Preview Yet another Fallout 3 preview

[slipgate_angel]

The dog is none other than Fallout's Dogmeat, the swift-moving, loyal, pugnacious pooch from the original 1997 game. After disposing of the raiders yourself, you can invite Dogmeat to join you, and from then on.

So much for figuring it out ourselves.

 

[gc051360]

The fact that stuff like that has been told many times before and arguments similar to yours have been brought up time and time again, and in the end things always turned out the same shitty way is telling, isn't it?

If most of the time you have to wonder why the majority of reactions towards newly leaked information is pretty negative, then perhaps you should consider the idea that there is something to it other than just unjustified whining, eh?

Or maybe not? You see, that's exactly the point, since most complaints are pretty much void of substance. There sure are some valid concerns about several design choices, but that doesn't have to mean everything will turn out bad.

o rly? I feel that you will get nuked soon - go hide in the protective phone booth, don't worry, bethsoft put a toilet bowl there so you can drink from it in order to heal your wounds. oh and don't worry about muties - they are just evil and stupid - they also wear skulls on their belt and hold daedric maces - because they want to look like scary orks. and when the shit will start - don't worry - take your gun and from the first person view fucking shoot everything with a damage-per-second stat because that's how beth sees roleplaying. oh and don't worry for the children living in the city built in the crater of unexploded nuke - they are immortal. so go collect vault-boy statues and if you will run out of ammo - you can throw barbie heads at bad stupid muties. but I really suggest you to become a BoS paladin in the shining armor - and wreck havoc on those bad stupid muties with your flaming sword. got it? now gtfo before vault overseer will send his vault mafia to get you. and don't hesitate to press the A button - crying will add some dramatic moments.
p.s. and beware of the glowing ghoul hordes. they can shoot at each other with a glowing sperm healing wounds.

A perfect showcase of what i was trying to get across. While the "official journalistic department" may be sucking Beth's cock big time, we still have the very vocal and self-righteous and most of all infallible faction of true fans.
Funny thing is, i still look forward to playing that game. And only at that time will i decide wether it was good or bad or something inbetween.

You still look forward to playing the game?

Doesn't that defeat your whole "You're ruining it for other people" thing?

The thing is. You just can't take people having a different opinion than you. If we aren't all bowing down to Bethesda, then we are fanatical, moronic, etc. etc. You use all the stock lines that we have come to expect. "Game isn't finished...we don't know enough" etc. etc. Yet you don't say the same for the people who look at the same information, but draw positive conclusions.

But. Let's look at your earlier claim further. Obviously you believe that this internet anti-hype that is on some of the Fallout fan sites. Being negative about FO3...will "ruin" it for other people, and cause them not to buy the game.

Now, wouldn't Bethesda's hype machine, and the gaming "journalists" be guilty of the same thing, except working toward a different goal? At least us discouraging people from Fallout 3...will save them $60. Bethesda, would basically be trying to rob people.

But, again. Your argument fails, due to the fact that you aren't affected by this negativity. Why would others be? What makes you so special, that you are immune? Do you just assume you are smarter than everyone else?

 

[Colt_Seavers]

You still look forward to playing the game?

Doesn't that defeat your whole "You're ruining it for other people" thing?

The thing is. You just can't take people having a different opinion than you. If we aren't all bowing down to Bethesda, then we are fanatical, moronic, etc. etc. You use all the stock lines that we have come to expect. "Game isn't finished...we don't know enough" etc. etc. Yet you don't say the same for the people who look at the same information, but draw positive conclusions.

But. Let's look at your earlier claim further. Obviously you believe that this internet anti-hype that is on some of the Fallout fan sites. Being negative about FO3...will "ruin" it for other people, and cause them not to buy the game.

Now, wouldn't Bethesda's hype machine, and the gaming "journalists" be guilty of the same thing, except working toward a different goal? At least us discouraging people from Fallout 3...will save them $60. Bethesda, would basically be trying to rob people.

But, again. Your argument fails, due to the fact that you aren't affected by this negativity. Why would others be? What makes you so special, that you are immune? Do you just assume you are smarter than everyone else?

What the hell are you talking about? I don't have a clue how the game will turn out to be, wether good,bad or a mixture of both, but i'm still looking forward to actually playing it nonetheless. What's so hard about understanding that?

