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KickStarter BATTLETECH - turn-based mech combat from Harebrained Schemes

DeepOcean

Arcane
Joined
Nov 8, 2012
Messages
7,394
Can anybody enlighten me which overhaul mod is currently the best to enjoy the up to date game? I remember only Roguetech, but as far as I understand there’s at least one more publicly acclaimed mod called Advanced 3062. What are the main differences between them, are they both utilize all available DLCs?

I would highly recommend Battletech Extended 3025 - Commander's Edition

It features dynamic wars between the great houses influenced by your contract results, the entire inner sphere, more mechs and a lot of other features designed to extend and enrich the career mode and make it more open ended. The massive problem with RT is that it just pushes you to a weird point in BT lore, gives everyone and their mother expectationally overpowered and lore breaking lostech weapons and in general is just not very well balanced or feature rich compared to any of the overhauls. It's also the least stable.
Did they fix the uselessness of the light mechs? RogueTech is better than vanilla but it is kinda messy as you said. I'm still after an overhaul that turns this thing on a real tactical game instead of the dumb who has more/bigger lasors and LRMs is the winner.
 

Olinser

Savant
Joined
Nov 1, 2018
Messages
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Denial
or maybe make lighter mechs effective at their roles, but that'd require some serious mechanics reworking instead of just a couple of numbers shufflings.
Agreed, the core problem is fundamental to the entire IP. Tonnage correlating directly with power is a huge problem and it's something that should be serious reworked.

The problem is the gameplay is so limited that you simply can't improve most of the lighter mechs.

Heavier mechs have much heavier weapons and armor. That's true of the series since it started and never going to change.

Lighter mechs are much more mobile/agile, and can bring things like spotting and scouting to the part.

The issue with this game is the main functions of lighter mechs are either useless, or cannot override the negative that you can only take 4 mechs to begin with, replacing one with a significantly weaker combat light model is not worth scouting or speed.

If you had 16 mechs (or even 8), it would almost certainly be worth it to have a light scouting/sensor mech. When you've only got 4? FUCK no.

That's not to say lighter mechs can't be hugely useful. Last time I played the campaign I actually used a Griffin all the way through. Jump jets, 3x Medium Laser with +10 damage (35 damage each), 3x SRM-6 with +4 damage (72 damage each), and you have a damage potential on an alpha strike of 321 on a medium mech with jump jets. Jump rear arc, target center and you can core out any Assault in the game in 1 turn. Heck front arc target center torso and you can core out most heavies in 1 round even with some misses. Now you don't want 4 of them, but 1 is really good.

But light mechs? Useless. Heavy mechs? Speed tradeoff is pointless as you're simply not faster enough than Assaults to warrant it, and when you only have 4 mechs.

The gameplay is simply too shallow to have any kind of actual speed/maneuverability that overrides straight firepower.
 

Nathaniel3W

Rockwell Studios
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Strap Yourselves In Codex Year of the Donut Codex+ Now Streaming!
I tried playing with some alternate builds just to force some variety into the game. Nothing I tried was really viable.
  • Killer melee mech: I tried an Atlas, Black Knight, and Dragon (because it's the heaviest thing that moves at least 2 faster than an assault). I gave them whatever Arm Mods I had available at the time. Even with 100 bonus melee damage, they weren't worth it. They would get in one or two good hits, and then they'd get totally torn apart by enemy fire. And you can't even target the center torso, so those big hits usually just take off an arm or a leg.
  • Medium with jump jets: For getting behind an enemy just like Olinser says. Not gonna lie. It saved my bacon a time or two, like during my first playthrough when I was stealing the Argo or escaping from the Star League castle. But the jumping mech just doesn't have enough survivability to stay in the fight. It takes a couple of hits and then you have to pull back.
  • Flamers: I packed as many Flamer++s as I could onto a Banshee. I was hoping that every round I could keep one enemy assault mech shut down. Doesn't work because the flamers don't cause enough heat to instantly shut down a mech so the enemy always gets at least one round to fight back. And with how close you have to get to use flamers, your uber-Firestarter is going to get torn up.
  • Light spotter mech: I built a Stalker with 4x LRM-20s, extra ammo, heat sinks, and no armor, then paired it with a spotter mech. Given weapon and vision range, this was just a waste of a slot that could be used to deal and soak more damage. There was nothing that the light mech could do that couldn't be done better by an assault mech just walking up and trading blows with the enemy. The missile boat is part of my A-squad though, and I just let an Atlas or King Crab spot for it.
Edit: I didn't think about the flamer build until I fought one battle that throws a bunch of Firestarters at you while heavy mechs pound you from long range. That tactic works for the computer because it doesn't have a lance limit, and it doesn't care if it loses the sacrificial mechs and pilots.
 
Last edited:
Joined
May 22, 2010
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Airstrip One
85 pages show there is definitely a game here, but it is very flawed.

