Incline The Death of Freemium? Microtransactions Under Global Scrutiny

[Swigen]

“My kid’s got me so cucked I have no control over wut he buys with muh credit card on muh computer on the gaem I bought him. Thank u so much goverment for lookin out fer da chidren! P.S. gaems r too violent an sexul an cause shootins an I buy rated M for muh 7 yr old, plz halp!!!”

Remember the 1-900 $5 a minute tip line they printed in the back of EVERY game instruction manual back in the day and parents whined about their kids running up the phone bill and the government was like, “just beat you’re kids faggot”.?

 

[Cael]

“My kid’s got me so cucked I have no control over wut he buys with muh credit card on muh computer on the gaem I bought him. Thank u so much goverment for lookin out fer da chidren! P.S. gaems r too violent an sexul an cause shootins an I buy rated M for muh 7 yr old, plz halp!!!”

Remember the 1-900 $5 a minute tip line they printed in the back of EVERY game instruction manual back in the day and parents whined about their kids running up the phone bill and the government was like, “just beat you’re kids faggot”.?

You can't do that any more, thanks to sjw shits. It is now literally illegal in some countries to smack your kids.

 

[ZodoZ]

“My kid’s got me so cucked I have no control over wut he buys with muh credit card on muh computer on the gaem I bought him. Thank u so much goverment for lookin out fer da chidren! P.S. gaems r too violent an sexul an cause shootins an I buy rated M for muh 7 yr old, plz halp!!!”

Remember the 1-900 $5 a minute tip line they printed in the back of EVERY game instruction manual back in the day and parents whined about their kids running up the phone bill and the government was like, “just beat you’re kids faggot”.?

You can't do that any more, thanks to sjw shits. It is now literally illegal in some countries to smack your kids.

Therein lies a major problem in the world today (at least in the "civilized" unhappy parts of the globe.

 

[Wyatt_Derp]

We live in an era when credit-starved culture blobs need government intervention to stop them from pulling the lever of consumer drip-drops. There's not really words to describe how moronic and pointless this is.

Except that it gets the camel's nose under the tent a bit more. That makes more sense, but the obvious isn't apparent to those not paying attention.

 

[Infinitron]

https://www.theverge.com/2019/5/23/...-hawley-markey-blumenthal-privacy-video-games

Bill to ban the sale of loot boxes to children presses forward with bipartisan support
Sens. Ed Markey and Richard Blumenthal are on board

Today, Sen. Josh Hawley (R-MO) will be formally introducing his bill to ban the sale of loot boxes to children, and two of his Democratic colleagues have signed on in support of the legislation.

Hawley’s Protecting Children from Abusive Games Act would, if approved, prohibit video game companies from selling loot boxes to children under the age of 18 and make it unlawful for minor-oriented games to include pay-to-win mechanics. If a games company was found to be unlawfully including these features in games targeted to minors it would be financially penalized.

It’s only been a few months since Hawley has taken office and he’s already built up a reputation as a tough critic of US tech companies like Facebook and Google. With this new legislation, Hawley has paired up with two other lawmakers, Sens. Ed Markey (D-MA) and Richard Blumenthal (D-CT), to tackle what they believe to be exploitation in the gaming space.

“Only the addiction economy could produce a business model that relies on placing a casino in the hands of every child in America with the goal of getting them desperately hooked,” Hawley said. “I’m proud to introduce this landmark, bipartisan legislation to end these exploitative practices.”

Markey has worked with Hawley before to introduce changes to the Children’s Online Privacy Protection Act (COPPA) to extend greater data privacy protections to minors online. This legislation would create an “eraser button” for parents to remove all of their child’s data from the related service.

“Today’s digital entertainment ecosystem is an online gauntlet for children,” Markey said of the loot box bill. ”Inherently manipulative game features that take advantage of kids and turn play time into pay time should be out of bounds.”

Pressure to regulate loot boxes and pay-to-win mechanics has continued to build over the course of the past few years. Loot boxes and microtransactions have become prominent features in both mobile games and those created by triple-A studios like Blizzard and Electronic Arts. Just this week, Nintendo was forced to pull two games that contained the features from the Belgium market because they violated the country’s own loot box regulations.

“I’m proud to sponsor this bipartisan legislation to protect kids from predatory gaming apps and hold bad actors accountable for their reprehensible practices,” Blumenthal said. “Congress must send a clear warning to app developers and tech companies: Children are not cash cows to exploit for profit.”