No, i don't think my concerns have anything to do with a certain "anti-hype". I just don't see the value of mindless/groundless criticism when it's not appropriate, not in that quantity, at least
Yeah, apparently i did a terrible thing by saying that the game has yet to be finished..*gasp*. This is, however, reality. What are people mostly complaining about? Second-hand information from various sources. Big deal.

I don't see Bethesda rob anyone, quite frankly. You think you're on some sort of holy crusade to save anybody from playing that damn game? Hilarious.
No, i do not entertain an illusion of grandeur or whatever but it seems like some people just can't seem to fathom that others, like me, would like to play the game first and then build up a better opinion.

 

[felipepepe]

you can give him plenty of orders, such as having him go out to search for food, medicine, or even fallen weapons (if there are none nearby, Dogmeat will disappear for an hour or so of in-game time before returning).

I really think that they mean that Dogmeat will return in one hour WITHOUT any weapons. Or we will be fighting with portable nuke launchers with limitless ammo found by a dog?

 

[mahdi]

I just don't see the value of mindless/groundless criticism when it's not appropriate, not in that quantity, at least

Most of us don't see the criticism as mindless or groundless. It's more like a cynical disposition towards the industry. We've been screwed over enough to realize we do have some grounds for expecting the worst.

 

[Bluebottle]

In before (not-so) suprising post release flip-flop. Don't worry though Colt, on that day we'll welcome you with open arms - just like Frankie.

 

[Lonely Vazdru]

I just don't see the value of mindless/groundless criticism when it's not appropriate, not in that quantity, at least

This is not Mindless ! This is : THE CODEX !

If you can't see that... well, keep on whining.

Also, Colt, this thread needs more Heather Thomas.

There, feel better now ?

 

[DarkUnderlord]

Even if that's supposed to be sarcasm i can't see what it's trying to accomplish,really. A typical piece of spiteful rambling over second-hand information on a game which has yet to be finished, perhaps?
Quite frankly, it would be best to just wait until each and every one of us can actually build up something like an "objective" opinion, as soon as that game is available.
Of course, that won't keep some "fans" from not buying the game and still complain about it or compare it to Oblivion or whatever nonsense.
It's hard to tell how many people would actually enjoy Fallout 3 for its own right, but ruin it for themselves and others beforehand. Goodness forbid that F3 might actually turn out to be...fun?

Have you ever tried cutting your testicles off and seeing if its fun? You never know, you might enjoy it! I suppose you have to try rape first before you can say that's a bad thing too, huh? And what about poking yourself in the chest with sharp objects? Do you need to try that before deciding wheter it'll be fun or not?

I don't know why, but somehow the idea of creating your character by playing him as a kiddo sounds rather interesting to me, and yet I know that the way Bethesda makes it, it will be completely stupid and will become as annoying as the "Fight through the first dungeon together with the Emperor before creating your character!" system of Oblivion. It's just something you have to do over and over again when starting a new game to try out a different char, and it's even more annoying than a lame starting town because you can't skip it.

"Know" as in...guess? Based on what? There's not exactly a large pile of proof to be found anywhere around here, nor anywhere else, for that matter. Facts can only be presented once there's a piece of solid evidence, which would be sadly missing, since the game is not yet available.

So you've missed all the news about Fallout 3 then?

I would like to pick up that thought however, since i have just finished another walkthrough of Fallout 2. There's also something terribly annoying in there, right at the beginning. Something you have to do over and over again for each new game....the Temple of Trials. It wasn't that breathtaking for the very first walkthrough and it didn't get any better with each new one.

Yup. Hence the hate here for forced tutorials or opening sequences.

Not everything that shines is necessarily made of gold, i would say. However, this "childhood prologue" does seem to add a nice touch to the game

How do you know? You haven't played it yet! You're just making shit up!

Who knows? It might be quite worthwhile to have the dog fetch you some stuff.

... or it might not. OHOH.

There may be lots of restrictions and exceptions to that feature.
I didn't get the feeling that praising/scolding the dog would impact your alignment.

Sorry, you didn't "get the feeling"? So you don't know then? Doesn't that mean then by your argument that you don't get to say shit about Fallout 3?

I think it's just a feature to accomodate to your style of gameplay.

Here you go again! Saying bad stuff = you haven't played it yet but we can apparently think and feel all the good stuff we want without any problems.

Or maybe not? You see, that's exactly the point, since most complaints are pretty much void of substance.

Actually, it's pretty substantive when a company has a track record for over-hyping their games and failing to deliver. It also sounds like you haven't read any of the interviews yet.

