Icewind Dale The Icewind Dale Series Thread

[the_shadow]

I don't like playing with ECL classes, especially Drow and Deep Gnome. They might be OK for fighters, but not for spellcasters. It slows down their spell progression, and unless you level squat, you're not going to get Level 9 spells at the end of normal mode.

Picking the Transmuter class for a minor increase in HP and cold resistance seems a bit pedantic. I think a druid would be better for the different spellbook (particularly barkskin, spiritual wrath, sunbeam, smashing wave, and moonblade).

 

[baturinsky]

Spell Resistance is a big deal, and if you play with small party, there is more then enough exp to go around.

 

[the_shadow]

Spell resistance is gravy. You don't have to fight many dangerous mages, and even then, you have Holy Aura.

 

[roshan]

I don't like playing with ECL classes, especially Drow and Deep Gnome. They might be OK for fighters, but not for spellcasters. It slows down their spell progression, and unless you level squat, you're not going to get Level 9 spells at the end of normal mode.

Well it will just increase the satisfaction of getting those spells in HOF. I really don't pick characters builds that make the game easier, I don't mind playing through battles with gimped characters as long as I know they will come out more powerful in the long run.

Picking the Transmuter class for a minor increase in HP and cold resistance seems a bit pedantic. I think a druid would be better for the different spellbook (particularly barkskin, spiritual wrath, sunbeam, smashing wave, and moonblade).

It's not just that, it's also because they have what I consider the most skip-worthy opposition schools. Illusionists have the exact same opposition schools, but then transmuters win because of the gameplay elements.

 

[Roguey]

Yes, they do suck. We are talking about powergaming here.

Hmm okay.

http://www.gamefaqs.com/pc/552350-icewind-dale-ii/faqs/21354

Icewind Dale 2: Ultimate Powergaming Party FAQ
by Ken J. Egervari
...
Here are the skills and feats you should take for this character:

Skills: Concentration (cross-class for Maximize Attacks)
Feats: 1- Fighter(1): Power Attack,
Martial Weapon, Great Sword (WF)
3- Barbarian(1)/Fighter(2): Cleave,
Simple Weapon, Mace (WF),
6- Barbarian(2)/Fighter(4): Martial Weapon, Great Sword (WS)
Simple Weapon, Mace (WS)
...
As I mentioned earlier, I think it's important that you select Great Swords,
Axes (for 2-Handed Axes for 3x criticals) or another two-handed weapon for
this character, so it only makes sense that you get the Weapon Focus and
Specialization feats for these weapons. I also thought there was an
abundance of high quality maces in the game, and since you need to master 2
weapons to get Maximized Attacks, it's a good idea to take those feats too.

There's a "power gamer" who recommends that you put points into greatswords in his "ultimate powergaming party faq," ergo you are wrong about their being no decent greatswords.

Or as Josh says "balance is subjective and applicability varies based on character build, play style, and content."

 

[roshan]

Yes, they do suck. We are talking about powergaming here.

Hmm okay.

http://www.gamefaqs.com/pc/552350-icewind-dale-ii/faqs/21354

Icewind Dale 2: Ultimate Powergaming Party FAQ
by Ken J. Egervari
...
Here are the skills and feats you should take for this character:

Skills: Concentration (cross-class for Maximize Attacks)
Feats: 1- Fighter(1): Power Attack,
Martial Weapon, Great Sword (WF)
3- Barbarian(1)/Fighter(2): Cleave,
Simple Weapon, Mace (WF),
6- Barbarian(2)/Fighter(4): Martial Weapon, Great Sword (WS)
Simple Weapon, Mace (WS)
...
As I mentioned earlier, I think it's important that you select Great Swords,
Axes (for 2-Handed Axes for 3x criticals) or another two-handed weapon for
this character, so it only makes sense that you get the Weapon Focus and
Specialization feats for these weapons. I also thought there was an
abundance of high quality maces in the game, and since you need to master 2
weapons to get Maximized Attacks, it's a good idea to take those feats too.

There's a "power gamer" who recommends that you put points into greatswords in his "ultimate powergaming party faq," ergo you are wrong about their being no decent greatswords.

