Bros, New Vegas is painful

[Edward_R_Murrow]

So, yeah, I've been playing a bit of Fallout: New Faggot lately, because Gamefly decides that sending something from the bottom of my queue is a better idea than sending the game I've been awaiting for 2 months. Both even had the same listed availability/chance-to-ship. Whatever. Can't sweat the small stuff too much, I guess.

It's a conflicted experience. There's a lot of good in this game, and it does some great things.

-It's nice to see a Fallout game that finally bears resemblance to the first two, even if it draws a lot more from Fallout 2 than I'd like. The old factions are more correct to the setting (the Brotherhood are mostly xenophobes hiding in a bunker again), and most of the new factions are done well enough, with one glaring exception.

-This game does a stupendous job when it comes to peppering in stat and skill checks. There are a ton of them, spread across the skills and stats, and in many dialogues throughout the game so far. I'd say it does a better job on this than any other game I've played to date. Put it this way, I've wished I had a lot more points in Barter on more than one occasion. There are choices galore too, most quests having at least two options, some having more. The faction system is pretty nice too, if a little prone to exploitation, and a little too gamey at times.

-Quest design is very spotty. Some are excellent, like the interrogation of a prisoner, which consists of a lot more than just picking the [WIN]-tagged dialogue line. Unfortunately, too many quests devolve into "go here; kill/take this", with maybe a Speech/Barter/Intelligence check to avoid a fight or save some caps. Too many revolve around combat and exploring the wilderness or dungeons, which is to say any quests that do this in the Fallout 3 engine are a amount in excess. Still, the game does pretty well overall.

But the rest isn't so great, dragging the game down a lot

-The gameworld is a bit too fake with a side order of themepark feeling. Some things just don't make a whole lot of sense. Why do bone-nosed chem addicts have access to nice energy weapons? I know it's for gameplay progression reasons, but it's still retarded. The biggest thing here is Caesar's Legion. I can stomach the Roman Empire motif, even down to the costumes...it's pretty dumb, but I'm willing to roll with most things...except how these guys are a threat. Most seem to use swords. They should be massacred by the NCR, except they aren't because they have "numbers" or some bullshit. They could be an interesting tribal/raider faction, but really shouldn't have gotten the promotion to the Brotherhood's position as a credible threat to the NCR.

-The combat of the game is absolute shit, probably because Fallout 3 was absolute shit in this department too. Combat is a fucking travesty, with some of the worst gunplay I've had the displeasure of experiencing. In Fallout 3 I stuck mostly to the Small Guns like shotguns, magnums, repeaters etc. They didn't feel great, but they weren't the awful mess that big guns and energy weapons have been. In addition to having some disgusting models (look at those boxy laser weapons) the energy weapons feel more like laser tag than weapons of war, having very little feel at all. Enemies are the same idiocy as all Bethesda games, being utterly defeated by things like jumping atop a small rock if they are melee combatants, and showcasing moronic behavior at range. Standing still while firing (poorly) is still their main tactic.

-Exploration seems better than Fallout 3 so far, in that it isn't a shit-fest of copy-paste dungeons with level-scaled enemies dotting the landscape, waiting for an autistic hero to clean out every one of them and catalogue just how many fucking burnt-out pre-war books (and other assorted useless shit) are in each one. It still seems like most of what I've found off the beaten path, going of the roads, has been nothing but combat heavy stuff. More interesting combat stuff, like fighting ghoulified NCR troopers in a town hit by a dirty bomb, but still combat stuff, and still quite shitty.


So Bros, I'm at a crossroads. This game has a lot of good, but a lot of shit too. I really want to have fun with a new Fallout game, but I don't know if the rest of New Vegas is more good stuff or shit.

I'm at Vegas now, kicking around the outside, doing quests for the NCR, the Caravan, and the Brotherhood. Most of the quests I have on my plate now seem shitty...should I keep going with this game? Have I gotten most of the good stuff, or is the best yet to come? And how would I best procede in a way to avoid the seemingly high amount of shit-content?

 

[Wyrmlord]

Interesting - so making the game more Fallout-ish in feel did not necessarilly mean making it a better game.