There sure are some valid concerns about several design choices, but that doesn't have to mean everything will turn out bad.

... or it could equally mean that it might. So, given that either proposition could be true, there shouldn't be any harm to anyone in expressing either viewpoint, right? In fact, given the precise same thing happened with Oblivion, doesn't the weight start to shift ever so slightly into the "hmmm... this might not be so good" camp?

A perfect showcase of what i was trying to get across. While the "official journalistic department" may be sucking Beth's cock big time, we still have the very vocal and self-righteous and most of all infallible faction of true fans.
Funny thing is, i still look forward to playing that game. And only at that time will i decide wether it was good or bad or something inbetween.

... and so you're here now because...?

I don't have a clue how the game will turn out to be, wether good,bad or a mixture of both, but i'm still looking forward to actually playing it nonetheless. What's so hard about understanding that?

So if we were here heaping praise on Fallout 3 saying it's shaping up to be a great game, you'd be here telling us that we can't judge it yet and that we should wait until it comes out because it just might be crap? Yeah, I sincerely doubt that. Besides, aren't we allowed to take what we're being told and decide for ourselves? Just like you are? For example:

At age one you are capable of crawling around and playing with your toys, which consist of a red ball and a book.

What? Does this sound lame to anyone else?

I mean, how can gc051360 say that's lame? He hasn't played it yet! It might be awesome! We should just wait and see! Fallout 3's going to have all the red ball and book playing fun we'll ever need! It might be totally awesome! We don't know! Or you know... We could use our brains and think about whether that shit appeals to us or not and then make a decision based on that. "Is playing with a red ball something I'm really looking forward to as part of my Fallout experience: Yes / No?"

No, i do not entertain an illusion of grandeur or whatever but it seems like some people just can't seem to fathom that others, like me, would like to play the game first and then build up a better opinion.

There are two types of people when it comes to judging computer games. There are those who can see the train coming, see the track the train is on, see that the bridge further down the track is out and then determine where that train will end up. And then there are stupid people. Stupid people hold onto the hope that maybe, just maybe, this train won't be like all the others. This train won't fall down and crash into the abyss. This train will fly. Fly! Fly! These people are often heard chanting "I'll wait until it comes out. I'll wait until it comes out. I'll wait until it comes out." All the time while they dismiss any critiscism and hone in on all the hope and praise they can.

As I said, if we were here heaping praise on Fallout 3, you wouldn't have a problem with it. You wouldn't tell us we haven't played it yet. You wouldn't tell us that we should wait until it comes out because it "might be crap". And yet, should someone dare critiscise or judge the information we're being given by Bethesda, you'd be immediately on the front line telling everyone "no wait, it might not suck as much as you think!". That's called hypocrisy.

 

[elander_]

Yes well how do we know Fallout 3 is going to be crap?

- Fatman and mini-nukular explosions
- Exploding atomic cars
- Flaming swords using gasoline
- Ghoul regenerative fluids
- Todd sense of humor and drinking from toilets
- VATS bullet time instead of TB, not even as an alternative mode
- Mutants and ghouls just another Oblivion like monster to take damage
- Good/evil choices and under developed quests (judging by the single quest they have shown)
- No world map instead we get a sandbox even smaller than Oblivion
- Pete little obsession for combat and exploding heads and hiding information
- Emil about being forced to fight

And the list doesn't stop here.

 

[DraQ]

- Todd's "sense of humor" and drinking from toilets

Fixed.

 

[Colt_Seavers]

@Lonely Vazdru: Nice pic, thanks!

Have you ever tried cutting your testicles off and seeing if its fun? You never know, you might enjoy it! I suppose you have to try rape first before you can say that's a bad thing too, huh? And what about poking yourself in the chest with sharp objects? Do you need to try that before deciding wheter it'll be fun or not?

Oh boy, a shining testimony to maturity.
Know what? The one and only person to decide wether i liked the fucking GAME will be none other than myself, once i've played it. Case closed.

So you've missed all the news about Fallout 3 then?

I read that stuff on their homepage, i read it here, i read it at NMA and various other sites. So? Just because i don't particularly see things as negative as most people here i'm some sort of idiot? Maybe you'd even like to tell me straight on that i'm no Fallout-fan or RPG enthusiast?

Yup. Hence the hate here for forced tutorials or opening sequences.

