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Vapourware WOTC restricting content creation in new OGL - Paizo launches competing OGL - lol cancelled

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Even if it doesn't, it can't be trusted. We know what they want. They made it very clear. Even if this attempt is completely stymied their goal hasn't changed. They'll try to find some other way to reach their goal.
 
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https://www.dndbeyond.com/posts/1439-ogl-1-0a-creative-commons

So, what about the goals that drove us when we started this process?

We wanted to protect the D&D play experience into the future. We still want to do that with your help. We're grateful that this community is passionate and active because we'll need your help protecting the game's inclusive and welcoming nature.


Hahahaha lol no way anyone should trust WoTC ever again. May them crash and burn.
 

mediocrepoet

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https://www.dndbeyond.com/posts/1439-ogl-1-0a-creative-commons

So, what about the goals that drove us when we started this process?

We wanted to protect the D&D play experience into the future. We still want to do that with your help. We're grateful that this community is passionate and active because we'll need your help protecting the game's inclusive and welcoming nature.


Hahahaha lol no way anyone should trust WoTC ever again. May them crash and burn.
Regardless of trusting them, what the hell does this even mean? You can't have a game at your table without a sanctioned WotC observer to determine whether or not you're welcoming enough and to review your dungeons for wheelchair ramps?

Re: published products: if someone wants all the wheelchair ramp shit, people will buy it. People who think it's retarded (I have to expect this is everyone who isn't virtue signalling, retarded, or possibly a crippled kid who wants a hero that looks like themself which is the only time I'd let this pass) will not buy it and favour products that don't have that crap and the market will have spoken.
 

Rahdulan

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https://www.dndbeyond.com/posts/1439-ogl-1-0a-creative-commons

So, what about the goals that drove us when we started this process?

We wanted to protect the D&D play experience into the future. We still want to do that with your help. We're grateful that this community is passionate and active because we'll need your help protecting the game's inclusive and welcoming nature.


Hahahaha lol no way anyone should trust WoTC ever again. May them crash and burn.
This entire shitstorm boils down to "protect it from what, and from whom?" because D&D didn't need it during these 20 years that OGL had existed. It was doing just fine as customers chose what to support. No matter the outcome WotC have kicked the hornet's nest and sizeable companies would now rather distances themselves from OGL with their own thing than risk any future retardation.
 
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It's nothing really new, they tried to pull this trick in the past and it failed. They will not give up and will try again. But in all seriousness the 3.5 edition books, which you can easily find, is all you need.
 

Cross

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would pretty strongly imply that Hasbro is actually in dire financial straits and has also been intentionally obfuscating that.
Well...

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/business/business-news/hasbro-to-lay-off-1000-staffers-1235310817/

Hasbro to Lay Off 1,000 Staffers, 15 Percent of Workforce, Amid Cost-Savings Push​


The toy giant is also looking to sell its production division Entertainment One as it pivots to focus on gaming.

The toy and entertainment giant Hasbro says that it will cut its workforce by 15 percent, or 1,000 employees, in the coming weeks.

The significant layoffs are part of a larger restructuring and cost-savings effort underway, with the company having already put its TV and film division Entertainment One up for sale.
 

J1M

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On second thought, maybe we have Paramount Pictures to thank for this drastic change in direction.
Very much doubt it. This reeks of "Oh shit this controversy (that has already opened us up to short-selling by any investor who is even slightly online) is now so large that even our dipshit octogenarian shareholders who have no idea what the fuck it is that we actually do might hear about it and start purging us from their portfolio AND THAT WOULD MEAN THE COCAINE TRAIN IS COMING TO AN END!!!!".

I'm sure Paramount isn't happy about this whole brouhaha, but I can't imagine that they have an agreement where they are actually able to leverage any real, practical influence on what Hasbro does here. That would be... extremely unusual, and if it were the case would pretty strongly imply that Hasbro is actually in dire financial straits and has also been intentionally obfuscating that.
It doesn't have to be a contract signed in blood. It can just be a phone call reminding them that Hasbro was expecting to make $100m on the film.
 

J1M

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Given the past two "apologies" were totally fake and 100% bullshit, I'm doubt this doesn't have some kind of gotcha.
The gotcha is that they haven't committed to using the same approach for D&D6. They just said people can continue to use the older versions the way they have been.

It's still a victory over greedy disconnected executives and puts a lot of pressure on D&D6 to be mechanically superior to v3.5 and v5 if they want to make any license changes in order to avoid splitting the fanbase again.
 