Of note, Sen. Maggie Hassan (D-NH), who first raised concerns over loot boxes last fall in a hearing with the Federal Trade Commission, is not currently a cosponsor to the bill.

 

[DalekFlay]

Who decides what is a "minor-oriented game"?

 

[Zombra]

I'd rather keep government out of all this shit.

It's not a question of ARTISTIC FREEDOM GET OFF MY BACK BIG BROTHER but whether you want microtrans in every game from here to fucking eternity because why wouldn't devs throw it in? It's incredibly profitable, gamers are compulsive people. Even if you're not compulsive, don't you find it horrifically annoying? An outright ban might not be the answer but at minimum they should tax the absolute living shit out of it, just like other gambling.

 

[Dexter]

Who decides what is a "minor-oriented game"?

Probably the ESRB, but personally I hope not and they take the broadest possible interpretation for said. If it includes the colors Red, Green or Blue would be a good metric IMO.

 

[DalekFlay]

It's not a question of ARTISTIC FREEDOM GET OFF MY BACK BIG BROTHER but whether you want microtrans in every game from here to fucking eternity because why wouldn't devs throw it in? It's incredibly profitable, gamers are compulsive people. Even if you're not compulsive, don't you find it horrifically annoying? An outright ban might not be the answer but at minimum they should tax the absolute living shit out of it.

This same argument could be used to ban pizza and hamburgers, or limit spending on gaming in general. "Gotta look out for people who can't make reasonable decisions." Fuck that, let people decide for themselves. If people want to be fucking retards and support microtransactions then that's their decision. I think it's ridiculous but I don't agree with banning other people's behaviors because I don't like them. Unless we have a surge in criminality for people to get money to buy loot boxes then it's none of my business, and none of yours either.

I'm fine with limiting access for minors though, but again who decides what is a "minor-oriented game"? That's some bullshit right there, cut that part out and stick with the 18 years old age limit.

 

[Zombra]

This same argument could be used to ban pizza and hamburgers.

Yes. That is why we have the Food and Drug Administration. Want to abolish that too?

 

[c2007]

Gotta love the consumer advocacy in this thread.

A psychologically predatory practice is not good, even if it is profitable. It isn't about shitty parents (they exist anyway), it is about a bullshit model that preys on the ignorant and weak (children) while annoying the fuck out of me.

That we need to make a law about it says more about modern morality and the primacy of profit than it does about some Orwellian future. The former we can do something about.

 

[Steamboat Willie]

I just love how many faggots are now unironically screaming "Think of the children!" and clamoring for government regulation of video games after fighting against it for years.

 

[deuxhero]

Who decides what is a "minor-oriented game"?

From what I've read it draws on a definition in existing law regarding privacy policies.

 

[Zombra]

I just love how many faggots are now unironically screaming "Think of the children!" and clamoring for government regulation of video games after fighting against it for years.

You're an idiot. No one is advocating for censorship of content here (or anywhere), which is what the former conversation was about.

"Wait, we're having another different argument? But we argued about something before and I was right that time! I'm automatically right every time now!"

And even if the "prior argument" argument was valid, you'd still be wrong, because gambling was regulated a million years before video games even existed, so regulating it again now is perfectly consistent.

 

[Steamboat Willie]

You're an idiot. No one is advocating for censorship of content here (or anywhere)

Good thing that's not what I said then.

 

[Swigen]

Yeah, poor little bastards with credit cards. Everyone agrees lootboxes and pay to win is horse shit but as soon as you invite the government to intervene in anything with “fer da children” attached it becomes a very slippery slope where you may not like the next law that’s passed “fer da children”.

 

[Zombra]

You're an idiot. No one is advocating for censorship of content here (or anywhere)

Good thing that's not what I said then.

Then what the fuck are you talking about?

 

[c2007]

It's not for the children. It's for the people. I don't gamble because I understand how gambling works, and I also have not tried gitting gud at it because I prefer less risk.

Almost all of us (big almost) here are significantly smarter than the average consumer. The average person is not very bright and works hard for their money.

How cool of the greedy smart people to prey on the ignorant worker. How wise of them, to live for today and always maximize personal profit. An endless caste system of slaves to work to death and bilk, huzzah!

There may not be Good, but there is plenty of evil.

 

[Dexter]

I just love how many faggots are now unironically screaming "Think of the children!" and clamoring for government regulation of video games after fighting against it for years.