I really do think that that hate stems from somewhere else, not the fact that even the Fallout series is ridden with its own failures and tediums at times.
Maybe you can skip the whole "tutorial" after you've seen it a couple of times, which would solve the problem right there.

How do you know? You haven't played it yet! You're just making shit up!

Maybe you'd like to have a game that "features" not a single bit of story or background information? A completely empty world where you have to create everything yourself and dream up your own perfect little fairy tale.

... or it might not. OHOH.

Yup, that's also quite possible. It depends on how well its implemented.

Sorry, you didn't "get the feeling"? So you don't know then? Doesn't that mean then by your argument that you don't get to say shit about Fallout 3?

That part was a reaction towards another members impression, not the game.

Here you go again! Saying bad stuff = you haven't played it yet but we can apparently think and feel all the good stuff we want without any problems.

No, it's not a matter of hype or anti-hype. YOU want to think that i'm just trying to praise the good sides and be silent about the bad ones. The truth is, Fallout 3 could just as well turn out to be an abomination as it could turn out an enjoyable experience. I'm NOT saying that some concerns are completely unfounded, but the majority of them sure is.
Want some examples? Can be found right here in this very thread. "Mutants= ALL of them are just stupid monsters" "Super-Mutants=Orks" "Fallout3=Oblivion-Clone" "Under-developed quest, judging from nothing" "Fallout3=FPS". The list goes on and on.

Actually, it's pretty substantive when a company has a track record for over-hyping their games and failing to deliver. It also sounds like you haven't read any of the interviews yet.

Oh, now that's supposed to be substance,eh? Of course they can't produce a nice game because they're Bethesda..and made Oblivion. Apparently there are people who liked some of their older games but does that make them idiots? I have played the Elder Scrolls series as well and while none of those titles rank up to my all-time favorites, i still felt entertained for a while.

... or it could equally mean that it might. So, given that either proposition could be true, there shouldn't be any harm to anyone in expressing either viewpoint, right? In fact, given the precise same thing happened with Oblivion, doesn't the weight start to shift ever so slightly into the "hmmm... this might not be so good" camp?

Expressing your viewpoint doesn't do any harm unless it's a far cry from reality. You seem to be concerned that F3 will not turn out that good, am i right? Okay, let's wait and see then.

... and so you're here now because...?

What? Don't want me in your nifty little elite-club? I would think that RPG Codex can actually stomach different dispositions, thank you very much.

So if we were here heaping praise on Fallout 3 saying it's shaping up to be a great game, you'd be here telling us that we can't judge it yet and that we should wait until it comes out because it just might be crap?

Oh, vou're very welcome to post your thoughts here. Just don't expect me to take everything for granted that's being told. See? This little line of argumentation works vice versa.

There are two types of people when it comes to judging computer games. There are those who can see the train coming, see the track the train is on, see that the bridge further down the track is out and then determine where that train will end up. And then there are stupid people. Stupid people hold onto the hope that maybe, just maybe, this train won't be like all the others.

Not to mention that sort of people who desperatly want to see that train coming even though there aren't even any railtracks to be found anywhere.
And of course, all the other people that don't necessarily see that bad little train coming all that much are just plain stupid,huh?
Oh, i can see self-righteous hypocrisy just right, thank you very much.

 

[Gnidrologist]

Colt_Seavers. I don't think anyone here opposes the viewpoint on F3 as a potentially fun game for some people. Oblivion was also enjoyed by a lot. Just like Amercan Pie movie or Britney Spears songs. Does that suddenly adds objective and indesputable artistic value to those products?
Oh, i will not try to ''turn you off''. Just think about on your own and draw conclusions.

F3 for Fallout franachise is the same as Deus Ex 2 was for Deus Ex franchise. Only on a lot greater proportions. That *is* indesputable fact. If you disagree you are simply clueless and should read upon the various press releases, interviews and quotes from the Beth people.

Not that this is bad per se, but it's certainly a fair ground for dissapointment for many people, who liked the original games.

 

[DefJam101]

@Lonely Vazdru: Nice pic, thanks!

Have you ever tried cutting your testicles off and seeing if its fun? You never know, you might enjoy it! I suppose you have to try rape first before you can say that's a bad thing too, huh? And what about poking yourself in the chest with sharp objects? Do you need to try that before deciding wheter it'll be fun or not?

Oh boy, a shining testimony to maturity.
Know what? The one and only person to decide wether i liked the fucking GAME will be none other than myself, once i've played it. Case closed.

