Incline What happened to Beamdog?

[octavius]

They played the wrong hand of cards.

When I was contracted to do some freelance work on their Baldurs Gate 3 - Monoliths of Karhem, I was at first excited. It seemed like a different take on the formula, inspired by Polynesian mythology. But when I got there, it was a train-wreck. they had no design architecture, they did not have a single demo running despite months and months of "work," which I put quotes around because it consisted of a bunch of losers having meetings around a failed actor's table each week arguing trivia. Until I came to work for them, I gathered there wasn't anybody on the team who had the foggiest idea of how to develop a computer game.

The worst thing was they hired some lunatic who had a cameo on third Harry Potter film, he was an "actor" and an "artist". The corporate blindly followed his "artistic vision", because he was "a real artist". The worst thing was, you literally couldnt walk into the guys flat without stumbling on a dildo, or an underage male kid the god darn pedo bought home to "play some of his games". They literally had designs on monsters that looked like a vaginasaurus and some creepy scaly shit.

I bet when you were in the army you broke every record they keep track of.

 

[Andhaira]

Say what you will, but IWD: Enhanced Edition is dope. Same game, but has the resolution/disappear-able interface of BG II AND all the kits of BGII

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

I strongly suspect the answer is, Neverwinter Nights enhanced has not sold well.

They have put out major patches over the last year. I don't think they would waste money if that was the case.

Alternative theory, Beamdog are actually not complete morons unlike whoever is behind the Nier Automata scandal. They understand that patching your video game is fairly low effort, and an excellent way to make consumers happy so they tell their friends to buy your game. The long tail of steam revenue is very considerable.

I don't actually work at Beamdog though.

Maybe Neverwinter sold like the moon and they are preparing a rehash of its expansions?

I am guessing however that "Baldur's Gate 1/2 enhanced edition" would sell *many* more copies, than Neverwinter, given how much more love those games had.

O
Why don't they enhance some games that are really terrible like POR: Ruins of Myth Drannor, Pirates of Realmspace, Descent to Undermountain, Hillsfar, turn all the Heroes of the lance/dragons of flame into proper metroidvania games, (actually all the DL non-goldbox games sucked pretty hard so fix them).

 

[copebot]

Doesn’t really make sense to try to transform a remaster studio into an original game studio. Consider that remasters are actually hot right now and big game companies are actually acquiring remaster studios for big numbers (like the ActiBlizz acquisition of the D2 remaster guys).

Consider how well Rome Total War remastered sold, and how the company that did it was able to work on it in stages from mobile ports to full PC remaster. From a business perspective this type of studio should be doing well right now. Obviously though they never wanted to be just a remaster studio, they had creative ambitions, just stymied by the fact that all their creative outputs were bad.

 

[Gargaune]

What was the story with them failing to rewrite some renderer for NWN:EE?

I dunno about fail, they did it partway through, hit some roadblocks and decided to release what they'd done. Which consists of an updated lighting model, some screen effects, specular shader and normal mapping, though I don't think there are any new assets to take advantage of that last one. I'm not sure what else they were supposed to do to the rendering that got abandoned.

Why don't they enhance some games that are really terrible like POR: Ruins of Myth Drannor, Pirates of Realmspace, Descent to Undermountain, Hillsfar, turn all the Heroes of the lance/dragons of flame into proper metroidvania games, (actually all the DL non-goldbox games sucked pretty hard so fix them).

The issue with a lot of these old D&D games is that their IP ownership is supposedly a quagmire. Again, if memory serves, Trent specifically addressed questions with regards to the possibility of some Gold Box EEs and explained that copyrights on them are far more trouble than they're worth between all the different license holders.

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

I had forgotten about the D2 remaster again, perhaps because I know it'll be overpriced. Not like I don't own two full copies back when I played LAN with my Pa.

 

[copebot]

What was the story with them failing to rewrite some renderer for NWN:EE?

I dunno about fail, they did it partway through, hit some roadblocks and decided to release what they'd done. Which consists of an updated lighting model, some screen effects, specular shader and normal mapping, though I don't think there are any new assets to take advantage of that last one. I'm not sure what else they were supposed to do to the rendering that got abandoned.

Why don't they enhance some games that are really terrible like POR: Ruins of Myth Drannor, Pirates of Realmspace, Descent to Undermountain, Hillsfar, turn all the Heroes of the lance/dragons of flame into proper metroidvania games, (actually all the DL non-goldbox games sucked pretty hard so fix them).

