X-COM XCOM 2 + War of the Chosen Expansion Thread

[baturinsky]

If soldiers ration their overwatch to prevent overkill it seems like they'd have to nerf the shit out of overwatch or give the AI flat counter tools to deal with it, 'cause they weren't very good at assaulting XCOM's overwatch even with overkill (in the case where they can't see any XCOM at the start of the turn, anyway).

One of the major changes to overwatch highlighted in today's dev stream is that taking damage now disables OW. In EU/EW you had to run it or kill the OW unit.

In LW suppression fire disables OW

 

[Mozg]

I think that's in the base game too. Flashbangs also break overwatch.

Aliens also have the infuriating ability to know the exact tiles they can step into so they can see a guy on overwatch without actually triggering the shot (a trick that requires a human to painstakingly count out tiles). However, as far as I could tell some alien needs to currently see an XCOM unit to pull that trick, and their intelligence goes to complete shit if they need to double move to get into visual range, which ended up being a key to dealing with retarded Long War lategame Impossible enemy density of 60+ aliens packed into maps originally meant for 15. The only reason it could fail was if they accidentally screened for multiple units moving in by soaking up overkill overwatch.

 

[ArchAngel]

I think that's in the base game too. Flashbangs also break overwatch.

Aliens also have the infuriating ability to know the exact tiles they can step into so they can see a guy on overwatch without actually triggering the shot (a trick that requires a human to painstakingly count out tiles). However, as far as I could tell some alien needs to currently see an XCOM unit to pull that trick, and their intelligence goes to complete shit if they need to double move to get into visual range, which ended up being a key to dealing with retarded Long War lategame Impossible enemy density of 60+ aliens packed into maps originally meant for 15. The only reason it could fail was if they accidentally screened for multiple units moving in by soaking up overkill overwatch.

Well in Xcom 2 you will get a little icon to show when you can shoot at someone if you want to move into certain spot so that can be used to find out save spots to move into to fire without triggering overwatch.

 

[ArchAngel]

Maybe overwatch abilities will actually be worth taking now.

Well, they were already worth taking, depending on the ability. Sniper's Opportunist was godlike compared to the other choice on that level, support's Covering Fire was a good thing to have since it could trigger on things that aren't covered by regular overwatch and Sentinel is an alright idea if you ain't going full healbot. The only one that's kinda shit was heavy's Rapid Reaction, since it depended on the soldier not missing the first overwatch shot, and heavies have the lowest aim out of the bunch (unless you luck out with aim 80 rookie getting promoted in that class).

Covering Fire? Why would you want to attack someone in cover and have that reduction to attack chance in addition to normal overwatch reduction to attack chance?!

 

[CthuluIsSpy]

I think that's in the base game too. Flashbangs also break overwatch.

Aliens also have the infuriating ability to know the exact tiles they can step into so they can see a guy on overwatch without actually triggering the shot (a trick that requires a human to painstakingly count out tiles). However, as far as I could tell some alien needs to currently see an XCOM unit to pull that trick, and their intelligence goes to complete shit if they need to double move to get into visual range, which ended up being a key to dealing with retarded Long War lategame Impossible enemy density of 60+ aliens packed into maps originally meant for 15. The only reason it could fail was if they accidentally screened for multiple units moving in by soaking up overkill overwatch.

Only suppression and flashbangs. Damage doesn't remove overwatch.

 

[Average Manatee]

Maybe overwatch abilities will actually be worth taking now.

Well, they were already worth taking, depending on the ability. Sniper's Opportunist was godlike compared to the other choice on that level, support's Covering Fire was a good thing to have since it could trigger on things that aren't covered by regular overwatch and Sentinel is an alright idea if you ain't going full healbot. The only one that's kinda shit was heavy's Rapid Reaction, since it depended on the soldier not missing the first overwatch shot, and heavies have the lowest aim out of the bunch (unless you luck out with aim 80 rookie getting promoted in that class).