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Codex Year of the Donut
https://www.dndbeyond.com/posts/1439-ogl-1-0a-creative-commons

So, what about the goals that drove us when we started this process?

We wanted to protect the D&D play experience into the future. We still want to do that with your help. We're grateful that this community is passionate and active because we'll need your help protecting the game's inclusive and welcoming nature.


Hahahaha lol no way anyone should trust WoTC ever again. May them crash and burn.
Dungeon & Dragons was a game created by E. Gary Gygax & Dave Arneson. The product they market as "Dungeon & Dragons" is the equivalent of a man wearing a dress.
 
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On second thought, maybe we have Paramount Pictures to thank for this drastic change in direction.
Very much doubt it. This reeks of "Oh shit this controversy (that has already opened us up to short-selling by any investor who is even slightly online) is now so large that even our dipshit octogenarian shareholders who have no idea what the fuck it is that we actually do might hear about it and start purging us from their portfolio AND THAT WOULD MEAN THE COCAINE TRAIN IS COMING TO AN END!!!!".

I'm sure Paramount isn't happy about this whole brouhaha, but I can't imagine that they have an agreement where they are actually able to leverage any real, practical influence on what Hasbro does here. That would be... extremely unusual, and if it were the case would pretty strongly imply that Hasbro is actually in dire financial straits and has also been intentionally obfuscating that.
It doesn't have to be a contract signed in blood. It can just be a phone call reminding them that Hasbro was expecting to make $100m on the film.
If Hasbro thought that they had a chance of making 100M on this film then they are so fucking deluded that they have much bigger problems than this OGL stuff. There’s no way this movie is grossing a billion dollars which is probably around what it would need for Hasbro to take home 100M assuming they negotiated an extremely favorable deal with Paramount.

Much more likely is that Hasbro is making a very small percentage on the BO, but is betting that the movie will act as free advertising for toy sales.
 

Bara

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Pretty much good news for anyone playing present or past editions. Can just work backwards from the CC for the old stuff or if you really want 5e work off it directly.

6e though or whatever it is will be hard locked down and wile they are going to leave 1.0a alone now they so are for sure going to now make a full on GSL for 6e.

But whatever the past will just repeat itself when they did the GSL last time.

Also what fans 4e has are still locked behind their own restrictive GSL. I remember even seeing a random youtube video years ago by a bunch of them asking witc to ogl it and hope for the start of a 4e "renisance" the poor bsstards.
 

JamesDixon

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Pretty much good news for anyone playing present or past editions. Can just work backwards from the CC for the old stuff or if you really want 5e work off it directly.

6e though or whatever it is will be hard locked down and wile they are going to leave 1.0a alone now they so are for sure going to now make a full on GSL for 6e.

But whatever the past will just repeat itself when they did the GSL last time.

Also what fans 4e has are still locked behind their own restrictive GSL. I remember even seeing a random youtube video years ago by a bunch of them asking witc to ogl it and hope for the start of a 4e "renisance" the poor bsstards.

You don't need the OGL for what you could already use which is game mechanics. The OGL does not grant you permission to use any of their settings and other IP. I wish people would get it through their fucking retarded heads this simple fact of copyright law.
 

J1M

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Pretty much good news for anyone playing present or past editions. Can just work backwards from the CC for the old stuff or if you really want 5e work off it directly.

6e though or whatever it is will be hard locked down and wile they are going to leave 1.0a alone now they so are for sure going to now make a full on GSL for 6e.

But whatever the past will just repeat itself when they did the GSL last time.

Also what fans 4e has are still locked behind their own restrictive GSL. I remember even seeing a random youtube video years ago by a bunch of them asking witc to ogl it and hope for the start of a 4e "renisance" the poor bsstards.

You don't need the OGL for what you could already use which is game mechanics. The OGL does not grant you permission to use any of their settings and other IP. I wish people would get it through their fucking retarded heads this simple fact of copyright law.
Since you seem bold enough to be the lightning rod for a (winnable) lawsuit, why don't you rewrite the game mechanics for 4e and slap a creative commons license on it?
 

JamesDixon

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Since you seem bold enough to be the lightning rod for a (winnable) lawsuit, why don't you rewrite the game mechanics for 4e and slap a creative commons license on it?

4E is shit and DANDINO. I am working on my version of AD&D 2E and no, I'm not slapping a creative commons license on it because I don't need to license game mechanics from an already published RPG that is no longer supported. Also, by using the creative commons license it admits that Wizards has a valid claim to the copyright to game mechanics. Jesus you are so stupid sometimes.

