Tasteful Understated Nerdrage/MrBtongue Thread

[Drax]

Shit, didn't know commandos was made on the motherland. Good memories.

 

[pippin]

Shit, didn't know commandos was made on the motherland. Good memories.

They also did Praetorians and Imperial Glory. There was some good talent at Pyro.

 

[Drax]

Didn't play those, gotta check.

 

[sullynathan]

Man, why are those European games so gloomy or cynical?

 

[Drax]

They come from fallen empires?

 

[Dexter]

Since I wrote this up for the nearly-2000-pages thread, but it pertains the video in question I'm gonna repost it here for the inevitability of it being lost somewhere on page 1928.

You should be a bit more careful with the word retard if didnt even get the point of his video. First of all, he was never talking about racial, but cultural diversity, so most of your complains are void. If you look at Gothic or Witcher or Dark Souls and can honestly say that they do not differ fundamentally from typical western rpgs from USA, then i dont know what to say.


But lets look at his other points, and how people here interpreted them:

First of all, he didnt claim that all white people automatically make white peoples games. He said that the industry has a tendency of self reference, and he even used the very same argumentation as you (industry forms habits of selfrepeating because they want a save return of their investment) And his fucking main point was not about racial/cultural/sexual diversity IN the games, as he clearly stated in 1:56. He was talking about people from different cultural backgrounds having a different mindset, simply leading to a different artistic vision in their projects (which is true). He never said that race/culture/gender is the SOLE reason for diversity in games, but it most certainly is one factor of it. Also, he never said he wants to forcibly change the outcome by implenting meaningless diversity in games, he says that the skin colour of the main protagonist is simply part of the self repeating circle, and was pretty ironically stating that he simply grew bored of it. He simply says we should, at some points, break through the circle, as it wont happen in itself, and NOT EXCLUDING other cultural influences would be one way to go.

Good that you mentioned the japanese videogame market, and i agree with you that it is even more incestoid than the western video game market, mainly because of the very same reason he and you stated. Like you, i either disagree with him or he just expressed himself poorly in this regard. He stated that "japanese game creators always had a unique sensibility to game development", which is simply not true in that general sense. But i think what he meant to say is that those games are unique to the western audience in the sense that if you played western rpgs all your life, and you switch to jrpgs, you can clearly sense fundamental differences in game designs right away. You are exposed to diversity, and therefor experience (subjective) uniqueness. Also, the example he picked out to get his point across was Bloodborne, a game that mixes both japanese videogame culture and THEIR external perception on the western one. And even with the jrpg genre being one big circlejerk, you cannot deny that if you play both western rpgs, and jrpgs, your overall gaming experience will be more diverse than if you just play one of those.

All i can say is that some of you guys need to keep calm in those kinda discussions. You hear some SJW triggerwords and all the sudden you start salivating like some fucking pavlovs dog, barking on and on, eager to scare the big bad SJW off. It doesnt lead to a fruitful discussion, it doesnt make you look smart or superior or anything. All it does is displaying your insecurities.

Sorry brah, but that's horseshit, almost nobody is arguing against a "diversity" of viewpoints and cultures participating in the video game industry. In fact they couldn't even stop them if they tried, short of invading their countries to stop them from producing games. But the examples he brought up (Why didn't he choose Dragon Age: Inquisition, Revolution 60, Gone Homo or any of the other mediocre products from developers that care for "diversity" over meritocracy and deliver mediocre shit?) are prime examples to be used contrary to his proposed thesis.

http://www.dualshockers.com/2015/03...orum-where-the-brutal-ps4-exclusive-was-made/

We could do the same with Piranha Bytes too:

If anything, the point he makes and the examples he picks would perfectly align with the view that "diversity" in the way SJWs are reffering to it is damaging to a products quality and long-term success. He couldn't make a stronger case defeating his own argument if he tried.

It's just another example of a butthurt "progressive"/SJW abandoning logic and common sense at the first sign it might impinge on his dearly-held ideology and he's too much of a retard to even realize it.

Aside from that, this bit of your post was just funny: "First of all, he was never talking about racial, but cultural diversity, so most of your complains are void."

That's exactly what the retard is talking about throughout the video, it's basically a collection of buzzwords and bullshit he diarrheas out to the viewer, here's some of his more amazing bits of wisdom:

"Gaming is not inclusive enough" (his entire thesis)

"You see, I'm a straight cis white male with a lump of coal where my heart should be and as such I care nothing for anyone's representation or comfort level."

"Even I, soulless husk and avatar of white privilege that I am."

