Broken Age - Double Fine's Kickstarter Adventure Game

[DeepOcean]

I decided to read Felipepepe review then read the comments on steam. Jesus Christ, what little dishonest bitches are in that thread. Okay, people like shitty adventure games, no problem they have the decision to rot their brains with any shit they want but the level of dishonesty fanboys can reach is ludicrous. It is worse than liking shitty games, people don't even know what integrity is anymore.

 

[felipepepe]

Every fan is a idiot, when in group they only get worse.*

*Except for Fallout 1 fans, those are bros. :3

 

[Ninja Destroyer]

Broken Age skirts that fate with really well-balanced and smart puzzles that are never so obtuse as to require a hint system — which is good, since there isn't one to speak of — but challenging enough that I took my fair share of breaks to stare at the ceiling and pray for more intelligence than genetics and public schools provided me.

Praying won't help in your case.

Double Fine? More like Double Tale.

Lol, holy shit, I seriously laughed out loud at that quote. Needs to be on this page again. This guy must have trouble figuring out how to log onto the internet to post his review.

This is why the game is easy. It is made for the average joe, who backed the game and think themselves as a hardcore adventure game player. But even if they were back in the days, now their intelligence degenerated so much, that they are constantly stuck in the game. That or they didn't even played it from start to finish, just makeing shit up. When designing a game, Tim and Co took the average intelligence of the backers, and tailored the puzzles for them.

Double Fine will make more of the same. Nicely done visually, easy adventure games that will sell really well. Even the steam tags says: Adventure, Casual, Indie. They have a big fandom, so Tim and co. can hapilly make more of them. It's time for a change of generations. People like Blackthorne, MRY, or Pyke are hungry for a success, not having anything on a gold plate. Maybe they will not make classics, but at least they are making gameplay less similar to Putt Putt joins the Parade. Also, they are better at managing the money.

 

[J_C]

People like Blackthorne, MRY, or Pyke are hungry for a success.

If it is success they want, they should make easy games. Otherwise they will only satisfy a few hundred people on the Codex.

 

[Redlands]

I've decided J_C isn't actually Matt Barton. I have, however, found out "his" real identity...

Spoiler

Oh Mister SCHAYfer EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEH!

 

[Pyke]

If it is success they want, they should make easy games. Otherwise they will only satisfy a few hundred people on the Codex.

Fuck I hope not.

EDIT: Here's what I don't think that people are understanding. 'Easier' adventure games require MORE content to keep the story and the gaming moving along - thus 'Easier' adventure games are MUCH more expensive to make.

Adding in more challenge to an AG gives you more bang for your buck.

The amount of animated cut scenes and story content in Act 1 of Broken Age is insane. Its enough to make my artist-brain swell a little...this SHOULD have been at least a 6 hour play experience with the amount of work they put into it. But instead, dumbing down the puzzles for easier 'casual consumption' just means you have to constantly add in more content to replace it. Puzzles are free - content is expensive.

I really think that this is one of the main reasons why the budget blew up like it did. They had content creators in BEFORE they even had a game. You can see the same thing happen in film - bring in artists and start to 'make shit', and then take the script and try to fit it into the content. That's the difference between a Pixar film and Transformers. Pixar films are planned to the hilt before they even TOUCH a computer. Transformers they started filming without even knowing who the antagonist was.

They had a rough idea for a story, and then brought in artists and said 'make up some stuff and then we'll see which ones are appealing and fit them into the story'. Imagine is those artists had a clear script to work from...the work they produced would have been highly focused, more of it would have hit the correct notes, and more of it would have been ready to turn into production ready designs.
If you are throwing away most of your preproduction you are doing something wrong.

 

[Tigranes]

That's true, the amount of art assets that went into the spaceship and you actually 'do' very little in there, and there are many areas that are there just for one-shot cutscenes.

Oh, let me mention the one thing that was actually shit: the fucking rescue kids minigame. What the fuck, man? What were you thinking?

 

[J_C]

If it is success they want, they should make easy games. Otherwise they will only satisfy a few hundred people on the Codex.

Fuck I hope not.

