The Outer Worlds: Spacer's Choice Edition - Obsidian's first-person sci-fi RPG set in a corporate space colony

[Infinitron]

Tonally, it's Obsidian's KOTOR1. You have to have a heart of stone to hate it.

(It's absolutely superior to KOTOR in terms of gameplay and generally superior in terms of quest/area design of course.)

Oct 27, 2019 at 7:29 PM - Roguey: TOW, Knights of the Old Republic if it had first person action combat
Oct 27, 2019 at 7:30 PM - Infinitron: Roguey: It's really not like KOTOR

I remember these things.

Yeah, I remember that too. I was thinking about gameplay when I said that, as my subsequent message in that conversation suggests.

 

[DalekFlay]

KOTOR and KOTOR 2 have very different writing. Despite being a sequel, it has a very different tone. They aren't even in the same league. Which one you prefer is an entirely different matter.

Like I said, replaying KotOR 2 now, and it definitely has some good writing. Though Kreia is overrated because she mostly says the same shit over and over. It's cool to get some commentary on the black and white nature of the force in the movies, but you don't need to hear it over and over. Still... yes, it's a well written game. The gameplay though... ehhhhh.

 

[Harthwain]

Disagree,both kotor games solid and good writing. They ended up as the best star wars lore i have seen in my life.

I think KotOR 2 outclasses 1 in sense that it's much less blue-or-red. You can argue your point about Jedi joining the Mandalorian War. You have characters with very interesting approaches (G0-T0), etc. The story itself is a very interesting development of the idea of the Force, whereas KotOR 1 hinges entirely on a plot twist that should be clear to anyone (but I guess people are either not perceptive enough or they like the idea of being one of the most famous persons in the galaxy, especially when they were literaly nobodies for half of the game).

Still, KotORs weren't really about combat. More about the story. At least that's how I saw it. And Infintron blaming Obsidian for the gameplay when they simply used what Bioware did is a bit... strange. Since they didn't create an entirely new game, they could only improve on the story and it probably made more sense to keep the engine. It made the direct link between both KotORs that much stronger.

 

[Trashos]

KOTOR got a lot of mileage just for being one of the first games of its kind. A cinematic-looking third-person RPG with fun planet-hopping space adventures and talkative companions, available on consoles. I think you can justifiably argue that the The Outer Worlds is a game that has nothing new or essential for genre veterans, but maybe there's an 18 year old out there for whom Parvati is his Mission Vao and Felix his Carth. It feels like that sort of introductory game - a solid, appealingly packaged compilation of genre beats and greatest hits.

For example, that cannibal family quest outside Stellar Bay. Fallout 3 did that back in 2008 - the Andale cannibals. But 2008 was a long time ago! It's too cool a sidequest concept not to reuse eventually. Or how about Vicar Max's vision quest. He talks to the spirit of his mother, and then to himself. Total cliche, right? But if you haven't seen anything like that before...hey, maybe it's actually kind of moving. (The way all of his dialogue in the game changes after that is genuinely impressive btw)

I dunno, man, to me it looks like it failed to impress the casuals too much. Even a casual like Angry Joe gave it only an 8 (changed up from an initial 7 just because), and he currently hates Bethesda. We all know about Bethesda's orphans, but Obsidian will have to do better if they want to fill that spot or be the new Bioware. Funnily, current Obsidian does not have the writing talent of degenerate Bioware (of old, when they still mattered). They only have the degeneracy.

Commercially maybe they will be able to take the spot they are after, but I do not see it as a done deal if a serious competitor suddenly shows up. They have to do better.

 

[Infinitron]

When I say The Outer Worlds is tonally similar to KOTOR, that's a very specific claim. I don't mean to say that it's trying to be a BioWare game or that Obsidian aim to be the new BioWare. Obsidian's narrative design is still significantly different from classic BioWare. The way you traverse the main quest by doing missions for various faction figureheads is 100% post-New Vegas Obsidian. No four planets with four star maps here. No player romances either, though I'm sure those will show up in a sequel eventually.

Even the claim about tonal similarity needs to be qualified. The Outer Worlds lacks KOTOR's self-serious Jedi and Force moments. There's no companion equivalent to Bastila. Instead of that, you have the occasional blip of classic Fallout darkness. The "Early Retirement Program" in Byzantium for example - that's real Boyarsky shit that's hard to imagine showing up in a BioWare game.

 

[fantadomat]

The Outer Worlds lacks

everything outside of shooting mechanics...

 

[orcinator]

The Outer Worlds lacks

everything outside of shooting mechanics...

If your only criteria for shooting mechanics is making sure that hitscan guns are able to reliably scan for hits.

 

[Starwars]

Early retirement program just felt like a shittier version of Vault 11 to me.

 

[Nano]

Disagree,both kotor games have solid and good writing.

The first KOTOR's writing is mostly terrible.

 

[DalekFlay]

Early retirement program just felt like a shittier version of Vault 11 to me.

Early retirement program was maybe the most cliche and obvious quest in the game. Tip of the hat to Animal Farm as always, but that trope needs to be taken out behind the shed and put out of its misery. Can't imagine seeing it as a highlight of the game's quest design.

 

[JDR13]

That was a trope long before Animal Farm.

 

[IHaveHugeNick]

*scrolls back few pages*

Why are people bitching about combat? Timey-wimey stuff was miles better than VATS. Instead of mundane and dry shooting at hotspots, you have much more freedom to dick around, especially in combos with some of the more wacky weapons. It's both more dynamic and more engaging because you can think on your feet instead of V>check percentages>hit the hotspot>wait a while>repeat.

