The New DOOM Thread (2016)

[shihonage]

You're the audience. Also stop making this thread into a chatroom. I'm off, bbl. Maybe.

 

[CyberP]

You're the audience.

Yep, I happen to like shooters with a greater degree of complexity, challenge and tactical options.

 

[CyberP]

Brutal doom>>Vanilla Doom , simply as that. If BD is the definitive FPS experience i don't know, what i do know is that there is plenty of better FPS than Doom out there.

Name at least two.

I'll focus on PC-only:

System Shock
Duke Nukem 3D.
Shadow Warrior.
Blood.
Brutal Doom.
Return to Castle Wolfenstien
STALKER
Red Faction

These two maybe not, but some may argue otherwise:

Half-Life
Quake

Doom may be a defining FPS of historical importance but it was outgunned a long time ago. Enter Brutal Doom which puts it as one of my favourite FPS' of all time.
Maybe I just don't understand the elegance in Doom's simplicity, or maybe I just demand more from my games and don't find joy in the most basic of repetition.

 

[Eddas]

Don't you guys feel that any possible outcome this game have is going to feel at least strange? I mean, Doom is a classic and that's it. How could you make another game with the same feeling without changing the basic mechanics that makes Doom the good old game it was (and is)? I do not know if I'm making myself clear...

 

[Darth Slaughter]

Brutal doom>>Vanilla Doom , simply as that. If BD is the definitive FPS experience i don't know, what i do know is that there is plenty of better FPS than Doom out there.

Name at least two.

Lots were named, but no one mentioned dark forces, the original. It was a doom clone that came a year later, and it was a great shooter, set in the star wars universe, but without light-sabers. The game had great level design, with installations, planets, bases that actually looked like what they were supposed to be, that followed doom formula (blue, red and yellow) but addded mission objectives. Doom had great level design also, but everything was a little generic mess. Other than that, DF had inovations like bridges you could walk over and under, jump, crouch, some 3d models and different lighting, things that were already available in ultima underworld RPGS, but DF got these on fast pace action FPS. And that was only a year after doom was released. Dark forces was not as popular as doom probably due to no multiplayer, and not mod-friendly, and the fact it was not a shareware distributed game.

 

[Eddas]

Don't you guys feel that any possible outcome this game have is going to feel at least strange? I mean, Doom is a classic and that's it. How could you make another game with the same feeling without changing the basic mechanics that makes Doom the good old game it was (and is)? I do not know if I'm making myself clear...

I guess that what I'm trying to say is: it could be a good game, but not a good Doom, without the same feeling, not a "sequel".

 

[AlexOfSpades]

In Doom you're mowing monsters left and right with lighting speed, it's killing on the macro level, not micro level. In most FPS, introduction of headshots changes the whole dynamic as players are encouraged to turtle and aim. When you slow down player, you can't throw as many monsters at them at the same time. The feel of the game is altered.

This makes a lot of sense. Shooters became more of a dueling thing, rather than a you VS the room. Thank you for explaining

 

[CyberP]

the most basic of repetition.

OK, I took it too far there. Doom has greater gameplay complexity, tactical options and challenge over horrifically scripted modern military shooters.

 

[dnf]

In Doom you're mowing monsters left and right with lighting speed, it's killing on the macro level, not micro level. In most FPS, introduction of headshots changes the whole dynamic as players are encouraged to turtle and aim. When you slow down player, you can't throw as many monsters at them at the same time. The feel of the game is altered.

This makes a lot of sense. Shooters became more of a dueling thing, rather than a you VS the room. Thank you for explaining

It's the beat em up vs 1vs1 2d/3d fighter all over again. And then BD comes and mix the 2(the beat-em-up aspect of DooM is still dominating), resulting in a better game. Shihonage have bonds too deep with an outdated formula i'm afraid, like the 2d fag that blames 3d for opening a new dimension in gaming(pun intended).

I can concede that some animations are over the top. BD makes me pity the enemies sometimes, they should also have some patterns similar to Quake 2, like dying enemies making shots before dying.

