Warren Spector's Soapbox Thread

[LESS T_T]

(1:51:40)

 

[ciox]

 

[Infinitron]

Seems PCGamesN had a chat with Warren Spector: https://www.pcgamesn.com/deus-ex/deus-ex-warren-spector-zelda-breath-of-the-wild

Warren Spector sees Zelda: Breath of the Wild as a “validation” of games like Deus Ex

Warren Spector, the legendary designer behind games like Deus Ex (and Epic Mickey), is known for his involvement with all manner of immersive sims, games that ask the player to come up with creative solutions to problems. Games like Thief and Deus Ex defied common wisdom at the time by not holding players’ hands, and today more and more mainstream games are doing the same.

That even includes Nintendo, who last year transformed one of their most iconic franchises into an open world adventure driven by emergent gameplay systems with The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild, and Spector sees a sort of throughline from his team’s work to this modern success. “The most exciting thing to me about Zelda,” Spector tells us, “other than the fact that it’s a ton of fun, is that it’s a validation of things that we’ve been saying and trying to do in our own work for many years.

“In games like Deus Ex and Epic Mickey, I remember thinking ‘why isn’t everybody making games like this?’ Now we’re starting to see more games like this coming out. I think the success in gameplay of games like the Zelda game validates what we’ve been saying for a long time. It proves that there’s a much larger audience than we’ve seen before. And the success of the Zelda game might even attract people to Underworld Ascendant as a similar kind of gameplay experience.”

Spector is now working on some more direct follow-ups to classic immersive sims, working with other former Looking Glass developers at Otherside Entertainment on both Underworld Ascendant and System Shock 3.

More on the way, maybe?

 

[LESS T_T]

And the success of the Zelda game might even attract people to Underworld Ascendant as a similar kind of gameplay experience

Heh, I guess, 'a Breath of the Wild-like game but in underworld' is a way more effective marketing than 'an immersive sim from its original creators' or 'a successor to Ultima Underworld.'



Oh well.

 

[Latro]

warren spector has a switch? lol nerd

 

[Edward The Mediocre]

Let's be honest here, he's just one numale smile away from being a total washed up cuck.

 

[ciox]

“In games like Deus Ex and Epic Mickey,

Every time he does this it's like nails on a chalkboard.

 

[Ash]

Games like Thief and Deus Ex defied common wisdom at the time by not holding players’ hands, and today more and more mainstream games are doing the same.

 

[Ash]

Even JRPGs aimed at kids in the 90s held the player's hand less than 99% of junk masquerading as "adult" games today. So Breath of the Wild gives you multiple tools and lets you get creative without shoving everything in your face...it's an exception to the modern rule, and many 90s and 2000s games did stuff like that, or sometimes did it less yet in more meaningful ways (e.g without breaking game balance). As for hand-holding in general, we all know that's gotten to ridiculous extremes these days, to the point a modern Ubisoft game parodied it (while still including it itself, therefore self-defeating).

Ex-LGS and Arkane devs place waay too much emphasis in multiple solutions, giving the player their cake, and creative emergent gameplay these days. In Shock 2 you could only beat the Many in combat. There was no stealth/social/alternative option. In shock 1 it was often the same, even less freedom there in fact. In Deus Ex you HAD to pass through vandenberg's maintenance tunnels despite there being a door on the otherside (which they made indestructible specifically so you had to pass through the tunnels). Everything in moderation, including freedom. We still want tightly-knit game rules, not a sandbox free of consequences.

 

[unfairlight]

Let's be honest here, he's just one numale smile away from being a total washed up cuck.

Only a year late lad, he was a turbo hillshill during the election. He's been a washed up leftist cuck for a long while.

 

[LESS T_T]

 

[Nano]

which they won't - trust me

Why?

 

[ciox]

DX4 having its second half cancelled due to poor sales?

 

[Ash]

Maybe he caused drama when he was involved shortly with Square Enix/Eidos for Mankind Retarded promotional material recently.
Maybe they think he's "too stubborn" or "old fashioned". In other words he'd make something like the original again rather than something suitable for mass market consumption.
Maybe because whatever Spector would want to make it would be different to their shitty "Deus Ex Universe" brand identity. Ya know, #BlackAndGold #CasualGameplay #AdamJensen #UnsatisfactoryNarratives

 

[J1M]

No, it's because he was studio director for invisible war.

 

[LESS T_T]

 

[Tito Anic]

Fact is: our RPG heroes declined along with industry. Only indies are figting for ITZ: Styg, Vince, Piranha, Freehold Games,Thomas Biskup etc. Last big DX like game was Arx Fatalis.

 

[Ash]

Accurate.

 

[Hines]

Warren Spector's not too happy with The White House's recent violent video game reel:

 

[Outlander]

Warren Spector's not too happy with The White House's recent violent video game reel:

LOL @ the Fallout 4 bit, it looks so bizarrely bad, it's so bad it really stands out from the rest.

 

[Lahey]

Your own games can be cut with such a mindset -pressed into the same service of highlighting depictions of violence to undermine art and expression. Such depictions are sometimes necessary if art is going to be useful to our species. Have you not read Shakespeare? The bible?

Warren… this was a dishonestly cut hit reel - strategically out of context shots assembled by a propagandist mindset. That the tactic can have such an impact on a mind as disciplined and sophisticated as yours is disheartening.

I realize the violent game video provided no context, but that doesn't change the fact that the images are in shockingly bad taste. That they could be cut together at all is the problem. Again, I'm just talking about bad taste, not violence in videogames.

I get what you mean, however Deux Ex allows people to murder several children in any number of ways, well beyond using guns. In a lot of the games featured in the montage it isn't possible to blow people up (leaving a bloody stain in their place), but it very much is in Deux Ex.

Good points. But I hope players were repulsed by the killing of children. And, easy for me to say, but true: I'm ashamed of the kid-killing possibility and wouldn't do it again. Can't promise, but I don't think I'll ever make another game where you can kill virtual people at all.

https://twitter.com/Warren_Spector/status/972153633809797120

Response to my tweet about the violent video game video are coming in fast & furious. Most are calm & well-considered. For those upset with me, I know the images in the video don't reflect the vast majority of games & it provides no context. I get that it's pure propaganda.

Huge difference between 'that's a bit much for me' and damning your peers by saying they should all be ashamed of themselves.

Yeah, I hear you. I was pretty upset by that video when I wrote my "you should be ashamed post." I might have crossed a line myself. Sometimes my mouth gets ahead of my brain! (I'll still stand by my comment that images like that hurt us with the public and policy makers.

It hurts the industry when people share out of context imagery and even our own industry leaders are telling one another to be ashamed, yes.

 

[Sordid MCA/Prosper Hybryd]

Can't promise, but I don't think I'll ever make another game where you can kill virtual people at all.

 

[groke]

Zipactriotl strikes again.

 

[Cross]

I guess now we know why his career path involved going from Deus Ex to Epic Mickey.

 

[Zep Zepo]

I'll just leave this gem here...

citation: https://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/34fdjb/hi_i_am_warren_spector_a_game_developer_from/

Zep--