The New DOOM Thread (2016)

[agentorange]

I found this.

http://www.doomworld.com/vb/wads-mods/57957-psx-doom-final-doom-tc-version-2-1-now-released/

 

[Euronymous]

That interview is from 2008, ergo irrelevant.

That's the only time that id Tech 6 has been stated of what it's going to be though.

 

[DefJam101]

While Q2 is deffo much easier than Q1 (assuming you try to fight stuff instead of going full sonic) I don't recall the hardest difficulty of Q2 having hitstun at all, let alone stunlock.

 

[praetor]

the only reason why enemies in Unreal were challenging was because the weapons sucked. fucking hard. they may have been imaginative, but they were awful. other than that, they were slightly smarter than the average AI of the time, and Q2 AI may or may not have been slightly stupider than the average. whatever the case, the only AI even remotely approaching the definition of "challenging" was (and still is, when it comes to FPS) in bots. all the rest is just slight variations of hollywood stupid

 

[AlexOfSpades]

If one day i'm ever designing an FPS, i'm calling Draq to help me. Geeze.

I think Quake's biggest failure was the scenario. Just to start, there's zero design consistency - between Quake 1, 2 and 3 the world changed completely three times. I know lore isn't exactly the most important part of a shooter, but what the hell? I personally liked the Strogg concept, but the problem with the whole series is that all three games have typically just one color. Quake 1 was mostly brown, Quake 2 was always gray (every fucking room, every fucking map, everywhere), and Quake 3 was exclusively warm tones (yellow, orange, red). The problem with this is that after some time playing the game, you quickly get tired of the maps, and they all start looking the same for you when most of them have the same colors. Unreal 1 was extremely varied in the map and color department (compare: Terraniux with the water god's temple) and this ensured that, visually, the game was always fresh. I think this is something Quake failed to do, funnily enough, in every single one of their games.

Speaking of variety, Unreal's weapon variety > Quake's. I felt that several of Quake's weapons were redundant or unimaginative. Edit: I won't lie though, many of the weapons in Unreal sucked ass, at least the razorjack and biorifle. Or should i git gud?

Going back to the thread, the title says that id ripped off Brutal Doom, seriously? Where's that, i can't find the damn thing (with all these pages)

 

[Ivan]

Doom (4)

 

[Infinitron]

Going back to the thread, the title says that id ripped off Brutal Doom, seriously? Where's that, i can't find the damn thing (with all these pages)

Start reading from here: http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/inde...ps-off-brutal-doom.81888/page-15#post-3390400

 

[DraQ]

the only reason why enemies in Unreal were challenging was because the weapons sucked. fucking hard. they may have been imaginative, but they were awful.

At worst they were somewhat underpowered.
I noticed that to be satisfying an FPS weapon should have some 1-hit potential (not guaranteed, but possible) against something and for powerful weapons this something should be a typical or stronger foe and Unreal weapons, sadly, don't pass this test above easy.

other than that, they were slightly smarter than the average AI of the time, and Q2 AI may or may not have been slightly stupider than the average.

Actually, the Q2 AI was a bit smarter than average, to the point of some reviewer jizzing over themselves because of it. The thing is it still was pretty dumb, clumsy at level navigation, while also being crippled by ridiculous reaction and attack preparation times.
Q1 had noticeably dumber AI but it was still at least nominally challenging and satisfying to play.

Unreal's AI, OTOH wasn't just a bit smarter than average, it was, and still is, pretty fucking smart in all areas but teamwork. It was programmed by guy who was essentially *THE* bot AI programmer back then and it showed.

I personally liked the Strogg concept

Well, it could have worked if they actually felt like menacing space cyborgs instead of bunch random cripples. You don't need spazz mehreens to fight such threat, a bunch of potato policemen will do.

Not coincidentally my favourite enemy in Q2 was Medic - because it was the only enemy that reminded me that I'm not fighting a random bunch of cripples with clunky prostethics and shouldn't feel bad about it. It was also the only enemy seeming to possess something along the lines of an AI.

but the problem with the whole series is that all three games have typically just one color. Quake 1 was mostly brown, Quake 2 was always gray (every fucking room, every fucking map, everywhere), and Quake 3 was exclusively warm tones (yellow, orange, red). The problem with this is that after some time playing the game, you quickly get tired of the maps, and they all start looking the same for you when most of them have the same colors. Unreal 1 was extremely varied in the map and color department (compare: Terraniux with the water god's temple) and this ensured that, visually, the game was always fresh. I think this is something Quake failed to do, funnily enough, in every single one of their games.

True. At least Quake 1, while visually monotonous, cycled through several distinct themes and featured some distinct, memorable stuff in its maps.

Not even close to Unreal's variety, but enough to make it work.

Speaking of variety, Unreal's weapon variety > Quake's. I felt that several of Quake's weapons were redundant or unimaginative.

It was worse in Q1 where SSG was pretty much SG++ and SNG was very definitely NG++, but Id never really excelled at making interesting weapons. At best they made good shotgun cycling sounds.

Edit: I won't lie though, many of the weapons in Unreal sucked ass, at least the razorjack and biorifle. Or should i git gud?

