The 1999 appreciation thread.

[Jason Liang]

I feel like you're being serious right now and I don't like this feeling.

... I lived through the 90's, and '99 did not feel exceptional at all in the moment, considering that the games that blew my mind at the time were Diablo (1997), Final Fantasy VII (1997), and StarCraft (1998). That's not even mentioning the games that I didn't have access to, like Resident Evil 2 (1998), Metal Gear Solid (1998), Thief (1998), and Grim Fandango (1998).

So I see no reason to elevate 1999 above any other year from 1992 to the end of the decade, and comparatively 1999 was probably a disappointment, considering that many of the best games from 1999 were dated-looking "diamonds in the rough" that we appreciate now in hindsight like SMAC and JA2, or just polished, rehashed sequels to the previous, innovative games in the series like HoMM3 and GTA2. In fact, the biggest game of 1999 for me at the time was probably Final Fantasy VIII.

It's sort of mindboggling to me that JA2 was released in 1999 when X-Com was released 5 years earlier. 5 years is like a difference of 3 gaming generations.

 

[Zboj Lamignat]

Except that those games were extremely well-received and appreciated at the time of release and you're just making shit up and treating it like facts. Same with the dated-looking "argument". Starcraft is a much better example of a game looking dated at release than SMAC.

Anyway, if you want some fact-checking then do a simple exercise and look up some absolutely mainstream places (like IGN or whatever) for review scores of GTA2 versus SMAC or JA2.

 

[Jason Liang]

Except that those games were extremely well-received and appreciated at the time of release

Now this is definitely fake news. In 1999 no one was playing JA2, and by 2000 (which was my sophomore year in college) everyone was too busy playing Diablo 2 or Counterstrike, or pirating music and p0rn from the internet in 2000, to play dated games like JA2 or SMAC.

According to wikipedia:
Jagged Alliance 2 sold 300,000 units by 2006.

Diablo 2-

On its debut day, Diablo II sold 184,000 units.[58] The game's global sales reached 1 million copies after two weeks,[59] and 2 million after one and a half months.[60] It was awarded a spot in the Guinness Book of World Records 2000 edition for being the fastest selling computer game ever sold, with more than 1 million units sold in the first two weeks of availability.[47] Its sales during 2000 alone reached 2.75 million globally.

FACTS.

 

[Zboj Lamignat]

What point are you even trying to make? Why did you suddenly replace GTA2 with D2 (which is, btw, another example of a game looking extremely dated on release, which was rightfully pointed out in many reviews) and "appreciated in hindsight" or "diamonds in the rough" with sales numbers? Stop making a dumbass of yourself, we all know that Skyrim is amazing and SS2 is a turgid pos because it didn't sell well, it doesn't change the fact that it got absolutely rave reviews on release. Did you check those scores? Want me to quote them?

 

[Jason Liang]

What point are you even trying to make? Why did you suddenly replace GTA2 with D2 (which is, btw, another example of a game looking extremely dated on release, which was rightfully pointed out in many reviews) and "appreciated in hindsight" or "diamonds in the rough" with sales numbers? Stop making a dumbass of yourself, we all know that Skyrim is amazing and SS2 is a turgid pos because it didn't sell well, it doesn't change the fact that it got absolutely rave reviews on release. Did you check those scores? Want me to quote them?

What do review scores even mean? I can look through my archive of VG&CE issues and list dozens of games with amazing review scores that no one even remembers in 2021. JA2 could have easily gone that route if it had not found a fanatical niche audience.

Is your point that GTA 2 is overrated? I did not play GTA2 when it was released- I didn't play GTA2 until many years later, when San Andreas was released on PC. But it's certainly a great game, not only as a bridge between Shadowrun (Genesis) and San Andreas but well-crafted and fun in its own right. It's certainly one of the top games of 1999 in hindsight, fun and playable in 2021, unlike most of the games listed in the thread starter.

 

[Zboj Lamignat]

They mean that no-one thought much about GTA2 while those other games were rightfully identified as very good and worth playing? You know, the actual point?

Is your point that GTA 2 is overrated?

How on earth did you reach that conclusion, when the point (not that it really needs making) is that no one really rates GTA2 much, if at all.

I did not play GTA2 when it was released- I didn't play GTA2 until many years later, when San Andreas was released on PC.

Yeah, no shit, it's not like I got the impression that you might have a bit distorted perspective of how PC gaming looked in late nineties.

It's certainly one of the top games of 1999 in hindsight, fun and playable in 2021, unlike most of the games listed in the thread starter.

Righto, imagine all those people playing GTA2 to death while the games from OP's list are only having professional remsaters/remakes, vibrant modding communities and multiplayer with often thousands of active players.

 

[Jason Liang]

They mean that no-one thought much about GTA2 while those other games were rightfully identified as very good and worth playing? You know, the actual point?

Is your point that GTA 2 is overrated?

How on earth did you reach that conclusion, when the point (not that it really needs making) is that no one really rates GTA2 much, if at all.

I did not play GTA2 when it was released- I didn't play GTA2 until many years later, when San Andreas was released on PC.

Yeah, no shit, it's not like I got the impression that you might have a bit distorted perspective of how PC gaming looked in late nineties.

It's certainly one of the top games of 1999 in hindsight, fun and playable in 2021, unlike most of the games listed in the thread starter.

Righto, imagine all those people playing GTA2 to death while the games from OP's list are only having professional remsaters/remakes, vibrant modding communities and multiplayer with often thousands of active players.

Yet you list 4 games that are junk compared to GTA 2, that no one even bothered to make sequels to until a decade later or are just dead franchises.

