Might and Magic The Might and Magic Discussion Thread

[Hobo Elf]

Sandro makes an appearance in MM5, among other things.

What, really? Fuck. I'm gonna have to go play MM4-5 now. Damnit.

 

[Luzur]

So is there any continuity between installments of Might and Magic? Or is it like the Final Fantasy series where there are some gameplay similarities between games, but the story and setting for each one is unique?

Let me recall.

There is a dude called Sheltem, whom you defeat in II.

As a gift, Sheltem teleports you to a world of islands in III.

Another group of people are invaded in their dreams by a magician who tells you that a skeletal necromancer living in the clouds has taken over a kingdom, which happens IV.

This group of people thus confront Sheltem in V, who was the master of the skeletal necromancer.

The heroes teleported onto the islands in III become feudal warlords of Heroes of Might and Magic strategy game, and continue their conquests in this series.

When VI happens, the entire previous story arch is closed down, and a whole new one begins in a whole new world.

The rest of MMs continue from VI.

heres the complete story up to M&M8 (it was made before M&M9 was released.):

Corak is either an Ancient, or a constructed servant of the Ancients. We really don't know who or what the Ancients are yet, but judging by the GOOD ending to MM VII, we are on the threshold of finding out.

Now, the Ancients used to spend a lot of time "seeding" the galaxy with microcosms - small biospheres supporting life. In fact, in the first 5 MM's, all the planets are flat, and in fact are strategically placed life support systems. We don't know why they did this.
About 900 years ago (if my memory of MM VII serves me) the Ancients got in a horrible war with a race called the Kreegan. A large part of the galaxy was cut off from the direct influence of the Ancients, and fell into barbarism and witchcraft. In fact, these isolated worlds are precisely the worlds in which the MM games occur.

Many of these worlds had "guardians", appointed agents of the Ancients who were sent to guide the microcosmic little flat planets to their appointed place in the galaxy.
Now then... as the story begins, Sheltem, the Guardian of Terra has gone funny in the head. As we eventually fid out from logs in the shuttles in MM V, Terra was a large, hospitable planet, which the Ancients were intending to seed with numerous of these microcosms. Apparently, the Ancients weren't too happy with the way he was running things (he became a bit of a tyrant, it seems), so they dispatched agent Corak to check things out. Corak placed Sheltem in a stasis and was bringing him home to check his programming.
Somehow, Sheltem escapes and goes on a rampage. Corak begins his long quest to track him down and neutralize him. As the story opens in MM I, Sheltem goes to ground on one of these microcosms named Vehilucar Astropod Research Nacelle. He deposes the good King Alamar and masquerades in his place. Our party of adventurers discoveres him and sets everything to rights. Sheltem flies to Central Research Observational Nacelle via a gateway which we will see more of in MM VII. It should be noted here that there is a location in MM I called Castle White Wolf. The Lord of this Castle is named IRONFIST, and one of his quests is to find LORD KILBURN. Remember those names for about 6 paragraphs.
In MM II, Sheltem winds up on CRON and starts to drive it off course and hurl it into it's sun. With a little help from Corak in stasis, our heroes manage to thwart this scheme as well. However, Sheltem escapes as we are busy decrypting a quote that will give us the password to the device and stop CRON from committing sun-icide.
Next, in MM III, Sheltem arrives back on Terra which is where the whole mess started. Again, our trustly adventurers find out what's going on behind the scenes and drive Sheltem off. Three space shuttles depart Terra. One containing Sheltem, another containing Corak in pursuit, and another containing our party of adventurers. Something happens on this journey. Sheltem lands safely on Xylonite Experimental Enviromental Nacelle. Corak lands much less safely on XEEN, and our adventurers are thrown off course, supposedly never to be seen again... at least, not until MM VII.
MM IV (Clouds of XEEN) opens up on XEEN, and our new party of adventurers defeats an evil undead lord calling himself simply, "Lord Xeen". As we defeat Lord Xeen, we see a vision of Sheltem proclaiming, "You may have defeated my lieutenant, but the Darkside of Xeen will always be mine. BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!"
MM V opens. Sheltem is up to his old tricks, masquerading as Alamar again, and driving planets off course to fly into their suns. The dragon pharaoh summons our party and they perform many tasks to set things right. Eventually, they discover Corak's shuttle, and the stage is set for the final showdown of Corak and Sheltem. You seek out a "soul box", a device which can contain Corak's essence so that you can smuggle him into Castle Alamar without Sheltem being aware. Once you arrive, you release Corak, and he finally has a chance to confront Sheltem face to face. It is obvious that Sheltem has grown very strong "in the ways of force" and is going to win this battle... but Corak grabs Sheltem and initiates his own self-destruct mechanism, destroying them both. So ends the first story arc in the Might and Magic pantheon.
(The extended 'World of Xeen' ending doesn't figure into the grand scheme too much, so I won't comment on it here.)