I've always been for regulation when it's sensible and hopefully reaches a good and positive outcome for consumers: https://rpgcodex.net/forums/index.php?threads/why-net-neutrality’s-peril-raises-the-stakes-for-future-satellite-broadband-options.119255/page-2#post-5393669

Trying to regulate things like violence/sexual content in entertainment is bad since it would be suppression of speech, it would also be against the First Amendment so I don't expect any such legislation from the legislative in the US (private pressure groups and large businesses are a lot more concerning here as we've seen over the past few years): https://www.cnet.com/news/video-games-given-full-first-amendment-protection/

Gambling is rather different here and has been regulated for hundreds of years, this is just the law catching up with modern technological implementations of it and its gamification after plenty of abuse by even mainstream companies.

Blanketly/kneejerkedly being against any regulation, even if it's for a good reason or lead to a good outcome because "regulation bad" is stupid and on top of that an untenable and extreme position. Regulations are all around us at all time and as Zombra pointed out many of those times for good reason, which is why an argument talking about "pizza and burgers" in this context is also stupid. You for instance wouldn't want your pizza or burger to be poisonous or contain certain unsafe ingredients or to be prepared in unhygienic conditions. There are probably hundreds or even thousands of regulations that apply to making things like pizza or burgers, from concerns regarding employment, to things like fire safety standards to hygiene and health standards. Even in places like Egypt they have some health standards and regulations and for instance arrest people for bottling juice in factories that look like this: https://www.wereblog.com/revolting-juice-factory-in-egypt

Spoiler

If you want to make an argument as to why this is bad, your argument shouldn't be "regulation is bad!" since that's pretty low level and untenable with there being hundreds of thousands of regulations applying to you and the things you buy or interact with every day including at home and in your workplace and whatnot, but pointing out exactly why you think this regulation is bad or might lead to a bad outcome and come up with compelling reasons why one should be against it.

 

[Humanophage]

How do children even gamble? You are not supposed to give money to children because they are not yet capable of using it, as the argument seems to agree. Children are quite interested in buying other questionable things too - e.g., collectible cards or unhealthy food.

Alternatively, if you choose to give money to the child because you think it will get them used to capitalism or something, then there is no problem if they spend the money however they see fit. It is quite likely that they'll be embarrassed about it down the road.

 

[HeroMarine]

Yeah, poor little bastards with credit cards. Everyone agrees lootboxes and pay to win is horse shit but as soon as you invite the government to intervene in anything with “fer da children” attached it becomes a very slippery slope where you may not like the next law that’s passed “fer da children”.

We will worry about the next law when we arrive there.

 

[Goi~Yaas~Dinn]

https://www.theverge.com/2019/5/23/...-hawley-markey-blumenthal-privacy-video-games

Bill to ban the sale of loot boxes to children presses forward with bipartisan support
Sens. Ed Markey and Richard Blumenthal are on board

Today, Sen. Josh Hawley (R-MO) will be formally introducing his bill to ban the sale of loot boxes to children, and two of his Democratic colleagues have signed on in support of the legislation.

Hawley’s Protecting Children from Abusive Games Act would, if approved, prohibit video game companies from selling loot boxes to children under the age of 18 and make it unlawful for minor-oriented games to include pay-to-win mechanics. If a games company was found to be unlawfully including these features in games targeted to minors it would be financially penalized.

It’s only been a few months since Hawley has taken office and he’s already built up a reputation as a tough critic of US tech companies like Facebook and Google. With this new legislation, Hawley has paired up with two other lawmakers, Sens. Ed Markey (D-MA) and Richard Blumenthal (D-CT), to tackle what they believe to be exploitation in the gaming space.

“Only the addiction economy could produce a business model that relies on placing a casino in the hands of every child in America with the goal of getting them desperately hooked,” Hawley said. “I’m proud to introduce this landmark, bipartisan legislation to end these exploitative practices.”

Markey has worked with Hawley before to introduce changes to the Children’s Online Privacy Protection Act (COPPA) to extend greater data privacy protections to minors online. This legislation would create an “eraser button” for parents to remove all of their child’s data from the related service.

“Today’s digital entertainment ecosystem is an online gauntlet for children,” Markey said of the loot box bill. ”Inherently manipulative game features that take advantage of kids and turn play time into pay time should be out of bounds.”

Pressure to regulate loot boxes and pay-to-win mechanics has continued to build over the course of the past few years. Loot boxes and microtransactions have become prominent features in both mobile games and those created by triple-A studios like Blizzard and Electronic Arts. Just this week, Nintendo was forced to pull two games that contained the features from the Belgium market because they violated the country’s own loot box regulations.