 

[oldbonebrown]

I love GTA 2. I was actually thinking just yesterday that I should make a general thread for it because all good games should have one.

Awesome attitude behind that game, very punk and very 90s. Seldom has spree-killing felt that good.

It hasn't aged perfectly, but there's nothing that does the same thing quite as well and it's still fun to play. I wish we could get a remake or a direct sequel. Preferably a remake because modern Rockstar would gay a sequel up with plot and bowling.

 

[Zboj Lamignat]

Yet you list 4 games that are junk compared to GTA 2, that no one even bothered to make sequels to until a decade later or are just dead franchises.

Literally making shit up and moving goalposts again, not to mention childish button mashing. Just how utterly thick can you be.

 

[oldbonebrown]

Thank god for prestigious GTA 2 and it saving 1999 from overrated cringe like SS2, AoE2, MM7 or AoW.

When you put it that way... Yes
GTA2 knows that all the plot you need is an UZI. The gun tells you what you need to do and I would shoot you down before you even got past the intro dialogue in your gaywad games, nerd.

 

[Jason Liang]

Compare the look of GTA 2


to JA2


to SMAC

 

[schru]

Jagged Alliance 2 looks better, and of all three, I've only played a little of GTA 2. GTA 2 doesn't look very different from the first GTA, which was released in 1997, it just has texture filtering and coloured lighting.

 

[good fucking shit happen]

I love GTA 2. I was actually thinking just yesterday that I should make a general thread for it because all good games should have one.

Awesome attitude behind that game, very punk and very 90s. Seldom has spree-killing felt that good.

It hasn't aged perfectly, but there's nothing that does the same thing quite as well and it's still fun to play. I wish we could get a remake or a direct sequel. Preferably a remake because modern Rockstar would gay a sequel up with plot and bowling.

It's a classic man. Nothing beats driving around in a Wellard and blasting fags with a flamethrower. Best flamethrower in a video game by the way. The gang warefare is also a huge upgrade from the first game and gives the game this retro-futuristic Yojimbo vibe. Only thing missing from the first game are the bikes which had high speed and you could easily speed past other cars but the stakes were higher since if you crashed into something during a chase you were fucked.

 

[good fucking shit happen]

GTA 2 doesn't look very different from the first GTA, which was released in 1997, it just has texture filtering and coloured lighting.

Worlds apart man.

 

[good fucking shit happen]

 

[schru]

I don't know, perhaps one can't appreciate the difference from YouTube videos, so I could be wrong. But I played through the first GTA and when I tried GTA 2 I wasn't very impressed by the visuals. The gameplay certainly has more interesting additions.

 

[Verylittlefishes]

AoE 2: Age of Kings
Soul Reaver
Silent Hill
Silver
Heroes Of Might And Magic 3
Planescape: Torment
Command & Conquer: Tiberian Sun
The Longest Journey
Quake III Arena

what a year...
now we have, like, 1-2 good games every year and they are often not even good (what good game was released in 2020? anyone?)

 

[rusty_shackleford]

Jason go be Chinese somewhere else.

 

[good fucking shit happen]

I don't know, perhaps one can't appreciate the difference from YouTube videos, so I could be wrong. But I played through the first GTA and when I tried GTA 2 I wasn't very impressed by the visuals. The gameplay certainly has more interesting additions.

Yeah the small screen and compression makes it hard to see but GTA was very crunchy and pixely and looked very flat as well as had a more low fidelity art direction on the whole. GTA2 upped the game on all levels and if you play them one after another you will notice that shit hard and not just in the gameplay department.

 

[oldbonebrown]

It's a classic man. Nothing beats driving around in a Wellard and blasting fags with a flamethrower. Best flamethrower in a video game by the way. The gang warefare is also a huge upgrade from the first game and gives the game this retro-futuristic Yojimbo vibe. Only thing missing from the first game are the bikes which had high speed and you could easily speed past other cars but the stakes were higher since if you crashed into something during a chase you were fucked.

My entire experience with the original is getting on a superbike and ramming into a wall at a speed that the screen scrolling could barely keep up with.

The flamethrower was great until it was turned on you, one touch and you were toast. Damn unfair game in many ways, but that's what you get when you fuck too hard with the Krishnas I guess.
Ye, the gang warfare system added a lot to the game. Was it Zaibatsu that got out the rocket launchers when you hit bottom respect with them? Better get a fast car and not stop for anything. I did favour B-types over Wellards though.

 

[anvi]

For example, 1992 had-
etc...

Yeah you could probably do it for any of the 90s years. Most of my favorite games of all time, some are on the 1999 list. But most of them wouldn't exist if it wasn't for those earlier 90s games. They were standing on the shoulders of giants. Also some of those earlier games are like foundations of the entire world of gaming. What Wolf3d/Doom/Quake did for all of gaming was like an industrial revolution. And some are direct ancestors, my precious Tiberian Sun would never have existed without Grandpa Dune.

 

[Pentium]

what good game was released in 2020? anyone?

Spoiler

 

[Joggerino]

what good game was released in 2020? anyone?

I went through the whole list and the answer is...

Spoiler

Factorio

 

[Deflowerer]

AoE 2: Age of Kings
Soul Reaver
Silent Hill
Silver
Heroes Of Might And Magic 3
Planescape: Torment
Command & Conquer: Tiberian Sun
The Longest Journey
Quake III Arena

what a year...
now we have, like, 1-2 good games every year and they are often not even good (what good game was released in 2020? anyone?)

Nioh 2.