Hext up would be HoMM I. Per the letters, someone apparently named Morglin Ironfist was involved in a power struggle on his home planet and his lineage was usurped by his cousin. Morglin failed to make a successful coup and therefore ran for his life with a small retinue that was loyal to his line. There are a number of hints dropped that this may be the Lord Ironfist from Castle White Wolf on Varn, or perhaps one of his descedants. Note also, that MM VI has one subplot featuring a Lord Kilburn, aslo named in MM I. And MM I begins in the town of 'Sorpigal', and MM VI begins in 'New Sorpigal'. Anyway, while on the lam, Morglin Ironfist accidentally trips through a magical portal to another world, Enroth, and sets up his reign there.
HoMM II is the next scene in the story, the succession wars. Morglin's sons, Archibald and Roland have a little tiff on who is going to inherit the throne. It's all family squabbles, nothing hugely important to the overall story. At the end, Roland wins, and Archibald is turned to stone and imprisoned in the library of Castle Ironfist.
MM VI picks up again with the big picture, and makes it much bigger. The Kreegan, after 900 years of fighting the Ancients in other parts of the galaxy are finally making a push towards this region. They land in Enroth and in Erathia and start a reign of terror. MM VI takes place in Enroth. Roland is defeated in the opening battles and is captured, not to be seen again in Enroth for a LONG TIME. His wife, Catherine of Erathia has heard of her father's death and has departed for home and doesn't hear of this issue for some time.
Their son, little Nicolai, is left in charge. Our heroic adventurers are guided by the chief regent on a series of quests to figure out what is going on. Eventually we discover that the evil cult of Temple of Baa are in league with the demonic Kreegans and many other adventures are had... Eventually, the Oracle of Enroth is able to tell us how to defeat the Kreegan. We need to free the stoned Archibald! He has a magic item we need to teleport the Kreegan's nest into the void as we destroy it - in order to avoid destroying the planet as well. We succeed in defeating the Kreegan.
HoMM III follows up from MM VI and largely takes place at the same time. The Kreegan and warlocks have overrun Erathia and made quite a mess of things. Catherine arrives for her father's funeral and discoveres that the land has a bit of trouble. She takes up the banner of Erathia and begins a successful campaign to push them back. The warlocks make a pact with the Necromancers to ressurect Catherine's father as a lich and lead the war against Erathia. It's a bloody mess, but eventually Catherine wins the day, lays father to eternal rest, pushes the Warlocks back to Nighon, and forces the remaining Kreegans to hole up in Eeofol.
In all the turmoil, the re-awakened Archibald sneaks into Deyja, the land of Necromancers just north of Erathia, and begins rebuilding his influence in the world.
MM VII opens with the strongest link between the original five games. The shuttle carrying the 8 member party from MM III - which missed XEEN competely - finally crashes off the coast of Antagarich (the continent which contains Erathia, Eeofol, Avlee, Nighon, Bracada, and Tatalia.) At this time, they have a split. 4 of them decide to seek out the wizards of this world and offer them their technology and see if they can rebuild a gate to the Ancients. The other 4 seek out Archibald and the Necromancers an seek to build the Forge - a machine which can grant them extremely powerful weapons to dominate this world. Which group will succeed depends entirely on your party's actions. Assuming that you choose the 'good' path, which is fairly important for the overall story line... You will finally wipe out the Kreegans, free Roland and indirectly defeat the Necromancer's Guild. You will also succeed in building a gate which takes you to an interstellar waypoint, where you meet someone named 'Corak', though not the same 'Corak' of MM's I-V. Corak gives you some information about the Kreegans and the Ancients, and answers the question, "Where can we go from here" with, "Anywhere you want to!"
MM VIII opens. Apparently, we were a little slow to defeat the Kreegan menace. Someone among the Ancients seems to have a "Scorched Earth" policy. That is - do NOT let the Kreegans have a planet under any circumstances. If the locals can't defeat the Kreegans, destroy the planet. The Planeswalker, Escaton, who appears to be an another automaton like the original Corak, is dispatched to destroy our planet. He appears on the third continent of this world, Jadame, and opens portals to the 4 elemental planes. Once their energies leak into the world, and meet at a certain magical crystal... POP goes the world. Our heroes are tasked with the monumental project of building an alliance among the races of Jadame and closing the planes. Along the way, we discover that the order was given before we finally defeated the last of the Kreegan in MM VII, but that Escaton in unable to avert his programming and stop the process. Roland and Catherine make an important cameo appearance as they stop in Jadame on their journey from Erathia back to Enroth.
At the end of MM VIII, The Ironfist Dynasty is back on track and the Kreegan (and all of their side effects) are finally beaten down.

Also, we have found the Gateway from MM VII opened for the first time in many centuries.

