Baldur's Gate Baldur's Gate 3 Pre-Release Thread [EARLY ACCESS RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Cryomancer]

https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/20...might-not-cap-player-levels-to-ten-after-all/

Baldur's Gate 3 might not cap player levels to ten after all

That is a HUGE incline. Low level D&D is awful. At lv 10, you can cast a cloudkill and now, need to rest to cast it again. Fighters would get a 2 attack at lv 5 and spend the rest of the game with two attacks per round...

 

[User0001]

https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/20...might-not-cap-player-levels-to-ten-after-all/

Baldur's Gate 3 might not cap player levels to ten after all

That is a HUGE incline. Low level D&D is awful. At lv 10, you can cast a cloudkill and now, need to rest to cast it again. Fighters would get a 2 attack at lv 5 and spend the rest of the game with two attacks per round...

Low level is still awesome.

 

[Ontopoly]

I hope when the game finally releases a new thread is made and the old one goes directly into retardoland.

I'll still be here. Those 700 pages represent the people and all their thoughts and hopes and disappointments. I'm proud of these 700 pages and I think they mean something to me and a lot of posters on the forum who participated. The passion that drove this to 700 pages is nothing to be ashamed of. These pages contain the immediate and raw reactions of the codex everytime larian gave us news or updates.

 

[Ontopoly]

Suddenly all of the Larian cultists praising the game for low level dnd will be fine with a higher level cap. Anything Larian gives, we will take sitting down. No problem. Larian only makes good decisions and no bad decisions according to these people.

 

[Cryomancer]

Low level is still awesome.

Nothing better than casting a sleep and being worthless for the rest of the day... And fight the might, all powerful ... KOBOLD!!! Sorry, but I prefer a adventure which involves escaping from Carceri, and having to take sides in the war between demons and devils or something similar to invading a Lich crypt, defending a village from a Adult dragon or fighting a mindflayer colony. Way better than kobold slaying on sword coast(which is 95%+ of the 5e adventures)

Suddenly all of the Larian cultists praising the game for low level dnd will be fine with a higher level cap. Anything Larian gives, we will take sitting down. No problem. Larian only makes good decisions and no bad decisions according to these people.

If Larian makes BG3 into a sword coast legends clone, Larian cultists still gonna praise Larian.

Low level D&D is so boring that many games have you starting at lv 3 like nwn1/2 OC and going almost to lv 10 on the first chapter. ToEE and Dark Sun : Shattered Lands are exceptions to that rule but would be far better with a higher lv cap. And this games are better at lv 7+. You have to multiclass on Shattered Lands due the lv cap, otherwise, good lucky on the final battle.

 

[User0001]

Suddenly all of the Larian cultists praising the game for low level dnd will be fine with a higher level cap. Anything Larian gives, we will take sitting down. No problem. Larian only makes good decisions and no bad decisions according to these people.

Both low and higher level is interesting. Some might be worried that extensive planning/work required by the team for higher-level gameplay to work will jeopardize the lower level experience, which is valid. If it's designed correctly, with the exponential world-reactivity options that high levels implicate, then everyone's probably fine with it.

Low level is still awesome.

Nothing better than casting a sleep and being worthless for the rest of the day... And fight the might, all powerful ... KOBOLD!!! Sorry, but I prefer a adventure which involves escaping from Carceri, and having to take sides in the war between demons and devils or something similar to invading a Lich crypt, defending a village from a Adult dragon or fighting a mindflayer colony. Way better than kobold slaying on sword coast(which is 95%+ of the 5e adventures)

Spoiler

 

[Ontopoly]

If it's designed correctly, with the exponential world-reactivity options that high levels implicate, then everyone's probably fine with it.

Perfect example. Basically "high level is bad but Larian can pull it off because they are so great and they can over come the flaws of high level dnd"

Larian cultists are predictable. I called it. Everyone's probably fine with it because Larian did it and can do no wrong in their eyes

 

[fantadomat]

Both low and higher level is interesting. Some might be worried that extensive planning/work required by the team for higher-level gameplay to work will jeopardize the lower level experience, which is valid. If it's designed correctly, with the exponential world-reactivity options that high levels implicate, then everyone's probably fine with it.

And yet i don't remember a single game that did high levels well. Most of them end up with killing gods or similar shit.

 

[Cryomancer]

And yet i don't remember a single game that did high levels well. Most of them end up with killing gods or similar shit.

Look to Pathfinder Kingmaker. "killing Gods" is behind a optional chapter.... You can fight Lantern King which is a DEMIgod, however, before he put nasty curses on you and almost destroy your kingdom. And you weaken him by a lot. Seriously guys. I don't get why so many people believe that high level = God. Do you have any idea about how powerful deities are? A high level PC(16+) is at best eqquivalent to a Dark Lord of a Realm of Dread. Dark Lords are weaker than Demon Lords. Demon Lords, are weaker than quasi deities. Quasi deities weaker than demigods, demi gods are weaker than fully fledged Gods. A Deity can pick a Cleric and make this cleric the chosen of that deity and make that cleric a lv 30 epic character.

