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KickStarter Vigilantes: neo-noir, turn based tactical RPG

ushas

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Jan 5, 2015
Messages
550
Stumbled upon an EA review (probably not much useful for codexers though)
https://popgeeks.net/vigilantes-steam-review/

Vigilantes (Steam Early Access) Review
Vigilantes is a clear callback to some of the games of the 90’s, specifically XCOM and the original Fallout. If you aren’t a fan of those games you might not like it. It also plays up the narrative style of the old-school Noir stories of yesterday, while mixing it with a futuristic tone of sorts. What this results in is a rough yet adequate RPG.

You play as Sam Contino a man who is “never going to go on that ski trip” after he walks in on a mugging and decides to do something about it. This leads to him going from a simple life to one of a vigilante, one that he seems pretty easy to go down into. Along the path to you freeing your city from several gangs you’ll get allies, get the chance to craft items to help you on your way, and slowly improve until you’re the vigilante that this city needs.

There are several things that tip off that Vigilantes is still not fully done yet. The first is that the game is a pretty steep learning curve. There are big and small text boxes that have to tell you oodles of information, And while this is nice in a sense, you can’t help but wonder how much better it would’ve been if the game just walked you through the motions the first time instead of just dropping it all on your lap.

This only gets hammered home with the opening “cutscene” is several minutes long, and features a very chatty narrator who doesn’t seem to want to stop talking. This happens even more when new characters are introduced and we get “scenes” with them that are nothing more than still images with voiceovers on them. It gets pretty annoying after a while, and there’s no way to skip them.

As for the combat, the game takes a very XCOM approach to things, you have so much you can do in a turn, every action takes up Action Points, and you need to play strategically else you’ll get killed. Or, your partners will get killed. I will give Vigilantes credit, they put a lot of depth into their gameplay. You have options as to whether you want to fight bare-handed, with a melee weapon, or with a gun, you can switch on the fly (but it drains AP), and the more you use said weapon the better you’ll get at it.

However, at times it seems as though the combat just isn’t in your favor. Despite having high stats, it felt as though I missed more than I hit. Also, because everything drains your AP, it really limits your actions in key situations. Once you build up a team you do have more options, but that also gives you more ways to lose.

The other thing that’s interesting about Vigilantes is the Home Base feature. Here you can rest, heal, swap out inventory, start to build up your crew, and more. But again, it’s not explained beyond “Press buttons to see what happens”. For such a key feature, it doesn’t get the attention it deserves.

As you progress, the enemies you face will grow, and grow more powerful. The game does adapt to your skills and techniques, adding even more strategy and difficulty to the title. If you’re not careful, the game will overwhelm you, or the city may turn against you because of what you do. Your choices on whether to let people live or die will be a factor.

In the end, Vigilantes is a competent RPG that may intrigue you, or it may not, it just depends on how you like this style of games. It’s on Steam Early Access now if you want to try it out.
Perhaps the reviewer wants to be given some re-assurance that there is way to skip the voiced screens - it's by pressing Esc key, for example, or by clicking on the "skip" button available on said screens.

Edit: I originally thought he wanted more tutorials, but probably misread. It's some walk through the motions. Not sure what that really means here though.
 
Last edited:

Taka-Haradin puolipeikko

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Did some quick testing with shotgun over watch.
It seems that shotgun fire from OW is treated as single bullet attack instead of cone.
I tried to set up several shots so that they would hit multiple targets (friend or foe), but only unit that was ever affected was the one that triggered OW.

edit.
Some more feedback would be nice in certain places.
Like sound effect when using "load weapons"-button on inventory screen.
Also some feedback about acts that affect ally opinion would probably be useful, as long as it won't become annoying.
 
Last edited:

Timeslip

Timeslip Softworks
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Yet more stuff:

Shotguns seem to able to shoot outside of the cone.
Sam dropped one mafioso while using over watch from what seemed a quarter level away.

Temporary allies seem to be quite strong to the point where I could draw enemy attention to them without any worry. (Might be the difficulty I'm playing though; currently playing on Vigilante.)