Long before I played Fallout (I am a latecomer), I asked people in another forum what their concerns about Bethesda making Fallout 3 were. And one said, "Bethesda will make a PG-13 game which is not as mature or adult in content." I told him that was a pretty trivial comment, given that he could at least worry whether or not the game is fun.

I was lectured by the entire forum that "presentation", "feel", or "atmosphere" are always more important in games and always make up for bad or mediocre gameplay. They told me Fallout's selling point was the sex, drugs, and violence, and without it, it would no longer be Fallout. Hence, they felt Bethesda would be bad.

Now that they have finally got a game that gets the feel right, but has mediocre gameplay, what do they think?

 

[Tycn]

Interesting - so making the game more Fallout-ish in feel did not necessarilly mean making it a better game.

Bullshit. It is a much better game regardless of whether you consider it to be any good.

 

[Oriebam]

What makes the combat worse than Fallout 3? It might be the fact that the game actually runs smoothly now on my computer, but combat now is much better, it doesn't annoy me. Start using Guns(small arms) and try to play in a way that doesn't make the AI bother you, I guess.

About skill checks I didn't play FNV very much yet(for now at least, I have been playing some other shit and don't play this one for long sessions) but so far(I got to a place with some old woman where you get to hear one ED-E log and have boone in the party) but it doesn't seem to have that many. They sure try hard to make bartering useful though.

I didn't have some points for the sake of avoiding any potential spoilers, so there's a chance something I said won't make sense, this is likely my excuse

 

[Jaesun]

Imagine New Vegas in the Fallout 2 Engine....

It would be the 2nd best Fallout game, instead of trapped within the fucking shit Fallout 3 engine...

 

[Zarniwoop]

It's a great game, despite the Bethesda-ness.

The combat is a bit retarded, yes. Energy weapons are almost useless, except for the Gauss Rifle, whereas the various types of Power Fists are stupidly overpowered. 2-3 Hits from one can kill you even with power armor (which is also far less effective) on.

Although for me the worst thing isn't the combat, it's the way they fucked around with the canon again. Like the OP says, Caesar's Legion just being retconned in as a major threat is a bit retarded. Then there's the NCR itself. In Fallout 2 they all have Bazors and blow the crap out of everyone, while in NV they have weak-ass pea-shooters. In Dead Money (which is a really good add-on IMO), they mention cars being "gas guzzlers" in some of the Sierra Madre's logs. WTF?? In Fallout 2 it's widely known that the cars ran on Micro Fusion Cells before the war.

The point is, yes there are flaws, but overall it's much closer to the Fallout atmosphere than that piece of shit "Fallout" 3 was. For me, the game gets better the farther you go, the beginning is a bit slow. Kind of like... Fallout. And there are LOTS of places to explore on the world map. Also, Dead Money is awesome, but be prepared for a struggle to survive, depending on your skills. It's quite different from the rest of the game. Definitely worth the $2 (I think) I paid for it on the Steam Summer Sale.

edit: The part with the ghoulified NCR (Torchlight I think) doesn't need to involve much combat, you can just hack the turrets to blow the crap out of them and explore the town, etc. Can't remember if there's a lot of stuff to find though, more just backstory about the war.

 

[Konjad]

It's a good game. Combat isn't good, but the atmosphere similar to Fallout, pretty good dialogues and quests make this game awesome.

 

[hakuroshi]

Exploration for exploration sake is pointless in New Vegas as you'll visit pretty much every place just doing quests and maybe following some info leads. There are very few rewards worth the time.

Breesing through the storyline while picking every side quest may be a good approach to enjoying the game.

 

[Vaarna_Aarne]

It's a good game. Combat isn't good, but the atmosphere similar to Fallout, pretty good dialogues and quests make this game awesome.

Which is pretty much the case with the first two, since Fallout 1 & 2 also lacked good combat.

 

[Konjad]

It's a good game. Combat isn't good, but the atmosphere similar to Fallout, pretty good dialogues and quests make this game awesome.

Which is pretty much the case with the first two, since Fallout 1 & 2 also lacked good combat.

First fallouts had a great combat, but just to some point. About the half way through it becomes shit, because you just start attacking the eyes with 95% of success.