“I’m proud to sponsor this bipartisan legislation to protect kids from predatory gaming apps and hold bad actors accountable for their reprehensible practices,” Blumenthal said. “Congress must send a clear warning to app developers and tech companies: Children are not cash cows to exploit for profit.”

Of note, Sen. Maggie Hassan (D-NH), who first raised concerns over loot boxes last fall in a hearing with the Federal Trade Commission, is not currently a cosponsor to the bill.

If it's bipartisan now, then I'm certainly less suspicious of it, even with Hawly's name attached.

It's not a question of ARTISTIC FREEDOM GET OFF MY BACK BIG BROTHER but whether you want microtrans in every game from here to fucking eternity because why wouldn't devs throw it in? It's incredibly profitable, gamers are compulsive people. Even if you're not compulsive, don't you find it horrifically annoying? An outright ban might not be the answer but at minimum they should tax the absolute living shit out of it.

This same argument could be used to ban pizza and hamburgers, or limit spending on gaming in general. "Gotta look out for people who can't make reasonable decisions." Fuck that, let people decide for themselves. If people want to be fucking retards and support microtransactions then that's their decision. I think it's ridiculous but I don't agree with banning other people's behaviors because I don't like them. Unless we have a surge in criminality for people to get money to buy loot boxes then it's none of my business, and none of yours either.

I'm fine with limiting access for minors though, but again who decides what is a "minor-oriented game"? That's some bullshit right there, cut that part out and stick with the 18 years old age limit.

Fascinating. Could you fuck off back to Rapture now, please?

It's not for the children. It's for the people. I don't gamble because I understand how gambling works, and I also have not tried gitting gud at it because I prefer less risk.

Almost all of us (big almost) here are significantly smarter than the average consumer. The average person is not very bright and works hard for their money.

How cool of the greedy smart people to prey on the ignorant worker. How wise of them, to live for today and always maximize personal profit. An endless caste system of slaves to work to death and bilk, huzzah!

There may not be Good, but there is plenty of evil.

 

[Irata]

Most games won't be bothered much by this bill if it passes. For example, Fortnite, as far as I know, only has cosmetic microtransactions. So there is no "pay-to-win" there. Any time someone wants to buy a lootbox all that will happen is they'll be required to enter a password or have to reenter payment details. Does Fortnite even have lootboxes? If not then this bill won't impact games like that at all. Cosmetic microtransactions aren't loot boxes and they're not pay-to-win. I'm guessing this is a smartphone issue for the most part.

 

[Clockwork Knight]

https://nichegamer.com/2019/05/23/n...g-pocket-camp-in-belgium-over-loot-box-fears/

Nintendo to Shut Down Fire Emblem Heroes and Animal Crossing Pocket Camp in Belgium Over Loot Box Fears
by Ryan Pearson | @rppokepower on May 23, 2019 at 12:30 PM, EDT

Nintendo will be adding to the growing list of games that will no longer be available in Belgium, after officials declared loot boxes as a form of gambling, and vowed to ban them.

The two titles, Fire Emblem Heroes and Animal Crossing Pocket Camp, will no longer be distributed to smartphone accounts based in Belgium. A statement on the official Nintendo Belgium website also explained when the games would no longer be available, that purchased currency could still be spent and that future monetized games would not be released in the region:

“Due to the current unclear situation in Belgium regarding certain in-game revenue models, we have decided to end the service for Animal Crossing: Pocket Camp and Fire Emblem Heroes in Belgium. It will therefore no longer be possible to play and download the games from Tuesday 27th August 2019.

Players who still have Orbs and / or Leaf Tickets in their account can continue to use them until the service ends. In addition, future Nintendo games with similar earnings models will no longer be released in Belgium.

We would like to thank all players in Belgium for playing Animal Crossing: Pocket Camp and Fire Emblem Heroes.”

Other games that have pulled services from the region include Kingdom Hearts Union X [Cross], Dissidia Final Fantasy Opera Omina, and Mobius Final Fantasy. EA meanwhile removed premium currency from FIFA 18 and FIFA 19.

For those outside of Belgium, Fire Emblem Heroes and Animal Crossing Pocket Camp are available now on Android and iOS.

 

[DalekFlay]

I just love how many faggots are now unironically screaming "Think of the children!" and clamoring for government regulation of video games after fighting against it for years.

This forum is filled with mommy state euros, sadly.