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TBS Age of Wonders 1 & 2

Discussion in 'Strategy and Simulation' started by BING XI LAO, Apr 6, 2020.

  1. octavius Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    octavius
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    Not sure why you gave me that [​IMG] rating, since I try to avoid using the Awesome Button and do it the hard way instead.

    Oh well, I'm still enjoying your S&S mod.
    I'm playing the Undead in the old map Lord of Nightmares, an XL 3 level map.
    Even with nerfed Wraiths the Undead are probably the most OP faction against the AI, and I was making good progress. I had cast Hatred to try to make things more dynamic, and enourage the other factions to fight each other, but the only tangible result was the Dwarves having a High Men hero defect and and defeat three of their stacks. And then the whole cunning plan backfired when my own Orc main hero rebelled...

    So how do you deal with this?
    Reject heroes other than Undead ones?
    Avoid Looting and Razing non-undead Evil cities?
    Give Bard skill to the heroes? Will that be enough?
     
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  2. BING XI LAO commie-cunt mainlander Patron

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    Because you SHOULD play PBEM and live games and trashtalk the toxic anime profile pic on the discord who thinks he's the best player!
    Clearly you are too [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    In theory you could kill then reanimate him with Animate Hero, I think it switches him to Undead race. Problem is that Animate, Call, and Resurrect Hero are pretty iffy and sometimes the hero won't allow you to rehire him with gold. Even then you could Dominate him, but probably not possible against high DEF score.
    Frankly if you're Undead and casting Hatred, you could just RP destroying everything including your own living former allies. It's how the Undead in the campaign behaved!
    Also, don't you find being able to get 2 DEF per levelup too easy? Ziggurat and the other hex edit mods (AoW+ and AoWx and Warlock) make it harder.
     
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  3. BING XI LAO commie-cunt mainlander Patron

    BING XI LAO
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    Breath attacks don't work at melee range.... bugged!
     
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  4. octavius Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

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    Tried that, but it seems to work just like Call and Resurrect Hero; it summons a random dead hero who then refuses to join. Or does it matter where you cast the spell?

    Hmm...that could possibly work.

    Yeah, I guess I should have had that mindset from the start.

    Of the main inbalances I actually find high DEF + unlimited retaliation the least abusive. It's powerful, but it doesn't make the hero invincible. Besides with S&S there's so much other stuff to spend the skill points on.
    And since I started replaying AoW last year I've generally gone for leader type instead of a meleer anyway.

    EDIT: Dominate worked to get him back, but his morale is still Terrible. And Bard Skill didn't seem to have any effect.

    Oh well, at least I learnt something about playing the Undead from this game.

    EDIT 2: Hatred is probably most effective (if you want to keep your Orc and Goblin heroes) if you remove it before things turn too ugly.

    EDIT 3: Hmm...removing Hatred negated all it's effects instead of just stopping further effects. So now all the good guys love each other again. But at least my heroes will not rebel.
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2021
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  5. octavius Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

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    Yeah, that's annoying. I've seen it in auto mode too, so definitely a bug and not an undocumented design feature.

    BTW, when razing a Life Node no avengers appear when using your S&S mod?
     
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  6. BING XI LAO commie-cunt mainlander Patron

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    I shortened the selection of possible raze defenders in that mod, and clearly the game considers empty listings as still a valid choice unfortunately. One more reason to upgrade to Ziggurat, where i never got round to messing with raze defender lists yet.
     
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  7. octavius Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

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    I had fun with the listings when making my SM mod. Not much variation in vanilla and 1.4 didn't touch them, so I added many lists where you could encounter some of the new 1.4 units, for example. Worked very well in practice.

    BTW, breath attacks not working at melee range only happens some times.
     
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  8. Norfleet Moderator

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    What happens if you just duplicate entries instead of leaving them as empty?
     
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  9. BING XI LAO commie-cunt mainlander Patron

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    Probably works 100% fine in that case
     
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  10. visions Arcane

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    Does anyone know if concealment works against the AI in AOW1? I've read on the GOG forum that it doesn't but the GOG forum has its fair share of false information (people mixing up mechanics from AoW1 and AoW2). Before reading this claim on the GOG forum, I always used units with concealment in a manner that assumes that concealment works and can't recall having been attacked by any AI player when doing so. So I was surprised when reading this claim.

    I'm replaying the campaign and my lone concealed orc assassins haven't been attacked by any AI player now either. Just loaded up a save and tested it. With my assassin in concealment the AI player didn't attack him. Moved him out of concealment and was attacked. I'm too lazy to conduct more than one test today but does anyone know for certain?
     
    • Makes you think... Makes you think... x 1
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  11. razvedchiki Erudite Sad Loser

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    whats mods should i use with patches 1.4/1.5?
     
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  12. octavius Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

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    • Acknowledge this user's Agenda Acknowledge this user's Agenda x 1
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  13. octavius Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

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    I'm gonna test out BING XI LAO's Ziggurat mod.
    Since I play only SP I've decided to modify some of the units, and entirely replace a couple of others.

    The two most "problematic" units to me are the Incarnate, since the AI can't deal with or use it properly, and I myself find it boring, and the Undead Wraith due to the PI which the AI can't deal with.