At the minute, shotguns function as ordinary weapons in overwatch. As ushas mentioned there are technical problems with using the cone of fire in OW. There's no easy (or even moderately complex) way to work around this, and aware it's inconsistent, but wouldn't rule out this being changed.

Temporary allies all share the same stats at the moment, and you're right, they are pretty high - will look at setting them more appropriate to who the character is
 

Timeslip

Timeslip Softworks
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Shotguns seem to able to shoot outside of the cone.
Sam dropped one mafioso while using over watch from what seemed a quarter level away.
So you used a shotgun in OW? Then it probably works as intended right now (technical reasons). But please join me in begging Timeslip to change this:)

Once I forget how much debugging overwatch drove me up the wall and could have made me miss the release date, I'll probably have another swing at it :)
 

Timeslip

Timeslip Softworks
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There is a point.. for those specialised in it. For example in D&D unarmed does low damage and cannot kill unless you specialise in it.
Also in your game you can put unarmed as best way to take out enemies without killing them by giving a hit chance penalty to trying to use lethal weapons to not kill.

Also enemy AI should not only look at damage per AP but hit chance as well. Using fists or hammers should have a noticeable difference in hit chance as they are pretty different fighting styles.

Differentiating weapon types further is something am interested it. All the close combat weapons have the same CTH, but this can be modified through the attack type: heavy, light, etc. Blunt doesn't have a light attack, bladed doesn't have a heavy. The idea of a higher base damage, but lower CTH for blunt could work too
 

Timeslip

Timeslip Softworks
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Developer
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Messages
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Stumbled upon an EA review (probably not much useful for codexers though)
https://popgeeks.net/vigilantes-steam-review/

Vigilantes (Steam Early Access) Review
Vigilantes is a clear callback to some of the games of the 90’s, specifically XCOM and the original Fallout. If you aren’t a fan of those games you might not like it. It also plays up the narrative style of the old-school Noir stories of yesterday, while mixing it with a futuristic tone of sorts. What this results in is a rough yet adequate RPG.

You play as Sam Contino a man who is “never going to go on that ski trip” after he walks in on a mugging and decides to do something about it. This leads to him going from a simple life to one of a vigilante, one that he seems pretty easy to go down into. Along the path to you freeing your city from several gangs you’ll get allies, get the chance to craft items to help you on your way, and slowly improve until you’re the vigilante that this city needs.

There are several things that tip off that Vigilantes is still not fully done yet. The first is that the game is a pretty steep learning curve. There are big and small text boxes that have to tell you oodles of information, And while this is nice in a sense, you can’t help but wonder how much better it would’ve been if the game just walked you through the motions the first time instead of just dropping it all on your lap.

This only gets hammered home with the opening “cutscene” is several minutes long, and features a very chatty narrator who doesn’t seem to want to stop talking. This happens even more when new characters are introduced and we get “scenes” with them that are nothing more than still images with voiceovers on them. It gets pretty annoying after a while, and there’s no way to skip them.

As for the combat, the game takes a very XCOM approach to things, you have so much you can do in a turn, every action takes up Action Points, and you need to play strategically else you’ll get killed. Or, your partners will get killed. I will give Vigilantes credit, they put a lot of depth into their gameplay. You have options as to whether you want to fight bare-handed, with a melee weapon, or with a gun, you can switch on the fly (but it drains AP), and the more you use said weapon the better you’ll get at it.

However, at times it seems as though the combat just isn’t in your favor. Despite having high stats, it felt as though I missed more than I hit. Also, because everything drains your AP, it really limits your actions in key situations. Once you build up a team you do have more options, but that also gives you more ways to lose.

The other thing that’s interesting about Vigilantes is the Home Base feature. Here you can rest, heal, swap out inventory, start to build up your crew, and more. But again, it’s not explained beyond “Press buttons to see what happens”. For such a key feature, it doesn’t get the attention it deserves.