Hell, even Karsus which is a lv 40 Arcanist is extremely weaker than any lesser deity in her avatar form.

 

[User0001]

If it's designed correctly, with the exponential world-reactivity options that high levels implicate, then everyone's probably fine with it.

Perfect example. Basically "high level is bad but Larian can pull it off because they are so great and they can over come the flaws of high level dnd"

Larian cultists are predictable. I called it. Everyone's probably fine with it because Larian did it and can do no wrong in their eyes

As mentioned in the RPS article, it's harder to implement in a crpg as opposed to dungeon-mastering it, but it's not wors by default.

Both low and higher level is interesting. Some might be worried that extensive planning/work required by the team for higher-level gameplay to work will jeopardize the lower level experience, which is valid. If it's designed correctly, with the exponential world-reactivity options that high levels implicate, then everyone's probably fine with it.

And yet i don't remember a single game that did high levels well. Most of them end up with killing gods or similar shit.

I don't disagree with you. Easy to fuck up.

 

[The_Mask]

And yet i don't remember a single game that did high levels well. Most of them end up with killing gods or similar shit.

MOTB. (and, no, offling Myrkul doesn't count). Tyranny, if you play a spellcaster is fun lategame. Academagia is fun lategame too, because you just go on adventures and you just solve things. And these are just 3 I came up with in less than 3 minutes. I'm sure there are other examples.

It really depends on the sub-genre of RPG you're referring to, and/or the difficulty you're playing it on.

 

[Dodo1610]

BG3 still won't contain DND high-level gameplay they only backpaddled on saying that the level cap will be level 10. Now they said that they don't know atm. Larian will certainly not change their max level 10 campaign to a max 20 one. Maybe they change it to level 11/12 for the level 6 spells but certainly not more than that.

 

[Cryomancer]

Maybe they change it to level 11/12 for the level 6 spells but certainly not more than that.

I agree. I doubt that the lv cap will be greater than 15... Most early 90s SSI games I believe that includes spells up to tier 6~7. Dungeon Hack, Dark Sun : Wake of the Ravager, Ravenloft : Strahd Possession and Stone prophet, all include tier 6/7 spells but not tier 8/9... The way that they are saying, with lv cap = 10 and short rest being translated to per encounter, warlocks would become the best casters ever. IDK if they chanced their mind about short rests. IMO it should be difficulty based.

• Easy difficulty = Unlimited short rests
• Normal = 3 Short rests per long rest
• Hardest = 2 short rests per long rest;

EDIT : I believe that Eye of the Beholder III: Assault on Myth Drannor includes tier 9 spells but not sure(never played)

 

[User0001]

I hope when the game finally releases a new thread is made and the old one goes directly into retardoland.

Yeah, 701 pages and the game hasn't even reached EA-stage. Mostly a collection of unsubstantiated speculation, memes and shitposting. This forum acts all prestigious but I have only seen a handful here that are capable of formulating thoughts not bogged down into the equivalent of an American refusing to wear a mask because it "stops the oxygen intake".

By the way this forum is exactly as reddit you only replaced downvotes with butthurt people spamming retarded rating on everyone they disagree with.

Reddit's streamlined structure has a tendency to devolve actual discussion into a game of "who can make the most popular opinion the fastest" - *end thread*. You'll see more shit here and there's more work to find quality posts, but when you do, they'll be miles more interesting than anything you'll find on Reddit. I'll take this over the soulless alternative any day of the week.

"Edit: Thanks strangers for all the awards! I FInALly feel validated after my long struggle with depression!!!11"

 

[Roguey]

Look to Pathfinder Kingmaker. "killing Gods" is behind a optional chapter

Everyone says that chapter is utter garbage, even after they tried to improve it in a patch.

 

[fantadomat]

And yet i don't remember a single game that did high levels well. Most of them end up with killing gods or similar shit.

MOTB. (and, no, offling Myrkul doesn't count). Tyranny, if you play a spellcaster is fun lategame. Academagia is fun lategame too, because you just go on adventures and you just solve things. And these are just 3 I came up with in less than 3 minutes. I'm sure there are other examples.

It really depends on the sub-genre of RPG you're referring to, and/or the difficulty you're playing it on.

Ahhh what are you talking about? Clearly the discussion is about game that use D&D/like system,not about visual novels or demos.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

I hope when the game finally releases a new thread is made and the old one goes directly into retardoland.

Yeah, 701 pages and the game hasn't even reached EA-stage. Mostly a collection of unsubstantiated speculation, memes and shitposting. This forum acts all prestigious but I have only seen a handful here that are capable of formulating thoughts not bogged down into the equivalent of an American refusing to wear a mask because it "stops the oxygen intake".

By the way this forum is exactly as reddit you only replaced downvotes with butthurt people spamming retarded rating on everyone they disagree with.

I rated your post retarded, why is it still visible? I thought this site is like reddit?