 

[Azrael the cat]

It's a great game, despite the Bethesda-ness.

The combat is a bit retarded, yes. Energy weapons are almost useless, except for the Gauss Rifle, whereas the various types of Power Fists are stupidly overpowered. 2-3 Hits from one can kill you even with power armor (which is also far less effective) on.

Although for me the worst thing isn't the combat, it's the way they fucked around with the canon again. Like the OP says, Caesar's Legion just being retconned in as a major threat is a bit retarded. Then there's the NCR itself. In Fallout 2 they all have Bazors and blow the crap out of everyone, while in NV they have weak-ass pea-shooters. In Dead Money (which is a really good add-on IMO), they mention cars being "gas guzzlers" in some of the Sierra Madre's logs. WTF?? In Fallout 2 it's widely known that the cars ran on Micro Fusion Cells before the war.

The point is, yes there are flaws, but overall it's much closer to the Fallout atmosphere than that piece of shit "Fallout" 3 was. For me, the game gets better the farther you go, the beginning is a bit slow. Kind of like... Fallout. And there are LOTS of places to explore on the world map. Also, Dead Money is awesome, but be prepared for a struggle to survive, depending on your skills. It's quite different from the rest of the game. Definitely worth the $2 (I think) I paid for it on the Steam Summer Sale.

edit: The part with the ghoulified NCR (Torchlight I think) doesn't need to involve much combat, you can just hack the turrets to blow the crap out of them and explore the town, etc. Can't remember if there's a lot of stuff to find though, more just backstory about the war.

About half the game's plot and lore centres around how/why NCR has degenerated from the strength it had in FO2:
- firstly, some folks mention that NCR is STILL much stronger, and more modern, in the area where it started, and that the New Vegas region is something of a wild frontier - Caesar's Legion aren't the only opposing army NCR faces, just the main one in this part of the Republic, and one which happens to be dangerously close to taking a crucial piece of infrastructure.
- NCR is at an all-time weakpoint during NV, due to being bled dry by the efforts needed to push back the Legion from Hoover's Dam.
- also (and this is the main issue the game focuses on), simply overexpanding and occupying New Vegas has caused the NCR to decay internally. Vegas (and New Reno, as at least one NPC mentions) has corrupted the NCR culture, causing a former 'picket fences and green lawns' state to become economically centred around gambling, drugs and corruption.

Given that, the weaker weapons at the start of the game make some sense.

Also, try playing the game past the first few story points. The main NPC progression in NV isn't level-scaled but story-scaled, which I consider a massive incline. The sophistication of the weaponry packed by both NCR and Caesar's Legion increases dramatically as the main quest is progressed. In terms of 'internal lore logic' the idea is that at the start of the game the NCR's internal bureaucratic inefficiency is such that they can't actually get their weaponry out to the troops in an efficient manner. As the main quest progresses, the region moves closer to fullscale battle and both sides start deploying their heavier arms.

That's why in the early parts of the main quest, NCR squads will have all the same mid-strength assault rifle, with maybe one stronger rifle on the commanding officer, and Legion squads will all have swords or axes (apart from Legion Assassins, who always carry guns). Later on, NCR squads will have a full mix of miniguns, assault rifles, snipers and grenades, and Legion squads will have more firerams units as well as chainsaws and better armour.

Even so, yes it's blatantly silly to have chainsaws and power fists combatting gun-toting NCR troops. But that's always been part of FO. It was equally silly having viable melee and unarmed builds in FO1. Given that you''re playing a game series where unarmed and melee have always been viable (sometimes overpowered) builds, it does make sense to at least have that reflected in the game world.

 

[Shannow]

I see the game quite similar as Edward. I played perhaps another 10-15 hours after entering Vegas. So I'll answer your question:
The main-quest picks up in Vegas, the side quests get worse, with (pointless) running back and forth. As you level up, you'll probably become so powerful, that nothing short of packs of deathclaws will pose any challenge (since I went melee, they might not even be a danger to a ranged build).
If you're not having much fun now, you'll probably have even less as you progress.
What you can expect:
Some more interesting locations/quests.
More drudgery/ever worsening gameplay (and in my case more bugs and crashes).

 

[Lyric Suite]

Imagine New Vegas in the Fallout 2 Engine....