As you progress, the enemies you face will grow, and grow more powerful. The game does adapt to your skills and techniques, adding even more strategy and difficulty to the title. If you’re not careful, the game will overwhelm you, or the city may turn against you because of what you do. Your choices on whether to let people live or die will be a factor.

In the end, Vigilantes is a competent RPG that may intrigue you, or it may not, it just depends on how you like this style of games. It’s on Steam Early Access now if you want to try it out.
Perhaps the reviewer wants to be given some re-assurance that there is way to skip the voiced screens - it's by pressing Esc key, for example, or by clicking on the "skip" button available on said screens.

Edit: I originally thought he wanted more tutorials, but probably misread. It's some walk through the motions. Not sure what that really means here though.

Flashing Neon "Skip" key incoming in V21 :)
 

ArchAngel

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Mar 16, 2015
Messages
21,337
There is a point.. for those specialised in it. For example in D&D unarmed does low damage and cannot kill unless you specialise in it.
Also in your game you can put unarmed as best way to take out enemies without killing them by giving a hit chance penalty to trying to use lethal weapons to not kill.

Also enemy AI should not only look at damage per AP but hit chance as well. Using fists or hammers should have a noticeable difference in hit chance as they are pretty different fighting styles.

Differentiating weapon types further is something am interested it. All the close combat weapons have the same CTH, but this can be modified through the attack type: heavy, light, etc. Blunt doesn't have a light attack, bladed doesn't have a heavy. The idea of a higher base damage, but lower CTH for blunt could work too
Fist being a much faster weapon will naturally make it harder to dodge then a slower but more powerful hammer attack. But what I was mostly thinking about (but didn't explain) is weapon skill. Should not every character have some weapon skill that influences their chance to hit?
And if you give thugs hammer, one assumes they are trained in that weapon and got a decent hit chance with it. Otherwise they would not be using those weapons?!

Unarmed fighting is one of the toughest fighting styles to learn and use well in a way that is deadly to enemies. Nobody should be trying to use that as a default attack with an intent to kill someone.
 
Last edited:

Taka-Haradin puolipeikko

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Encountered a bug where city screen got zoomed in too close. Couldn't see sectors on the edges of the city.
No way to scroll or change zoom level of the map screen.

Reloading game fixed it.

Cheers, will look at this tomorrow, should be an easy enough fix.
It's possible false positive.
I might have been fooled by that very slow zoom speed.
 

Timeslip

Timeslip Softworks
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If I get one more email from a tiny website/let's player asking for between 2-20 keys to give to friends, in exchange for the honour of a review, I'm going to send Elena Furey out to have a "talk" with them.
 

ushas

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Jan 5, 2015
Messages
550
I would like to have 20 friends interested in TB games like Vigilantes :(

You suspect them being members of a paramilitary organization, I suppose?
 

Timeslip

Timeslip Softworks
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2-20 keys, wtf? I thought one was enough.

You and me both. Most of them are fishing for keys to sell on G2A/Kinguin. I'm happy enough to send keys to smaller sites, as long as they are relatively active, but when I see a site with an Alexa rating of 8,000,000 asking for 3 keys for some vague reason, it goes in the bin. Another classic is to pretend to be a big youtuber with no contact address in the about page. Grifters nowadays have no sense of pride in their work.
 

Timeslip

Timeslip Softworks
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I would like to have 20 friends interested in TB games like Vigilantes :(

You suspect them being members of a paramilitary organization, I suppose?

Well, when you manage to make that many tactically inclined friends, be sure to hit me up. Don't forget to have a youtube channel with 3 subscribers though :)
 

ushas

Savant
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Jan 5, 2015
Messages
550
Hm, exactly 3 subs is a strange condition. But then if they would be really tactically inclined they would want to support devs. So won't need to hit you.

By sound of it looks like quite prevalent. Does Steam plan to do something about it?
 

ushas

Savant
Joined
Jan 5, 2015
Messages
550
Edit: I originally thought he wanted more tutorials, but probably misread. It's some walk through the motions. Not sure what that really means here though.
A slower introduction to mechanics, likely.
I see. Yeah, makes more sense than a dancing lesson.