Obviously not all supposed "powergamers" are as good at it as others. This powergamer is obviously a failure at powergaming, in the same way that many game designers are failures at game design.

 

[octavius]

How great is Josh's sword, Roguey? Does he let you polish it?

 

[Roguey]

Obviously not all supposed "powergamers" are as good at it as others. This powergamer is obviously a failure at powergaming, in the same way that many game designers are failures at game design.

He wrote a 27,000+ word text about it which is more than you can say. :D

Josh describing the roshans of the world:

The goal is not to make everyone "happy" because a) it's impossible and b) some people are only happy when their niche is excessively rewarded. E.g. sUpAh SnYpA fans in F:NV were very sad when the x5 crit chance bonus was removed from the Sniper Rifle and Gobi Campaign Rifle even though those weapons were still extremely good in their intended role. It didn't matter to some people. They wanted them to be good in all roles. Well, too bad.

Similarly, if someone wants plate armor to be realistic in PE or they want wearing leather armor to allow you to do 300% more damage than someone in heavy armor, those people aren't going to get what they want. That's fine. We have stated pretty clear goals both internally and externally. As long as we feel that we hit those goals and the majority of players agree, we can't worry about the margins who a) never agreed with those goals or b) don't feel we met them. It's just not a productive way to go about design.

 

[Rake]

How great is Josh's sword, Roguey? Does he let you polish it?

Well, if you consider that he is dead set to make daggers competetive against greatswords...

 

[octavius]

How great is Josh's sword, Roguey? Does he let you polish it?

Well, if you consider that he is dead set to make daggers competetive against greatswords...

Which is better?
Several quick thrusts or one long thrust?

 

[roshan]

Obviously not all supposed "powergamers" are as good at it as others. This powergamer is obviously a failure at powergaming, in the same way that many game designers are failures at game design.

He wrote a 27,000+ word text about it which is more than you can say. :D

Tsk tsk. Quite desperate of you to hide behind argumentum ab auctoritate. I think we're done here.

 

[roshan]

How great is Josh's sword, Roguey? Does he let you polish it?

Well, if you consider that he is dead set to make daggers competetive against greatswords...

Which is better?
Several quick thrusts or one long thrust?

Would he rather face it power attacking head on, or have it do a sneak attack from behind?

 

[ZagorTeNej]

Roguey do you consider level squatting to be degenerate gameplay?

 

[Roguey]

Roguey do you consider level squatting to be degenerate gameplay?

The way IWD2 handled xp was bad.

 

[baturinsky]

Roguey do you consider level squatting to be degenerate gameplay?

What is level squatting? Having ballast 1-level chars to pull average party xp low enough to keep getting combat exp?

 

[the_shadow]

Yes, they do suck. We are talking about powergaming here.

Hmm okay.

http://www.gamefaqs.com/pc/552350-icewind-dale-ii/faqs/21354

Icewind Dale 2: Ultimate Powergaming Party FAQ
by Ken J. Egervari
...
Here are the skills and feats you should take for this character:

Skills: Concentration (cross-class for Maximize Attacks)
Feats: 1- Fighter(1): Power Attack,
Martial Weapon, Great Sword (WF)
3- Barbarian(1)/Fighter(2): Cleave,
Simple Weapon, Mace (WF),
6- Barbarian(2)/Fighter(4): Martial Weapon, Great Sword (WS)
Simple Weapon, Mace (WS)
...
As I mentioned earlier, I think it's important that you select Great Swords,
Axes (for 2-Handed Axes for 3x criticals) or another two-handed weapon for
this character, so it only makes sense that you get the Weapon Focus and
Specialization feats for these weapons. I also thought there was an
abundance of high quality maces in the game, and since you need to master 2
weapons to get Maximized Attacks, it's a good idea to take those feats too.

There's a "power gamer" who recommends that you put points into greatswords in his "ultimate powergaming party faq," ergo you are wrong about their being no decent greatswords.

Or as Josh says "balance is subjective and applicability varies based on character build, play style, and content."

The author recommended investing in a two-handed weapon (most likely due to the 1.5 multiplier to the strength modifier). They never commented on whether weapon selection was better or worse for great swords.