 

[Alpan]

When I say The Outer Worlds is tonally similar to KOTOR, that's a very specific claim.

It's specific, and equally bland. I've read news posts from you that are less dry than such a claim. There's hardly anything of worth in saying that Obsidian, a talented RPG outfit, made an RPG in 2019 that is tonally similar to another well-regarded but simplified RPG set in a franchise as familiar as Star Wars.

It's not 2003 any more. The Mission Vaos and the Carth Onasis you hope some newfangled gamer will pick up from The Outer Worlds don't have the Star Wars franchise behind them (the true reason behind KoTOR's lasting power -- being perhaps the first good SW RPG), and anyway, they are well-covered by many other games. They have Skyrim, Fallout 4, and now there's also this Witcher series (starring Henry Cavill!) on Netflix and I hear the game is quite cool, too.

 

[Infinitron]

Destructoid GOTY: https://www.destructoid.com/destructoid-s-award-for-overall-best-game-of-2019-goes-to--575748.phtml

Tip of the hat to Animal Farm as always

Logan's Run

 

[rusty_shackleford]

Destructoid GOTY: https://www.destructoid.com/destructoid-s-award-for-overall-best-game-of-2019-goes-to--575748.phtml

Tip of the hat to Animal Farm as always

Logan's Run

Nobody here should be surprised that every shill outlet will name it GOTY. It hits every fad button possible in the safest way possible. It's basically the result of someone focus testing a bunch of rick and morty fans from reddit.

 

[Infinitron]

Nah, it hasn't gotten many awards. There was the IGN RPG of the Year and this...what else?

 

[Duraframe300]

Nah, it hasn't gotten many awards. There was the IGN RPG of the Year and this...what else?

4 Game of the Year wins all in all. Disco got 12 (Which got it into the Top 5), still more than Fallen Order which got 3.

https://gotypicks.blogspot.com/

 

[Infinitron]

Nice website.

https://gotypicks.blogspot.com/2019/10/2019-game-of-year-genre-awards.html

RPG of the Year: The Outer Worlds 16, Disco Elysium 11
Best Story: The Outer Worlds 2, Disco Elysium 10

 

[JDR13]

*scrolls back few pages*

Why are people bitching about comabt? Timey-wimey stuff was miles better than VATS. Instead of mundane and dry shooting at hotspots, you have much more freedom to dick around, especially in combos with some of the more wacky weapons. It's both more dynamic and more engaging because you can think on your feet instead of V>check percentages>hit the hotspot>wait a while>repeat.

Too bad it's mostly irrelevant due to the ridiculous amount of weapons and ammo the game shoves in your face. Plus the fact that it becomes way too easy before the end even on the harder difficulty.

 

[Infinitron]

It is generally an easy game, but one thing I found which surprised me was that the endgame combat against UDL corporate troops became prohibitively difficult until I modded my weapons, which I'd avoided doing until that point. I wasn't expecting that, I figured the game would let me coast until the very end.

It made me regret that I hadn't experimented with modding earlier because the way it changes your weapon models is cool. That's mostly due to me being a degenerate item hoarder, but the foolish way they chose to set up the game's itemization contributed to it.

 

[DalekFlay]

It is generally an easy game, but one thing I found which surprised me was that the endgame combat against UDL corporate troops became prohibitively difficult until I modded my weapons, which I'd avoided doing until that point. I wasn't expecting that, I figured the game would let me coast until the very end.

It made me regret that I hadn't experimented with modding earlier because the way it changes your weapon models is cool. That's mostly due to me being a degenerate item hoarder, but the foolish way they chose to set up the game's itemization contributed to it.

I think it's more that the enemies later on become more and more bullet-spongey, requiring the extra damage modding provides.

 

[Infinitron]

Nah, they go down pretty quickly individually, they just hit real hard with N-Rays and Shock Cannons and shit that you have to do even better than that. Making my sniper rifle Corrosive + Extra crit damage did the trick.

I didn't find enemies in TOW to be particularly bullet spongey when you're not clearly outclassed (don't use unmodded assault rifles on sentry robots, etc). Unless you're expecting Call of Duty-style one hit kills or something.

 

[DalekFlay]

I didn't find enemies in TOW to be particularly bullet spongey when you're not clearly outclassed (don't use unmodded assault rifles on sentry robots, etc). Unless you're expecting Call of Duty-style one hit kills or something.

You're not the first person to disagree with me, but I dunno. I definitely had the opposite experience. On hard mode even with modding and 100 skill I was constantly having to pump endless rounds into enemies near the end. The prisoners in the final area especially, just endless health bars. I'm comparing it against normal shooters though, so I guess it's relative.

 

[Infinitron]

I think most games of this type have the problem that the "faster but less damage"/"slower but more damage" tradeoff usually turns out to be false. It's just really hard to beat hitting the AI as hard as possible and taking them out in one shot. You want to play through the game as a tacticool spy dude with pistols and submachine guns, but as soon as you encounter something that actually challenges you, you end up running for that plasma launcher BFG. Or as in my case, the compromise of turning your sniper rifle into an anti-materiel battle rifle for close range combat.

But still, I found that my assault rifle was usually okay against human enemies, just not as efficient. Around half of a 24-round clip to take one down, usually.

 

[Daidre]

I spent 90% of them game using 2 Plasma Rifles - one usual, and another with corrosive upgrade. I was one-shotting most of enemies on Hard with a rare exception of some elite animals on Monarch. I have tried a lot of other guns along the way but everything seemed like total trash next to max charged headshot from plasma Rifle.

Can't comment on endgame enemies though, I was so tired of the game at this point that just run through last dungeon as complete pacifist with cheaty stealth.