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Incline Colony Ship Combat Beta Thread

HeatEXTEND

Prophet
Patron
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Feb 12, 2017
Messages
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Location
Nedderlent
What makes this game more demanding is definitely the learn by use system. In AoD you had generic SPs you could use on top of the combat SPs, and invest everything in combat. Here, you are restricted by what you do.
Just on the border of your waking mind

There lies... Another time

Where darkness & light are one

And as you tread the halls of sanity
You feel so glad to be
Unable to go beyond
I have a message
From another time...

OMGRAILROADEDNOCHOICECYOACYOACYOAREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
:troll:
 

Binky

Cipher
Joined
Nov 17, 2015
Messages
453
Winnie has the best gear in the demo. How good will it be in the full game? Is this as good as it'll get or is there more advanced stuff to loot coming?

Bugs. Got stuck near some pipes or wood after talking to Vasquez. Grazes on me sometimes replenished health (didn't use the healing item or have the regeneration feat) or shield health (it wasn't the natural per turn shield regeneration). If you have the charger feat and spend all your AP on attacks, the turn ends and the 4 extra movement points are wasted. I'd like to stab someone and then run away.

I'm currently playing an implant-hating religious fanatic (body modification is anathema!), which got me thinking. Will there be any downsides in the game for having implants? Can they be used against the wearer (like the biochip in Deus Ex: HR)? I assume the pulse grenade won't affect them. Glowing blue or orange eyes wouldn't be exactly welcome on a ship where mutants are called misshapen freaks that should have been wiped out.
 

Trash Player

Scholar
Joined
Jun 13, 2015
Messages
440
Winnie has the best gear in the demo. How good will it be in the full game? Is this as good as it'll get or is there more advanced stuff to loot coming?

Bugs. Got stuck near some pipes or wood after talking to Vasquez. Grazes on me sometimes replenished health (didn't use the healing item or have the regeneration feat) or shield health (it wasn't the natural per turn shield regeneration). If you have the charger feat and spend all your AP on attacks, the turn ends and the 4 extra movement points are wasted. I'd like to stab someone and then run away.

I'm currently playing an implant-hating religious fanatic (body modification is anathema!), which got me thinking. Will there be any downsides in the game for having implants? Can they be used against the wearer (like the biochip in Deus Ex: HR)? I assume the pulse grenade won't affect them. Glowing blue or orange eyes wouldn't be exactly welcome on a ship where mutants are called misshapen freaks that should have been wiped out.
I am sure there are better weapons. One early update suggested 5 tiers per subtype, it might have changed due to limited asset. Armors are inferred to be as good as it gets but I am not too sure at all.
Early lore updates suggest implants are regarded as no more than prosthetics. It makes sense that they are earth-made techs, the founders wouldn't have allowed them in the first place if they are considered profane. ECLS monks are pretty much cyborgs that are held in awe by the rest, so there is that.
 

Technomancer

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Dec 24, 2018
Messages
1,469
Winnie has the best gear in the demo. How good will it be in the full game? Is this as good as it'll get or is there more advanced stuff to loot coming?
I asked Vince a similar question and he replied that the demo does not contain all gear from the game. So it is pretty vague. That set description says that its from cost-effective mass-produced armor series. What I want to see is one elite set armor made by the best earth technology without any budget compromises and then taken on the ship by the highest command. It would be like finding mythical armor compared to everything else on the ship.
 

razvedchiki

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on the back of a T34.
I asked Vince a similar question and he replied that the demo does not contain all gear from the game. So it is pretty vague. That set description says that its from cost-effective mass-produced armor series. What I want to see is one elite set armor made by the best earth technology without any budget compromises and then taken on the ship by the highest command. It would be like finding mythical armor compared to everything else on the ship.

.....that could be unearthed in mission control.
 