I have case law and the actual law on my side. Do you have anything intelligent to add to this conversion?
 

Alex

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Pretty much good news for anyone playing present or past editions. Can just work backwards from the CC for the old stuff or if you really want 5e work off it directly.

6e though or whatever it is will be hard locked down and wile they are going to leave 1.0a alone now they so are for sure going to now make a full on GSL for 6e.

But whatever the past will just repeat itself when they did the GSL last time.

Also what fans 4e has are still locked behind their own restrictive GSL. I remember even seeing a random youtube video years ago by a bunch of them asking witc to ogl it and hope for the start of a 4e "renisance" the poor bsstards.

You don't need the OGL for what you could already use which is game mechanics. The OGL does not grant you permission to use any of their settings and other IP. I wish people would get it through their fucking retarded heads this simple fact of copyright law.
Since you seem bold enough to be the lightning rod for a (winnable) lawsuit, why don't you rewrite the game mechanics for 4e and slap a creative commons license on it?
Why would anyone waste their time with 4e?
 

mediocrepoet

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Pretty much good news for anyone playing present or past editions. Can just work backwards from the CC for the old stuff or if you really want 5e work off it directly.

6e though or whatever it is will be hard locked down and wile they are going to leave 1.0a alone now they so are for sure going to now make a full on GSL for 6e.

But whatever the past will just repeat itself when they did the GSL last time.

Also what fans 4e has are still locked behind their own restrictive GSL. I remember even seeing a random youtube video years ago by a bunch of them asking witc to ogl it and hope for the start of a 4e "renisance" the poor bsstards.

You don't need the OGL for what you could already use which is game mechanics. The OGL does not grant you permission to use any of their settings and other IP. I wish people would get it through their fucking retarded heads this simple fact of copyright law.
Since you seem bold enough to be the lightning rod for a (winnable) lawsuit, why don't you rewrite the game mechanics for 4e and slap a creative commons license on it?
Why would anyone waste their time with 4e?
4E sucks, but the point was that 4E is the system that's out that isn't covered by any version of the OGL.
 

saint amchad

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On second thought, maybe we have Paramount Pictures to thank for this drastic change in direction.
Very much doubt it. This reeks of "Oh shit this controversy (that has already opened us up to short-selling by any investor who is even slightly online) is now so large that even our dipshit octogenarian shareholders who have no idea what the fuck it is that we actually do might hear about it and start purging us from their portfolio AND THAT WOULD MEAN THE COCAINE TRAIN IS COMING TO AN END!!!!".

I'm sure Paramount isn't happy about this whole brouhaha, but I can't imagine that they have an agreement where they are actually able to leverage any real, practical influence on what Hasbro does here. That would be... extremely unusual, and if it were the case would pretty strongly imply that Hasbro is actually in dire financial straits and has also been intentionally obfuscating that.
It doesn't have to be a contract signed in blood. It can just be a phone call reminding them that Hasbro was expecting to make $100m on the film.
If Hasbro thought that they had a chance of making 100M on this film then they are so fucking deluded that they have much bigger problems than this OGL stuff. There’s no way this movie is grossing a billion dollars which is probably around what it would need for Hasbro to take home 100M assuming they negotiated an extremely favorable deal with Paramount.

Much more likely is that Hasbro is making a very small percentage on the BO, but is betting that the movie will act as free advertising for toy sales.
That is if its not "Hollywood accounting" and they get a big fat $0.
 

Bara

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Pretty much good news for anyone playing present or past editions. Can just work backwards from the CC for the old stuff or if you really want 5e work off it directly.

6e though or whatever it is will be hard locked down and wile they are going to leave 1.0a alone now they so are for sure going to now make a full on GSL for 6e.

But whatever the past will just repeat itself when they did the GSL last time.

Also what fans 4e has are still locked behind their own restrictive GSL. I remember even seeing a random youtube video years ago by a bunch of them asking witc to ogl it and hope for the start of a 4e "renisance" the poor bsstards.

You don't need the OGL for what you could already use which is game mechanics. The OGL does not grant you permission to use any of their settings and other IP. I wish people would get it through their fucking retarded heads this simple fact of copyright law.

OGL/Creative Commons just makes life easier in keeping some universal language being the games going.

If nothing else it gives publishers a feeling of safety and prevents any chilling effect from the fear of lawsuits. If you can't see that at least your really freaking thick headed.

