Luan
Educated
herostratus said:
Good! Let them burn, ungrateful bastards.
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The Codexian Saga LP
- Thread starter The Barbarian
- Start date
Good! Let them burn, ungrateful bastards.
MasterSmithFandango
Arcane
- Joined
- Aug 6, 2008
- Messages
- 7,269
Economic support won't help a people that are resorting to suicide bombing. The only way to truly tip the balance is to get involved ourselves. Why are we so willing to go to war with other humans, but we shy away from attacking xenos?
taplonaplo
Scholar
- Joined
- Aug 8, 2008
- Messages
- 628
Coz the aliens didn't attack us since... was it our first contact war or the phyrries?
MasterSmithFandango
Arcane
- Joined
- Aug 6, 2008
- Messages
- 7,269
They attacked the Commo though... is it hard to think that the only reason they didn't attack us was the Commos were a buffer? We don't have that buffer anymore. The Hin'in are expansionist, and after they deal with the Raumeni and truce with the Bron, which will happen, they'll only have one place to go, and we won't be able to stop them.
anus_pounder
Arcane
Not changing my vote, but I assume that by the time they crush the ramen and truce with the bros AND rebuild their military, we would also have got our shit together (+ expanded a bit maybe).
MasterSmithFandango
Arcane
- Joined
- Aug 6, 2008
- Messages
- 7,269
Them having their shit together is a lot better off than us having our shit together. It's the Roman Empire having their shit together against... umm... I don't know, something tiny.
The Barbarian
Liturgist
A - Radech
D - Nickless
A - treave
A - laclongquan
D - herostratus
D - Mikayel
A - Azira
B - Conkrete Knight
C - Bethesda Love
A - meeneque
A - wjw
B - Ulminati
A - Luan
A - anus_pounder
A - taplonaplo
D - obediah
D - Flying Spaghetti Monster
D - LusciousPear
A - Dark Underlord
B - juggernaut
B - praetor
B - root
A = 10
B = 5
C = 1
D = 6
Winner = A
The update is forthcoming over the next six hours.
D - Nickless
A - treave
A - laclongquan
D - herostratus
D - Mikayel
A - Azira
B - Conkrete Knight
C - Bethesda Love
A - meeneque
A - wjw
B - Ulminati
A - Luan
A - anus_pounder
A - taplonaplo
D - obediah
D - Flying Spaghetti Monster
D - LusciousPear
A - Dark Underlord
B - juggernaut
B - praetor
B - root
A = 10
B = 5
C = 1
D = 6
Winner = A
The update is forthcoming over the next six hours.
obediah
Erudite
- Joined
- Jan 31, 2005
- Messages
- 5,051
The Barbarian said:
I bow before the Barbarian's counting skill (and blood-dripping sword), but in the future I hope he will consider more creative partitioning of votes. In this particular case, I think the crux of the vote was whether or not to intervene in the hin'in-raumen war. Because there were three competing votes for intervention, isolationism won in a landslide even though more councilors sought intervention.
I understand that no matter how clever a scheme Conan comes up with, we sniveling councilors find a way to fuck it sideways, We can only hope he will continue to show us more patience than we deserve.
The Barbarian
Liturgist
Conan understands the concern - it is an issue that has cropped up repeatedly since the inception of this exercise.
In retrospect, the choice perhaps should have been made modular, with two collated options (depicting intervention/non-intervention and the level of commitment to fighting the Hin'in).
If there is no serious opposition, Conan will strongly consider a 'play-off' vote, in situations such as this, in the future, so as to better reflect the will of the voting body.
This democracy business makes the Barbarian's head hurt. His inclination is to hit things until they agree to his views.