So you've missed all the news about Fallout 3 then?

I read that stuff on their homepage, i read it here, i read it at NMA and various other sites. So? Just because i don't particularly see things as negative as most people here i'm some sort of idiot? Maybe you'd even like to tell me straight on that i'm no Fallout-fan or RPG enthusiast?

Yup. Hence the hate here for forced tutorials or opening sequences.

I really do think that that hate stems from somewhere else, not the fact that even the Fallout series is ridden with its own failures and tediums at times.
Maybe you can skip the whole "tutorial" after you've seen it a couple of times, which would solve the problem right there.

How do you know? You haven't played it yet! You're just making shit up!

Maybe you'd like to have a game that "features" not a single bit of story or background information? A completely empty world where you have to create everything yourself and dream up your own perfect little fairy tale.

... or it might not. OHOH.

Yup, that's also quite possible. It depends on how well its implemented.

Sorry, you didn't "get the feeling"? So you don't know then? Doesn't that mean then by your argument that you don't get to say shit about Fallout 3?

That part was a reaction towards another members impression, not the game.

Here you go again! Saying bad stuff = you haven't played it yet but we can apparently think and feel all the good stuff we want without any problems.

No, it's not a matter of hype or anti-hype. YOU want to think that i'm just trying to praise the good sides and be silent about the bad ones. The truth is, Fallout 3 could just as well turn out to be an abomination as it could turn out an enjoyable experience. I'm NOT saying that some concerns are completely unfounded, but the majority of them sure is.
Want some examples? Can be found right here in this very thread. "Mutants= ALL of them are just stupid monsters" "Super-Mutants=Orks" "Fallout3=Oblivion-Clone" "Under-developed quest, judging from nothing" "Fallout3=FPS". The list goes on and on.

Actually, it's pretty substantive when a company has a track record for over-hyping their games and failing to deliver. It also sounds like you haven't read any of the interviews yet.

Oh, now that's supposed to be substance,eh? Of course they can't produce a nice game because they're Bethesda..and made Oblivion. Apparently there are people who liked some of their older games but does that make them idiots? I have played the Elder Scrolls series as well and while none of those titles rank up to my all-time favorites, i still felt entertained for a while.

... or it could equally mean that it might. So, given that either proposition could be true, there shouldn't be any harm to anyone in expressing either viewpoint, right? In fact, given the precise same thing happened with Oblivion, doesn't the weight start to shift ever so slightly into the "hmmm... this might not be so good" camp?

Expressing your viewpoint doesn't do any harm unless it's a far cry from reality. You seem to be concerned that F3 will not turn out that good, am i right? Okay, let's wait and see then.

... and so you're here now because...?

What? Don't want me in your nifty little elite-club? I would think that RPG Codex can actually stomach different dispositions, thank you very much.

So if we were here heaping praise on Fallout 3 saying it's shaping up to be a great game, you'd be here telling us that we can't judge it yet and that we should wait until it comes out because it just might be crap?

Oh, vou're very welcome to post your thoughts here. Just don't expect me to take everything for granted that's being told. See? This little line of argumentation works vice versa.

There are two types of people when it comes to judging computer games. There are those who can see the train coming, see the track the train is on, see that the bridge further down the track is out and then determine where that train will end up. And then there are stupid people. Stupid people hold onto the hope that maybe, just maybe, this train won't be like all the others.

Not to mention that sort of people who desperatly want to see that train coming even though there aren't even any railtracks to be found anywhere.
And of course, all the other people that don't necessarily see that bad little train coming all that much are just plain stupid,huh?
Oh, i can see self-righteous hypocrisy just right, thank you very much.

I lol'd @ this.

 

[Brother None]

So you've missed all the news about Fallout 3 then?

I read that stuff on their homepage, i read it here, i read it at NMA and various other sites. So? Just because i don't particularly see things as negative as most people here i'm some sort of idiot? Maybe you'd even like to tell me straight on that i'm no Fallout-fan or RPG enthusiast?

Uh...what?

You said there's simply not enough to go on. We can, very reasonably, points out that the game is finished and PR being released at Bethesda's discretion. This PR has shown little of the story, true, and littler of the quest, but all the more of graphics, world building, character building, factionalism and combat.

And all of that stinks.