Covering Fire? Why would you want to attack someone in cover and have that reduction to attack chance in addition to normal overwatch reduction to attack chance?!

Plus there's the problem of not being able to crit on overwatch.

That said the AI seems to get super scared over Covering Fire sometimes, causing it to just hunker down or go into overwatch. Particularly floaters in LW go from the most OP motherfuckers who could tear any squad to pieces if they knew what they were doing, to pussies who have a 90% chance to just overwatch. No idea why, guessing the AI doesn't take into account flying bonuses when deciding whether its worth to risk overwatch?

I'm pretty sure I tried the first one of them but I just couldn't get into the RTwP gameplay it had. Might give them another go sometime, you can never kill enough aliens

FWIW, those games get better with each iteration. Aftershock > Aftermath and Afterlight > Aftershock.

All the games are good in different ways, with different failings.

 

[Jarpie]

Why are you guys hyped for this? The first XCom: Reboot for Retards was so unbelievably shit that I wouldn't expect anything from the sequel.

 

[Turtle-Zone 3000]

Why are you guys hyped for this? The first XCom: Reboot for Retards was so unbelievably shit that I wouldn't expect anything from the sequel.

M..m..m..mods will fix it.

 

[Zarniwoop]

Have you seen how hyped up these morons were/are for Fallout 4?

 

[laclongquan]

While F4 sounds to be unbelievable easymod, we still have hope of another Fallout 4 - NewVegasesque game.

 

[ArchAngel]

Why are you guys hyped for this? The first XCom: Reboot for Retards was so unbelievably shit that I wouldn't expect anything from the sequel.

Because it is possible to enjoy multiple kinds of Xcom games.

 

[Jarpie]

Because it is possible to enjoy multiple kinds of Xcom games.

How can someone enjoy eating dog shit when there's real proper food available?

 

[bonescraper]

I dunno, we're discussing video games here.

 

[ArchAngel]

I dunno, we're discussing video games here.

 

[Grotesque]

Why are you guys hyped for this? The first XCom: Reboot for Retards was so unbelievably shit that I wouldn't expect anything from the sequel.

Because it is possible to enjoy multiple kinds of Xcom games.

Hi there!
Let me be the first to bring to your attention that it exists only one "kind" of X-COM.
The other kinds of X-COM are just incomplete experiences.

 

[Zombra]

Funny how four letters on the wrapper can make so many so angry. If it were called "Jake's Fun Alien Game" no one would care.

 

[Jarpie]

I find Jake Solomon likeable based on his interviews I've seen, and it's a shame that Sid Meier told him to simplify and "modernize" NuXCom, wasn't their first prototype much closer to the original game?

 

[Jaedar]

I find Jake Solomon likeable based on his interviews I've seen, and it's a shame that Sid Meier told him to simplify and "modernize" NuXCom, wasn't their first prototype much closer to the original game?

Yeah. Solomon seems like a cool guy who could have made a real x-com game if they had let him. I think it was playtesters that found it confusing that fucked it up though.

 

[Zeriel]

Have you seen how hyped up these morons were/are for Fallout 4?

Comparing XCOM to Fallout 4 is a new level of retardation. XCOM broadly preserves the overall mechanics of the series, though it is dumbed down. It has turn-based combat, a geoscape, etc. Fallout 3 and 4 are in an entirely different genre from their original titles. You're reaching more than a bit there.

Looks like the VIP abduction videos were taken down. I guess the French site jumped the gun on putting it up.

It's probably going to be the same material they talk about on the weekly XCOM 2 stream on Firaxis' twitch channel.

 

[Grotesque]

Funny how four letters on the wrapper can make so many so angry. If it were called "Jake's Fun Alien Game" no one would care.

And also if Fallout 4 would have been called "Another bland moneygrab", nobody would care.
Congratulations, you just discovered warm water.

 

[Zeriel]

Welp, that's a thing.

 

[Jimmious]

What's the problem with it? You don't like the aesthetic of it? I find it kinda cool.

 

[Modron]

What's the problem with it? You don't like the aesthetic of it? I find it kinda cool.