The Barbarian
Liturgist
The Wheel Keeps on Turning
The Fourth Great Terror and the Leonidian Purges would wrack the newly reincorporated Commonwealth space for almost half a decade, in the aftermath of the Respublican-Commo War. During that time, the much maligned Maxim Cassano’s DPSIA and its various political-religious instruments reshaped Commo society. The period of 360-363AU saw monumental changes take place in the governed territories, with draconian measures put into place against all forms of heresy, apostasy and dissent. Thousands more fell victim to Cassano’s holy ‘ghazi’ (a derogatory name for his security personnel, coined by bitterly resentful Commos), who left no stone unturned in stamping out evil (as they saw it). Insult was added to injury, as children orphaned in the security sweeps were ‘adopted’ by the state, to be raised as model Respublicans. Even back on Codexia, many were left with a sour taste in their mouths, as word reached home of Cassano’s ‘efficiency’.
The historian, of course, must always beware of hasty characterisations. Governor Maxim Cassano was a harsh man and a brutal overseer, but, according to all available information, he was also an uncompromisingly professional, astute and personally pleasant individual. Calling him a ‘monster’ is, perhaps, a distortion of the reality; an unlimited mandate with a lofty goal is fertile ground for excess. Cassano was just a man. His was an evil lurking in all men of ambition. In any case, the repression of the Terror years was wound down very carefully, as the Commos became acclimatized to their new lives as citizens of a theocratic republic. By 363AU, resistance had slackened to almost nothing. The throngs of Leonid and the shanty towns of New Bristol alike were by then resigned to their fate, and apathetic as to the future. Cassano was well rewarded for his efforts in that achievement.
In the meantime, the Venerable Respublica, as a whole, began to recover from the strains of a long and costly conflict. The damage to the home world was slowly being repaired. Monuments were put up to honour a heroic and a righteous people. The economy was given a major boost by the eventual inclusion of the old Commonwealth into the Respublican free trade zone – though productivity remained subpar. All in all, defence spending stayed high, but fell as an overall percentage of the gross domestic product. Shielding was finally installed on all major warships in the ‘Space’ fleet, and combat readiness was strongly emphasized in the published White Paper, and was thereafter maintained as a matter of course. New vessels of war were coming out of the slip yards at record pace, as the state girded itself to take part in regional politics.
The wider Hin’in War dragged on. At times intermittent – even uneventful – and at others brutal and frenetic, it was a strange sort of conflict. Months would pass without a notable clash, and then a seemingly random, swirling melee would result in the destruction of dozens of vessels. Planetary bastions were fought over methodically, with manoeuvre substituting brute force, where brute force was lacking. In Raumeni space, the Hin’in hoarded their resources, only grudgingly engaging significant forces of the insectoid resistance. They were evidently becoming misers, when it came to spending their limited available resources. The state of the fighting in the Hin’in domain, itself, was still relatively unknown. The Bron had made appreciable gains – that much seemed obvious – but had been stalemated for some time. The entire affair was becoming almost routine, and war the status quo. The longer they considered it, the more many Respublican officials wondered aloud whether or not, in fact, there was anything to gain by taking any further part in the endlessly conflict.
Searching eyes instead locked on to other possibilities for the advancement of Marianism and the human race as a whole. In particular, the Phyr Dead Zone offered a unique opportunity for renewing the colonial dynamic that had been stilted for so many decades now in the human sphere. Not only were there many known, habitable worlds strewn across the Zone, but they were also unclaimed for the most part. After all, the Phyr were a scattered, broken people, the remnants of which could hardly be expected to put up much of a fight in the face of a determined Respublican colonial drive. Another option presented itself in the form of the huge, largely unexplored expanse of space that lay to the ‘galactic north’. Though rumoured to be home to the crystalline Amoneth, Codexian pioneers had found little trace of those mythical beings over the centuries. Even if they still resided there, they were either unwilling or unable to present themselves to make contact with the encroaching humans. Finally, a Neo-Confucian school of thought strongly advocated an insular approach to state building, pushing for a virtually sterile colonial environment. They were concerned by needless expansionism, and wanted instead to focus on the internal health of the Respublica.
A long-term choice is, thus, required.