Now you don't want to go from there into speculation on whether or not the story and quests and dialogue will suck as badly as they did in Oblivion. People here, and on NMA, do speculate on that based on our previous experience with Bethesda. The odds are that we'll turn out right, but it's true, we don't know if we will.

Now I again fail to see the problem here. You don't want to speculate so...don't? Does it bother you that much when there are people out there that disagree with you? You say you don't want to jump to conclusions before you play the game? Then if I were you I'd skip all the game's coverage and even moreso all the game's discussions. Nobody is making you read this, y'know.

Expressing your viewpoint doesn't do any harm unless it's a far cry from reality. You seem to be concerned that F3 will not turn out that good, am i right? Okay, let's wait and see then.

Why? You speak of "expressing viewpoints doing harm", a ridiculous anti-modern concept.

What harm? Who are we hurting by expressing our concerns for this game? Are we making the game objectively better or worse by talking about it?

Seriously, this is all odd to me. The only possible reason you can speak of harm related to expressing opinions is if you're someone who is deeply disturbed when someone else has a different opinion than you do. Well, I say: get over yourself. You want to wait and see? So did NMA, two years ago. Yet so far almost all that is shown just confirms our worst fears.

You want to continue to wait and see? Go ahead. Nobody's stopping you. But why are you so bothered that we refuse to conform to your attitude?

 

[Kingston]

Heh. I will adress one point so DU doesn't have to do all the work.

I'm NOT saying that some concerns are completely unfounded, but the majority of them sure is.
Want some examples? Can be found right here in this very thread. "Mutants= ALL of them are just stupid monsters" "Super-Mutants=Orks" "Fallout3=Oblivion-Clone" "Under-developed quest, judging from nothing" "Fallout3=FPS". The list goes on and on.

• "Mutants = ALL of them are just stupid monsters" - A direct quote from a Pete Hines follows: "But obviously, when you're talking about supermutants, dialogue really isn't a viable option."
  
  "Super-Mutants=Orks" - That's what they look like, and act like it seems. The "Behemoth" is like a huge troll. All they do is kill others and collect their bodies. THEY'RE EVIL.
  
  "Fallout3=Oblivion-Clone" - A recent quote from either Pete Hines or Todd Howard follows (I don't recall which one said it): "From now on we are referring to it as 'Oblivion with Guns' "
  
  "Under-developed quest, judging from nothing" - The only example of a quest we've had is to blow up Megaton because a big bad guy asks you to. Sounds pretty retarded to me.
  
  "Fallout3=FPS" - In a recent preview the previewer said "Without VATS, this game would be an FPS."
  

Our concerns are perfectly valid.

 

[Colt_Seavers]

So you've missed all the news about Fallout 3 then?

I read that stuff on their homepage, i read it here, i read it at NMA and various other sites. So? Just because i don't particularly see things as negative as most people here i'm some sort of idiot? Maybe you'd even like to tell me straight on that i'm no Fallout-fan or RPG enthusiast?

Uh...what?

You said there's simply not enough to go on. We can, very reasonably, points out that the game is finished and PR being released at Bethesda's discretion. This PR has shown little of the story, true, and littler of the quest, but all the more of graphics, world building, character building, factionalism and combat.

And all of that stinks.

Now you don't want to go from there into speculation on whether or not the story and quests and dialogue will suck as badly as they did in Oblivion. People here, and on NMA, do speculate on that based on our previous experience with Bethesda. The odds are that we'll turn out right, but it's true, we don't know if we will.

Now I again fail to see the problem here. You don't want to speculate so...don't? Does it bother you that much when there are people out there that disagree with you? You say you don't want to jump to conclusions before you play the game? Then if I were you I'd skip all the game's coverage and even moreso all the game's discussions. Nobody is making you read this, y'know.

Expressing your viewpoint doesn't do any harm unless it's a far cry from reality. You seem to be concerned that F3 will not turn out that good, am i right? Okay, let's wait and see then.

Why? You speak of "expressing viewpoints doing harm", a ridiculous anti-modern concept.

What harm? Who are we hurting by expressing our concerns for this game? Are we making the game objectively better or worse by talking about it?

Seriously, this is all odd to me. The only possible reason you can speak of harm related to expressing opinions is if you're someone who is deeply disturbed when someone else has a different opinion than you do. Well, I say: get over yourself. You want to wait and see? So did NMA, two years ago. Yet so far almost all that is shown just confirms our worst fears.

You want to continue to wait and see? Go ahead. Nobody's stopping you. But why are you so bothered that we refuse to conform to your attitude?