 

[Ontopoly]

Look to Pathfinder Kingmaker. "killing Gods" is behind a optional chapter

Everyone says that chapter is utter garbage, even after they tried to improve it in a patch.

They don't say that because you're fighting a Demi God though or because the stakes are too high. They say that because it's difficult and the fights are the same enemies through out. I personally loved it and think hateot is one of the best final dungeons to exist in gaming

Reddit's streamlined structure has a tendency to devolve actual discussion into a game of "who can make the most popular opinion the fastest" - *end thread*. You'll see more shit here and there's more work to find quality posts, but when you do, they'll be miles more interesting than anything you'll find on Reddit. I'll take this over the soulless alternative any day of the week.

Reddit is the worst forum on the internet. They are even trying to shy away from the forum part and move towards a social media style. Format wise it's very easy to follow a conversation but the upvoting system, paying to gold a comment, mods constantly flexing their powers and being chosen for no reason other than they got the name first shits all over it. They call this forum toxic and racist and act all high and mighty but they have legitimately fucked up shit on there. From straight up cp to legitimate terrorist and hate crime support. Never seen that here. Sure, some people will throw an occasional racist comment or some edgy shit but they have legitimate communities based on this stuff that don't get shut down. Stuff that calls for actual actions against certain people.

 

[fantadomat]

I don't get why so many people believe that high level = God.

Ahhh we don't,the devs are doing it. Also the kingmaker boss was pretty much a god lol,not being worshipped by humans doesn't make it less of a deity. Also you weaken him by doing retarded shit that shouldn't affect him. The problem is that in those table top games deities and other powers are just too weak,they shouldn't even be seen as possible enemy lol.

I don't disagree with you. Easy to fuck up.

It is more like not being possible to do it right,judging by all the games till now . BG2's expansion for example was atrocious and by far the worst part of the whole franchise.....till bg3 that is.....maybe.

 

[The_Mask]

I personally loved it and think hateot is one of the best final dungeons to exist in gaming

Not many RPGs under your belt then, huh?

 

[fantadomat]

LoL the last chapter of Kingmaker was really bad. Also have no idea what do you mean by hard enemies,a well build party could cleave trough them like hot knife trough butter. Only the final boss could be a bit of a challenge.....and swarm spiders .

 

[Cryomancer]

Look to Pathfinder Kingmaker. "killing Gods" is behind a optional chapter

Everyone says that chapter is utter garbage, even after they tried to improve it in a patch.

Still OPTIONAL garbage... And is not as if hotu and motb aren't good expansions. Also, looking into D&D/Pathfinder games on RPG codexl ist of best RPGs ( https://rpgcodex.net/article.php?id=11193 )

• Nº1(Planescape) = Has high level content
• Nº3(BG2) = Has high level content. You can fight liches and dragons, not only Kobolds
• Nº13(PFKM) = Has high level content.
• Nº19(BG1) = Has only low level content
• Nº21(nwn2) = has high level content. You start at lv 3 and are around lv 10 after the first chapter.
• N24(IWD) = Has high level content but focus more on medium level except on the expansion
• Nº26(Pool of Radiance) = Never played but believe that is mostly low level content(NOT SURE)
• Nº35(Dark Sun : Shattered Lands) = Low level, lv cap = 9.
• Nº41(ToEE) = Low level, lv cap = 10

Looking in the top 50, most of good D&D games has medium to high level content. And guess what. Mainly those on the top 20. I loved Dark Sun : Shattered Lands however, it would be far better If i had a higher level cap and din't had to multiclass because my characters reach lv cap far before the final battle on my first run and I suffered a lot on the final battle.

If Shattered Lands had a lv cap = 15, I can bet that It would have in the top 15 if not top 10.

The problem is that in those table top games deities and other powers are just too weak,they shouldn't even be seen as possible enemy lol.

I agree. 2e did it right. No stats for deities. They are above what game rules can measure. Their avatar which has a tiny fraction of their power are ridiculous strong. Chauntea avatar is a Druid 40/Cleric 20 with 197 HP and -6 AC + 25 WIS and CHA and she can cast 12 priest spells of the maximum level per day.

 

[Roguey]

And is not as if hotu and motb aren't good expansions.

They had their fair share of high-level absurdity (difficult to balance, epic level gnolls, magic loot everywhere).

 

[Cryomancer]

And is not as if hotu and motb aren't good expansions.

They had their fair share of high-level absurdity (difficult to balance, epic level gnolls, magic loot everywhere).

**** Balance. This excessive focus on balance(and accessibility) is why most modern RPG's are trash. And why poe 1/2 is inferior to bg1/2.

As for magical loot, the chapter 1 of the NWN2 OC had epic loot everywhere... And on nwn1 hotu, I don't think that in the 8th layer of the hell, magical items would be that rare. Nor in the underdark.

 

[Roguey]

**** Balance. This excessive focus on balance(and accessibility) is why most modern RPG's are trash. And why poe 1/2 is inferior to bg1/2.

Balance is that thing people don't care about until a game is too easy or too hard for their liking (exacerbated to an extreme with high level content).