In a perfect world, somebody would probably already be working on this.

 

[FatCat]

Imagine New Vegas in the Fallout 2 Engine....

In a perfect world, somebody would probably already be working on this.

Doubtfully 99% of people outside of the Codex , most likely would prefer gamebryo over fallout engine.
Such a grandiose project for a lil bunch of people is waste of time.

 

[Zarniwoop]

It's a great game, despite the Bethesda-ness.

The combat is a bit retarded, yes. Energy weapons are almost useless, except for the Gauss Rifle, whereas the various types of Power Fists are stupidly overpowered. 2-3 Hits from one can kill you even with power armor (which is also far less effective) on.

Although for me the worst thing isn't the combat, it's the way they fucked around with the canon again. Like the OP says, Caesar's Legion just being retconned in as a major threat is a bit retarded. Then there's the NCR itself. In Fallout 2 they all have Bazors and blow the crap out of everyone, while in NV they have weak-ass pea-shooters. In Dead Money (which is a really good add-on IMO), they mention cars being "gas guzzlers" in some of the Sierra Madre's logs. WTF?? In Fallout 2 it's widely known that the cars ran on Micro Fusion Cells before the war.

The point is, yes there are flaws, but overall it's much closer to the Fallout atmosphere than that piece of shit "Fallout" 3 was. For me, the game gets better the farther you go, the beginning is a bit slow. Kind of like... Fallout. And there are LOTS of places to explore on the world map. Also, Dead Money is awesome, but be prepared for a struggle to survive, depending on your skills. It's quite different from the rest of the game. Definitely worth the $2 (I think) I paid for it on the Steam Summer Sale.

edit: The part with the ghoulified NCR (Torchlight I think) doesn't need to involve much combat, you can just hack the turrets to blow the crap out of them and explore the town, etc. Can't remember if there's a lot of stuff to find though, more just backstory about the war.

About half the game's plot and lore centres around how/why NCR has degenerated from the strength it had in FO2:
- firstly, some folks mention that NCR is STILL much stronger, and more modern, in the area where it started, and that the New Vegas region is something of a wild frontier - Caesar's Legion aren't the only opposing army NCR faces, just the main one in this part of the Republic, and one which happens to be dangerously close to taking a crucial piece of infrastructure.
- NCR is at an all-time weakpoint during NV, due to being bled dry by the efforts needed to push back the Legion from Hoover's Dam.
- also (and this is the main issue the game focuses on), simply overexpanding and occupying New Vegas has caused the NCR to decay internally. Vegas (and New Reno, as at least one NPC mentions) has corrupted the NCR culture, causing a former 'picket fences and green lawns' state to become economically centred around gambling, drugs and corruption.

Given that, the weaker weapons at the start of the game make some sense.

Also, try playing the game past the first few story points. The main NPC progression in NV isn't level-scaled but story-scaled, which I consider a massive incline. The sophistication of the weaponry packed by both NCR and Caesar's Legion increases dramatically as the main quest is progressed. In terms of 'internal lore logic' the idea is that at the start of the game the NCR's internal bureaucratic inefficiency is such that they can't actually get their weaponry out to the troops in an efficient manner. As the main quest progresses, the region moves closer to fullscale battle and both sides start deploying their heavier arms.

That's why in the early parts of the main quest, NCR squads will have all the same mid-strength assault rifle, with maybe one stronger rifle on the commanding officer, and Legion squads will all have swords or axes (apart from Legion Assassins, who always carry guns). Later on, NCR squads will have a full mix of miniguns, assault rifles, snipers and grenades, and Legion squads will have more firerams units as well as chainsaws and better armour.

Even so, yes it's blatantly silly to have chainsaws and power fists combatting gun-toting NCR troops. But that's always been part of FO. It was equally silly having viable melee and unarmed builds in FO1. Given that you''re playing a game series where unarmed and melee have always been viable (sometimes overpowered) builds, it does make sense to at least have that reflected in the game world.

Ok, this makes sense. I've only done one playthrough and to be honest I didn't deal with the NCR that much outside what's required by the main quest, so I might have missed a lot of that backstory. I got into the strip much sooner than planned (I think) by using l33t h4xx0r skills on the Securitrons to let me in and then dealt with the casinos etc. on my own.

