Baldur's Gate The Baldur's Gate Series Thread

[DragoFireheart]

The last pages from this thread made me feel like I'm back in the early 2000's (discussing optimal BG 1/2 solo builds, seriously ?), but that stuff about importing character from BG2 to NWN is the final nail in the coffin. Alright, which one of you guys opened a time portal ?

agris has the first 2014 post.

I recently stared playing the entire saga again and begun asking a lot of questions for the past month or so.

 

[Kem0sabe]

I left steam downloading the two enhanced editions, so I'll d probably start replaying them this Christmas. Have to check wha mods are or aren't compatible

 

[Seari]

Why?

 

[Kem0sabe]

I have no rational explanation beyond 'feel like playing them'

 

[DragoFireheart]

I have no rational explanation beyond 'feel like playing them'

I think he meant why the EE versions over the originals.

 

[Kem0sabe]

I think he meant why the EE versions over the originals.

I got them both extremely cheap and curious how playable they are in his enhanced edition form

 

[DragoFireheart]

I think he meant why the EE versions over the originals.

I got them both extremely cheap and curious how playable they are in his enhanced edition form

The GUI looks like crap, some stuff has been cut/replace (cutscences in BG1), and certain mods are no longer compatible.

It's probably playable but frankly any dollar amount is a rip off.

 

[Sykar]

hell bovine

Yeah, I've seen the youtube videos of a sorc soloing stuff like Demogorgon. Ridiculously powerful.

What's a good list of spell picks for a solo sorc?

There is no definitive spell list; the fun thing about sorcerers is that you actually don't need that many spells to be effective, so you can vary your picks. The deciding factors would be what mods you are using, and whether you give a damn about your reputation. The most fun battles I've read about were by Alesia on old Bioware BG2 forums. She played several Ascension solos with different classes, including sorcerer. The stories should still be there, I just don't bother with those forums anymore.

Basically what you want is all the spell triggers etc. (because they effectively let you cast several times per round), spell immunity, project image, that high level contingency spell (for the project image cheese), wish (the evil options :D) and protection spells. The protection spells are dependent on the mods you're using. Time stop is not that necessary, I had imprisonment in my evil run instead, because well, killing gets boring so quickly. I also had polymorph (not recommended, so many enemies are immune, it's annoying) and the one that made characters permanently stupid (you'd be surprised which enemies can be disabled by it, that spell was fun).

, anything that slows down mage progression is not worth it.

So then Sorcerer is best going by this logic since not only is it pure arcane but it can have more spell casting (at the cost of limited spell choices)?

Which two-multi is best: F/M, C/M, or T/M?

For a solo game sorcerer is the most powerful, because you can choose spells as soon as you level up; unless you use console commands to give your character spell scrolls, that is the main problem for other solo mage classes. If you go for Project Image cheese, then the sorcerer becomes basically a god long before the game ends. I'd say M/C is second in power (or alternatively the wild mage if you don't mind the risk).

Only if you know the system well and only after level 20, because Bioware for some weird reason thought it's good to cram sorcerers spell selection to the max after 20, eliminating their biggest weakness, while wizards get nothing after 20. Before that, specialized wizards and sorcerers are so close that it doesn't matter much. For first timers, wizards are the better choice.

I'd disagree. The rise in power for my sorceress was after acquiring spell trigger (the one that lets you put acid fog into it), and that was definitively before level 20. She won the battle against the lich party with it (the one that holds that powerful mage staff). And then proceeded to commit suicide out of greed, because I didn't wait for the clouds to dissipate, before trying to collect the staff from the corpse. Good thing I don't play no-reload games.

You are aware that wizards get their next tiers of spells a level earlier until 13? You are also aware that a specialized wizard has until level 18 about the same amount of spells per day? Additionally, he can chose to cast Spell Trigger, but then discard it and memorize 2 spells while your sorcerer can only cast Trigger at 16. So yeah, what's more powerful, being able to cast Spell Trigger over and over, or Trigger and then maybe two Incendiary Clouds, mh...

