Get better at using melee weapons
Archery - Get better at using bows
Destruction Magic - get better at using damage spells. Spells require you to hold a spellbook instead of a weapon and the other hand must be free.

Misc Skills:
Athletics - Running requires stamina. The heavier your equipment, the more is consumed.
Acrobatics - Jumping requires stamina. The heavier your equipment, the more is consumed.

Defense skills:
Dodging - Get better at avoiding attacks by moving out of the way. Dodging will consume stamina. Stamina used is proportional to the total weight of your equipment.
Parrying - Get better at blocking weapons with your own weapon. Stamina used and deflection efficiency is proportional to the weight of the weapon and gauntlet. Requires you to hold a melee weapon.
Countershot - deflect incoming arrows by automatically firing arrows at them. Requires you to hold a bow. Uses stamina and arrows.
Counterspell - deflect incoming spells by automatically causing them to fizzle. Requires spellbook ready. Uses mana.
Buckler - Allows you to proficiently block attacks with a buckler. Low effectiveness against melee attacks, ineffective against ranged attacks, no mobility reduction.
Targe - Allows you to proficiently block attacks with a targe. Moderately effective against melee attacks, ineffective against ranged attacks, low mobility reduction.
Kite shield - Allows you to proficiently block attacks with a kite shield. Moderately effective against both melee and ranged attacks, moderate mobility reduction.
Pavise - Allows you to proficiently block attacks with a pavise. Moderately effective against melee, very effective against ranged attacks, high mobility reduction.
Tower Shield - Allows you to proficiently block attacks with a tower shield. Very effective against everything, huge mobility reduction.
Leather armor - move proficiently in leather armor. minimal protection. No mobility reduction.
Chain mail armor - move proficiently in chain mail armor. Moderate melee protection, extra lightning damage. Lingering fire damage. Ice damage has a chance to break your armor. Slight mobility reduction.
Scale Mail armor - Move proficiently in scale mail armor. Moderate protection against everything, extra lighting damage. Lingering fire damage. Ice damage has a chance to break your armor. Moderate mobility reduction.
Plate Mail armor - Move proficiently in plate mail armor. Good protection against everything. massive extra lightning damage. massive lingering fire damage. Ice damage has a chance to break your armor. Large mobility reduction.
Obsidian Armor - Move proficiently in obsidian armor. Moderate protection against physical attacks. Immune to elemental damage. Massive mobility reduction.
Iron Skin - Increased damage reduction from iron skin spells. Wearing armor while this spell is active will completely immobilize you. Moderate mobility reduction.
Blink - Use magic to slip into another dimension to avoid an attack. Each blink consumes mana. The more you and your equipment weigh, the more mana will be used.


*All blocking requires stamina based on shield weight and weight of blocked weapon
**Mobility reduces overall speed, including walking, running, attacking, casting, jumping height/distance, etc.

There, you can easily build a character that doesn't include 2-4 specific skills. Fuck, you can build a character that doesn't include any of them, because all of them (including dodging) has a downside and you might choose to just run around in normal clothes and save all your resources for keeping your distance and attacking.

They do. I'm not speaking of desperate, "do or die" need, but just trying to utilize those skills in right circumstances - trying to get to potential loot or running because you have stamina to burn and it will be quicker.

You will get a marginal, virtually non-existent boost in running or jumping instead of getting marginal, virtually non-existant boost in magic skills. It's no different from a morrowind warrior keeping teleport spells around because they're more convenient than walking in some situations. Why is this a problem? Rigid builds are not how the real world actually works, they're a manufactured gamey feature that this type of system tries to avoid, usually by design.

Compare melee weapon skills - if you're poor at those, then even if you might use them when pressed, you'll avoid using them at all cost, because trying to use them ends up with you getting raped horribly most of the time.

If ammunition and mana are scarce you might use them against weaker enemies anyway to conserve your resources, just like you might run instead of teleport somewhere to conserve your resources. No need to fireball a rat.

Except you can always practice jumping until your character bleeds regardless of your actual build. That's the whole problem here.

No, that's not a problem at all. You can always practice any skill you want until your character bleeds. A wizard can grab some heavy armor and an axe and go fight increasingly strong enemies until he masters them both. There is nothing special about passive skills in this regard.

Except archer using axes instead of bow is punished by getting raped. Mage clearing obstacles by bunnyhopping is rewarded by having more mana to spend when he actually needs it *AND* increased ability to jump. See the disparity?

No, I don't. Archer using axes against fodder will kill them is rewarded by having a bit of extra skill if he is forced into melee against a competent opponent and having more arrows to use when he actually needs them. He will get raped against strong opponents, just like a mage won't be able to clear a chasm by bunny hopping, but they will both gain marginal use from practice with these respective skills while being prohibited from making liberal use of them. There is no disparity unless the game design is shit (enemies are too easy, there are no opportunities to genuinely make good use of a high jumping skill, etc.)

 

[flushfire]

I cheated to the maximum level and still didn't have enough perks for some of my builds.

We've already talked about that here.