    So I replaced the Incarnate (keeping the name, though) with this:
    Show Spoiler
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]


    In Morrowind the Dark Elves had Ancestor Ghosts as racial ability, and in Shadow Magic the Sword Dancer is a very fun unit. So this unit is based on those concepts.
    It gets Lightning Strike on Silver and First Strike on Gold and with only 13 HP it's a bit of a glass cannon.
    I made a small test map just to see how it looks in-game, so its DF and RES is lower than it should be (5 and 8) with a normal morale.


    I changed the Undead Wraith to this:
    Show Spoiler
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]


    This is of course based on the AD&D concept of ghouls, with Entangle Strike mimicing the paralyzing touch.
    I think it will be a unit worth building, since it complements the other units very well.

    Let me know what you think of these units. Are they too weak or too OP compared to their costs (177 and 41 respectively)?
     
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  14. BING XI LAO commie-cunt mainlander Patron

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    If you can make the effort, you could replace the Incarnate with Lagi's Hydra. Seem like okay designs to me but maybe the ghoul should be weaker, Entangle strike is excellent.

    I think Zigg mod still has the Hydra available as a unit graphic in the files.
     
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2021
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  15. octavius Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

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    I tried the Hydra with MolzyMod once. It certainly helped make the AI Dark Elf player stronger. But I think the Hydra is just too radical a change.
     
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2021
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  16. octavius Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    octavius
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    Hmm, did Cave Crawling bug out with Ziggurat Mod, BING XI LAO?

    [​IMG]
    (Nature Elemental does not have Free Movement)

    [​IMG]
     
    • Equip the Ring Equip the Ring x 1
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  17. BING XI LAO commie-cunt mainlander Patron

    BING XI LAO
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    Cave Crawling doesn't work on tiles with those green reeds growing on them. It also doesn't work on mushrooms, though that part might be my fault - but probably isn't.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
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  18. octavius Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

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    I'm noticing a big shift in the power between Elves and Dark Elves with the Ziggurat Mod. Nature Elementals are no longer invincible against most enemies, and Shadows and Executioners are now quite a bit more fearsome. So my own version of the Incarnate (spirit of a former sword master) is not as suitable for this mod as for vanilla.

    I like it so far, especially that heroes are no longer the main combat units, but more important as spell casters and for special abilities like True Seeing.
     
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  19. BING XI LAO commie-cunt mainlander Patron

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    Hmm, why are Nature Elementals weaker? Also, what would happen vs AI if you had the basegame Incarnate, but without Phys imm?
     
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  20. octavius Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

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    I see they are not really weaker than in vanilla, but against Executioners they certainly feel weaker. Also, I've mostly used MolzyMod since I started replaying AoW1 and that mod increased both HP and Movement, making them extra strong.

    I remember when I started playing AoW1 that I thought abilities like Possess and Dominate was exciting, but when I started to master the game I felt they were too easy to abuse, so I've mostly ignore them, and when playing Dark Elves (also in Shadow Magic) I've only built lvl 3 or lesser units.
    Not sure how the AI would fare against them, but at least if wouldn't be more left to the chance of the AI having units with Magic Strike.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2021
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  21. octavius Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    octavius
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    Nature Elemantals still rule (as long as they can avoid Executioners):
    [​IMG]

    The Black Dragons have been modified to be more like Glaurung than Ancalagon the Black. I replaced Flying with Floating, gave them Physical Protection and +5 HP. Maybe they need even more HP and some extra Movement. And Wall Crushing too.
    The Nature Elemental was buffed with Bless and HC.
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2021
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  22. octavius Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

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    Hmm...this was weird.
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    I haven't hoarded skill points, and I have heroes with higher levels who did not experience this problem.
    Using BING XI LAO's Ziggurat mod.
     
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  23. BING XI LAO commie-cunt mainlander Patron

    BING XI LAO
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    Yeah, haven't figured out that bug yet. I think they next levelup will be the same number, but positive, and then it goes back to normal.
    Also saving the map in the editor under the ruleset probably gets rid of it.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
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  24. octavius Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    octavius
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    I did a test myself, and it seems like Concealment does indeed work against the AI. I've always assumed that it doesn't work, but it may be that my memory is faulty after having played much more Shadow Magic than AoW1. SM was an incline in most regards, but there was also some decline, and Concealment not working may be one of them.
     
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  25. BING XI LAO commie-cunt mainlander Patron

    BING XI LAO
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    I think this map http://aow.heavengames.com/downloads/showfile.php?fileid=1233 might be not just the prettiest I've made but the prettiest anyone's made. Though it is a desert with the occasional lava lake, and is short on verdant gardens.
    Often when I TURN in the ongoing PBEM I take a screenshot.
    Show Spoiler

    Screenshot_5.png

    Also, a new map is in the works by me:
    Show Spoiler
    Screenshot_29.png

    In which the surface is a frozen wasteland devoid of any life, not even vegetation. Even the dungeons there will be filled only with machines, spirits and the undead. Only the lava caves have light and warmth. Moreover, the lava caves being the only source of light, are actually placed on the top map level where units have full vision range without needing Night Vision. And the surface I placed on the bottom map level - it is dark, and nits without Night Vision will have reduced vision there.

    There's also a map made by someone else which will soon be approved at AoWHeaven, which will have timed indy attacks via 1-way teleporters, gradually shrinking the safe region of the map towards the center.... that's right. It's AoW: Fortnite Edition. Will say more when I have my hands on it.
     
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2021
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