He just wishes it was truer to the inspiration source:

 

[Infinitron]

Hands On: XCOM 2’s Brutal Difficulty And Superb Tactical Overhaul

Nobody gets left behind. That was my XCOM: Enemy Unknown rule and it was a rule that I adhered to in almost every one of the hundreds of missions I oversaw. If a squad fell in combat, they fell side by side.

XCOM 2 [official site] has made me break my one rule. Repeatedly. Deviously. Tragically. It’s hard as nails, and superbly distorts the tactics and strategies that were successful in its predecessor. I’m smitten.


I received a preview build of XCOM 2 just before Christmas and I’ve spent almost as much time with over the last two weeks as I have with all of the family and friends added together. Making a mockery of the idea of a winter break from the game criticism beat, it’s been my near-constant companion. That in itself should tell you something about how much I’ve been enjoying it, as should my previous words on the subject.

There’s so much more to tell though. I don’t want to spill the details about all of the new and exciting things though because you deserve to discover them for yourself. With its varied mission types, new foes and winding strategic structure, XCOM 2 puts the Unknown back in the series and that’s the way it should be.

In the three campaigns that I’ve started (and finished; the version I’m playing does have a cut-off point but I’ve failed rather than reaching it), I’ve faced more objectives than in every complete playthrough of Enemy Unknown and Within put together, and I’ve developed an entirely new tactical mindset.

That’s what I’m going to focus on here – the tension and terror of the tactical side of XCOM 2. When I first played the game, in a brief session at a preview event, I was surprised by the apparent depth of the strategic map. A closer look suggests that depth might not be quite the right word: unpredictability is closer.

Gone is the steady and structured escalation of the invasion, and gone are the boring bastard satellites that were to the campaign’s shape what weights and other hindrances were to Harrison Bergeron. Freed from the single-route linear progression, XCOM 2 presents an alien menace that reacts and builds power, through visible facilities in the world, and through a Doomsday counter that can be interrupted and set back by the player. There’s more, in the form of side missions and alien activity directed toward objectives other than an apocalyptic end-goal.

I’ll analyse all of that more carefully when I have the full game in my mitts. There’s loads to say about the actual missions as well, you see. They’re even more surprising than the changes to the Geoscape and the entire alien occupation storyline.

Above all else, XCOM 2 is a game of surprises, which is (ironically?) precisely what I didn’t expect it to be. It builds on the foundation laid by Enemy Unknown but distorts and challenges your expectations and understanding of that game at almost every turn.

The most obvious example of that tendency that I’ve seen occurs during an encounter with something new. That ‘something new’ disrupts the battlefield, forcing a rethink regarding the importance and utility of the usual movement from cover to cover. It makes a mockery of the good practice you’ve drilled into your soldiers and that will likely cause you to lose a squad or two as you readjust.

What’s truly brilliant about the execution of these twists in the tale is the way that they’re introduced. Although times have changed and XCOM are now a guerrilla resistance operation striking against an occupying force rather than a sanctioned defense force attempting to repel an invasion, many of the plot beats in XCOM 2 have direct analogues in Enemy Unknown. There’s a familiarity to the research path that initially makes the game seem like it’s going to mirror the original, in the way that Terror From The Deep found its own brand of terror missions and alien containment facilities.

Those analogues do exist but Firaxis make every effort to subvert the structure at every turn. That’s true in the day-to-day operations of XCOM, who are now called on to abduct high-ranking officials rather than to prevent abductions, and it’s true in the turn-by-turn catastrophes on the randomised tactical maps.

They look spectacular, those maps. Almost every object and building works not only as a block of potential cover on the battlefield but as a signpost to the events between the two games. There are optional backstory voiceovers, which trigger when you see certain environmental features for the first time, causing one of your chums to break radio silence so that they can fill in the details of the world for you. While there’s a lot more of that this time around – your crew have as much to say for themselves as party members in an RPG – the environment contains all the clues and evidence you need to piece things together. It’s a masterclass of environmental storytelling, and the images of your custom-designed operatives as wanted terrorists that flash up on in-world billboards and checkpoints are the icing on a delicious cake.