"Now at this point, given the subject matter you may expect me to discuss how I wish that it had some people of color in it. Or how I wish they had taken it easy on the cleavage and hooker corpses. Well I do, and I do." (regarding Witcher III, not realizing that these are some of the things that make it stand out as great and unique instead of blank porridge designed by focus group and a "diverse team", which would not make it seem "Polish" anymore)

"One of the two main points I want to make in this video: Diversity is an Asset, this is the argument that I only rarely see made." (lol) "Most appeals for more inclusivity in gaming tend to be built on the concept of fairness, that we should stop excluding marginalized groups because doing so is unfair to them."

Somehow, by bringing up these games as his "favorite" in 2015, one of which was targetted by the SJW gestapo (might as well throw in Kingdom Come as an upcoming example for a Czech game while we're at it, that was attacked for the same thing) and that as above basically disprove his point and are actually an example of the opposite as SJWs understand it leading to quality, he somehow concludes this:

"When I look at all the people that have, one way or another, been elbowed out of gaming" (how does that happen, is someone waiting at the Checkout informing them that they may not buy these games?) "I see something like an undiscovered countries worth of talent right here within our own borders. A country full of people that would make and play games, and would make and play games in greater numbers" (lol) "if we didn't keep throwing obstacles in their path."

"I always wonder, over the years how many FromSofts worth of talent have we driven off by us constantly asking them to see their tits. How many CDProjekts worth of creativity have we driven off by behaviour that's racist or homophobic or generally abusive."

The answer is none, because these two studios are a prime example for cultural homogeneity, they are developing games as a passion and they largely don't seem to be the kind of studios that go on about "diversity", "inclusivity" and "x-phobia" but rather concentrate on making a good game. As Poles and Japs they don't give much of a shit about your Social Justice buzzwords and they are also situated in countries that are amongst the most xenophobic and anti-immigration there are in todays "modern" world and are just doing their thing without any respect as to how many goony-bearded fellas in the U.S. writing for Polygon or Kotaku or making shitty emotion-laden YouTube videos they might offend. And there might be a correlation between said and the quality of their products, especially if directly compared with other examples like Nuu-BioWare or similar that do and can't shut up about it because it seems those are the only "features" that warrant bringing up, talking about them all day.

"There's no shortage of games about stubbly, growly voices straight white guys shooting and stabbing things." (like the ones you just brought up?)

"New character types, new perspectives, new ideas, and the best thing to get them is to bring in new people." (again, you argued and brought up prime examples against that the entire video)

Somehow this then led to his second point (queue melodramatic music with content that he directly ripped from an Anita Sarkeesian "Tropes" video):

"Which brings me to the second main point I wanted to make, that diversity must be cultivated. If this was the sort of thing that happened on it's own, it would have happened by now. The fact that it hasn't is on us."

Forced quotas of mediocre "minorities", that wouldn't be otherwise hired because they have something to offer, but because it would make "MrBTongue" and fellas feel fuzzy inside... and this would somehow lead to more "quality games" like the ones he brought up (Witcher III and Bloodborne) that were made by largely homogenous teams of normal straight white Poles and Japs that couldn't give less of a shit about "diversity", instead of more Dragon Age 2's and "Sim City" remakes. Let the gender studies majors flood the industry!

"So many of the things that frustrate me in this business, can be linked to its disproportionate whiteness and maleness"

What the fuck does that even mean, you self-hating closet racist white-guilt stricken moron? And why did you bring up Witcher III and Bloodborne as prime examples of what the "industry" supposedly has to offer then instead of Gone Homo, "Her Story", Cibele, Sunset and so on? At least be consistent about your retardation.

For that matter, how many of his "80 hour long RPGs" came from other environments than that? How many were produced in Africa for instance, or India or in the Arab world and how "diverse" were the teams that made them? Some of the "publishers" that he complains about are the ones that go rah-rah diversity like EA or UbiSoft and still (or precisely because of it) output crap and use that as a shield from any sort of criticism of their content or its quality as if that somehow overrides everything else because morons like him exist praising them for it. (Dragon Age 2, Mass Effect 3, Dragon Age: Inquisition) - "We have teh gayz! Female protagonist! Trans character! Don't attack us!". In fact I'd be kind of hard-pressed to think of an example of a game that has profitted from the kind of "diversity" he and his fellow brain-slugs are talking about. Most of them would be negative examples and a lot of the "classics" in their heyday were produced by extremely homogenous teams with horrible straight white males in charge. Their creative products got worse as they descended more into irrelevant corporate and political matters and mud-fights over regarding the things that actually matter, like the quality of their products or the merit of their employees.
http://bootstrike.com/Torment/about.php

"If the work-force is the same, then the aggregate product will be the same. And if the product is the same, the market strategy will be the same, so the target audience will be the same, so the community will be the same, so the hiring habits will be the same, so the workforce will be the same. And with each iteration, the pattern gets more deeply ingrained. We shouldn't let this closed loop of sameness suffocate the potential of the medium. The way to break it is to listen and change, and the more of us, the better."

