Wasteland Wasteland 2 - what's your general opinion?

[Jaesun]

So, my final opinion about W2 is slightly harsher than my initial one. W2 has its high points but some of its low points can be jarring. I dropped it somewhere in Hollywood. It was the occasional retarded writing and the shitty loot/gear mechanics that probably did the most damage. Oh well, I still played it for many hours and had a lot fun overall.

Just out of sheer curiosity have you played Wasteland?

 

[ghostdog]

So, my final opinion about W2 is slightly harsher than my initial one. W2 has its high points but some of its low points can be jarring. I dropped it somewhere in Hollywood. It was the occasional retarded writing and the shitty loot/gear mechanics that probably did the most damage. Oh well, I still played it for many hours and had a lot fun overall.

Just out of sheer curiosity have you played Wasteland?

Yep. Though I never finished that one either.

 

[SCO]

My opinion is the same it always was, i don't trust Fargo.

 

[Clockwork Knight]

Really? I thought it was kinda boring. He has lost his touch. Btw, slight offtopic, but i wouldn't know where to find this: which parts (locations/npcs) did he write in New Vegas, if any?

http://fallout.gamepedia.com/Chris_Avellone#Fallout_series

According to J.E. Sawyer, Avellone was directly responsible for Cass, Lanius, and some minor characters at Mojave Outpost, as well as possibly General Oliver. In addition, his work on Old World Blues was split with Travis Stout.

 

[Ayreos]

It was okay, but not great. Fallout is still leagues beyond. I thought each part of it showed a lack of good ideas and insight. That leveling mechanic, those obligated choices and arbitrary difficulty spikes, plus magic radiation circles...

 

[Duraframe300]

Really? I thought it was kinda boring. He has lost his touch. Btw, slight offtopic, but i wouldn't know where to find this: which parts (locations/npcs) did he write in New Vegas, if any?

Was Chris ever amazing when it came to sole area design?

Don't particulary remember an example.

 

[TwinkieGorilla]

Incline or decline?

Mild incline, major disappointment.

 

[Infinitron]

My recommendation: next time hire Avellone to write the whole game for you, not just a couple of locations.

Which locations did he do?

I think just Ag Center.

No, he did Highpool too and a couple of other locations.

 

[Gnidrologist]

I wouldn't know about that. He, in my mythological mind, was/is the best dialogue writer. Never bothered to research how he fared in other game design areas. One reason i'm , reluctant to continues my NV walkthrough is that NPC are god damn boring. Wondering through wastes seem more enjoyable experience than interacting with npc in this game. Only NPC i remember fondly are the Yes Man robot in Beny's apartment. I'm still hardly through even 1/3of the game though. It's on stale at this moment.

 

[Gnidrologist]

On the other hand, as i remember he wasn't part of Bloodlinens and dialogues there were best i ever encountered in vidya. Who wrote them? Mythsoda? Not to forget fabulous Deb of night show. That was gorgeous. I still sometimes fire it up for tasteful lulz.

 

[GloomFrost]

I wouldn't know about that. He, in my mythological mind, was/is the best dialogue writer. Never bothered to research how he fared in other game design areas. One reason i'm , reluctant to continues my NV walkthrough is that NPC are god damn boring. Wondering through wastes seem more enjoyable experience than interacting with npc in this game. Only NPC i remember fondly are the Yes Man robot in Beny's apartment. I'm still hardly through even 1/3of the game though. It's on stale at this moment.

So do you honestly not remember Mr. House, Ceaser, Arcade, Garret twins, Mick and Ralph, Raul, Cachino?? WOW

 

[Kem0sabe]

What's special about house and Caesar?

 

[undecaf]

Finally got around LA and the game does pick up a better pace and more intrigue (better than what it at the beginning suggests, at least... "Go find another 3 radiotowers, 7 bags of cat litter and help and shit") - not finished yet, but I suppose I'm around half way through. The downsides are the same as previously, the most predominant for me being that after Arizona there's not much left in the way of character progression (not that the system was "great" to begin with, though, it just gets far less important and interesting). All the "needed" skills are about set and most of the skillpoints get hoarded to jumpstart Surgeon in case the dedicated medic(s) gets KO'd in combat. And I don't think the solution would be a simple "less SP/less XP" either, that'd likely just make things more frutstrating and cumbersome. The armor system could really benefit from a bit more complexity (like more damage types and damage thresholds), as as people have said, it really is weird that in a lot of cases, one needs to strip for protection. There's also at times a nauseating amount of back and forth. I hold on to my verdict, it is "incline" in a sense that it delivers an "old school" TB cRPG experience and I'm having reasonably good time with it, but it really suffers from some of the rough edges.

I don't know when the balance patch is due, but I do hope it touches more things than just combat and loot lists.

 

[GloomFrost]

What's special about house and Caesar?

Both are developed characters with excellent, detailed backgrounds, dialogues with them are well written and explain who they are and what do they want from life, (for example House's speech about society of consumers and why democracy doesnt work or Ceasers speech about thesis and antithesis), some interesting details like robot fetish for House and Ceaser's brain tumor, add to that memorable voice overs. I dont know how can people say that there is nothing special about them especially if you compare them to abominations from bethesda "games" (shivers)

 

[Kem0sabe]

What's special about house and Caesar?