The issue with a lot of these old D&D games is that their IP ownership is supposedly a quagmire. Again, if memory serves, Trent specifically addressed questions with regards to the possibility of some Gold Box EEs and explained that copyrights on them are far more trouble than they're worth between all the different license holders.

It doesn't necessarily mean that it's impossible to figure out, but that it would require 100s of hours of legal work to uncover. A lot of times lawyers write licensing agreements on the assumption that the parties to the contract will still be at least somewhat in existence. When there are multiple layers of bankruptcy involving companies that people don't even remember existing owned by dead people, it gets pretty complicated unless the licensing agreements were written to dissolve themselves in such eventualities. Then there are questions as to whether or not there are even still records of the contracts.

The other issue with just doing it and waiting to be sued is that there is always some weirdo or someone's ex-wife who can be convinced by a plaintiff attorney that they are owed royalties or a veto on a project because of their supposed rights. This is one of the reasons why copyright should probably revert to having a shorter expiration date, just to avoid these kinds of confusing situations. With old books or antiquated art it is not challenging to just take the old material, do the print version of 'remastering' it, and to then copyright the new edition of the work. Eventually, when games are old enough, it'll be possible to do more of those types of projects, so things that would have been potentially encumbered could just be remastered in the clear because any copyrights that had encumbered it will have expired. That unfortunately gets confusing with the bigger overarching Mickey Mouse type copyrights that keep getting infinitely renewed, like saying that a game based in 1990s Forgotten Realms violates your eternally renewed copyright to Forgotten Realms even in 2050.

 

[Mustawd]

While addressing players on the official forums earlier in the week, community manager Julius Borisov confirmed that Beamdog has been working on a new game which is not a remaster. The project is actually a brand new intellectual property but details of which will only be shared in due time.

“While the door on remasters hasn’t been totally shut, currently Beamdog is working on a new game, its own IP,” he said. “No details have been shared yet.”

https://segmentnext.com/2021/04/17/beamdog-new-ip/

 

[deuxhero]

I strongly suspect the answer is, Neverwinter Nights enhanced has not sold well.

They have put out major patches over the last year. I don't think they would waste money if that was the case.

I suspect the answer's somewhere in the middle - didn't make enough waves to warrant further investment in full-sized expansions like TotM (especially if there are WotC licensing overheads in the mix), but probably still constitutes a steady stream of income to justify continued development. NWN EE is still a live project and the latest patch, with that community content browser in particular, shows Beamdog still has ongoing plans there.

As for what else they're working on, Rusty's already pointed to their jobs listings. If I recall correctly, back when NWN EE was launched and people were asking about NWN2, Trent said it wasn't in the cards and already suggested that they were keen to shift from EEs to brand new IP of their own. Which was actually kinda disappointing, because NWN2 is the one title that could benefit the most from an EE treatment.

How so? What does NWN2 need besides better camera, turn based combat, and ability to implement custom spellcasting for classes?

 

[Rusty Eyes]

When will people stop crying about how Beamdog "ruined" the IE games via their Enhanced Editions? Icewind Dale and Planescape: Torment were great right upon release; the latter having an additional editing pass by Avellone himself. Both Baldur's Gate EEs are considered the authoritative versions of the games by the playerbase currently, with everyone and their modders having switched onto them. Were they buggy at release? Sure. But that's the cardinal sin of 95% of all RPGs on release, no matter whether vanilla or remake. What matters is the end result. Don't like the new party members? Don't accept them into the party, just like any other companion already present in the game.

 

[Rusty Eyes]

Last I heard of them, the latest of several original titles got canceled. No idea what they're currently working on.

I actually wouldn't mind an Arcanum or Temple of Elemental Evil Enhanced Edition if it got the gears moving to let Tim Cain release the source code for them (from what I recall he has it preserved, but can't release it because his contract with either Activison or Atari prevents him releasing stuff that could bypass the CD check DRM the games are no longer sold with). The EE wouldn't be worth playing, but source access would be huge for the original.

This isn't possible, since it seems that inXile are working on a sequel alongside the original writer, Chadwick Moore, so I assume inXile aquired the rights to Arcanum.

https://twitter.com/Pappylicious/status/1316047456665100289

 

[Contagium]

"... developer Beamdog coming around with another notable CRPG will surely have fans of the genre gleaming with happiness."

Author should have conducted a Codex poll before publishing that statement.

 

[fantadomat]

I recall they were really pinning their hopes on developing Baldur's Gate 3, and their "Enhanced Editions" were a way to show they understood the source material ("Hey, we have guys who worked on the originals!") and would be best suited to expand on it.