First, this is blatantly untrue, see Bullfrog, Maxis, DMA Design etc. before being bought by big publishers. And then he closes it up with a call to "action" and "activism" together á la Snita Aarkeesian.

Nah, he's a grade A retard that defeated his own argument in his own video and didn't even realize it.

 

[Rabbid]

stuff

Actually, this is a good summary analysis of that video. You did well posting it here too.
Could do without all that anti-SJW bullshit, but when in Rome... The video was an absolute mess anyway, so well said.

 

[Rahdulan]

He's back, guys.

 

[TalesfromtheCrypt]

Blabablabla the guy's a retard, fucking youtube personalities man.

 

[sullynathan]

codex will be butthurt with this one

 

[Monkeysattva]

I mean, the show isn't bad because its cynical, but because the dialogue and cinematography have gone to shit. He doesn't seem to notice the difference between Arya threatening someone with her sword, and the sand snakes: i.e. a normal scene with some tension, and total xena material.

 

[DeepOcean]

Why you guys waste time with this clown? He is like all the other youtube "personalities", no taste white trash that just regurgitate arguments without they wasting a single neuron of their own thinking or make claims pretending that making wild claims alone without proof or logic behind makes you an intellectual.

 

[tormund]

Love how he is using "death of the author" crap in order to preemptively dismiss any claim how his ideas and interpretation might not be compatible with Martin's intention, but then tries to present show's interpretation as objectively wrong and unfaithful to the "spirit" of the books.

He cannot into his own postmodernist academia BS.

 

[Cadmus]

Love how he is using "death of the author" crap in order to preemptively dismiss any claim how his ideas and interpretation might not be compatible with Martin's intention, but then tries to present show's interpretation as objectively wrong and unfaithful to the "spirit" of the books.

He cannot into his own postmodernist academia BS.

he humbly states that this is his interpretation and that it's only how he views it

jesus christ, when you fucktards need to be edgy, at least be edgy for the right reasons

 

[Esquilax]

I mean, the show isn't bad because its cynical, but because the dialogue and cinematography have gone to shit. He doesn't seem to notice the difference between Arya threatening someone with her sword, and the sand snakes: i.e. a normal scene with some tension, and total xena material.

No, but I think he has a point in that the cynicism is of the edgy grimdark variety. Especially in the past two seasons, you have a lot of pointless filler scenes of Ramsay torturing various characters, and a lot of deaths that are in there purely for shock value. He does bring up a good point in that you definitely have a "Cult of the Badass" surrounding characters like Daenarys who have lots of really fucking annoying scenes in there to show how incredibly cool they are.

 

[Cadmus]

Danny still looks like a little girl after 6 years on the show, I don't know how is it even possible.

 

[toro]

Danny still looks like a little girl after 6 years on the show, I don't know how is it even possible.

Like a fat girl. Over developed girl.

 

[Monkeysattva]

I mean, the show isn't bad because its cynical, but because the dialogue and cinematography have gone to shit. He doesn't seem to notice the difference between Arya threatening someone with her sword, and the sand snakes: i.e. a normal scene with some tension, and total xena material.

No, but I think he has a point in that the cynicism is of the edgy grimdark variety. Especially in the past two seasons, you have a lot of pointless filler scenes of Ramsay torturing various characters, and a lot of deaths that are in there purely for shock value. He does bring up a good point in that you definitely have a "Cult of the Badass" surrounding characters like Daenarys who have lots of really fucking annoying scenes in there to show how incredibly cool they are.

That's my point too - the stupid "badass" cringe-fest only really started with the sandsnakes in season 5. (Of course there are always scenes that aren't good, even earlier, but I'm talking generally) That's also when Danny becomes insufferable, and Arya's story line descends into a bad training montage.

I also think he's sort of off with his point in a general way. The problem isn't simply that there's a cult of the badass, it's that the badassery is horribly shlocky, patronising, silly, and ultimatively girly. Bron in season one and two was an utter badass, but he had actual realism about him. It's not the badass per se, but the fake badass that's the problem.

 

[Soulcucker]

Sure the show has somewhat lost it way post season 4 (especially the Danny and Dorne storylines), but his analysis seems pretty flakey to me. I don't see his they made Arya to be a badass argument given her recent refusal to murder, her constant beatdowns by the Waif, and that all of her kills occurred when her opponents were at a major disadvantage or unsuspecting. Also he undercuts his own argument about how only in the books the dragons serve as a metaphor for power while showing the very scenes in the show that establish the dragons are uncontrollable (heck even in the coliseum battle in the end of season 5 Drogon ends up killing Unsullied while attacking the Sons of the Harpy).