Deleted Member 22431

Guest
Well, fuck this stupid tank build. The heavy armor and STR needs some serious reconsideration. Not only the heroic feat involving STR is bad, but the armors that give you AP penalties are not good enough to justify the investment, and that includes the feat that reduces AP penalties and STR. At the moment, DEX and PER are king, followed by CHA (because of the feats and companions), CON and STR. The difference between a high DEX and a low one is like night and day.
 

Deleted Member 22431

Guest
From steam:

UBER said:
In a great RPG, like Chrono Trigger for instance. Everything is learned from LVL1. You don't have to invest all these points right off the bat to make ur character good at something. You progress throughout the game and it gives you a sense of development. In this game, so far, you are given a bunch of stats that you didn't really earn, and are forced to input them into traits that may or may not work with your build. If you have fun making a new character every 5 minutes because the one you just made didn't work, then that's not RPG, that's just a re-roll simulator. I'm not trolling pidar, so stop with ur moronic accusations.

UBER said:
I understand your wishes with this game. However, I'm not into the habit of re-rolling a character every time something doesn't work. Especially when the full game comes out, if you expect people to do this, you will get a lot of refund requests. Unless you seriously change the way the game plays from the start, I doubt many will be enjoying this.

GOOD RPGs give you a blank slate. A character that YOU have to build through completing quests, challenges, and fights. Giving a character ~10 points to assign right off the bat, which is not earned in any way is pretty meh. And then when you go through the whole role picking part and questionnaire, I spent like 10 minutes reading and deciding which path to go down, you expect people to re-roll and do the same thing again when the first fight fails? I mean... how do you not understand that this is gonna turn people off?

I understand this is a combat demo. And I hope the full final game is more 'noob friendly' or you guys are going to have a lot of players turned away. Perhaps you can add difficulty settings like Easy, Normal, Difficult, and Hardcore. Like most games have. Then you can adjust the difficulty of the combat through that setting. Otherwise it's gonna be very hard for 'new' players to enjoy the game. RE-rolling 10 times to see what works and what doesn't, is not my idea of fun. Even though some will disagree.

Best of luck!

UBER said:
I'm not a masochist.
So dying all the time is not fun for me.
Perhaps look into that self-flagellation complex you carry.

UBER said:
Sure, Fallout is great, but the first enemy doesn't kill you with a two-shot crit. And having to chose stats in the beginning is okay as long as they are balanced. When you first started Fallout 3 did you have to remake your character 5 times just to beat the first enemy? I don't think so. Also it's more interesting to gain skills and apply them to your build through progression rather than assign them all in the beginning to have an over powered character at a specific task. The point of a good RPG is to role play a fun character, not to remake one every time you died. But good and bad are all subjective, what you think is good, someone else might think is bad. That's the whole point of taste.
B1


:hmmm:
 

Darth Canoli

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Politician This one is a piece of work, still, he has a point, if Iron Tower's goal is to sell the game, difficulty settings for Fallout 3 and Chrono-Trigger tards is mandatory, they have money to spend too.

Also, think about all the Disco fanboys, Vault Dweller give them their story mode, you want your GOTY, right ?
 

Deleted Member 22431

Guest
Politician This one is a piece of work, still, he has a point, if Iron Tower's goal is to sell the game, difficulty settings for Fallout 3 and Chrono-Trigger tards is mandatory, they have money to spend too.
This doesn't make any sense even still. The game is designed to be played in a way that is character system based and this is the moon to casual players. You can cripple the enemies, lower their THC and HP, and these players will still die, reload with the same build and die again. They don't know how to play cRPGs. Did you see the references he quote? A jPRPG and a popamole game that plays itself. That's the bar. Unless ITS abandon their interest in cRPGs there is no way to please this crowd. This will apply to any decent cRPG. Let's say he plays Underrail on easy. He will die many times, ask for a refund, and leave a negative review. But you see, that's his choice to behave like a self-indulgent retard. He knows he could learn the systems and beat the game, but he doesn't want to do any effort. He thinks that developers are being paid to please his ego, and therefore he should do whatever other developer does.
 