Do you... prepare the state to take advantage of the fallout from the Hin’in War? Sooner or later, the time to strike will be right. Our enemies are weakening by the day. Let us orient our economic, social and political policies toward successfully defeating these xenos, and claiming what we will from them.
OR
Do you... concentrate instead on exploiting the territories of the scattered Phyr? Their resistance would be weak – perhaps even non-existent – and their dead worlds are ripe for the taking. We could glean almost endless resources at next to no cost. The Turanei seem to have no interest there, whatsoever.
OR
Do you... choose to expand into the empty expanse to the galactic north? The Amoneth are myth and legend. If they were going to show themselves, they would have done so already. Who knows what lies beyond? Let us take advantage of this lull by exploring this stellar wilderness.
OR
Do you... look inward? The Neo-Confucians are right. Why look elsewhere for salvation, when our people continue to face uncertainty and difficulty in everyday life? Let us pursue peaceful, internal development. Let us expand our economy, broaden our horizons and carve out our own destinies. We will not be weakened by peace. Quite the contrary; it will cement the Venerable Respublica across the stars. Our fleets will be strong and our people happy.
Please Note: Long-term, in this case, signifies that the choice will affect at least a decade of game-time. Consider it from that perspective.
The Fourth Great Terror and the Leonidian Purges would wrack the newly reincorporated Commonwealth space for almost half a decade, in the aftermath of the Respublican-Commo War. During that time, the much maligned Maxim Cassano’s DPSIA and its various political-religious instruments reshaped Commo society. The period of 360-363AU saw monumental changes take place in the governed territories, with draconian measures put into place against all forms of heresy, apostasy and dissent. Thousands more fell victim to Cassano’s holy ‘ghazi’ (a derogatory name for his security personnel, coined by bitterly resentful Commos), who left no stone unturned in stamping out evil (as they saw it). Insult was added to injury, as children orphaned in the security sweeps were ‘adopted’ by the state, to be raised as model Respublicans. Even back on Codexia, many were left with a sour taste in their mouths, as word reached home of Cassano’s ‘efficiency’.
The historian, of course, must always beware of hasty characterisations. Governor Maxim Cassano was a harsh man and a brutal overseer, but, according to all available information, he was also an uncompromisingly professional, astute and personally pleasant individual. Calling him a ‘monster’ is, perhaps, a distortion of the reality; an unlimited mandate with a lofty goal is fertile ground for excess. Cassano was just a man. His was an evil lurking in all men of ambition. In any case, the repression of the Terror years was wound down very carefully, as the Commos became acclimatized to their new lives as citizens of a theocratic republic. By 363AU, resistance had slackened to almost nothing. The throngs of Leonid and the shanty towns of New Bristol alike were by then resigned to their fate, and apathetic as to the future. Cassano was well rewarded for his efforts in that achievement.
In the meantime, the Venerable Respublica, as a whole, began to recover from the strains of a long and costly conflict. The damage to the home world was slowly being repaired. Monuments were put up to honour a heroic and a righteous people. The economy was given a major boost by the eventual inclusion of the old Commonwealth into the Respublican free trade zone – though productivity remained subpar. All in all, defence spending stayed high, but fell as an overall percentage of the gross domestic product. Shielding was finally installed on all major warships in the ‘Space’ fleet, and combat readiness was strongly emphasized in the published White Paper, and was thereafter maintained as a matter of course. New vessels of war were coming out of the slip yards at record pace, as the state girded itself to take part in regional politics.
The wider Hin’in War dragged on. At times intermittent – even uneventful – and at others brutal and frenetic, it was a strange sort of conflict. Months would pass without a notable clash, and then a seemingly random, swirling melee would result in the destruction of dozens of vessels. Planetary bastions were fought over methodically, with manoeuvre substituting brute force, where brute force was lacking. In Raumeni space, the Hin’in hoarded their resources, only grudgingly engaging significant forces of the insectoid resistance. They were evidently becoming misers, when it came to spending their limited available resources. The state of the fighting in the Hin’in domain, itself, was still relatively unknown. The Bron had made appreciable gains – that much seemed obvious – but had been stalemated for some time. The entire affair was becoming almost routine, and war the status quo. The longer they considered it, the more many Respublican officials wondered aloud whether or not, in fact, there was anything to gain by taking any further part in the endlessly conflict.
