CD Projekt's Cyberpunk 2077 Update 2.0 + Phantom Liberty Expansion Thread

[Perkel]

If you talk to fixers in person those ? will be all revealed and you can see what kind of job are they.

 

[AwesomeButton]

If you talk to fixers in person those ? will be all revealed and you can see what kind of job are they.

Talking to them about anything at all reveals all the question marks that are for their missions? Smells like another case of unfinished mechanic/code we forgot to comment out.

 

[Perkel]

Talking to them about anything at all reveals all the question marks that are for their missions? Smells like another case of unfinished mechanic/code we forgot to comment out.

 

[Riddler]

The Open World requires a roguelike/battle brothers/pirates/mount&blade bare minimum story structure with the player writing his story different every time. The Complex Storyline requires the developer to control what area the player is in with respect to how much he has progressed the main quest.

I partially disagree. I think you can mix the two by having open world segments surrounded by linear story stuff.

A pretty good example is chapter 2 in Baldurs Gate 2 (while it was hub based it might as well have been open world). You had a relatively open world where you were free to do what you want, with an over-arching goal that progresses the main quest. After the open world section you you returned to a linear story structure for the rest of the game. The goal doesn't have to be money but some kind of resources gathering as a goal is probably a good idea (it could be allies, intelligence, artifacts, magical power, etc).

 

[Perkel]

I think this is kind of wrong.

closed world - story focus - easy
closed world - system focus - hard
closed world - system and story focus - very hard
open world - story focus - easy
open world - system focus - very hard
open world - system and story focus - insanely hard
sandbox - story focus - very hard
sandbox - system focus - hard
sandbox - system and story focus - basically impossible to do

Both Tw3 is clearly "open world - story focus" same as C77 though C77 is a bit closer to system focus but not much.

 

[AwesomeButton]

Perkel , my point is that the subject of conversation can't have been in any way connected to any mission represented by any icon, right? I'm pretty sure that yes, hence my remark.

 

[AwesomeButton]

This kind of confirms my theory that the intro talk from fixers that you get on your phone was initially meant to be dialogue lines you would exchange face to face with them, but that was cut and then the dialogue adapted. I wonder if V's voiced lines of that dialogue are mistakenly lying unused in the game files.

 

[AwesomeButton]

I partially disagree. I think you can mix the two by having open world segments surrounded by linear story stuff.

A pretty good example is chapter 2 in Baldurs Gate 2 (while it was hub based it might as well have been open world). You had a relatively open world where you were free to do what you want, with an over-arching goal that progresses the main quest. After the open world section you you returned to a linear story structure for the rest of the game. The goal doesn't have to be money but some kind of resources gathering as a goal is probably a good idea (it could be allies, intelligence, artifacts, magical power, etc).

My way of naming is different. For me there is just hub-based and open world RPGs. What Perkel calls sandbox I call open world, what Perkel calls open world, I call "badly executed" or "pseudo" open world.

 

[zioburosky13]

Even Forbes said Panam is the waifu of the year has good thing to say about Panam.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/paulta...-best-npcs-of-the-generation/?sh=1e683b220227

Panam is incredibly well written and animated, and her voice acting by Emily Woo Zeller is fantastic. Her missions may always be planted in the “side quests” portion of the game, and yet her storyline is better than the main plotline by a wide margin, and hers is the only ending that feels “right” compared to the others, so make sure you go full through her quest before the grand finale.

 

[typical user]

Early design concept draft of Max-Tac for CP2077

 

[CyberWhale]

Early design concept draft of Max-Tac for CP2077

Accepted design execution for NCPD in CP2077.

 

[Perkel]

After a while i find it hilarious that this is probably the only game where you actually fear police.

"I want to shot some civilians "thinks for a second, sweats profusely, maybe not"

Also they do spawn a lot but they do not despawn as quickly and they are pretty fast. I had one black chick NCPD with baton running after me at the same speed as me for about few streets.

 

[typical user]

After a while i find it hilarious that this is probably the only game where you actually fear police.

"I want to shot some civilians "thinks for a second, sweats profusely, maybe not"

When the police force has Goku on the payroll you better behave nice citizen.

 

[CyberWhale]

Simply call your car and drive over them instead.

 

[Robber Baron]

Even Forbes said Panam is the waifu of the year has good thing to say about Panam.

I wonder if the reaction would've been the same if Panam was white.

 

[copebot]

I'm more baffled why everyone keeps chasing the "Open World AND Complex Storyline" dream by repeating the same mistakes.

You either end up guiding the player like a sheep through the map, i.e. not really "open world" gameplay, or completely lose track of the player's power level versus enemy power level.

The Open World requires a roguelike/battle brothers/pirates/mount&blade bare minimum story structure with the player writing his story different every time. The Complex Storyline requires the developer to control what area the player is in with respect to how much he has progressed the main quest.

For me the best kind of RPG is a game where the player is "rewarded" with more story, because the story is interesting. The player "buys" progression in the story by learning how to utilize increasingly complex mechanics in order to overcome unique challenges (not simply health and damage bloat of enemies).

Since you can't come up with unique and interesting challenges that fit multiple playstyles throughout the course of a 100hrs long story, it follows that the good RPG is relatively short, and worth multiple playthroughs.