Of course you should!

Ok, biorifle wasn't the most interesting weapon (although it shone against pupae) and RJ could use, apart from generic damage +50% that should be applied to the whole arsenal, ability to continue through enemies (as did very mechanically similar and devastating in confined spaces axe in Hexen II ).
My least favourite Unreal weapon was Stinger, though. It was basically worse minigun and and worse flak cobined into one and available early in game, that you only used against bullet sponges due to always having surplus ammo for it and inability to end such fight with several powerful shots anyway.

 

[Euronymous]

What's with all the Unreal elitists?

 

[Lyric Suite]

Autism.

 

[DraQ]

Autism.

VS brain mush - which is better and why??

Discuss!!

 

[AlexOfSpades]

Sorry if we're pooping in your party. So, uhh! Doom, huh? Reboot. "Context-specific takedowns". Anyone excited?

 

[shihonage]

Not after id made it clear by their statements and actions that this is a fake video. They're afraid to put it on Youtube because people will "take it apart frame by frame".

Now they hired a Crytek guy who will try to drag the non-existing "id tech 6" to the finish line.

In the end, the pool of child saliva called Brutal Doom will have better playability than "Doom 4: Colonial Marines".

 

[dnf]

Brutal doom adds locational damage(anything less than this and you got an outdated shooter) and limb dismemberment
(optional)Cinematic takedowns, stealth takedowns actually makes melee interesting instead of irrelevant shit like the originals(Doom, quake, you name it)
Tons of new animations for enemies, improved xploshuns and graphical effects
improved sound, louder, better weapons.
improved enemie AI, more agressive enemies, etc...

Seems to me haters gonna hate a popular thing. An mod from an 20 year old game pulling out a Counter-strike and influencing a large game company deserves a deeper critical analysis instead of knee jerk reactions of oldfags.

If BD is childish, then i don't want to be an adult. Ironic, considering the nature of Doom, a game made famous thru shock value.

 

[Euronymous]

You're the first person I've seen who even likes BD.

 

[toroid]

What they should of done was added the PS1 ambient music for Doom/Final Doom. They had the better soundtracks if I recall.

Just found em

I can't play without the PSX soundtrack. I use it in all of my doom installs.

How do you get the PSX soundtrack to play during the game?

I use the PSXMUSIC.WAD file found on this page (right in the middle of the page).

I tend to have a few different file configurations so I can play whatever fits my mood. I keep all the different wads in the game folder, and I load the appropriate file groups with batch files. (I'm using GZdoom, by the way.)

For example: If I want to play Brutal doom with the PSX soundtrack then I'll create a new .txt file in the GZdoom folder and add the line "gzdoom -file brutal19.pk3 psxmusic.wad ", save it, and then change the extension to .bat, and then I'll send that .bat file to the desktop as a shortcut. Voila! Double click it to play Brutal doom with PSX music.

 

[Lyric Suite]

Brutal Doom is a relatively entertaining gimmick, but classic Doom is where its at and where it will always be.

 

[dnf]

Brutal Doom is a relatively entertaining gimmick, but classic Doom is where its at and where it will always be.

I will never get the kind of purists who prefer to play an old dated game in it's vanilla state instead of an improved version. BD may not be up to everyone's taste, but playing vanilla Doom is just robbing yourself from a better experience.

 

[Euronymous]

Uh, no it's not...

 

[agentorange]

yea. i have fun messing with various wads, for graphical flourishes, improved controls like mouse look and jumping, etc. but I rarely play through the entire game with those; on other hand vanilla Doom 1 or 2 I will play through time and time again.

 

[Eddas]

I'm glad we already have Doom 1 and 2. This new "Doom" is going to be pretty shitty, I can feel it.

 

[Major_Blackhart]

 

[buzz]

dnf I get what you are saying and you have a valid opinion. It's just that some people (me included) often prefer a tight and focused gameplay experience rather than one that expands all over the place.
For example, the logical evolution of Megaman means that the game should have free aiming, like Abuse, right? But I don't really want that. I want simple directional aiming that serves the game and its design.

Same with Brutal Doom. Does a game like Doom really need "stealth takedowns"? Stealth and melee are not the purpose of an arcade shooter and even then you have the berserk upgrade. I don't feel like the Doom levels are actually designed for stealth gameplay of any kind.
Better AI, that's not really relevant in Doom which again, is basically an arcade game on PC. Do I want my boss battles to have realistic and smart AI? Or do I want them to just have simple behavioral patterns that I can crack and solve like a puzzle?
Even free mouselook feels really odd to me.

Personally, I respect the guy(s) who make Brutal Doom and all these crazy mods and custom levels, extending the shit out of the shell life for the game. But sometimes people just want the classic experience, with no extra. Not all my playtroughs JA2 involve the 1.13 mod, I almost never use the restoration mods for Fallout 1 and 2 and the only Wizardry mod I've ever used was the one that allowed you to accelerate the combat speed in Wiz8.

 

[34scell]

You can just use the gore mod without the gameplay changes

 

[evdk]

You can just use the gore mod without the gameplay changes

But... the gore is retarded.