Okay, once more. I'm bothered because of the way that speculation is being pressed into extremes. I'm not saying you shouldn't speculate or whatever. For some reason that doesn't seem to be as obvious as i thought.

 

[WhiskeyWolf]

"Fallout3=Oblivion-Clone" - A recent quote from either Pete Hines or Todd Howard follows (I don't recall which one said it): "From now on we are referring to it as 'Oblivion with Guns' "

It was Todd.

I'm bothered because of the way that speculation is being pressed into extremes.

Why are you bothered? What do you mean by "extremes"?

 

[Brother None]

I'm bothered because of the way that speculation is being pressed into extremes.

Then why are you bugging us? The official Bethesda forums is where this happens, that's the troll-fest of extreme fans of Bethesda vs extreme fans of Fallout.

And more importantly: why does this bother you? How does this affect you? Why did you feel the need to come here to tell us your wait and see attitude is somehow inherently superior to our argumentative criticisms?

 

[JarlFrank]

Colt_Seavers, I dare to call you someone who's not a Fallout fan and hasn't got a clue about RPGs. And you have no fucking plan about anything that happens on the gaming market, and especially in Bethesda. Just look at Oblivion. Compare the Oblivion of the pre-release hype to the one we finally got to play. Cut features, some of the most important ones that were hyped to the heavens were missing from the final version, and everything just has been dumbed down and totally *not* like what was promised in the first place.

And now, Fallout 3. Is there any reason why Bethesda would not do the same again? Oblivion was so severely lacking compared to its previews, and magazines still praised it, and it sold more copies than a daily newspaper. Also, compare Fallout 1 and 2 to Fallout 3. You have to be blind if you don't notice the difference. Or stupid. Or both. Fallout 3 is completely different in gameplay, and if you look at the ingame history and lore, it's severely dumbed down and has lost all of its depth in favour of a game world that looks "cooler". You don't have to be a prophet to see where Bethesda is heading with that game.

 

[Gnidrologist]

I've found out that the magnitude of disinterest in certain topic is inversely proportional to an enthusiasm with which a person in question will state his opinions on it.
Internet is so fun.

 

[Colt_Seavers]

Colt_Seavers, I dare to call you someone who's not a Fallout fan and hasn't got a clue about RPGs. And you have no fucking plan about anything that happens on the gaming market, and especially in Bethesda. Just look at Oblivion.

How amusingly ridiculous.
Seems like you've already run out of arguments so now you start to throw in complete bullshit. What? Do you want to pull out your fandom-meter and tell me my exact count next?
Please, let me partake in your almighty wisdom, great master of role-playing games.

You know what, forget this crap. I have already stated what i wanted to say.

 

[Gragt]

You know what, forget this crap. I have already stated what i wanted to say.

Indeed but why stop the fun already? Don't you want to try to bring this hive of scum and villainy that is the Codex down?

 

[Colt_Seavers]

You know what, forget this crap. I have already stated what i wanted to say.

Indeed but why stop the fun already? Don't you want to try to bring this hive of scum and villainy that is the Codex down?

Nope. Never had the intention to do so. Nice image you've got there, concerning the Codex, i mean.

 

[JarlFrank]

Colt_Seavers, I dare to call you someone who's not a Fallout fan and hasn't got a clue about RPGs. And you have no fucking plan about anything that happens on the gaming market, and especially in Bethesda. Just look at Oblivion.

How amusingly ridiculous.
Seems like you've already run out of arguments so now you start to throw in complete bullshit. What? Do you want to pull out your fandom-meter and tell me my exact count next?
Please, let me partake in your almighty wisdom, great master of role-playing games.

You know what, forget this crap. I have already stated what i wanted to say.

Did you actually read past that sentence? I explained there thoroughly *why* Fallout fans are so skeptical and pessimistic, and what happened with Oblivion. If you haven't read that, do so now.

 

[Colt_Seavers]

Did you actually read past that sentence? I explained there thoroughly *why* Fallout fans are so skeptical and pessimistic, and what happened with Oblivion. If you haven't read that, do so now.

Yeah, i did read past the initial barrage of insults. Like i've said before, i can see that there are valid concerns about Fallout3, just as much as there are those which are blown out of proportion. If you didn't read that, do so now.

I'm not interested in continuing this any further, seeing that there's a whole lot of bitterness connected to that issue.