Searching eyes instead locked on to other possibilities for the advancement of Marianism and the human race as a whole. In particular, the Phyr Dead Zone offered a unique opportunity for renewing the colonial dynamic that had been stilted for so many decades now in the human sphere. Not only were there many known, habitable worlds strewn across the Zone, but they were also unclaimed for the most part. After all, the Phyr were a scattered, broken people, the remnants of which could hardly be expected to put up much of a fight in the face of a determined Respublican colonial drive. Another option presented itself in the form of the huge, largely unexplored expanse of space that lay to the ‘galactic north’. Though rumoured to be home to the crystalline Amoneth, Codexian pioneers had found little trace of those mythical beings over the centuries. Even if they still resided there, they were either unwilling or unable to present themselves to make contact with the encroaching humans. Finally, a Neo-Confucian school of thought strongly advocated an insular approach to state building, pushing for a virtually sterile colonial environment. They were concerned by needless expansionism, and wanted instead to focus on the internal health of the Respublica.
A long-term choice is, thus, required.
Do you... prepare the state to take advantage of the fallout from the Hin’in War? Sooner or later, the time to strike will be right. Our enemies are weakening by the day. Let us orient our economic, social and political policies toward successfully defeating these xenos, and claiming what we will from them.
OR
Do you... concentrate instead on exploiting the territories of the scattered Phyr? Their resistance would be weak – perhaps even non-existent – and their dead worlds are ripe for the taking. We could glean almost endless resources at next to no cost. The Turanei seem to have no interest there, whatsoever.
OR
Do you... choose to expand into the empty expanse to the galactic north? The Amoneth are myth and legend. If they were going to show themselves, they would have done so already. Who knows what lies beyond? Let us take advantage of this lull by exploring this stellar wilderness.
OR
Do you... look inward? The Neo-Confucians are right. Why look elsewhere for salvation, when our people continue to face uncertainty and difficulty in everyday life? Let us pursue peaceful, internal development. Let us expand our economy, broaden our horizons and carve out our own destinies. We will not be weakened by peace. Quite the contrary; it will cement the Venerable Respublica across the stars. Our fleets will be strong and our people happy.
Please Note: Long-term, in this case, signifies that the choice will affect at least a decade of game-time. Consider it from that perspective.
- Joined
- Jun 18, 2002
- Messages
- 28,548
Technically it's Raumeni bitch and oh yes they did. Never forget that it was the Ramen who occupied Schadenfreude.BethesdaLove said:
I have not forgotten. Have you?
What utter piffle, tripe and nonsense councillors! Why would we go to war in the aide of xenos?Flying Spaghetti Monster said:
There is an end-game scenario in here somewhere. One in which we can focus on the home-front and defend ourselves against any future unwarranted aggression.
The Barbarian
Liturgist
You have embarrassed Conan, but you have done so correctly. He will forgive you this gaffe.
The Barbarian
Liturgist
If there is strong ambiguity, a play-off vote will definitely be employed to make the Will of the People clear.
- Joined
- Jun 18, 2002
- Messages
- 28,548
Easy way is if people choose to do so, they express their preference when they vote.
EG: A D B C. Meaning if A doesn't get enough votes, their second preference is D. If that too fails, they'd prefer B over C. And if people only vote for one or two options, then they risk whatever the consequences of that might be.
EG: A D B C. Meaning if A doesn't get enough votes, their second preference is D. If that too fails, they'd prefer B over C. And if people only vote for one or two options, then they risk whatever the consequences of that might be.
obediah
Erudite
- Joined
- Jan 31, 2005
- Messages
- 5,051
root said:
Yeah, when I went through yesterday, A had more votes than BCD combined. So I figured it would be better to wait until after voting was closed to make my observation. If it had been something like 5-4-4-4 where there was a clear mandate for intervention, I would have spoken up sooner.