My guess is that MM IX will draw us directly into the Kreegan/Ancient war.

 

[Sceptic]

There is a dude called Sheltem, whom you defeat in II.

You first defeat him in MM1 actually, where he's pretending to be King Alamar (he does this again in 5). The way he fits into MM2's story is... weird to say the least. Most of MM2 is dealing with the Megadragon and all the time-travel stuff and Sheltem just appears at the very end. It's not very clear if he had anything to do with the rest of tghe game's plot but he feels just shoehorned in.

As a gift, Sheltem teleports you to a world of islands in III.

He doesn't, you follow him there. Or more precisely, you follow Corak who's following him there.

The heroes teleported onto the islands in III become feudal warlords of Heroes of Might and Magic strategy game, and continue their conquests in this series.

No. The party from MM3 reappears in MM7 but not in any of the HOMM games. Presumably Lord Ironfist's (from MM1) son or descendant escapes through a similar gate to the one your party uses to go from MM1 to MM2 and ends up in Enroth, setting up the events of the HOMM series and MM6-8.

 

[Jaesun]

My vote goes to III.

 

[Wulfstand]

The heroes teleported onto the islands in III become feudal warlords of Heroes of Might and Magic strategy game, and continue their conquests in this series.

No. The party from MM3 reappears in MM7 but not in any of the HOMM games. Presumably Lord Ironfist's (from MM1) son or descendant escapes through a similar gate to the one your party uses to go from MM1 to MM2 and ends up in Enroth, setting up the events of the HOMM series and MM6-8.

I don't fully remember all the names of the 8 heroes, but Crag Hack is definitely one of them, and he's one of the main heroes in HoMM 3: SoD.

 

[Wyrmlord]

The heroes teleported onto the islands in III become feudal warlords of Heroes of Might and Magic strategy game, and continue their conquests in this series.

No. The party from MM3 reappears in MM7 but not in any of the HOMM games. Presumably Lord Ironfist's (from MM1) son or descendant escapes through a similar gate to the one your party uses to go from MM1 to MM2 and ends up in Enroth, setting up the events of the HOMM series and MM6-8.

I don't fully remember all the names of the 8 heroes, but Crag Hack is definitely one of them, and he's one of the main heroes in HoMM 3: SoD.

Yeah, and I have seen Crag Hack in the previous HoMMs.

But I am not going to believe Might and Magic has a lore written for consistency anyway.

MM4+5 was very childish and playful, with a lot of fourth wall breaking jokes and references, so we know that consistent setting is something that the makers threw out of the window.

However, it amazes me that a lighthearted series like Might and Magic, with Wolf Nipple Chips that you can purchase from inns, suddenly became serious business in MM6. Indeed, gaming shows a very significant shift towards looking more and more serious as time goes by.

 

[Paula Tormeson IV]

Where can I get MM8? I couldn't get this one to work.

 

[Sceptic]

I don't fully remember all the names of the 8 heroes, but Crag Hack is definitely one of them, and he's one of the main heroes in HoMM 3: SoD.

NWC had the annoying habit of recycling the same name for what is clearly different characters. You could argue that Sandro from MM5 and SOD are the same person, though I remember there were things in his background that didn't fit, but Crag Hack from MM3 and SOD just can't be the same person. In fact Crag Hack appears as far back as MM1, where he's a Knight. You can then import him into MM2, but you can't import your party from MM2 to MM3, even though they're meant to be the same characters. If they are you then have to deal with his sudden change from Knight to Barbarian. The SOD Hack is a native of Antagarich and makes no mention whatsoever of being from another planet. Then MM1-3's Hack reappears in MM7 anyway.

However, it amazes me that a lighthearted series like Might and Magic, with Wolf Nipple Chips that you can purchase from inns, suddenly became serious business in MM6. Indeed, gaming shows a very significant shift towards looking more and more serious as time goes by.

I'm not sure. MM1-2 were full of silly (Wolf Nipples Chips indeed :D) but even MM3 started showing signs of seriousness. Some of the dungeons are pretty atmospheric and all the backstory you get on the Ancient, the Creators and Sheltem is pretty serious. Also, MM5 was much darker than MM6 in tone, atmosphere and especially music, in fact I'd pick it as the darkest game in the series. It still has its sillyness, but then so did 6 which was filled with silly pop culture references.

 

[JarlFrank]

Sandro makes an appearance in MM5, among other things.

Like, the awesome necromancer guy from HoMM3 appears in Darkside of Xeen?

I have to fucking finish Darkside (only played part of it with an imported party from Clouds).

 

[Luzur]

just dont expect him to look like in HoMM3.

also, wtf Wyrmlord, i posted the complete story here, and yet you dont believe that M&M got a deep plot?

 

[Clockwork Knight]

Where can I get MM8? I couldn't get this one to work.

