Torment Torment: Tides of Numenera Pre-Release Thread [ALPHA RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Surf Solar]

That take on BG3 sounds pretty cool.

 

[tuluse]

That take on BG3 sounds pretty cool.

 

[Tigranes]

See, that would make a kickstarter for the ages.

"Continue BG's storyline in a spiritual successor to Torment, with a strategy/sim layer of gameplay!"

 

[Kem0sabe]

Sounds like an awesome idea, but imagine the types of encounters that they would have to throw at you just to challenge a god. Anyone know if there are any PnP campaigns of that level or if it is even possible with the latest DnD ruleset?

Even a gimped deity is still vastly more powerful than most/all mortals and would operate on a level that would make most dialogues/encounters trivial.

 

[Shannow]

That take on BG3 sounds pretty cool.

 

[hoverdog]

See, that would make a kickstarter for the ages.

"Continue BG's storyline in a spiritual successor to Torment, with a strategy/sim layer of gameplay!"

Shame we'll never ever see it.

 

[Tigranes]

Sounds like an awesome idea, but imagine the types of encounters that they would have to throw at you just to challenge a god. Anyone know if there are any PnP campaigns of that level or if it is even possible with the latest DnD ruleset?

Even a gimped deity is still vastly more powerful than most/all mortals and would operate on a level that would make most dialogues/encounters trivial.

I think this is why I'd want to have seen this combine a strategy/sim aspect. We already had RPGs that kept track of your actions and accrued resources at a sort of macro-level, from the NWN2 stronghold to ME's War Readiness? (Though from what I heard that was just weird?) So you may not go as far to a hybrid as, say, Dragon Commander, but it could learn from games like The Guild. You're not just a lone dude traveling and fighting enemies anymore, because having such D&D high level party to party encounters in divine levels would get ridiculous. Rather you'll be having couriers tell you about shit going wrong in a dozen places and you having to choose where to go, where to distribute your own men, and your own RPG-style adventuring consist of selected, strategic interventions.

That is, you take an experience like convincing / manipulating Dak'kon in PST, and then make that not just a critical moment in your personal relations with that NPC in your party, but a moment in which you are also sustaining your own life as a God in making him believe, you are also determining what kind of tenets and principles you are imparting to your followers, and it has consequences for macro-level faith / power / whatever levels that the game is keeping track of.

Anyway, yeah, we'll never see this, but I'm just waiting for games to be just a little more innovative and exploit that continuum a lot more. You have an RPG which uses sim elements in specific, conventionalised ways (e.g. Crossroads Keep), then you have full blown hybrids like Dragon Commander. I just feel like there's a brilliant mixture here waiting to be realised that can also solve a longstanding problem for RPGs - that you never really feel like a general, politician, etc, you're always just a loner one way or the other. It should really be the direction devs should be going for with all their talk about genre mixing and 'epicness', but noooo.

 

[Koschey]

as well as revisiting old favorites like Sigil

Sounds like fun; I seem to distinctly remember a certain dominatrix eager to instantly slice'n'dice any cocky godling waltzing through her city

 

[80Maxwell08]

Sounds like we should kickstart sending George Ziets to Beamdog for when they add content in BG2EE or if they try to make BG3.

 

[Diablo169]

I want to see George Ziets creative lead another rpg. Make it happen Obsidian, failing that hire him already Fargo!

 

[Snerf]

As someone that would have thought BG done after ToB, I agree that it's a pretty damn good idea "for some quick brainstorming". I think it could end up great as a strategy/tactical game with heavy narrative elements.

The more I read from Zeits, the more I like.

 

[LeStryfe79]

Quick brainstorming my ass!

 

[Roguey]

I hate the idea particularly since I'm against other people "finishing" the stories of others. And a god entering Sigil, lawlz

 

[Kirtai]

And a god entering Sigil, lawlz

It happened in one of the novels when the god stuffed his divinity inside an artefact to hide it. After losing it the last time he did that. The God of Reckless Fools indeed.

 

[hiver]

Maybe he could wear a disguise?

While Goerge concept is the best idea one could make if the main idea of the sequel is that you continue being a god - the BG3 could also go in another way.

You being turned back into a mortal, loosing almost all godlike powers and memories in the process. Waking up in human form again - and continuing to discover what that means.
Or... - yes you know it - what can change the nature of the man?

Ok, seriously now - it doesnt have to be that particular question. You might want to find out why and how you were turned back into a human. Who did it and why.
Maybe even have a different start by turning yourself back into human form after you realized what being a god entails and it isnt so funny.




How about another Time of Troubles starts and all gods become mortal avatars forced to walk the earth? Only this time even weaker in that form then in the first event.