Case in point Jeffrey Talanian of Hyperborea relief after getting really panicked by the situation.

 

JamesDixon

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OGL/Creative Commons just makes life easier in keeping some universal language being the games going.

No, it's you giving up your rights and bending over to take it up the ass. You can't copyright rules. Period end of story.

If nothing else it gives publishers a feeling of safety and prevents any chilling effect from the fear of lawsuits.

In order for there to be lawsuits there must be standing. Filing a lawsuit claiming that someone infringed upon your game mechanics under copyright is an automatic lack of standing by the courts. What lawsuits huh? Oh fear porn that's right.

If you can't see that at least your really freaking thick headed.

I can see that you love taking it up the ass by all the corporations and waive your rights. How's the gimp suit and the cage? I'd rather be thick headed with the law on my side than to be some bottom for a multi-billion dollar corporation that just loves to rape their playerbase.

Case in point Jeffrey Talanian of Hyperborea relief after getting really panicked by the situation.

Who used the OGL which means he acknowledged Wizard's claim of copyright over game mechanics. Do you know what the fuck a license means? I shall educate you. The legal definition of a license is, "permission to do something that would otherwise be illegal." How is using public domain things like game mechanics illegal?

:nocountryforshitposters:
 

Bara

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Dude your really aggressive at being a idiot but you do you

Good luck with your clone system your going to need it
 

JamesDixon

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Dude your really aggressive at being a idiot but you do you

Good luck with your clone system your going to need it

I'm getting tired of repeating the exact same thing to morons like you who don't understand the law or the cases that came before.

I shall repeat it again in the hopes you actually read the goddamn thing.

"[G]ame mechanics and the rules are not entitled to protection, but courts have found expressive elements copyrightable, including game labels, design of game boards, playing cards and graphical works." Tetris Holding, LLC v. Xio Interactive, Inc. , 863 F.Supp.2d 394, 404 (D.N.J. 2012) (citations omitted); see also Durham Indus., Inc. v. Tomy Corp. , 630 F.2d 905, 913 (2d Cir.1980) ("[C]opyright protection extends only to the artistic aspects, but not the mechanical or utilitarian features, of a protected work."). Unlike a book or movie plot, the rules and procedures, including the winning conditions, that make up a cardgame system of play do not themselves produce the artistic or literary content that is the hallmark of protectable expression. See Boyden, 18 GEO. MASON L. REV. at 466. Instead, the game rules, procedures, and winning conditions create the environment for expression. Id. ; see also Nat'l Basketball Ass'n , 105 F.3d at 846 ("Unlike movies, plays, television programs, or operas, athletic events are competitive and have no underlying script.").

This general rule is consistent with the decision in Baker v. Selden , 101 U.S. 99, 25 L.Ed. 841 (1879), in which the Supreme Court ruled that a particular bookkeeping system was not copyrightable. The language and illustrations that the plaintiff had used to explain his system were copyrightable, but they did not protect the system itself from use by other parties. The Copyright Office has applied the rule that copyright does not protect a system's operation method to games. The December 2011 fact sheet for Copyright Registration of Games states:

Copyright does not protect the idea for a game, its name or title, or the method or methods for playing it. Nor does copyright protect any idea, system, method, device, or trademark material involved in developing, merchandising, or playing a game. Once a game has been made public, nothing in the copyright law prevents others from developing another game based on similar principles. Copyright protects only the particular manner of an author's expression in literary, artistic, or musical form. U.S. COPYRIGHT OFFICE , FL-108, COPYRIGHT REGISTRATION OF GAMES (2011).

DaVinci Editrice S.R.L. (Plaintiff)) v. ZiKo Games LLC (Defendant) 2016

I have the courts and the US Copyright Office on my side. Wizards doesn't have standing because you can't copyright game mechanics.
 

Bara

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Dixon ultimately its not a matter of if your right and wrong.

It's a matter if you can afford a lawsuit or not. And yeah they probably don't care about you or other small publishers but some don't want to take that chance.

But your thick head really can't seem to comprehend that.

Why would anyone waste their time with 4e?

I don't know man, but it's got its fans still surprisingly. Found that video of some guy talking about "4er"



I also stand corrected as looking for that video it appears that some have started a 4e retroclone using the ogl.
 

JamesDixon

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I'm a retard that I just want to keep running my idiotic mouth because I love Wizards.

You don't say.

Oh for the record it does matter what the fucking law says.
 

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