And of course as far as mods go, BD is quite conservative as far as feature creep mod goes. New animations, effects, sounds and mechanic tweaks and that's it. Nothing compared to the Aeons of Death that Unkillable Cat posted few pages back.

"OK, I took it too far there. Doom has greater gameplay complexity, tactical options and challenge over horrifically scripted modern military shooters."
Even the most turd shotters like alien rage has better features if compared to Doom, namely graphics( don't laugh, oldfags can become really creative with rationalizations), aiming and shooting.

Also, can some mod please filter the word "gameplay" for christsake? Most redundant word ever.

 

[Morgoth]

Unreal is a renderer demo haphazardly dressed up to resemble a game from a large distance. Those finding art in it are the same people who would buy painting of a square from an art gallery.

Half-Life is an overrated, front-loaded linear scripted shooter which foreshadowed the decline of modern FPS. Also, nobody speaks about last third of that game... for a good reason.

Oh wow. So then you truly believe this thoughtless, amateur and overrated mess that is Doom can be compared to these timeless masterpieces?

Serious question: What's wrong with you?

 

[buzz]

Hmm ... the Brutal DOOM fans remind me of some type of people.

Oh zing, I get it. Here:

DOOM fans:

Spoiler

Brutal DOOM fans (NSFW):

Spoiler

Even the "it has moar so it's bettuh" mantra is typical death/black metalhead bullshit.

Also, the entire last pages summed up:

 

[Eddas]

Oh wow. So then you truly believe this thoughtless, amateur and overrated mess that is Doom can be compared to these timeless masterpieces?

Serious question: What's wrong with you?

You are doing it wrong : http://youtu.be/5e_dJHLsuPM

 

[shihonage]

Unreal is a renderer demo haphazardly dressed up to resemble a game from a large distance. Those finding art in it are the same people who would buy painting of a square from an art gallery.

Half-Life is an overrated, front-loaded linear scripted shooter which foreshadowed the decline of modern FPS. Also, nobody speaks about last third of that game... for a good reason.

Oh wow. So then you truly believe this thoughtless, amateur and overrated mess that is Doom can be compared to these timeless masterpieces?

Serious question: What's wrong with you?

You must be a Tarkovsky fan.

 

[buzz]

Hey, what's wrong with Tarkovsky? His movies have some pretty great visuals.

 

[sexbad?]

You're all retards.

 

[skacky]

Something that might be of interest to you. I don't agree with it 100% but calling Doom a mindless game is stupid and I already explained why several times (not in here though): http://blog.danbo.vg/post/50094276897/the-most-misunderstood-game-of-all-time
And while Brutal Doom can be fun I think it is clearly inferior to vanilla.

 

[Lyric Suite]

Don't you guys feel that any possible outcome this game have is going to feel at least strange? I mean, Doom is a classic and that's it. How could you make another game with the same feeling without changing the basic mechanics that makes Doom the good old game it was (and is)? I do not know if I'm making myself clear...

Doom was pretty much a one hit wonder as far as i am concerned. This is not to say it was just a matter of luck, as if to say they didn't know what they were doing and just randomly made a masterpiece. Most of their other games employ many of the same principles in varying degrees of success (even Doom 3 had a few decent things about it, to wit, i really liked the way the engine moved), but Doom was just a miracle of all the right elements coming together perfectly. For me id soft is like one of those 80s metal bands who put out one or two great albums and then lost it completely. Like Megadeth or Metallica. Doom was their Master of Puppets or Rust in Peace. It was genuinely inspired and there's nothing anybody can do to bring the spirit that led to the creation of this game.

That said, they don't have to try to beat Doom. They just have to make a game that isn't utter and complete shit. Modern shooters aren't bad because they fail to live up to the classics, they are bad because they are so stupid and boring they are downright unplayable.