The Time of Troubles was precipitated by an attempt by the gods Bane and Myrkul to steal the Tablets of Fate from the overgod Ao. The tablets were created by Ao to sustain the balance of good and evil, law and chaos and contain the areas of which each of the gods of the Forgotten Realms rule over. Angry with the gods for their habitual pursuit of power and negligence toward their mortal faithful, Lord Ao relegated every god (except for the guardian god Helm, selected to protect the gates to the heavens) to walk among their followers on the earth. The immediate effects of this edict were threefold. First, divine magic (spells granted to clerics by their patron deities) ceased to function altogether[2] unless the cleric was within one mile of their deity's avatar. Second, arcane magic (a force channeled from The Weave by wizards and sorcerers) ceased to be regulated by its steward, Mystra, and became dangerously unpredictable. Third, the characteristically immortal and aloof deities were now vulnerable (though devastatingly powerful) and dwelling among the civilizations of Faerûn.

 

[Captain Shrek]

I want to see George Ziets creative lead another rpg. Make it happen Obsidian, failing that hire him already Fargo!

Totally this. Would like to see what would come of it.

 

[Murk]

Scrap BG3 and set it up as a new game and I'd be down with the idea. It coincides with similar RPG/strat hybrids I've been craving. Like a larger, more fleshed out Age of Wonders with a deeper combat engine and more interaction and C&C based resource acruement.

Balancing having Zealots of one faction at the cost of no faith from another, or a more pseudo-agnostic "everyone can agree with it but it doesn't require comittment" style that gives you less faith from each but more potential followers to the eventual showdown of toppling other gods.

Basically I guess this'd be a better Strategy game with RPG elements than the other way around.

 

[hiver]

One more. A very simple one.

You get to be a follower of the very God the player in the original games got to become.
Choose whether it was evil new god of murder or a good deity at the start - or tutorial - and go on playing while main quests are given by that god (you in previous games).

Non lethal gameplay for good - lethal for evil.

With the options to turn against your god.

 

[Hobz]

I'm sure Trent Oster could find something better given enought time to brainstorm with Hervé.

 

[Sordid MCA/Prosper Hybryd]

http://www.nowgamer.com/features/1766807/brian_fargo_interview_new_torment_numenera_crpg.html

Art is pretty. If they can't get MCA then they should hire Zeb Cook at least. Is it possible?

Edit:
AAAAAAAAAA!!!!
Guess who works on Fallout 4!??!
https://twitter.com/BrianFargo/status/291240980219305985

 

[hiver]

You talked about perhaps using turn-based combat instead of real-time with pause: is that wise? Surely the fans would wage war against you?

- (no, dumbass - we wouldnt) -

Let me turn this over to project director Kevin Saunders: “We see the key elements of the combat system for this game as agnostic of whether the implementation is real-time with pause, turn-based, or some hybrid, like a phase-based system.
We’ll discuss further in the future, but, briefly, by key elements, we mean aspects like: ensuring that character customization choices influence combat, meaningful tactical decisions, synergy with the narrative and creative elements, accentuating and further developing the companions, etc.
Because we can craft the game we are promising regardless of this specific decision, it is exactly the type of question for which we’d involve our backers.




We would outline what we will attempt to achieve through combat, and how it is interwoven with the narrative and overall gameplay, present the primary options, and let our backers weigh in – confident that we can satisfy our design goals for this game while taking their preferences into account.

We’ve been taking this approach with Wasteland 2 and have found backer input to be invaluable in such design decisions.”


- yeah sure, mkay, great.

 

[Jaesun]

That pic is fucking awesome.

I just came in my pants.

 

[Sad He-Man]

That pic is fucking awesome.

I just came in my pants.

Looks a bit like Beksinski crossed with Giger.

 

[Infinitron]

Don't YEAAAAH so quickly, hiver. There's a good chance the fans will choose real time.

 

[Infinitron]

More hiver on Formspring: http://www.formspring.me/ksaun/q/415565684223797180

Why go for RtwP combat if you guys will already have a fully working and tested Turn based system from Wasteland 2?

That’s a great point in favor of turn-based (TB) combat, and of course we’ll be looking to leverage as much from Wasteland 2 for Torment as makes sense. The combat system is an aspect that really is up for discussion and we are by no means cemented on real-time with pause (RTwP). Actually, for the recent Rock, Paper, Shotgun article, we considered not even suggesting a direction, but a) it’s true that our initial inclination was RTwP and b) thought we’d glean more useful feedback in terms of community response by indicating that. That feedback is important to us and, in fact, we plan to look to the Torment backers for their input on this topic.

We have several design goals for combat that aren’t inherently dependent upon whether the combat is RTwP, TB, or something else. These include aspects such as meaningful player decisions at both the strategic and tactical levels (I use the terms “strategic” and “tactical” in the same manner that JESawyer does); emphasizing quality of combat encounters over quantity (including the ability to avoid the majority of combat through gameplay decisions); the integration of narrative elements (the spirit eating mechanic of Mask of the Betrayer is an example of this.)

Because we can achieve these goals with either system, and because we don’t feel that the choice of RTwP or TB is fundamental to the Torment experience, it is exactly the type of design decision in which we’ll want to engage the game’s backers.