Sunday morning brunch - OB-info/hype

[HardCode]

http://www.elderscrolls.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=266093

Bethesda doctored it up with fake reins LOL. And the fan-bitches STILL adore them.

 

[Micmu]

I'm sure they tried three different implementaions and then decided for the best one.

 

[The Internets]

So, you'd rather have a bunch of things half-assed than have fewer things but done really well?

Imagine this scenario: you could have sex with 20 average/borderline-slightly-ugly girls, or you could have sex with 3 drop-dead gorgeous super models/actresses). Which would use choose?

Or, to put it in more 'Oblivion like terms', the choices would actually be dry hump 20 slightly-ugly girls or have sex with your mom.

I don't know what that means, but I do know no reins in not half-assed, it's half finished.

I'll bet this games first patch makes gaming history by being the first that's actually bigger than the original game. Imagine, a DVD sized patch.

 

[Blacklung]

Yeah but that'll never happen...to any of us.

Edit: Talking about Chefe's post...dangit I was beat to punch.

 

[Wysardry]

I'm more concerned about so many people not knowing the difference between the words reign and rein.

 

[Data4]

I'm more concerned about so many people not knowing the difference between the words reign and rein.

Actually, the only one I saw who was confused is someone who is a staff member at a "major" RPG site. <shrug>

-D4

 

[spacemoose]

Actually, the only one I saw who was confused is someone who is a staff member at a "major" RPG site. <shrug>
-D4

It's not what you know, its who you know. This applies to everything really, and thats how you get unqualified cretins holding positions that they've got no place being in

 

[Zeb]

That wouldn't be Pete 'No Idea' Hines, would it?

 

[rennatyma]

http://www.jivemagazine.com/review.php?rid=1594

Awesome. As best I can tell, this review is unashamedly written entirely from publicity material. It reads like they didn't even take part in the supervised demo.

I normally just lurk in here but I had to point out that it says they reviewed it at E3 2005 and that this is a preview or something. JIVE does that. They just do previews, get the press releases out and on occasion, do an article or a review. Check out some of these:

http://www.jivemagazine.com/article.php?pid=1881

or this

http://www.jivemagazine.com/review.php?rid=992&rtid=5


and my favorites:


http://www.jivemagazine.com/column.php?pid=2886

http://www.jivemagazine.com/article.php?pid=82

JIVE's is ok for the most part.


I'm not sure what all the fuss is anyway. It's going to be a great game and we all know it regardless of the reviews or previews out there.

 

[Micmu]

It's going to be a great game and we all know it regardless of the reviews or previews out there.

Who's we?

 

[Data4]

It's going to be a great game and we all know it regardless of the reviews or previews out there.

Who's we?

Obviously some moron who can't distinguish between his own opinion and common knowledge. I hate it when people tell me I'm going to like it, with an implied "or else".

-D4

 

[Irwanday01]

My two cents about the missing reigns:

First, the absence dosen't bother me;

second, bethesda could be releasing a patch shortly after release if they hear enough complaints;

third, someone can easily mod it;

fourth, Is it possible that they had the reigns implemented and then found that the reigns conflicted with the downoadable horse armour?

they could be trying to figure out how to fix that issue.

just my thoughts of course.

 

[kingcomrade]

Jesus Christ we have like a dozen posts about how its spelt reins not reigns. And then:

My two cents about the missing reigns

Not only that, but he mistook his semicolon key for a period.

 

[Irwanday01]

excellent point KC, spelling and grammer errors should totally invalidate a thought. Especially when most posters use teh instead of the. Do you have any input or not. Could the missing reins be a byproduct of the downloadable content?


Oh and since we're pointing out spelling errors now, I guess I should let you know that spelt should actually be spelled. :D

 

[Wysardry]

Having an extra gee in "reins" or too few reins on the geegee (making it difficult to tell it to "gee") are both basically instances of the same problem: someone doesn't care enough to do it correctly.

 

[dongle]

First, the absence dosen't bother me;

I noticed it two seconds into the video, but to each their own, good for you if it doesn’t bother you;

second, bethesda could be releasing a patch shortly after release if they hear enough complaints;

You're saying they worked on the game for what, four years, couldn't implement reigns, but they can in another month or two;

third, someone can easily mod it;

Bullshit, they haven't even said if they'll release a way to import new models at ALL, and still you expect an amateur modeler to "easily" do what 100 professionals couldn't in four years;

fourth, Is it possible that they had the reigns implemented and then found that the reigns conflicted with the downoadable horse armour?