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Darth Canoli

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Messages
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Perched on a tree
Maybe if they get to play it because of an easy/story mode, they'll learn something and try to play games with actual gameplay.

Feed a child with butter pasta only and he'll like nothing else, you have to help him develop his palate.
 

Deleted Member 22431

Guest
Maybe if they get to play it because of an easy/story mode, they'll learn something and try to play games with actual gameplay.

The easy story mode will make them believe that the whole game should play itself.

The easy story mode will require the abandonment of the design principles that make developing cRPGs worthwhile in the first place.

The easy story mode would be too hard even still because it would require stat and skill checks.

In general, cRPG players are spoiled, ignorant, and have a profound distaste for anything that resembles cRPG systems. They want to roleplay a hero that is not restricted by SPs and stats and always wins every fight with minium effort. Nothing will change these basic facts. It's not possible in this day and age to reach the masses with a good cRPG. cRPGs that have a wide appeal suck.
 

Vault Dweller

Commissar, Red Star Studio
Developer
Joined
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Messages
28,035
Winnie has the best gear in the demo. How good will it be in the full game? Is this as good as it'll get or is there more advanced stuff to loot coming?
We wouldn't show everything we have in the combat demo, would we?

I'm currently playing an implant-hating religious fanatic (body modification is anathema!), which got me thinking. Will there be any downsides in the game for having implants? Can they be used against the wearer (like the biochip in Deus Ex: HR)? I assume the pulse grenade won't affect them.
You assume incorrectly.

Glowing blue or orange eyes wouldn't be exactly welcome on a ship where mutants are called misshapen freaks that should have been wiped out.
By today's standards, no. In the distant future, they will be as common as hip replacements, so I doubt that anyone would raise an eyebrow. The mutants are a different story though.

Winnie has the best gear in the demo. How good will it be in the full game? Is this as good as it'll get or is there more advanced stuff to loot coming?
I asked Vince a similar question and he replied that the demo does not contain all gear from the game. So it is pretty vague. That set description says that its from cost-effective mass-produced armor series. What I want to see is one elite set armor made by the best earth technology without any budget compromises and then taken on the ship by the highest command. It would be like finding mythical armor compared to everything else on the ship.
Better than cheap export to third world conflict zones? Absolutely. Custom armor made for Commander Shepard himself? Doubtful.

I asked Vince a similar question and he replied that the demo does not contain all gear from the game. So it is pretty vague. That set description says that its from cost-effective mass-produced armor series. What I want to see is one elite set armor made by the best earth technology without any budget compromises and then taken on the ship by the highest command. It would be like finding mythical armor compared to everything else on the ship.

.....that could be unearthed in mission control.
There will be plenty of unique things there, that's for sure.
 

Binky

Cipher
Joined
Nov 17, 2015
Messages
453
Early lore updates suggest implants are regarded as no more than prosthetics. It makes sense that they are earth-made techs, the founders wouldn't have allowed them in the first place if they are considered profane.
They also frowned on alcohol, whores, and many other things now present on the ship.
By today's standards, no. In the distant future, they will be as common as hip replacements, so I doubt that anyone would raise an eyebrow.
Humans have been bashing each other's brains out over petty differences for millennia. I'd like to be wrong on this, but I doubt this will ever change.
 

Technomancer

Liturgist
Joined
Dec 24, 2018
Messages
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Better than cheap export to third world conflict zones? Absolutely.
Now that gets my hopes up! Did not realize that Winfield's armor was that cheap on Earth.
Custom armor made for Commander Shepard himself? Doubtful.
Doubtful or impossible, ha ha? N7 armor was extremely lame though, when it came to personal protection armor suits with no expense spared in production, colossus armor was the top-line product, yours only for a gazillion star dollars.
 