EDIT: Here's what I don't think that people are understanding. 'Easier' adventure games require MORE content to keep the story and the gaming moving along - thus 'Easier' adventure games are MUCH more expensive to make.

Adding in more challenge to an AG gives you more bang for your buck.

The amount of animated cut scenes and story content in Act 1 of Broken Age is insane. Its enough to make my artist-brain swell a little...this SHOULD have been at least a 6 hour play experience with the amount of work they put into it. But instead, dumbing down the puzzles for easier 'casual consumption' just means you have to constantly add in more content to replace it. Puzzles are free - content is expensive.

I really think that this is one of the main reasons why the budget blew up like it did. They had content creators in BEFORE they even had a game. You can see the same thing happen in film - bring in artists and start to 'make shit', and then take the script and try to fit it into the content. That's the difference between a Pixar film and Transformers. Pixar films are planned to the hilt before they even TOUCH a computer. Transformers they started filming without even knowing who the antagonist was.

They had a rough idea for a story, and then brought in artists and said 'make up some stuff and then we'll see which ones are appealing and fit them into the story'. Imagine is those artists had a clear script to work from...the work they produced would have been highly focused, more of it would have hit the correct notes, and more of it would have been ready to turn into production ready designs.
If you are throwing away most of your preproduction you are doing something wrong.

I get what you are saying but it is not true that they had only a rough idea for the story, and brought in the artists early. We saw in the documentary, that Tim wrote most of the game, before going into full production mode. But I agree that good puzzles would lenghtened the playtime. Unfortunately most gamers who are interested in adventure games today prefer good stories to good puzzles. That's why they don't think that Brokan Age's easy puzzles are such a bad thing.

 

[felipepepe]

Yeah, you can see that in some areas, like the outside the lumberjack's house:

It's a gorgeous area that they made for the tech demo, and when they forced it into the game, there was nothing to do in it. You open the mail box, but that's it. And there are many other areas like it, with only one object to interact with, that aren't even part of a puzzle or anything.

 

[Infinitron]

Re: Too much art, they actually did that in Monkey Island 2! Governor Phatt's mansion:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FDqa6Pg7JGQ

Four songs, three backgrounds, one minor puzzle. Gotta love MI2's high budget!

I remember thinking even as a kid that place was a bit weird.

 

[J_C]

Yeah, you can see that in some areas, like the outside the lumberjack's house:

It's a gorgeous area that they made for the tech demo, and when they forced it into the game, there was nothing to do in it. You open the mail box, but that's it. And there are many other areas like it, with only one object to interact with, that aren't even part of a puzzle or anything.

Well they had a limited budget.

 

[Pyke]

I get what you are saying but it is not true that they had only a rough idea for the story, and brought in the artists early. We saw in the documentary, that Tim wrote most of the game, before going into full production mode. But I agree that good puzzles would lenghtened the playtime. Unfortunately most gamers who are interested in adventure games today prefer good stories to good puzzles. That's why they don't think that Brokan Age's easy puzzles are such a bad thing.

Maybe we took what was happening in the documentary differently but from what I saw he hadn't even written 'Boys World' yet when they had their 'art jam'. In fact they read a massive list of location ideas off (including some from the backers) to get the artists 'inspired'. "

In the very next episode they begin to talk about financial issues, and only in the episode after that " full-scale puzzle design begins in earnest. "

So from 08/08/12 to 10/26/12 (going from release dates) almost 3 months went by from having preproduction artwork to STARTING on puzzle design. That means that most of the game was clearly NOT written when the artists came in. The design document should have been complete before the artists came in. There are quite a few more instances where they reference that the game design is still not complete.

Unfortunately most gamers who are interested in adventure games today prefer good stories to good puzzles.

Is there a reason that those 2 things are mutually exclusive? Surely you can have a game with good stories AND good puzzles? If other genre's can do it, why not Adventure Games? Half Life is both an exceptional FPS AND an amazing story. Halo is a really fun shooter AND has one of the most fleshed out worlds in SciFi history. Bioshock is an amazingly fun FPS and has world building and a story that would make Jules Verne proud.