That turned out well.

Hmmm i think that you are correct,tho i think that they would have done a better BG3 than larian. Still wouldn't have sold well,while larian's garbage will sell well. In the end there was no good choice,both studios would have delivered shit. Still at least beamdog's shit would have been closer to the originals,while larian's shit is DOS3 but renamed in to BG3.

 

[fantadomat]

They played the wrong hand of cards.

When I was contracted to do some freelance work on their Baldurs Gate 3 - Monoliths of Karhem, I was at first excited. It seemed like a different take on the formula, inspired by Polynesian mythology. But when I got there, it was a train-wreck. they had no design architecture, they did not have a single demo running despite months and months of "work," which I put quotes around because it consisted of a bunch of losers having meetings around a failed actor's table each week arguing trivia. Until I came to work for them, I gathered there wasn't anybody on the team who had the foggiest idea of how to develop a computer game.

The worst thing was they hired some lunatic who had a cameo on third Harry Potter film, he was an "actor" and an "artist". The corporate blindly followed his "artistic vision", because he was "a real artist". The worst thing was, you literally couldnt walk into the guys flat without stumbling on a dildo, or an underage male kid the god darn pedo bought home to "play some of his games". They literally had designs on monsters that looked like a vaginasaurus and some creepy scaly shit.

This sounds very similar to a certain old story from the codex archives. Not sure if you are paying homage to it in jest or you actually worked for beamcocks and saw that shit.

 

[fantadomat]

When will people stop crying about how Beamdog "ruined" the IE games via their Enhanced Editions? Icewind Dale and Planescape: Torment were great right upon release; the latter having an additional editing pass by Avellone himself. Both Baldur's Gate EEs are considered the authoritative versions of the games by the playerbase currently, with everyone and their modders having switched onto them. Were they buggy at release? Sure. But that's the cardinal sin of 95% of all RPGs on release, no matter whether vanilla or remake. What matters is the end result. Don't like the new party members? Don't accept them into the party, just like any other companion already present in the game.

Hmmmm well the EE are not bad per se,but they are not something to brag about. They are pretty nice mechanical way,it saves time to search for mods,and that is all they do. People hate beamcock because they are more or less talentless sjw hacks. They just copy/paste a bunch of already made mods,ignore the bugs the come out of it and just resell them as EEs. They can't make a EE of any Troika game because they lack the skills needed to enchant the original game and it is pretty hard to just steal the mods because the mod community is not as big as BG games and it will be pretty obvious who's mod they stole. Sooo in the end the EE editions are nice megamod pack,but beamcock are shit.

 

[Contagium]

When will people stop crying about how Beamdog "ruined" the IE games via their Enhanced Editions? Icewind Dale and Planescape: Torment were great right upon release; the latter having an additional editing pass by Avellone himself. Both Baldur's Gate EEs are considered the authoritative versions of the games by the playerbase currently, with everyone and their modders having switched onto them. Were they buggy at release? Sure. But that's the cardinal sin of 95% of all RPGs on release, no matter whether vanilla or remake. What matters is the end result. Don't like the new party members? Don't accept them into the party, just like any other companion already present in the game.

Did you actually play NWN EE? It was awful. Ran worse than the original with a myriad of bugs. Years later they are still trying to get it fixed.

 

[Generic-Giant-Spider]

Both Baldur's Gate EEs are considered the authoritative versions of the games by the playerbase currently

loads gun

 

[Gargaune]

It doesn't necessarily mean that it's impossible to figure out, but that it would require 100s of hours of legal work to uncover.

I don't think he meant it's impossible to figure out, just that the complicated licensing structure would involve a lot of investigation and then negotiation on fees and shares etc., to the point that it made the prospect commercially unattractive.

How so? What does NWN2 need besides better camera, turn based combat, and ability to implement custom spellcasting for classes?

That's what I mean, NWN2 has a lot of "almost there" items that could be easily fixed for massive benefit, so a worthwhile EE would be relatively cheap to develop. We're talking about incomplete and unpolished features as well as a smattering of bugs that would make a big difference if fixed. Off the top of my head, stuff like:
- Party controls: fix the 3D model multiselection bug, add precise positioning, save companion positions, preferably add formations as well;
- Camera: unlock Strategy camera range, fix Strategy camera elevation bug, implement the speed slider for edge turning, add some sort of "keyholing" or occlusion outline option (since NWN2 doesn't have vertical tiles);
- UI: native widescreen layout, save Minimap setting, save Exploration camera mode, auto-toggle for Quickcast, fix the scrambled controls bug;
- Graphics: update head models (like Xaltar's mod does), wouldn't say no to some updated shaders and thingamajigs;
- Engine: fix the platform clock bug, optimise loading speed to whatever extent possible.