Vault Dweller

Commissar, Red Star Studio
Developer
Joined
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Messages
28,035
By today's standards, no. In the distant future, they will be as common as hip replacements, so I doubt that anyone would raise an eyebrow.
Humans have been bashing each other's brains out over petty differences for millennia. I'd like to be wrong on this, but I doubt this will ever change.
These petty differences wouldn't include tech augmentations, in my opinion. As a race, we're very understanding about such things (coincidentally this makes Mankind Divided's 'socially-aware' main theme pretty fucking stupid). Lost a leg? Have a wooden peg. Lost an eye? Here's a glass eye for you. Lost your teeth to scurvy? No worries, thanks to our cutting edge tech you can have meticulously carved wooden dentures (apparently the first dentures were made back in 7 century BC).
 

Technomancer

Liturgist
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Messages
1,469
These petty differences wouldn't include tech augmentations, in my opinion. As a race, we're very understanding about such things (coincidentally this makes Mankind Divided's 'socially-aware' main theme pretty fucking stupid). Lost a leg? Have a wooden peg. Lost an eye? Here's a glass eye for you. Lost your teeth to scurvy? No worries, thanks to our cutting edge tech you can have meticulously carved wooden dentures (apparently the first dentures were made back in 7 century BC).
But those early prosthetics were so primitive that they barely improved the life of a man who in a case with lost limbs has become an invalid. No reason to persecute someone who is ruined, pitiful and weaker than you. Cybernetic enhancement of the future on the other hand inevitably comes with advantages of being a cyborg. It deepens the gap between the poor who can't afford it and the rich who can and with implants become even more successful in life. The advent of advanced cybernetic technology can be seen as emergence of new subspecies, who are more evolved and advanced than a baseline human. Our primitive ancestors showed us that we don't really want to share our worlds with other sapient beings and I think there is a possibility for violent tensions in the society of the future unless cheap cybernetic/genemod technology is available to absolutely everyone.

But speaking about Colony Ship, a theme like that definitely does not fit the setting. The colonists have enough reasons to kill each other to bother about some chosen few implant users.
 
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Binky

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Messages
453
These petty differences wouldn't include tech augmentations, in my opinion. As a race, we're very understanding about such things (coincidentally this makes Mankind Divided's 'socially-aware' main theme pretty fucking stupid). Lost a leg? Have a wooden peg. Lost an eye? Here's a glass eye for you. Lost your teeth to scurvy? No worries, thanks to our cutting edge tech you can have meticulously carved wooden dentures (apparently the first dentures were made back in 7 century BC).
But you're not replacing lost limbs with the implants, are you? You're "improving" the body God gave you - from the point of a religious fanatic (playing God). Cutting off a healthy arm and replacing it with a bionic one is a bit different, no?

In any case, it was not my intention to start such a discussion in a combat demo thread. Just found it odd that religious zealots would be OK with this.

Forgot to mention bugs: improving one gadget seems to improve all. Haven't tested it, but both distortion fields had 55% ranged defense in my 10 charisma run.

I've beaten the game with a riot armor build (the penalties are still very harsh), and one without implants. Picking true grit healed me (bug) before Winnie, but those stimpacks suck. Let's see if I can do it without gadgets this time.
 

Shadenuat

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deepens gap more than some people living in palaces and others in muddy huts? yeah right

DE1 aug problem was between augs, old augs were treated as old software to be abandoned
nu-DE is dum anime.

technology makes life easier for everyone, people use it regardless of consequences. people who tried to banish satan from internet now sell church wares on their church pages, free delivery on sundays.
 
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Vault Dweller

Commissar, Red Star Studio
Developer
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Messages
28,035
No reason to persecute someone who is ruined, pitiful and weaker than you. Cybernetic enhancement of the future on the other hand inevitably comes with advantages of being a cyborg. It deepens the gap between the poor who can't afford it and the rich who can and with implants become even more successful in life.
Well, the rich are the first to benefit from all tech and medical advances, that's true, but the tech makers can't limit their markets only to the 1%. So they'd market cheaper versions like the next best thing and the poor will get deeper in debt to own that new best thing, etc. Remember when only the rich had mobile phones (talking about those big ass phones with antennas). Now every pleb has a smart phone.