We've seen shots of the Elven horse armor, no reigns;

they could be trying to figure out how to fix that issue.

Game's in stores waiting to go on sale, little late for that;


Plus you forgot #5, unfinished beta version used for video, #6 improperly configured .ini file, and #7 video compression artifacts;

:D

 

[dongle]

Here's some more thoughts on "just modding the reins in":

As I posted above it might be difficult to string a line between the horse's mouth and the NPC's hands. These are two separate models. It would probably need to be a part of the horse model, and the end would need to fit perfectly into the NPC's hand. Recall that all the races and sexes are different sizes and the point where the hands are could change. Could be hard to pull off without clipping issues.

And for something to be added to the horse model means we will need to get the model into our 3D program to edit. A way to import .nif files does not exist at Bethesda. To be able to edit them the way they would requires them to release the 3Ds Max source file to us. That'll never happen, especially to fix one of their own blunders. A few versions of Morrowind .nif to Max importers have been released by fans, they are far from perfect. A different version will need to be made for Oblivion. It was years before a stable Morrowind one was released.

None of the Morrowind .nif to Max plug-ins could import animation. This means one could import the horse, but all the animations are lost. That would all need to be re-done. Of all the thousands of modders I know of only a hundred or so who can work with 3D modeling programs. Even fewer can animate to any degree. I can count on one hand the Morrowind modders capable of doing a fully animated horse. (I'm not skilled enough to) Even then it takes for ever. Then do this for all horse breeds, and armor.

And we need to do all this before we even start making reins.

Another solution offered is to have the reins connected to the saddle, under the NPC's hand. That'd look OK. But then we need to fix the stupid Monty Python NPC animation where they hold the invisible reins, which is the most bothersome part. So now we need to repeat the above model re-annimation for every NPC race and gender.

So, you'll need to find a modeler with mad skillz, and a programmer to make the plug-in. You'll need to convince these folks to spend a lot of time and frustration, solely to fix a silly bug. Rather than spending that time making something new and cool.

It aint happening folks.


In any case Bethesda has to release a way to get new models into the game, otherwise this is all moot. This is not a part of the construction set. If they do it will likely be months from now, I get the feeling they may never release one at all. If a fan-made exporter that does critter animation ever come out for Oblivion it'll be years and years away.

 

[Section8]

Recall that all the races and sexes are different sizes and the point where the hands are could change.

Are they? I was under the impression that all bodies were identical, dimension wise, which means that all clothes/armour fit all characters and also...

<s>So now we need to repeat the above model re-annimation for every NPC race and gender.</s>

...to genericise the humanoid animations since all characters have an identical skeleton. I could be wrong though, and it may be that character meshes only share identical dimensions, and can be scaled. That would actually be a pretty logical reason not to have reins or stirrups on the horses, which in turn is a pretty logical reason why nobody fights on horseback, since they'd have a hell of a time steering the beast or trying to balance on it.

Maybe though, just maybe, there will be a way to replace the "sit bolt upright on horseback, barely moving, and holding imaginary reins" animation, provided it is actually applied to all character meshes at runtime.

 

[Relien]

Having an extra gee in "reins" or too few reins on the geegee (making it difficult to tell it to "gee") are both basically instances of the same problem: someone doesn't care enough to do it correctly.

There is no visible "g" in "reins"

 

[Twinfalls]

Zing of the week.

Here is a screenshot from Daggerfall that we never got to see in-game. It's the maker's early graphic material for mounted combat, but they didn't have the time to implement horses for NPCs.

Observe the rider stances and yes, the reigns. It's now been 10 YEARS since that game, and the dumb motherfuckers who've taken over the reigns of the series STILL can't manage to get anywhere near the vision of its creators?

 

[Fresh]

Twinfalls gets 10/10 nitpick points for that post.

 

[Here2Argue]

I always remember it as Reindeer and Reign of Terror.

Plus, Foreign.. Shit man, words are hard.

As for the Reign of reins.. we're fucked, proper.

 

[Lumpy]

Here are some pages from the Strategy Guide:
http://www.primagames.com/games/downloa ... 155276.pdf

And some more: http://photobucket.com/albums/y2/wepeel26/

 

[Micmu]

Here are some more: http://photobucket.com/albums/x4/orange43/

 

[Voltare]

And you know what the bad thing is? I smell " game of the year" being tagged on this steaming pile of shit..........