 

[roshan]

What is level squatting? Having ballast 1-level chars to pull average party xp low enough to keep getting combat exp?

It means not leveling up characters even though they have already enough XP to advance to the next level. I think what you described is called muling.

 

[Minttunator]

 

[Minttunator]

Thanks for the additional comments, bro! I'm not that worried about spoilers - this is a hack and slash game, after all.
I'm gonna have a look at the loot tables to see how bad the situation is with great swords and read more about Bane clerics - maybe I'll end up making some changes to the party.

I have to say that after reading up on some of the stuff that was discussed here I did end up restarting with an axe fighter and Bane cleric instead of what I originally rolled, so thanks to everyone that chimed in with advice.

The playthrough is currently on hold, though, thanks to the Path of Exile expansion being released and also partly due to the fact that - I'm sad to say - IWD2 feels like quite a slog. The starting area, Targos, was a ton of fun - especially since my expectations were pretty low - but the quality drops off pretty rapidly after that and the rest of the game thus far has been inferior to IWD1, in my opinion. Granted, I'm only in the Ice Temple, so I'm sure it'll improve towards the end.

 

[dukeofwhales]

The ice temple is the low point of the game. The remaining content is generally pretty good, although it's pretty erratic. The last chapter in particular is great.

 

[roshan]

Thanks for the additional comments, bro! I'm not that worried about spoilers - this is a hack and slash game, after all.
I'm gonna have a look at the loot tables to see how bad the situation is with great swords and read more about Bane clerics - maybe I'll end up making some changes to the party.

I have to say that after reading up on some of the stuff that was discussed here I did end up restarting with an axe fighter and Bane cleric instead of what I originally rolled, so thanks to everyone that chimed in with advice.

The playthrough is currently on hold, though, thanks to the Path of Exile expansion being released and also partly due to the fact that - I'm sad to say - IWD2 feels like quite a slog. The starting area, Targos, was a ton of fun - especially since my expectations were pretty low - but the quality drops off pretty rapidly after that and the rest of the game thus far has been inferior to IWD1, in my opinion. Granted, I'm only in the Ice Temple, so I'm sure it'll improve towards the end.

That is the worst part of the game (I wonder who designed it - JE Sawyer?). Most of my playthroughs (probably 3 out of 4) actually end at the ice temple. But whenever I have passed that point I have always finished the game!!!

 

[Metatron]

Thanks for the additional comments, bro! I'm not that worried about spoilers - this is a hack and slash game, after all.
I'm gonna have a look at the loot tables to see how bad the situation is with great swords and read more about Bane clerics - maybe I'll end up making some changes to the party.

I have to say that after reading up on some of the stuff that was discussed here I did end up restarting with an axe fighter and Bane cleric instead of what I originally rolled, so thanks to everyone that chimed in with advice.

The playthrough is currently on hold, though, thanks to the Path of Exile expansion being released and also partly due to the fact that - I'm sad to say - IWD2 feels like quite a slog. The starting area, Targos, was a ton of fun - especially since my expectations were pretty low - but the quality drops off pretty rapidly after that and the rest of the game thus far has been inferior to IWD1, in my opinion. Granted, I'm only in the Ice Temple, so I'm sure it'll improve towards the end.

IWD 2 has probably lower lows than the first one (ice temple, generic mindflayer dungeon #101) but in the end it's the better game though, mainly because both are pretty combat-oriented and the second one has D&D 3rd edition and much better encounter design than the first one. And despite the fact that they're obviously not storyfag games the overal plot and setting were also more interesting than the in that regard very unmemorable first IWD.

 

[Roguey]

That is the worst part of the game (I wonder who designed it - JE Sawyer?)

The ice temple was designed by Rob Holloway. He did Dragon's Eye as well.

 

[jdinatale]

Hey guys, I just reached chapter 2 and my characters hit level 5. I'm a complete noob, and I'm wondering who I should dual class and which class should be the second one. I have:

Paladin
Fighter
Ranger
Thief
Cleric
Mage

 

[Lilura]

The only one there worth dual-classing is the fighter, and generally you want mage. Which means you need to be human and have at least 15 Str and 17 Int. You should dual-class at clvl7 or 9.