 

[IncendiaryDevice]

This is not my cup of tea. Never has been really. I used to like that guy who does a cartoon version of himself speaking from a platform/plectrum/thingy, ohhhh, what was he called, speeds up his voice so it's a bit high pitched, agh whatever. But all channels like this start off well, because they have points to make that come from a nagging desire to express themselves, but just dilute over time to nothing as they find themselves wanting to find an issue to make a video about. So they end-up just doing vids of the kind of things we think about for good forum threads but later decide not to bother with because it's too convoluted.

This is where Redlettermedia does it right. Plinkett is only brought out when Mike actually wants to use him, as in really really wants to. Desperately. Yeah, he could do one every other week, but it'd go to shit. Mike's intelligent, he knows this. This is why they're rare. This is also why people who Demand plinkett episodes are thick as bricks.

 

[Cadmus]

The RLM Titanic video already shows their hearts are not in it. I hope that they make the Ep7 Plinkett passionate again.

 

[Jick Magger]

I mean, the show isn't bad because its cynical, but because the dialogue and cinematography have gone to shit. He doesn't seem to notice the difference between Arya threatening someone with her sword, and the sand snakes: i.e. a normal scene with some tension, and total xena material.

No, but I think he has a point in that the cynicism is of the edgy grimdark variety. Especially in the past two seasons, you have a lot of pointless filler scenes of Ramsay torturing various characters, and a lot of deaths that are in there purely for shock value. He does bring up a good point in that you definitely have a "Cult of the Badass" surrounding characters like Daenarys who have lots of really fucking annoying scenes in there to show how incredibly cool they are.

I also think he's sort of off with his point in a general way. The problem isn't simply that there's a cult of the badass, it's that the badassery is horribly shlocky, patronising, silly, and ultimatively girly. Bron in season one and two was an utter badass, but he had actual realism about him. It's not the badass per se, but the fake badass that's the problem.

As I've said in the main thread, I think the biggest issue with them is just the general lack of talent in the writing department in characterizing them. There's very much an air of 'Tell, don't show' around them in terms of their badassery. We're told that they are some of the best warriors in Dorne and beloved by the people, and yet they move like pregnant cows in their one fight scene (to the point where Jaime, who's a sub-par fighter without his sword arm at best, is able to keep up with them without too much effort), and they behave like violent, sadistic sociopaths (They decide to reward the smuggler who told them that Jaime and Bronn was in the country...by torturing and murdering him).

In the first season, we were shown basically everything we need to know about Bronn during the way to the Eyrie and the trial by combat: He'll do anything if he's paid to, he's a good fighter (but not the greatest, as the fighter he's up against does get the better of him at certain points), and he's brutally pragmatic. We as the audience are actually shown how much of a badass he is, not just told it by some character. When we're told how much of a badass Oberyn Martell is, they then actually back it up by showing him running circles around The Mountain, who up to this point has been shown as the most feared and dangerous fighter in Westeros. We're actually shown why these guys are badasses.

Another big issue is that the show comes off as extra grimdark and cynical because the bad guys no longer adhere to the 'rules' of the setting. Joffery, for instance, was cruel, sadistic, and stupid, but we're shown time and time again what the consequences of being these things along with being the king of the seven kingdoms are (i.e. he needlessly brutalizes and antagonizes the small folk into rioting, he single-handedly sets off the war of the Seven Kingdoms through his sadism, he gets poisoned by those who are cleverer and more savy than him, etc), and he adheres to Westerosi societal norms to a degree (which is why he doesn't, say, just order Tyrion to be murdered, since the taboo of kinslaying would irreparably damage his reputation). Ramsay is violent and sadistic even by Joffery's standards...but these are never really presented as having any long-term consequences for his character. We're constantly told about how Sansa getting away would damage House Bolton's hold on The North...and yet we're never actually shown this, as all the houses we've seen and been told about are still loyal to them. To the point where when Ramsay murders Roose Bolton and takes over as Warden of the North, the head of other houses out-and-out tell him that they know he's a kinslayer to his face (and Ramsay is so transparent that he doesn't even feign outrage, just awkwardly tries to steer the conversation in another direction)...but he doesn't care at all because 'Roose was a cunt'. They don't adhere to the pre-established rules of the setting, and so the viewers dislike them because they come across as infallible.

 

[The Decline]

 

[AN4RCHID]

This is not my cup of tea. Never has been really. I used to like that guy who does a cartoon version of himself speaking from a platform/plectrum/thingy, ohhhh, what was he called, speeds up his voice so it's a bit high pitched, agh whatever.

... Extra Credits?

 

[Ninjerk]

This is not my cup of tea. Never has been really. I used to like that guy who does a cartoon version of himself speaking from a platform/plectrum/thingy, ohhhh, what was he called, speeds up his voice so it's a bit high pitched, agh whatever.

... Extra Credits?

J1M