An Age of Decadence but with AAA graphics technology and no teleportation through dialogue choices.

FromSoft games are a good example of an alternative way around this. There's basically no story in most of them, or any 'story' progression is just tied to a boss fight. The world is nonlinear but some areas are gated by certain encounters or through secret passages. While you can overlevel bosses and certain areas in Souls games, without foreknowledge the design sort of discourages that. In Sekiro there isn't really over-leveling because you generally only get a broader set of abilities, more items, and more healing rather than actually getting more stats.

Open Worlds that really embrace the "RP" in RPG tend to be more compelling for it. In M&B2, you can be trader, artisan baron, a knight in someone else's kingdom, a bandit, found a kingdom, be a scavenger, etc. -- there's no real expression of a character through dialogue, but you can establish a compelling role in gameplay itself. Although M&B2 decided that it needed a 'main quest,' it is something that can be ignored. Generally there are no nonlinear story RPGs with open worlds. You can only tack on a linear story within a larger nonlinear game.

 

[Tyrr]

After a while i find it hilarious that this is probably the only game where you actually fear police.

"I want to shot some civilians "thinks for a second, sweats profusely, maybe not"

Also they do spawn a lot but they do not despawn as quickly and they are pretty fast. I had one black chick NCPD with baton running after me at the same speed as me for about few streets.

You wonder why there is any crime in a city with such a police force.

 

[Robber Baron]

You wonder why there is any crime in a city with such a police force.

The whole NC crime scene is on the corporations payroll. Controlled chaos is the best state of affairs for them - keeping the populace in fear while the active crime elements are occupied with fighting each other and the police closing its eyes since they get a check too. V on the other hand is outside of that system since he is not a part of any gang or corporation - so he gets a taste of the unrestrained police force.

 

[Turjan]

You wonder why there is any crime in a city with such a police force.

You didn't bribe them enough.

 

[Perkel]

You didn't bribe them enough.

It would be hilarious if they would patch game and add option to go to NCPD HQ and pay some bribes so the next time it would work like in GTA games with slowly expanding net rather than "OREWA SHINDERU" in 15 seconds.

 

[Twiglard]

Depends on the games, but it seems here the only choice is 1080p 30 fps lmao

I've got 2160p running with 55-60 alright, on i5 7600@3.9GHz, and an 3070. Having only 4 cores makes it slow down when streaming new areas. Sometimes drops to 40.

 

[gurugeorge]

I think the best way of handling story and open world together is to have the game start with open world and very loose story, so that the player can potter about, get their bearings, absorb the ambience of the virtual world, build up some level of power, etc. And then as the game progresses the story builds momentum, maybe even starts to have a time limit, and you start to be funnelled (according to the accumulation of your choices) towards one of several major, different endings.

The problem here, if it is a problem, is that you're dragged into a big story from the get-go, and while the story is pretty good, and well-told, it makes open world wandering seem psychologically wrong and off-key.

But of course it's not really a problem from CDPR's point of view, it's only a problem for "serious" gamers like us. From CDPR's point of view they know most people never even finish games, so they decided to front-load the story so that the casual player will at least get a good cinematic experience right out of the box. They also know that if the game had a loose-to-tight structure, casuals would complain that they were all at sea, didn't know what to do, etc., etc.

This is one of the main distinctions between casual players and most of us here: most of us here know how to make our own fun in videogames, and don't need our hands to be held. But developers have to cater to casuals first and foremost, because that's the biggest market - even if they like having players like us around, and want to give us something to chew on, catering to the foibles of casual players is their primary responsibility.

 

[AwesomeButton]

You didn't bribe them enough.

It would be hilarious if they would patch game and add option to go to NCPD HQ and pay some bribes so the next time it would work like in GTA games with slowly expanding net rather than "OREWA SHINDERU" in 15 seconds.

Orewa shinderu translates as "I'm sorry". "Omae wa mou shindeiru" is "you are already dead". :D

 

[Robber Baron]

Orewa shinderu translates as "I'm sorry"

俺は死んでいる (Ore wa shinde iru) is an altogether wrong sentence(which google translates as something like "I'm dead"). The "correct" is either 俺はもう死んでいる (Ore wa mō shinde iru - I'm already dead) or 俺は死んだ (Ore wa shinda - I'm dead). But then again using 俺は (Ore wa) for talking about oneself is considered "arrogant", so people use 私は (Watashi wa). Also don't quote me on anything I just like to watch old anime thats all.

 

[Cpt. Dallas]

The omnipotent and omniscient police (when *on foot*) exist to keep the player from going full GTA and offending nu-CDPR's tender sensibilities. Only that first civvie can actually be killed.

I played through all (8?) endings, even going back a few saves to change the one dialogue option with Johnny to unlock the secret Kamikaze run. The voicemails are an interesting take on the old slideshows. Best are River's if you die or Goro if you don't go Arasaka, or Misty if you cross over. The Johnny epilogue is weak if going Kamikaze, but fits elsewhere.

I'm not familiar with any original CP canon/lore, but it's odd that Alt is magically gifted godlike Shodan status. Her human scenes portray her simply as Johnny's trashy groupie piece of ass.

Both waifus are annoyingly arrogant, get people killed thorough their own incompetence and only V seems to show any remorse about it.