The randomisation of the maps works as well as I’d hoped as well. The repetitive maps of Enemy Unknown were one of the few black marks against it. Here, not only does the slotting together of structures and outdoor tiles make for exciting variety and unpredictability (that word again), it never seems to throw out an incoherent jumble. There’s a much better flow to the missions, which have aliens patrolling credible routes and gaggles of civilians watching from the sidelines as all hell breaks loose.

And that brings me to the objectives of those missions. I’ll be astonished if the full game somehow fails to live up to these early hours but whatever its achievements, the seemingly simple act of redesigning mission objectives might be the most important change of them all. When your squad land in a combat zone, they’re often concealed and I already suspected that mechanic would work extremely well – what I didn’t suspect was the brutality and necessary compromises that this new mode of warfare would bring about.

Everything is rooted in the difficulty level. Playing on the normal setting, I’ve found the game far more difficult than XCOM: Enemy Within on veteran. In that game, I’d fallen into the habit of considering a mission a failure if I didn’t return with a full complement of operatives. In XCOM 2, I’ve whooped with delight when a single soldier manages to limp back to the extraction zone (and they really do limp, stagger and slump on the mission debrief screens, as well as suffering from the long-term psychological effects of the war).

At first, I thought the game might be too difficult, with spikes that seemed to require grinding for resources to overcome, but I’m becoming convinced that I was thinking about my approach all wrong. If an objective calls for the destruction of a specific object or facility on the map, it’s sometimes necessary to use two squad members as a decoy, drawing aliens away from the target, while others get the job done. Those decoys are expendable.

Dying for the cause is often the only way to advance the cause and, hideously, I find myself totting up the resource costs to replace sacrificed soldiers against the benefits of a successful mission that requires their sacrifice. The future of humanity is at stake, after all.

I’ve found myself ordering soldiers to flee across city blocks in an attempt to get back to the evac zone while a sniper stays in place on a rooftop trying to take down pursuing enemies, knowing that she’s cut off from escape. The existence of objectives that encourage extreme risk-taking and that require the maintenance of a safe route back to the evac zone creates unfamiliar situations and outcomes.

With my new ruthless tactics, I’m enjoying more success but even my victories often look like failures as I throw more rookies into the meatgrinder. I’ve navigated the difficulty spikes by ditching familiar tactics and standard measurements of success, and learning to think like a desperate resistance leader rather than the commander of an organised military unit.

Aside from the possibility that the mid- and end-game really might be too punishing, with no sense of the tables turning in XCOM’s favour and backs permanently against walls, I have few quibbles. Loading times for missions are a little long and you’ll become familiar with the twitchy animations of your operatives as they sit in the Skyranger preparing for action, and though the cameras are improved, there are times when a dramatic moment is somewhat spoiled by a wall obstructing the view. Those things might be improved before release but even if they’re not, they’ll be cause for minor complaints given the quality of the game as a whole.

I’d love to rave about the new enemies and how they fit so effectively with all of the tactical and strategic changes mentioned above, and there are moments, scripted and otherwise, that I’m bursting to discuss. In fact, I haven’t felt like this about a game since 2012 when I wrote: “No coy introduction here; XCOM is marvellous and now that I’m not playing it, all I want to do is talk about it, write about it, and jump up and down hollering about it.”

Well, no coy conclusion here. XCOM 2 is marvellous and I’m sorely tempted to jump up and down hollering about it. Back in 2012 that was as much due to a sense of relief that Firaxis hadn’t made a mistake in attempting to revive the license at all – this time it’s because they’ve built on a strong foundation intelligently, and with an unexpected degree of cunning. The occupation storyline is more than a new flavour, it’s the base on which the game’s themes, tactics and strategies are built, and this war doesn’t feel like a rehash – it feels like a voyage into the unknown.

 

[Jimmious]

Once again...