Higher tonnage will always fight better than lighter tonnage, until you start to pass that Medium-Heavy sweetspot where the mobility is too low to make use of the higher protection and firepower in a general situation. I don't think the game can change that and I also don't think it should. Is it a problem? It is realistic, but it just isn't fun to play with. The main advantage a Light mech have is not in mobility, is not in spotting or scouting, it is logistics, which doesn't translate well into a game where every mission you are 100% going into combat. The only fix beyond artifically boosting the numbers is to make the heavier mechs more expensive and difficult to maintain and keep running in top condition.

Like a lot of people have said, having a maximum of 4 mechs in a Lance hamstrings the whole system. Remove that and a lot of the games core problems are fixed. Everything else will fall into place with some tweaking.
 

Riel

Arcane
Joined
Apr 29, 2012
Messages
1,357
Location
Itaca
I tried playing with some alternate builds just to force some variety into the game. Nothing I tried was really viable.
  • Killer melee mech: I tried an Atlas, Black Knight, and Dragon (because it's the heaviest thing that moves at least 2 faster than an assault). I gave them whatever Arm Mods I had available at the time. Even with 100 bonus melee damage, they weren't worth it. They would get in one or two good hits, and then they'd get totally torn apart by enemy fire. And you can't even target the center torso, so those big hits usually just take off an arm or a leg.
  • Medium with jump jets: For getting behind an enemy just like Olinser says. Not gonna lie. It saved my bacon a time or two, like during my first playthrough when I was stealing the Argo or escaping from the Star League castle. But the jumping mech just doesn't have enough survivability to stay in the fight. It takes a couple of hits and then you have to pull back.
  • Flamers: I packed as many Flamer++s as I could onto a Banshee. I was hoping that every round I could keep one enemy assault mech shut down. Doesn't work because the flamers don't cause enough heat to instantly shut down a mech so the enemy always gets at least one round to fight back. And with how close you have to get to use flamers, your uber-Firestarter is going to get torn up.
  • Light spotter mech: I built a Stalker with 4x LRM-20s, extra ammo, heat sinks, and no armor, then paired it with a spotter mech. Given weapon and vision range, this was just a waste of a slot that could be used to deal and soak more damage. There was nothing that the light mech could do that couldn't be done better by an assault mech just walking up and trading blows with the enemy. The missile boat is part of my A-squad though, and I just let an Atlas or King Crab spot for it.
Edit: I didn't think about the flamer build until I fought one battle that throws a bunch of Firestarters at you while heavy mechs pound you from long range. That tactic works for the computer because it doesn't have a lance limit, and it doesn't care if it loses the sacrificial mechs and pilots.

A few suggestion:

Melee. You can use support weapons such as Small Laser, Machine Gun and Flamer as part of your melee attack, every SMALL LASER hits for 20 damage, that's a LOT for very little heat. As a result the best mechs for melee are those that have decent Melee attack and plenty support slots. Also for melee you need manoeuvrable mechs to get into position, good mechs for melee are: Firestarter S and Grasshoper 5H, oher mechs are good but not as good. The thing is good melee mechs also need a reliable way to deal damage at mid range because you won't be able to melee your foe every turn or even use your small lasers, for secondary weapons you are looking at SRM batteries and Medium Lasers that you will use when you can't get close enough, HEat management isn't very improtant because you won't be firing all weapons at the same time most of the time, but the possibility to do an easily crippling Alpha Strike with MLs and SLs is there as a bonus, great specially in combination with JJs for surprise called back shots.

Suggested FS9-S build: 2ML 6SL 6 JJ + armor. I swear this little pest kicks ass and is reasonably hard to kill provided you jump long distances and stack plenty EVASION, this is the only light I use in a Medium mech lance, an I even carry within heavy mech lances often, though here is more arguable.

Forget Flamers, they are useless. And machine guns are meh, they are heavier than SL (need ammo) and they spread damage like crazy so they are only good for crit and pilot injury (mini head shot) seeking, I prefer the reliability of a 120 dmg 6 SL volley.

Imo, jumping medium mechs are useless, they aren't fast enough to stack enough EVASION to matter, the only usage of JJs is for getting into firing positions.

To spot you don't need a light mech, you just need the Sensor Lock skill, it is not a great skill, and Spotting is a very situational skill but being able to spot a turret or vehicle and then spam it with lrms into the ground is occasionally useful.

Honestly the game's stale, its tactics are very dull and are a repetitive exercise. DEtec enemies, get into cover to reduce damage, wait for them to come to you, focus fire, rinse and repeat.l You can play a few battle but it grows boring fast.
 

Vaarna_Aarne

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MCA Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2
Machine Gun's better than Small Laser IMO due to the high critical hit chance. Those things cause ammo explosions like crazy.
 

Riel

Arcane
Joined
Apr 29, 2012
Messages
1,357
Location
Itaca
There's is a saying in MWO (which I play a lot), you don't need to crit a component in a body part you destroy... or maybe the saying is mine? Probably, but it's still sound advice.