I'm buying it through Bucaneer's Den right now.

 

[Darth Roxor]

Like, the awesome necromancer guy from HoMM3 appears in Darkside of Xeen?

Well, sorta, but...

just dont expect him to look like in HoMM3.

 

[Wulfstand]

So i was watching this, after which i watched this.
The first link is gameplay footage of mm3 on the snes, the second's on the pc. So my question is this: did the snes version actually have better (as in waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay better) music than the pc version? That's blasphemous!

 

[Luzur]

way better music? no, PC is still number 1.

 

[DaveO]

I'm breaking the tie between MM7 and Worlds of Xeen. I think you can figure out which one I voted for.

P.S. - I'm puzzled on why some consider MM7 as the best entry in the series.

 

[Sceptic]

The video for PC music is using OPL2 for music. With MT-32 it sounds even better.

Speaking of music, has anyone played MM4-5 in DOSBox? If so which sound settings do you use? I noticed a combination of General MIDI for music and SB for sound effects resulted in a very annoying bells ringing sound whenever one of my characters miss or I walk through a door. It's REALLY annoying.

P.S. - I'm puzzled on why some consider MM7 as the best entry in the series.

I would guess because, while its world isn't as good as MM6's, the skill system is much improved. It's also easier

 

[Cynicus]

Speaking of music, has anyone played MM4-5 in DOSBox? If so which sound settings do you use? I noticed a combination of General MIDI for music and SB for sound effects resulted in a very annoying bells ringing sound whenever one of my characters miss or I walk through a door. It's REALLY annoying.

Run install and try the Sound Canvas driver instead of LAPC/MT-32.

 

[Mattresses]

of the codex

 

[Humanity has risen!]

http://www.celestialheavens.com/forums/ ... php?t=7154

Haha, in the poll at Celestial Heaven virtually no one picked III, IV or V.

 

[Luzur]

http://www.celestialheavens.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=7154

Haha, in the poll at Celestial Heaven virtually no one picked III, IV or V.[/quote

i voted MMIII

but those guys are M&M6-8 younglings, mostly, its just me and like 2 other guys that promote MM3-5.

EDIT: noticed i typed M&M II instead of III.

 

[Sceptic]

Run install and try the Sound Canvas driver instead of LAPC/MT-32.

I should've been more specific - it's the Sound Canvas option that does this. Works fine with MT-32 option, except I don't have an MT-32 and the emulators don't sound quite right.

but those guys are M&M6-8 younglings, mostly, its just me and like 2 other guys that promote MM3-5.

Most of them are HOMM fans actually. CH was started as a HOMM3 fan site initially and grew from there. You can tell by comparing how much HOMM3-4 stuff is on there compared to everything else.

 

[Luzur]

but those guys are M&M6-8 younglings, mostly, its just me and like 2 other guys that promote MM3-5.

Most of them are HOMM fans actually. CH was started as a HOMM3 fan site initially and grew from there. You can tell by comparing how much HOMM3-4 stuff is on there compared to everything else.

even more weird.

Codex should make its own Might and Magic forum.

 

[Humanity has risen!]

http://www.celestialheavens.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=7154

Haha, in the poll at Celestial Heaven virtually no one picked III, IV or V.[/quote

i voted MMIII

but those guys are M&M6-8 younglings, mostly, its just me and like 2 other guys that promote MM3-5.

EDIT: noticed i typed M&M II instead of III.

Then why don't you try promoting the games instead of letting VI-VIII overshadow everything else? It seems like these guys are practically unaware of their existence.

"OMG you youngsters get off your butts, dust off the M&M pack you got on GOG and try III, IV, and V. Here's why you should..."

You could even post a link to this thread.

I'm playing III right now and I'm so glad I did. It's simple, colorful and so beautiful, and there are a lot more features than in VI.

 

[Wyrmlord]

sportforredneck already did the Wiz 6-8 playthrough, as did theverybigslayer.

Maybe it's time for a MM6-9 LP by some brave soul. Perhaps with the later games modded?

 

[Sceptic]

Codex should make its own Might and Magic forum.

If you need a vote to do so you've got mine.

I'm playing III right now and I'm so glad I did. It's simple [...] and there are a lot more features

This is something that never ceases to amaze me with MM3-5. They are packed with features (3 even more so) yet they are so simple to play. Take combat. There are options for quickcast, or to have the character always do the same action every round, yet setting any of these never takes more than 2 clicks. When I first played the game I didn't even have to look at the manual because the function of everything was so obvious on-screen.

Maybe it's time for a MM6-9 LP by some brave soul. Perhaps with the later games modded?

I may end up unemployed at some point in the next year. If it happens I'll start an LP of the entire series including HOMM1-4. In in-universe chronological order. I'll probably never finish it though unless I stay unemployed for over a year.