 

[Musaab]

I own all the originals and the enhanced editions and I am really enjoying the enhanced editions. For whatever reason, everyone here loves to shit on the people making them as if they have set out to desecrate a holy site.

 

[Seari]

We already stated our reasons. Stop forcing your shitty enhanced editions down our throats.

 

[hell bovine]

You are aware that wizards get their next tiers of spells a level earlier until 13? You are also aware that a specialized wizard has until level 18 about the same amount of spells per day? Additionally, he can chose to cast Spell Trigger, but then discard it and memorize 2 spells while your sorcerer can only cast Trigger at 16. So yeah, what's more powerful, being able to cast Spell Trigger over and over, or Trigger and then maybe two Incendiary Clouds, mh...

Yeah, but that was not vanilla BG2, but my first (and only) run with the Tactics mod, which heavily modifies spell casting behaviour for wizards. And you have other monsters, beefed up by Tactics, in that battle. So I had no previous knowledge of this encounter; how do you prepare with a wizard for that? In this case, it was mass spamming of acid clouds via spell trigger that won the battle. A trigger plus two Incendiary clouds wouldn't, because the key is to cast all those cloud spells in one go to disable the two mages (especially the one that holds the staff and therefore is almost always invisible) at the beginning of the fight.If you don't know what's coming, then the wizard is at a disadvantage, especially in Tactics, where some of the enemies have some very surprising abilities.
EDIT: Spell trigger is more powerful, because it allows you to circumvent the spell per round limit. Heck, the spell triggers/sequencers/contingencies are the reason, why arcane spellcasters are so overpowered in this game. Every other class gets a limit on their actions per round, wizardly classes don't. In a turn-based game, that is what gives them such an unfair advantage.

 

[Sykar]

You are aware that wizards get their next tiers of spells a level earlier until 13? You are also aware that a specialized wizard has until level 18 about the same amount of spells per day? Additionally, he can chose to cast Spell Trigger, but then discard it and memorize 2 spells while your sorcerer can only cast Trigger at 16. So yeah, what's more powerful, being able to cast Spell Trigger over and over, or Trigger and then maybe two Incendiary Clouds, mh...

Yeah, but that was not vanilla BG2, but my first (and only) run with the Tactics mod, which heavily modifies spell casting behaviour for wizards. And you have other monsters, beefed up by Tactics, in that battle. So I had no previous knowledge of this encounter; how do you prepare with a wizard for that? In this case, it was mass spamming of acid clouds via spell trigger that won the battle. A trigger plus two Incendiary clouds wouldn't, because the key is to cast all those cloud spells in one go to disable the two mages (especially the one that holds the staff and therefore is almost always invisible) at the beginning of the fight.If you don't know what's coming, then the wizard is at a disadvantage, especially in Tactics, where some of the enemies have some very surprising abilities.
EDIT: Spell trigger is more powerful, because it allows you to circumvent the spell per round limit. Heck, the spell triggers/sequencers/contingencies are the reason, why arcane spellcasters are so overpowered in this game. Every other class gets a limit on their actions per round, wizardly classes don't. In a turn-based game, that is what gives them such an unfair advantage.

And what#s stopping a wizard to do the same?

 

[hell bovine]

You are aware that wizards get their next tiers of spells a level earlier until 13? You are also aware that a specialized wizard has until level 18 about the same amount of spells per day? Additionally, he can chose to cast Spell Trigger, but then discard it and memorize 2 spells while your sorcerer can only cast Trigger at 16. So yeah, what's more powerful, being able to cast Spell Trigger over and over, or Trigger and then maybe two Incendiary Clouds, mh...