Don't take me to mean ammo explosions don't hurt, what I mean is that if a body part that has 50 hit points suffers 50 damage it's is down 100% sure, on the other hand causing an ammo explosion is based on luck even with Machine Guns.
 

Infinitron

I post news
Staff Member
Joined
Jan 28, 2011
Messages
97,228
Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
BattleTech is officially over:



https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/webeharebrained/battletech/posts/2752749

CAMPAIGN COMPLETE - THANKS AGAIN!

d969550f0b99fb3efdee1f97f122eeed_original.jpg


Hey BATTLETECH Backers!

Thanks again for all your support for BATTLETECH over the last 4 years. That support allowed us to deliver the first turn-based, tactical MechWarrior experience in more than 20 years and we truly appreciate the opportunity to make it for you. Your support, along with some great press, awards, and accolades allowed us to continue supporting BATTLETECH with nine free updates plus our Flashpoint, Urban Warfare, and Heavy Metal expansions. Thanks again for making all of this possible!

Now, with our season pass at an end, HBS is going to focus on two brand new non-BattleTech projects. Our last free update, BATTLETECH Update 1.9, will release in late February. After that, BATTLETECH will continue to maintain customer support.

Here's a video of Mitch saying all this but with more "Mitch".

And before we go dark for awhile, we thought we'd leave you with these two historical artifacts. #1 is a bit of data...

b16594eb76e40a518b8ccf4906e43f3a_original.jpg


#2 is a visualization of the BATTLETECH project over time from a file structure POV. (It's much cooler than it sounds.)

We look forward to seeing all the badass BATTLETECH mods y'all come up with. Talk to you again when we have something to announce!

- HBS
 

lightbane

Arcane
Joined
Dec 27, 2008
Messages
10,156
The rape is over. Too bad they weren't able (or willing) to make the game less shit. Or let you use more than 4 teammates outside of mods.
 

Xamenos

Magister
Patron
Joined
Feb 4, 2020
Messages
1,256
Pathfinder: Wrath
I'm somewhat impressed they resisted the siren call to milk it with DLC for half a decade like other Paradox-owned games.
 

Infinitron

I post news
Staff Member
Joined
Jan 28, 2011
Messages
97,228
Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
I'm somewhat impressed they resisted the siren call to milk it with DLC for half a decade like other Paradox-owned games.

Well, it's possible that they will soon no longer have the rights to work with BattleTech.

But the DLC-milking has has always been mainly restricted to Paradox's flagship grand strategy titles.
 

Vaarna_Aarne

Notorious Internet Vandal
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Cell S-004
MCA Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2
Eh, without a total overhaul (as in, totally removing any traces of the baggage from tabletop) it'd just be a similar sort of mechanical nightmare as ClanTech always is.

Also the canon storyline is kinda dumb anyway (and I say this with the recognition that all the basic ingredients are there, they're just all implemented badly), as Rich Evans correctly summarized in disdain "HONOR WARRIOR MAKE HONOR," tho a lot of the bullshit is baked in the way the setting is sort of stupid in a general sense (tl;dr as usual, the way AeroSpace is *constantly* conspicuously absent because they didn't have the balls to just Macross more).
 

Trash

Pointing and laughing.
Joined
Dec 12, 2002
Messages
29,683
Location
About 8 meters beneath sea level.
What bothered me mostly was how samey the missions outside of the main storyline and flashpoints were. The recent MW3 despite its many flaws did have quite a few genuinely memorable missions. BT hardly had any and the open campaign felt pointless and boring because of it. The amount of boring maps and lack of helicopters and infantry only made it worse. Missed opportunity that even the mods have done little to improve upon.
 

AdamReith

Magister
Patron
Joined
Oct 21, 2019
Messages
2,109
Enjoy the Revolution! Another revolution around the sun that is.
Man, playing this for the first time was such a total let down. The fact that they won't even improve it is the icing on the cake.

Still, they managed to make giant robots blasting each other, salvaging mechs and mech modification somehow uninteresting which is an acheivement in itself. Hopefully whoever picks up the mantle for a turn based MW game does everything completey opposite.
 

fastjack

Augur
Joined
Mar 31, 2004
Messages
347
Location
the south bay
A lot of people are hoping for a new Shadowrun or Crimson Skies, but I believe their license from MS expires(ed?) in 2020 and I'm not sure they will renew it since Harebrained was bought by Paradox, and with MS being more heavily into PC than they were when the license was granted that makes them a competitor now (imo). Also I'd look for Weissmann to jump ship as soon as his contract wit Paradox allows since he is historically something of a serial entrepreneur who seems to found companies, increase their value, sell them and start the process over again. I also wouldn't be surprised if he went back to microsoft to head a studio focused on FASA properties for PC again though.
 

DeepOcean

Arcane
Joined
Nov 8, 2012
Messages
7,394
Really looking for my tranny vampire with haitian/arab/polynesean background on the next Vampire: The Masquerade game they will make.
 

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