These petty differences wouldn't include tech augmentations, in my opinion. As a race, we're very understanding about such things (coincidentally this makes Mankind Divided's 'socially-aware' main theme pretty fucking stupid). Lost a leg? Have a wooden peg. Lost an eye? Here's a glass eye for you. Lost your teeth to scurvy? No worries, thanks to our cutting edge tech you can have meticulously carved wooden dentures (apparently the first dentures were made back in 7 century BC).
But you're not replacing lost limbs with the implants, are you?
Depends on how you look at it. Today if your eyesight goes down, you buy glasses or start wearing contact lenses or do a surgery and hope for the best. How many people would say no to a brand new eyeball?

Cutting off a healthy arm and replacing it with a bionic one is a bit different, no?
No artificial limbs in the game. If you mean in general, I doubt that someone would cut off a perfectly good arm but there are plenty of amputees who'd love one.

Forgot to mention bugs: improving one gadget seems to improve all. Haven't tested it, but both distortion fields had 55% ranged defense in my 10 charisma run.
Will take a look, thanks.
 

Technomancer

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Well, the rich are the first to benefit from all tech and medical advances, that's true, but the tech makers can't limit their markets only to the 1%. So they'd market cheaper versions like the next best thing and the poor will get deeper in debt to own that new best thing, etc. Remember when only the rich had mobile phones (talking about those big ass phones with antennas). Now every pleb has a smart phone.
I have to agree, I was writing a response to previous poster with exact same words. Yes, I remember when first mobile phones were a luxury and a status item, and then they were not. Surely the asians will flood the market with cheap cyborgs eventually, so much money can be made and in modern world money rule everything. So even if I would like to see dystopian future with cyborg wars I do not truly believe it can happen with current world order.
 

Jaedar

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Aug 5, 2009
Messages
9,880
Project: Eternity Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Pathfinder: Kingmaker
Well, fuck this stupid tank build. The heavy armor and STR needs some serious reconsideration. Not only the heroic feat involving STR is bad, but the armors that give you AP penalties are not good enough to justify the investment, and that includes the feat that reduces AP penalties and STR. At the moment, DEX and PER are king, followed by CHA (because of the feats and companions), CON and STR. The difference between a high DEX and a low one is like night and day.
Some points of STR is quite good imo, otherwise you start getting armor penalties very early on. I will agree I don't really see the point to go all in on armor with the current armors.

Politician This one is a piece of work, still, he has a point, if Iron Tower's goal is to sell the game, difficulty settings for Fallout 3 and Chrono-Trigger tards is mandatory, they have money to spend too.

Also, think about all the Disco fanboys, Vault Dweller give them their story mode, you want your GOTY, right ?
I'm pretty sure VD tried this with DR (AoD also had an AWESUM MOED with an extra good character), the problem is that a lot of people will not be happy until they can select HARDEST MODE and still have an easy time.

Unfortunately DR doesn't have achievements just for beating the game on various difficulties, so from public data it's hard to tell. For the ironman achievements it's 0.1 percentile difference(1.7 vs 1.8) between easy and normal/hard. For the solo achievements, it is 4.6%, 3.5% and 2.9%. Those are all challenge runs though, so not sure what conclusions to make. For the ironmans it's a blip, for solo 50% more did it on easy. 50% more sales for having an easy mode seems like a good investment, but this is a very dubious conclusion to make from the data.
 

Darth Canoli

Arcane
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Messages
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Perched on a tree
DR is only about combat so i'm not sure it's relevant and AoD structure is controversial, most of us are spoiled completionists.

But the success of easy but with a moderate challenge mode games might give us some hints (DOS 1 & 2, The Banner Saga series...)

There's also the high probability that the dumb masses don't like choices with real consequences that much ...
 

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