Yeah, but that was not vanilla BG2, but my first (and only) run with the Tactics mod, which heavily modifies spell casting behaviour for wizards. And you have other monsters, beefed up by Tactics, in that battle. So I had no previous knowledge of this encounter; how do you prepare with a wizard for that? In this case, it was mass spamming of acid clouds via spell trigger that won the battle. A trigger plus two Incendiary clouds wouldn't, because the key is to cast all those cloud spells in one go to disable the two mages (especially the one that holds the staff and therefore is almost always invisible) at the beginning of the fight.If you don't know what's coming, then the wizard is at a disadvantage, especially in Tactics, where some of the enemies have some very surprising abilities.
EDIT: Spell trigger is more powerful, because it allows you to circumvent the spell per round limit. Heck, the spell triggers/sequencers/contingencies are the reason, why arcane spellcasters are so overpowered in this game. Every other class gets a limit on their actions per round, wizardly classes don't. In a turn-based game, that is what gives them such an unfair advantage.

And what#s stopping a wizard to do the same?

You can only put spells in triggers that you have memorized. Sorcerer flexibility offers more power in BG2, because the spell selection is littered with useless spells. For a sorcerer, you don't get to choose incendiary cloud, but you can choose what goes into spell triggers mid-battle. This might not seem much if you are looking at low levels, but is really not that different form the project image cheese. Because there just aren't that many useful spells to put in those triggers in the first place.
(you can do the same with a wild mage, but that power comes at a heavy price of being able to kill oneself with a cow)

 

[DragoFireheart]

Sorcerer

Vs

Wizard

Which is better and why.

 

[Seari]

Sorcerer has more casts per day, but learns fewer spells. Wizard doesn't have a limit to the amount of spells that they can learn(with 19 INT) but have fewer casts per day.

I guess sorcerer could be considered more powerful due to the large amount of casts that they get.

 

[DragoFireheart]

Sorcerer has more casts per day, but learns fewer spells. Wizard doesn't have a limit to the amount of spells that they can learn(with 19 INT) but have fewer casts per day.

I guess sorcerer could be considered more powerful due to the large amount of casts that they get.

There's also the fact that Sorcerers have full access to all known spell picks. Wizards (Mages) on the other hand are forced to pick which spells among their slot choices.

Only the Wild Mage breaks the symmetry that limits Wizards by allowing them to use Nahal's Reckless Dweomer and basically turn all level-1-casts into any-level-casts. Course, you have to deal with the potential death by cow squishing...

 

[DragoFireheart]

Ok, what the fuck?

I cast Mislead, move my copy well out of range of the Beholders, attacks the Beholders, and their eye rays still get fired at me.

Significantly lower amounts mind you, but a few still hit me. What is this I don't even.

 

[Seari]

Dunno. Maybe Smarter Beholders from scs.

 

[DragoFireheart]

Dunno. Maybe Smarter Beholders from scs.

I don't have SCS installed.

 

[Wyrmlord]

Guys, question about Throne of Bhaal.

I got pretty frustrated with ToB, because my 4-man BG2 party (Monk PC, Keldorn, Anomen, and Imoen) usually never got hit, because they all had respectably high ACs, especially my monk. Come ToB, and even the most basic level enemies could successfully attack my party members on each attack. I almost found it cheating.

So I get that ToB requires at least one party member to act as a decoy with super high AC who will never get hit. In BG2, my decoy was the monk, due to high spell resistance and AC.

Has anyone succeeded in building a -20 AC character who can be used to distract enemies? As a bonus, a -20 AC character with 75%-ish magic resistance?

 

[hell bovine]

Guys, question about Throne of Bhaal.

I got pretty frustrated with ToB, because my 4-man BG2 party (Monk PC, Keldorn, Anomen, and Imoen) usually never got hit, because they all had respectably high ACs, especially my monk. Come ToB, and even the most basic level enemies could successfully attack my party members on each attack. I almost found it cheating.

So I get that ToB requires at least one party member to act as a decoy with super high AC who will never get hit. In BG2, my decoy was the monk, due to high spell resistance and AC.