The Barbarian
Liturgist
A cogent idea.
The Barbarian proposes the following:
Each voter will order their choice preferences, with (1) being the first choice and (4) being the last choice.
Ie:
A - 1
C - 2
D - 3
B - 4
The option with the lowest collated sum wins.
Thoughts are welcomed.
The Barbarian proposes the following:
Each voter will order their choice preferences, with (1) being the first choice and (4) being the last choice.
Ie:
A - 1
C - 2
D - 3
B - 4
The option with the lowest collated sum wins.
Thoughts are welcomed.
I am not quite ready to vote yet, but at the moment, I'm liking the sound of B. It will give us a lot of new worlds at a known, low risk. The Amoneth may or may not be around and upset. The Phyr are a broken people, and live only because of our mercy.
Preparing to rejoin the war or looking inwards seem like choices that will ultimately lead to stagnation.
Preparing to rejoin the war or looking inwards seem like choices that will ultimately lead to stagnation.
taplonaplo
Scholar
- Joined
- Aug 8, 2008
- Messages
- 628
B - 1
D - 2
A - 3
C - 4
D - 2
A - 3
C - 4
- Joined
- Jun 18, 2002
- Messages
- 28,548
The Amoneth have intervened in the past, giving their shield technology to the ill-fated Phyr - whom we then assisted the Turanei to annihiliate (though we did resettle some refugees to our outer-worlds). Many Human lives were sacrificed to that end.
To my understanding, the Phyr Dead Zone is a large uninhabited area of space with many rich resource-filled worlds ripe for plunder. Let's take advantage of this and expand there. It would give home to Billions of Humans and moving into that territory would greatly expand the Respublican Empire. Territory wise, we occupy a tiny region of space. Let us expand in numbers and strength. Fuck looking inward while there is the opportuniy of a vast open expanse to exploit.
I do not believe the territories to the North are unoccupied as has been stated. We know the Phyr Zone, as our fleets have been there before. I believe expanding into the Amoneth will risk an unknown confrontation - and if we are to have confrontation, let it be with what we know. Failing that, we should prepare to take advantage of our enemy's weakened situation. We borrowed Billions from the Ramen at one time - I don't think we ever paid that back for a reason.
B - 1
A - 2
C - 3
D - 4
To my understanding, the Phyr Dead Zone is a large uninhabited area of space with many rich resource-filled worlds ripe for plunder. Let's take advantage of this and expand there. It would give home to Billions of Humans and moving into that territory would greatly expand the Respublican Empire. Territory wise, we occupy a tiny region of space. Let us expand in numbers and strength. Fuck looking inward while there is the opportuniy of a vast open expanse to exploit.
I do not believe the territories to the North are unoccupied as has been stated. We know the Phyr Zone, as our fleets have been there before. I believe expanding into the Amoneth will risk an unknown confrontation - and if we are to have confrontation, let it be with what we know. Failing that, we should prepare to take advantage of our enemy's weakened situation. We borrowed Billions from the Ramen at one time - I don't think we ever paid that back for a reason.
B - 1
A - 2
C - 3
D - 4
juggernaut
Educated
B
C
A
D
C
A
D
anus_pounder
Arcane
Well, the crystals did give the Phyr the cloaking tech, who knows what else they have? I would rather not mess with them for now. Also, these taurani lizard people, are they a match for say....the Hin'n ? or the old unified ramen ?
EDIT : Forgot to vote.
B - 1
C - 2
D - 3
A - 4
EDIT : Forgot to vote.
B - 1
C - 2
D - 3
A - 4
The Barbarian
Liturgist
You cannot be sure about how they would conduct a war with the Hin'in, but the Turanei would be able to defeat the old unified Raumeni clans in fairly short order. The reports of their battles with the Phyr are fairly instructive. The Turanei would be an absolute menace to almost any foe.
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