 

[praetor]

Doom was pretty much a one hit wonder as far as i am concerned. This is not to say it was just a matter of luck, as if to say they didn't know what they were doing and just randomly made a masterpiece. Most of their other games employ many of the same principles in varying degrees of success (even Doom 3 had a few decent things about it, to wit, i really liked the way the engine moved), but Doom was just a miracle of all the right elements coming together perfectly. For me id soft is like one of those 80s metal bands who put out one or two great albums and then lost it completely. Like Megadeth or Metallica. Doom was their Master of Puppets or Rust in Peace. It was genuinely inspired and there's nothing anybody can do to bring the spirit that led to the creation of this game.

That said, they don't have to try to beat Doom. They just have to make a game that isn't utter and complete shit. Modern shooters aren't bad because they fail to live up to the classics, they are bad because they are so stupid and boring they are downright unplayable.

but... Ride the Lightning is better than Master of Puppets! and Justice isn't all that far behind (with some tweaks to bring out the bass... iirc, on a guitar hero or game like that they even included a mix with a clear and audible bass line. dunno why it was never available commercially)

 

[dnf]

Something that might be of interest to you. I don't agree with it 100% but calling Doom a mindless game is stupid and I already explained why several times (not in here though): http://blog.danbo.vg/post/50094276897/the-most-misunderstood-game-of-all-time
And while Brutal Doom can be fun I think it is clearly inferior to vanilla.

Doom is a mindless shotter, no matter how much tought the devs put into the game. There is nothing wrong with that, there is a time and place for shallow amusement. The author description on that article is says it all:

ZIGGURAT VERTIGO
"I can think of no other way to describe the author of this blog other than a 'Doom Hipster'... if such a thing even exists."(certified fag00t)

When people use Doom as an argument against modern shotters what's the first argument that comes to mind? First thing that comes to mind is that level design meme "fps then and now", then we have weapon diversity, speed and high quantity of enemies and that's it. What we have here is people arguing in favor of auto-aim(hey consoles brought auto aim back rite), low level of detail and blurry textures. If you think vanilla Doom is the definitive Doom/FPS/experience/game/Citizen Kane, then why look forward or be pessimistic to other fps games at all? They all are 3d, polygon based hitscan enemies, mouse look, HD etc. There is not even a reason to complain, just play all WAD's made by Doom until your fingers drop FFS.

 

[Major_Blackhart]

Honestly, what's wrong with Brutal Doom?
I haven't played it yet, but it looks fun as hell.

 

[Machocruz]

If you think vanilla Doom is the definitive Doom/FPS/experience/game/Citizen Kane, then why look forward or be pessimistic to other fps games at all? They all are 3d, polygon based hitscan enemies, mouse look, HD etc. There is not even a reason to complain, just play all WAD's made by Doom until your fingers drop FFS.

You have a point. These games have very different aims (no pun intended). This is why I believe that one kind of FPS does not obsolete the other, just like Super Mario Galaxy does not obsolete SMB2, which plays very differently, nor does Fallout obsolete the best Wizardry. Doom has more in common with shmups or run and guns than it does FEAR, so I see little point in comparing such games.

 

[DefJam101]

Honestly, what's wrong with Brutal Doom?
I haven't played it yet, but it looks fun as hell.

There's nothing wrong with the mod at all. It's people arguing that brootal Doom is the "definitive version" of Doom, or that vanilla Doom is "outdated" who are the problem. Because they're dumb. And stupid. And FAGGOTS

 

[Morgoth]

I'm playing Doom with Beauty Doom 5.3 + PSX music WAD right now and I actually think it's an okay game.

Spoiler

BUT HALF-LIFE IS STILL KING OF ALL SHOOTERS!!!

 

[evdk]

I'm playing Doom with Beauty Doom 5.3 + PSX music WAD right now and I actually think it's an okay game.

Spoiler

BUT HALF-LIFE IS STILL KING OF ALL SHOOTERS!!!

Whatever you want to believe.

Personally I think that the PSX's more atmospheric OST suits the game less than the best of metal ripoff original.

 

[Baron Dupek]

Honestly, what's wrong with Brutal Doom?
I haven't played it yet, but it looks fun as hell.

It's really fun for some time but you're fed with it fast. And if you're somewhat tired with FPS genre - then you have problem. I liked this mod but barely finish single maps in one sit.