Has anyone succeeded in building a -20 AC character who can be used to distract enemies? As a bonus, a -20 AC character with 75%-ish magic resistance?

I'm not sure it's possible (I've only played ToB with Ascension installed, though); you can get below -20, but you still will get hit. Generally, if you want an untouchable tank, arcane spellcasting is the key, because you can make your character immune to melee attacks, and make those protections non-removable (short of a dead magic zone). Which is why bards made better tanks than fighters in ToB. :D

PS it's like an old addiction you thought you quit, this topic makes me want to play again

 

[Lios]

BG2 characters as i vaguely remember them
haven't really played BG1.

IMOEN: Bioware main character whatever that means. I actually kept her in my team after Spellhold the first time around, then got Jansen in the next playthrough. Also, if i remember correctly, she's a bhaalspawn too and can't take the heat, apparently. Get your shit together.

MINSC: A boulder getting smacked by the waves in a beach somewhere in the world is still more interesting, character wise. All this pseudo retarted quirky humor gets on my nerves. Plus he aligns with Aerie declaring her his new witch. Plus he will attack Edwin at some point. That being said, I also kept him around in my first playthrough cause he can deliver damage-wise.

JAHEIRA: Good as one of the two milfhunter romance options in the game. Found her useful only for the druid grove quest, then her patronizing bullshit started to get on my nerves. Nice pseudo russian/bosnian (?) accent and Albanian looking portrait though (that's a plus by the way). I remember that during her Harper questline she disappears leaving you a note not to follow her (which in-game this means "pursue her") : request accepted. So long and thanks for all the fish.

VICONIA: Second milfhunter romance option but I kept her as the team cleric. I always found it more satisfying to charm undead rather than destroying them, also. Plus bitchy comments in/and drow dialect that reminds me of cheap stripshows in the countryside, and her char.portrait is the most fap-worthy among your companions.

YOSHIMO: Fuck that backstabbing piece of shit. "Yoshimo is willing" to fuck you in the ass indeed. I never used any traps and I think there are better thieves in the game anyway. Killing him in spellhold is still satisfying after all these years. I shall dance in the head of a pin as well.

KORGAN: Excellent bully money hungry midget killing machine that makes Aerie flee from the party and suicide, eventually.

AERIE: Useful but I don't care bout your wings.

ANOMEN: I only used it in my first playthrough years ago, I remember that I failed his quest and became paranoid and attacked Aerie which was hillarious. He's a pretty solid character but I only prefer him paranoid, or else I slice his throat and murder him in the wilderness. Like a dog.

NALIA: At first I thought she was OK, her quest/keep was also cool, but then she started bitching every time I didn't give money to a beggar, thus I respected that if not anything else, she is versatile enough, and just kicked her out of the party instead of chopping her to bits and then feeding her to beggars.

JANSEN: I like this guy very much. He's a fine thief and pretty useful with ranged weapons. His banters with other members are OK though I kinda wished he would shut the fuck up after act 3 and onwards.

KELDORN: Respectable and damn powerful, he's also a good choice if you plan on having an old reactionary/bigot in your party. I don't remember his quest clearly, but I remember that you could persuade him to abandon a future of dying of old age in a little house with his old wife and return to epic ass kicking with you. Which is also cool. Not too convenient for evil parties as already stated in older posts.

HAER'DALIS: Hipster shit. Well, actually, his proficiencies in both short and long swords are cool and has some nifty magic-thingies going on, and I dig that he's a plane traveller and has seen lots of demented weird shit in his life, but speaking in such a manner should get a person shot without warning.

EDWIN: Yeah Edwin is the man we all know how it goes. I love how he goes tranny mode during his quest. Question: can you actually keep him as Edwina till endgame or are you forced to turn him back to dick mode? Don't remember much info of this kind.