The weapons definitely change as you progress, by the time I got to the Legate's camp, I was level 22 and 90-100% of them had ballistic fists, and seriously messed my shit up. Companions died almost instantly if I took them with, even though Boone had power armor on. It was pretty funny actually, having a line of about 10 guys at a time running behind me with that k-tssh sound. I just dropped a couple of mines in a line and got them to follow me. It was a complete suicide mission to try and take them on with guns.

Still doesn't explain the shitty energy weapons, although that probably just carried over from Fallout 3.

 

[Redshirt #42]

Fallout: New Vegas was a huge disappointment for me. Probably because I've never played Fallout 3, so I had no idea how horrible the engine is. Lots of bugs, glitches and unbearable visuals. I never judge games based on graphics but they are just horrendous in this game. I stopped playing because every time I loaded my last save, where I was stuck in Freeside, I simply couldn't walk past all the NPCs without pulling my gun out and shooting them in their faces. And what's even worse, if I wanted to, I could easily get away with it. You have to try so fucking hard to get repercussions for being an asshole. The combat system is simply bad. Melee is surprisingly powerful in real-time. All you need to do is mashing the same buttan over and over again. I could take out the Caesar's Legion troops and their furry leader in Nipton solo, on level 5, with a shitty meat cleaver. Shooting feels unnatural and underpowered. There's also a shit tonne of ranged weapons everywhere. In the original Fallouts, having a gun meant something. Also, the VATS system is pants on head retarded. The enemy is almost in melee range and I have a 95% chance to hit his head. So I shoot at it at least six times and none of the shots seem to hit. Either that or they dealt 0 damage, it's p. hard to tell since the game doesn't even fucking tell you. Fortunately, combat is no longer a problem the moment you get a companion, who usually kills everything before I can pull off a single shot. I couldn't find a single interesting character in the game. The factions are boring and predictable. Apparently, you don't have to join any of them, but even then you have to fight for an "independent" New Vegas or something. Why do I have to care about that shit-hole? The choices and consequences aren't very good either. There's always a "best" choice to solve everything.

It definitely isn't the best Obsidian game ever, certainly the most overhyped though.

 

[thursdayschild]

Yeah the legion seems awfully stupid, always has. It's a potentially good idea but should not be taken so literally. The great movie Titus Andronicus should have been the cue here - Saturnine talking to SPQR radio while flanked by motorcycle cops with machine guns was just an awesome scene and somehow fit in well with the original speech.

I haven't even played new vegas but I can't fucking stand seeing the movies or let's plays people make. Aside from the combat it just seems not good, whereas Fallout 3 at least seems amusing, almost so bad it's good.

Then you loot at the combat and heads just falling off for no reason. Wow. I'm the last human in a world where apes evolved from men, my final doubts are removed.

 

[thursdayschild]

It's a great game, despite the Bethesda-ness.

The combat is a bit retarded, yes. Energy weapons are almost useless, except for the Gauss Rifle, whereas the various types of Power Fists are stupidly overpowered. 2-3 Hits from one can kill you even with power armor (which is also far less effective) on.

Although for me the worst thing isn't the combat, it's the way they fucked around with the canon again. Like the OP says, Caesar's Legion just being retconned in as a major threat is a bit retarded. Then there's the NCR itself. In Fallout 2 they all have Bazors and blow the crap out of everyone, while in NV they have weak-ass pea-shooters. In Dead Money (which is a really good add-on IMO), they mention cars being "gas guzzlers" in some of the Sierra Madre's logs. WTF?? In Fallout 2 it's widely known that the cars ran on Micro Fusion Cells before the war.

The point is, yes there are flaws, but overall it's much closer to the Fallout atmosphere than that piece of shit "Fallout" 3 was. For me, the game gets better the farther you go, the beginning is a bit slow. Kind of like... Fallout. And there are LOTS of places to explore on the world map. Also, Dead Money is awesome, but be prepared for a struggle to survive, depending on your skills. It's quite different from the rest of the game. Definitely worth the $2 (I think) I paid for it on the Steam Summer Sale.

edit: The part with the ghoulified NCR (Torchlight I think) doesn't need to involve much combat, you can just hack the turrets to blow the crap out of them and explore the town, etc. Can't remember if there's a lot of stuff to find though, more just backstory about the war.