Puzzles arent in an AG to 'lengthen playtime', they are there to augment the story and get you invested in the characters. Saying that an Adventure Game needs either good stories or good puzzles is cheap and a cop out.

 

[Spectacle]

Re: Too much art, they actually did that in Monkey Island 2! Governor Phatt's mansion:

Four songs, three backgrounds, one minor puzzle. Gotta love MI2's high budget!

I remember thinking even as a kid that place was a bit weird.

Yeah, but that was LucasArts at the peak of their success, they actually had the budget for stuff like that.

 

[felipepepe]

Steam mods just locked my topic on Broken Age. What a joke.

 

[Boleskine]

Steam mods just locked my topic on Broken Age. What a joke.

Don't worry - your topic at the Double Fine forums is still open.

http://www.doublefine.com/forums/viewthread/12416/

 

[Infinitron]

Steam mods just locked my topic on Broken Age. What a joke.

Double Fine mods. They have jurisdiction in their game's forum.

 

[Infinitron]

Holy crap, that AuldWolf guy...I'm laughing my ass off here!! http://steamcommunity.com/app/232790/discussions/0/648817377370106786/#p15

 

[Yaar Podshipnik]

felipepepe, you hit the spot. That's not the oldschool game we were promised. It would be a perfect $5 play store title, to click through while in the tube. There's more gameplay in alpha of spacebase df-9

 

[J_C]

All that shit talk about Tim braking a promise and lying to the backers is retarded and not true. Good riddance for closing Felipe's shitty topic. I don't know which is more idiotic. Bashing Double Fine and calling the game a child's play which is for Tim's daughter, or defending the game as being a masterpiece.

 

[J_C]

Steam mods just locked my topic on Broken Age. What a joke.

Don't worry - your topic at the Double Fine forums is still open.

http://www.doublefine.com/forums/viewthread/12416/

Felipepe going circles over the whole internet, and moaning in every possible place.

 

[Infinitron]

felipepepe Now you see for whom we need the fanboy tag

 

[DeepOcean]

We should start ignoring J_C, he thinks that annoying contrary opinions should be silenced, nothing more just than applying the same standard to him.

 

[J_C]

felipepepe Now you see for whom we need the fanboy tag

And I will wear it proudly. Just please give me a Double Fine and an Obsidian one as well.

 

[jfrisby]

Steam mods just locked my topic on Broken Age. What a joke.

Wait until just before the non-backer release, start a new topic. Maybe leave the daughter out this time. At least the subject of puzzles has been brought up in most reviews.

 

[Skunkpew]

In fear of getting the wrath of this forum, I found Broken Age to be great for what it was: i.e. the first 15% of a real classic adventure game. It's the first 15% of a proper game where the player is still getting involved in the atmosphere and tone of the story. It's the first 15% before the player actually delves into the heart and meat of the glorious game. The puzzles maybe should be easier at the very start, because the game still needs to draw the player into the world.

If Broken Age were compared to other games, it's overall length is akin to getting through the Petrified Forest in Grim Fandago; successfully leaving the wizard's house for the first time in Kings Quest 3; or escaping from the garbage freighter in Space Quest 3. Imagine if every classic adventure game ended at such an early point. None of them would be remarkable, except for the seedling of an idea that could've been so much more. Thus is Broken Age.

The unfortunate thing is that this 15% 'opening scene' is all that Broken Age has to offer. And when the next part comes out, it will certainly cut right to the end, and will still not deliver any heart or substance that makes a player feel rewarded for having completed the game. This is why I dislike episodic games, because they consistenly eliminate the actual core section of the game, giving you only an opening and closing.

I'm not the one butthurt here.

The ironic thing is how my thread about how the game is a disappointment is the largest and most popular on Broken Age's steam page, thanks to retarded fanboys posting every 5 seconds trying to invalidate my views. I find fitting that a lot of them follow J_C's trope of "No one ever enjoyed hard puzzles that got you stuck!!!!".

There's nothing more pathetic and disingenuous than people who suck at adventure games, who have never completed real adventure games, and indeed people who hate what real adventure games actually were--telling you what adventure games should be, and telling you that you're wrong for enjoying the things that made adventure games fantastic.