Both are developed characters with excellent, detailed backgrounds, dialogues with them are well written and explain who they are and what do they want from life, (for example House's speech about society of consumers and why democracy doesnt work or Ceasers speech about thesis and antithesis), some interesting details like robot fetish for House and Ceaser's brain tumor, add to that memorable voice overs. I dont know how can people say that there is nothing special about them especially if you compare them to abominations from bethesda "games" (shivers)

No one is comparing them to Bethesda games, but they are shallow underdeveloped characters who are almost comically cliched.

 

[Gnidrologist]

Yeah, obviously, i didn't compare them to Beth's version, but to original Fallouts by BiS. It was really fun to read dialogues in those games, while i find lot of NPC dialogues in NV to be a chore that needs to be clicked through only not to miss a quest. Haven't finished the game yet and not meat Ceaser or Raul. Anyhow, i'm not saying writing is shit. It's competent, but bland. No wonder given who was in charge.

 

[GloomFrost]

Yeah, obviously, i didn't compare them to Beth's version, but to original Fallouts by BiS. It was really fun to read dialogues in those games, while i find lot of NPC dialogues in NV to be a chore that needs to be clicked through only not to miss a quest. Haven't finished the game yet and not meat Ceaser or Raul. Anyhow, i'm not saying writing is shit. It's competent, but bland. No wonder given who was in charge.

One of the reasons is that there are A LOT more people to talk to in NV then in f1 and f2 combined. Obsidian couldn't make every single npc memorable. But I personally still remember a lot of them.

 

[Gnidrologist]

One thing i have to say about this game - TOO MUCH TEXT. Yes, you read it right. It's nice to have a lot of reading material, when the plot is thrilling and writing top notch like Torment, Bloodlines or Deus Ex, but here in WL2 most of it is wiki like blurbs much like in Morrowind, but instead of Morrowind, where NPC would have copy pasted articles under the same keyword, which makes it easy to skip already known info, here we have a huge amount of redundantly similar texts about the same thing. Good example all the Titan wally, where everyone has to say something about ''tribute'', ''Titan'', ''mad monks'' etc. It annoying to wade through all that shit just not to miss some valuable hint in the heap of rubbish.
(moved from the wrong thread here)

 

[Gnidrologist]

Btw, it seems that killing random people for xp and loot after doing their quests has not any consequences. For examples, i decided to check what happens if i kill brother Chavez, who guards the boxes with supplies after doing his errand and didn't notice anything happening after that. Also, i decided to let honey badgers to kill monk that escorts us, because basically he is robbing my team of xp. Why would i not want to shoot all those lowlife raiders? It's not like there are any valuable npcs amogn them. Taking monks that escort them out also doesn't seem to bring trouble. I haven't got far in Titan wally though, so am i right or is there some branches that get shut because of this?

 

[SniperHF]

The monks have an expectation that their brothers will die defending "Titan's peace" so them dying and no one being concerned about it isn't much of a problem.

 

[Gnidrologist]

What about milita? I encountered three snipers just above the outpost 1. In dialogue they initiated fight so i killed them. They have AKs soi decided to leave it that way? Are those guys also ambivalent about their members being randomly killed?

It kinda feels nice to kill everyone in this game, because quite frankly, almost everyone are huge assholes towards the rangers for some reason. Even those, who should me praying to them. I will surely kill that Howdy guy, who guards cow herders after i complete the quest for black chick.

 

[SniperHF]

What about milita? I encountered three snipers just above the outpost 1. In dialogue they initiated fight so i killed them. They have AKs soi decided to leave it that way? Are those guys also ambivalent about their members being randomly killed?

Minor spoiler for the answer:

Spoiler

You might miss the dialog depending on if you find their headquarters or not.

Their leader does get mad about it when you talk to him. But IIRC it's mostly a throwaway line and the real question is whether or not you decide to work for them against the monks. Also whether or not you bring your monk escort with you affects their reaction.

 

[hiver]

Gnidrologist

The only consequence is that you will need to find more of the goo containers to enter the Monks base. None of the other stuff you mentioned has any consequences.
Which is why i was saying what i was saying.


There is no branches except the ones the game saws off while sitting on them.
Wtf do you think you are playing there?

 

[Gnidrologist]

I don't mind that. Was just asking. Expected this to be dungeon crawler with guns knowing, who is in charge and all in all i'm enjoying it.

 

[shihonage]

One thing i have to say about this game - TOO MUCH TEXT. Yes, you read it right. It's nice to have a lot of reading material, when the plot is thrilling and writing top notch like Torment, Bloodlines or Deus Ex, but here in WL2 most of it is wiki like blurbs much like in Morrowind, but instead of Morrowind, where NPC would have copy pasted articles under the same keyword, which makes it easy to skip already known info, here we have a huge amount of redundantly similar texts about the same thing. Good example all the Titan wally, where everyone has to say something about ''tribute'', ''Titan'', ''mad monks'' etc. It annoying to wade through all that shit just not to miss some valuable hint in the heap of rubbish.
(moved from the wrong thread here)

It's part of Brian Fargo's vision to "design game for all those hardcore autistic children who like lots of text and numbers and shit".

Dog food.