TB option would be a welcome addition, but I wouldn't expect that of a remaster. Obviously, the OC would still suck on the back of its design and the Toolset is a whole other mess, but most of the stuff above wouldn't be a mountain of work and could make the game a much more polished, comfortable experience out of the box.

 

[Tigranes]

Were they buggy at release? Sure. But that's the cardinal sin of 95% of all RPGs on release, no matter whether vanilla or remake. What matters is the end result. Don't like the new party members? Don't accept them into the party, just like any other companion already present in the game.

"What matters is the end result: shitty new content that you have the choice of avoiding! Jesus, why do people say this product was bad???"

 

[DeepOcean]

I remember when they released Torment Enhanced edition and I remember having a feeling of relief that they were just doing a glorified patch, well... it speaks volumes that people actually feel better when you dont produce any new content.

 

[good fucking shit happen]

Don't like the new party members? Don't accept them into the party

Fuck yeah. When I look for a good deal I always aim to pay extra for shit content I actively need to ignore. Ten times the price for a gay orc companion? Worth every penny.

 

[Monkey Baron]

When will people stop crying about how Beamdog "ruined" the IE games via their Enhanced Editions? Icewind Dale and Planescape: Torment were great right upon release; the latter having an additional editing pass by Avellone himself. Both Baldur's Gate EEs are considered the authoritative versions of the games by the playerbase currently, with everyone and their modders having switched onto them. Were they buggy at release? Sure. But that's the cardinal sin of 95% of all RPGs on release, no matter whether vanilla or remake. What matters is the end result. Don't like the new party members? Don't accept them into the party, just like any other companion already present in the game.

The only thing I like about the Enhanced Editions is that I get to own the games on Steam. I would have been able to own these games on Steam if all of the IE classics were never yanked off of the store in the first place.

I'm pretty sure that NWN2 on Steam is worth an absurd amount of money now because of this.

 

[v1rus]

They played the wrong hand of cards.

When I was contracted to do some freelance work on their Baldurs Gate 3 - Monoliths of Karhem, I was at first excited. It seemed like a different take on the formula, inspired by Polynesian mythology. But when I got there, it was a train-wreck. they had no design architecture, they did not have a single demo running despite months and months of "work," which I put quotes around because it consisted of a bunch of losers having meetings around a failed actor's table each week arguing trivia. Until I came to work for them, I gathered there wasn't anybody on the team who had the foggiest idea of how to develop a computer game.

The worst thing was they hired some lunatic who had a cameo on third Harry Potter film, he was an "actor" and an "artist". The corporate blindly followed his "artistic vision", because he was "a real artist". The worst thing was, you literally couldnt walk into the guys flat without stumbling on a dildo, or an underage male kid the god darn pedo bought home to "play some of his games". They literally had designs on monsters that looked like a vaginasaurus and some creepy scaly shit.

This sounds very similar to a certain old story from the codex archives. Not sure if you are paying homage to it in jest or you actually worked for beamcocks and saw that shit.

Spoiler

омаж

 

[fantadomat]

Don't like the new party members? Don't accept them into the party

Fuck yeah. When I look for a good deal I always aim to pay extra for shit content I actively need to ignore. Ten times the price for a gay orc companion? Worth every penny.

Worth the price i paid,i get to kill a gay ork companion. At least they are pretty accurate,he is evil,just like any fagz

 

[Azdul]

Both Baldur's Gate EEs are considered the authoritative versions of the games by the playerbase currently, with everyone and their modders having switched onto them.

No, they're not.

While Enhanced Editions were improved over last few years, they're still behind classic versions in few crucial aspects:
- community translations are still worse than original, professionally translated versions
- EEx was completely broken by patch 2.6, and will stay broken for at least next 6 months - while TobEx is still being improved
- EET is not as compatible and bug-free as BGT
- there is no support for EE in GemRB, while GemRB itself is constantly being improved
- some really good mods do not have EE versions, and no one is working on implementing them
- despite ambitious plans, EE exclusive must-have mods have never realised
- Big World Project / Big World Setup still do not support EE

BG EE is 9 years old - it's hardly a hot new thing. At this point many modders choose to work on classic editions again. The audience will be limited anyway - so you may as well do something that is fun.