CERND: If you don't want to raise kids motherfucker, then don't cum inside. Being able to transform to a werewolf is cool, not raising another future asshole because you couldn't be a father is better.

VALYGAR: Valygar's my nigga. Has family issues but managed to raise above all this shit and became a ranger, when all other options were ( A ) play basketball or ( B ) sell crack. Joking aside, I kept him last time I played and turned out a decent dual wielding katana deathmachine. Also, if I remember correctly, he can shut Jansen up at times, which is a remarkable feat of its own.

MAZZY: Didn't needed a faux paladin so I waved to her and let her go on with her life. Plus when I actually used her once she started treating Valygar like shit for no reason so I sent her to the devil. Tough luck bitch but the last thing I need in the party is a racist midget, no matter how funny it sounds.

SAREVOK: Skinhead tool of destruction. His interaction is sweet too, even though it's kinda lame to turn him into a do-gooder out of the blue.

 

[Greatness]

If I had to do a tier list of BG2 companions as I remember them:

Top Tier:
Korgan (doesn't talk too much, funny enough when he does)
Sarevok (isn't a whiny bitch like most of the rest, also OP)
Edwin (best personal quest and pretty OP, gets annoying sometimes)

Mid Tier:
Keldorn (good portrait/voice/kit and righteous racism, stupid personal quest)
Viconia (just don't do the romance and she's tolerable, everything else about her is pretty good)

Low Tier:
Yoshimo (one of the least annoying personality wise, by the time you get tired of him he dies anyways)
Mazzy (nice stats/abilities and she banters with Korgan, should've been a fighter/cleric though)
Jan (probably the most useful of the thieves, just make sure to tell him to shut the fuck up every chance you get)

Awful Tier:
Jaheira (even the bonus loot from her quest isn't worth putting up with her bitching. Druid spells are nice though and she's your best choice to get them from NPCs)
Valygar (I don't give a fuck about your family issues)
Imoen (why exactly would anyone want to rescue her?)
Minsc (biowares idea of "humor")
HaerDalis (pretty interesting class, but that writing makes me cringe every time)
Cernd (why is he even in the game, no personality and shapeshifting is garbage)
Nalia (she's annoying enough that replacing her with Imoen is actually a positive)
Aerie (nice job ruining the most OP class combo in the game bio, I can't even put into words how much I hate this character)

 

[DragoFireheart]

Wild Mages are the most powerful class.

http://www.sorcerers.net/Games/BG2/SpellsReference/EndlessSpells.htm#NahalsRecklessDweomer

Note:

Nahals Reckless Dweomer (NRD) has a built in Improved Alacrity.
NRD allows you to cast any spell in your spell book even if you didn't slot it. Combine it with Robe of Vecna to instantly cast any spell.
Chaos Shield and Improved Chaos Shield will stack if used with sequences or chain contingency, allowing you to avoid the negative surges more easily.
You can buy Limited Wish right after intro dungeon.

 

[Wyrmlord]

My ranking of best Baldur's Gate 2 companions strictly in combat effectiveness

1. Keldorn
Baldur's Gate 2 is a game where magicians are kings and everyone else is collateral damage caught in between. But Keldorn is the game changer in bringing magicians to their knees. He breaks their invisibility and then dispels their magical protections, so that you can begin hacking them immediately. He is like the perfect yin/yang balance here, the righteous anti-magician who defeats the perverted magic users of the world of BG2.

2. Anomen
A cleric who can lower magic resistance and use finger of death? That's pretty much every dragon fight won with one guy alone. Add in chaotic commands, and that's all the illithids defeated. Put in some summonable demons, with Keldorn's protection from evil, and you have some pit fiends to distract the enemies. Holy smite several times and Irenicus is dead.

3. Haer'Dalis
Highest AC in the game with a combo of Freedom of Action and Defensive Spin. An amazing decoy for all physical encounters in the game.

And that's pretty much it. 3-man parties are adequate for BG2, and 4-man parties are useful for harder fights.