 

[JarlFrank]

Having so many distinct armor skills would be a horrible skill inflation, and make little sense. When you're accustomed to wearing chain, you'll be just as accustomed to scale, because their weight and flexibility are similar.

 

[kris]

Athletics is easy: TES did it right. It's how you get better at running in general: you run as much as possible. The shitty level-up system is what made it a poor fit.

It is not right without regression. Athletic skill in particular needs that.

 

[Mastermind]

Having so many distinct armor skills would be a horrible skill inflation, and make little sense. When you're accustomed to wearing chain, you'll be just as accustomed to scale, because their weight and flexibility are similar.

Yes, the differences may not be enough to earn them their own skill, but it doesn't matter because I don't want that many armor skills anyway. The point I was making was that the number of available armor skills doesn't have anything to do with the non-existent "problem" DraQ sees.

 

[Mastermind]

Athletics is easy: TES did it right. It's how you get better at running in general: you run as much as possible. The shitty level-up system is what made it a poor fit.

It is not right without regression. Athletic skill in particular needs that.

If by regression you mean growth slows down, there was built-in regression in morrowind because it grew per second spent running. The faster you were, the faster you would get to another place, which means you'd get less growth across the same distance.
If you mean have the actual skill decay, I don't see why it would need to regress anymore than the other skills would.

 

[kris]

Athletics is easy: TES did it right. It's how you get better at running in general: you run as much as possible. The shitty level-up system is what made it a poor fit.

It is not right without regression. Athletic skill in particular needs that.

If by regression you mean growth slows down, there was built-in regression in morrowind because it grew per second spent running. The faster you were, the faster you would get to another place, which means you'd get less growth across the same distance.
If you mean have the actual skill decay, I don't see why it would need to regress anymore than the other skills would.

I meant that skill becomes worse if not used for a period.

 

[DraQ]

Quick question:

Does anyone know where the fuck does Skyrim keep its keybinds?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Wyrmlord III]

Question:

Does magically changing your appearance in Dawnguard prevent authorities from recognizing and arresting you? Does it wipe your criminal past clean, since you can magically change even the weight of your character?

abnaxus? DraQ? sea? Have you checked this?

 

[sea]

Question:

Does magically changing your appearance in Dawnguard prevent authorities from recognizing and arresting you? Does it wipe your criminal past clean, since you can magically change even the weight of your character?

abnaxus? DraQ? sea? Have you checked this?

Nope. My guess? Not at all.

 

[Manjuice Nutella]

Question:

Does magically changing your appearance in Dawnguard prevent authorities from recognizing and arresting you? Does it wipe your criminal past clean, since you can magically change even the weight of your character?

abnaxus? DraQ? sea? Have you checked this?

Do you think they would bother with any additional unnecessary work?

 

[DraQ]

Don't have the DLC.

 

[TwinkieGorilla]

I don't understand why I've started checking out Dawnguard. Damn me to heck. Skyrim is kind of like a blowjob when you're drunk. Nothing to come of it but pleasant enough while it lasts as long as you're not paying for it.

 

[Manjuice Nutella]

I don't understand why I've started checking out Dawnguard.

For the revolutionary features like darker dungeons or Chaurus Hunter?

You can also, in order to enhance your Skyrim/Dawnguard experience, adhere to those fantastic fascinating video tutorials

 

[Sranchammer]

Holy shit this game frustrates me to no end. I can't even fathom how anyone can put Skyrim in the same sentence as Morrowind. Jesus christ

 

[Ion Prothon II]

The game is so bland it's not even frustrating.

 

[Bahamut]

I don't understand why I've started checking out Dawnguard. Damn me to heck. Skyrim is kind of like a blowjob when you're drunk. Nothing to come of it but pleasant enough while it lasts as long as you're not paying for it.

I just DLed dawnguard for crossbows and werewolf perks

The game is so bland it's not even frustrating.

its a lobotomy in binary form

 

[TwinkieGorilla]

its a lobotomy in binary form

Truth be told, that's what I enjoy about it. When the ol' RL gets too busy and stressful I turn on and tune out to mindless entertainment and SkyJamz gets the job done.

 

[Wyrmlord III]

I don't understand why I've started checking out Dawnguard. Damn me to heck. Skyrim is kind of like a blowjob when you're drunk. Nothing to come of it but pleasant enough while it lasts as long as you're not paying for it.

How to enjoy Skyrim.

Get 100 in Conjuration (by cheating or by normal playing, both equally easy, but one takes less time)

Buy Dead Thrall spell and learn it. Buy Conjure Dremora Lord spell, but don't learn it.

Kill two Master Conjurers.

Place two Conjure Dremora Lord tomes in the corpses of dead Master Conjurers, one in each body.

Use Dead Thrall spell to turn Master Conjurers into your permanent thralls.

Watch as the two Enthralled Master Conjurers summon four Dremora Lords onto your enemies.

Enjoy the spectacle of four Dremora Lords and two master magicians destroying everything in their path.



(Alternatively, do this on two Master Necromancers or Master Vampires.)