Flashing Neon "Skip" key incoming in V21 :)
Cool!:)
Well, I would also make it travel all over the the screen with gradually increasing speed as well as decreasing size - a la catch a skip button minigame, but fortunately you aren't me.

However, I doubt he hadn't tried Esc key. So suspecting he might have skipped those screens even unknowingly, because there is a fairly slow transition effect (more precisely the the sense of transition isn't immediate). Also, it seemed to me that the first intro screen with citations doesn't react to Esc.
 

Alienman

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2-20 keys, wtf? I thought one was enough.

You and me both. Most of them are fishing for keys to sell on G2A/Kinguin. I'm happy enough to send keys to smaller sites, as long as they are relatively active, but when I see a site with an Alexa rating of 8,000,000 asking for 3 keys for some vague reason, it goes in the bin. Another classic is to pretend to be a big youtuber with no contact address in the about page. Grifters nowadays have no sense of pride in their work.

Those are the dudes that are ruining it for everyone else then I guess. When I was more active with my little Youtube channel I asked a few devs for a free key for some "coverage". The problem is that 90% of the stuff released are crap, and more often than not you get one these crap games but you feel morally obligated to make a few videos at least. Bit draining, and the channel felt like work instead of just some fun hobby project.

Anyway, stopped doing it and now just buy all my games. Oh well. Looking forward to your game. Planning on getting it soon. My gaming budget unfortunately got wrecked this month :)
 

Infinitron

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I suppose I ought to say that Timeslip has offered the Codex a preview key. I'm not really a fan of doing pre-release previews of games (I'd rather spend our precious volunteer manpower on doing reviews of finished games) but if oasis789 or sser or somebody else we can trust wants to do one, feel free to volunteer.
 

Abu Antar

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Enjoy the Revolution! Another revolution around the sun that is. Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
I'd like to read a preview of the game. I'm interested in Vigilantes, but it would be nice with as many opinions as possible.
 

ushas

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Messages
550
Another classic is to pretend to be a big youtuber with no contact address in the about page.
According to the dictates of eternal balance, soon after complaining about pretenders, one youtuber with 169K subscribers is bound to start LP of Vigilantes.

Vigilantes Gameplay Let's Play Part 1 (TAKE NO PRISONERS) by ReformistTM:


Wasn't able to watch it all yet, but from what I listened and read - he's having fun, even narrating conversations:)
Edit: Got himself familiarized in advance. So I guess works also as an introduction, in case anyone is contemplating to watch.
 
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Timeslip

Timeslip Softworks
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Those are the dudes that are ruining it for everyone else then I guess. When I was more active with my little Youtube channel I asked a few devs for a free key for some "coverage". The problem is that 90% of the stuff released are crap, and more often than not you get one these crap games but you feel morally obligated to make a few videos at least. Bit draining, and the channel felt like work instead of just some fun hobby project.

Anyway, stopped doing it and now just buy all my games. Oh well. Looking forward to your game. Planning on getting it soon. My gaming budget unfortunately got wrecked this month :)

Pretty much. The high rate of fraud requests makes it harder to connect with press, which is a shame. I don't think most developers would expect everyone who asked for a key to cover it - would start to become wary if someone asked for keys for several games and never covered any of them though. Cheers, it's not going anywhere and will only get better!
 

Timeslip

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I suppose I ought to say that Timeslip has offered the Codex a preview key. I'm not really a fan of doing pre-release previews of games (I'd rather spend our precious volunteer manpower on doing reviews of finished games) but if oasis789 or sser or somebody else we can trust wants to do one, feel free to volunteer.

You're welcome to hold off, the key won't expire and I get that you can't cover every game at all stages of development - you've given me a fair bit of air time as is :)
 

Lyre Mors

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Great looking project with a nice down to earth developer who hangs out on the codex. Yep, will be buying this to support very soon.
 

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