About half the game's plot and lore centres around how/why NCR has degenerated from the strength it had in FO2:
- firstly, some folks mention that NCR is STILL much stronger, and more modern, in the area where it started, and that the New Vegas region is something of a wild frontier - Caesar's Legion aren't the only opposing army NCR faces, just the main one in this part of the Republic, and one which happens to be dangerously close to taking a crucial piece of infrastructure.
- NCR is at an all-time weakpoint during NV, due to being bled dry by the efforts needed to push back the Legion from Hoover's Dam.
- also (and this is the main issue the game focuses on), simply overexpanding and occupying New Vegas has caused the NCR to decay internally. Vegas (and New Reno, as at least one NPC mentions) has corrupted the NCR culture, causing a former 'picket fences and green lawns' state to become economically centred around gambling, drugs and corruption.

Given that, the weaker weapons at the start of the game make some sense.

Also, try playing the game past the first few story points. The main NPC progression in NV isn't level-scaled but story-scaled, which I consider a massive incline. The sophistication of the weaponry packed by both NCR and Caesar's Legion increases dramatically as the main quest is progressed. In terms of 'internal lore logic' the idea is that at the start of the game the NCR's internal bureaucratic inefficiency is such that they can't actually get their weaponry out to the troops in an efficient manner. As the main quest progresses, the region moves closer to fullscale battle and both sides start deploying their heavier arms.

That's why in the early parts of the main quest, NCR squads will have all the same mid-strength assault rifle, with maybe one stronger rifle on the commanding officer, and Legion squads will all have swords or axes (apart from Legion Assassins, who always carry guns). Later on, NCR squads will have a full mix of miniguns, assault rifles, snipers and grenades, and Legion squads will have more firerams units as well as chainsaws and better armour.

Even so, yes it's blatantly silly to have chainsaws and power fists combatting gun-toting NCR troops. But that's always been part of FO. It was equally silly having viable melee and unarmed builds in FO1. Given that you''re playing a game series where unarmed and melee have always been viable (sometimes overpowered) builds, it does make sense to at least have that reflected in the game world.

And the fact you can't say that in one sentence exposes it for the shitty writing it is.

 

[Azrael the cat]

It's a great game, despite the Bethesda-ness.

The combat is a bit retarded, yes. Energy weapons are almost useless, except for the Gauss Rifle, whereas the various types of Power Fists are stupidly overpowered. 2-3 Hits from one can kill you even with power armor (which is also far less effective) on.

Although for me the worst thing isn't the combat, it's the way they fucked around with the canon again. Like the OP says, Caesar's Legion just being retconned in as a major threat is a bit retarded. Then there's the NCR itself. In Fallout 2 they all have Bazors and blow the crap out of everyone, while in NV they have weak-ass pea-shooters. In Dead Money (which is a really good add-on IMO), they mention cars being "gas guzzlers" in some of the Sierra Madre's logs. WTF?? In Fallout 2 it's widely known that the cars ran on Micro Fusion Cells before the war.

The point is, yes there are flaws, but overall it's much closer to the Fallout atmosphere than that piece of shit "Fallout" 3 was. For me, the game gets better the farther you go, the beginning is a bit slow. Kind of like... Fallout. And there are LOTS of places to explore on the world map. Also, Dead Money is awesome, but be prepared for a struggle to survive, depending on your skills. It's quite different from the rest of the game. Definitely worth the $2 (I think) I paid for it on the Steam Summer Sale.

edit: The part with the ghoulified NCR (Torchlight I think) doesn't need to involve much combat, you can just hack the turrets to blow the crap out of them and explore the town, etc. Can't remember if there's a lot of stuff to find though, more just backstory about the war.

About half the game's plot and lore centres around how/why NCR has degenerated from the strength it had in FO2:
- firstly, some folks mention that NCR is STILL much stronger, and more modern, in the area where it started, and that the New Vegas region is something of a wild frontier - Caesar's Legion aren't the only opposing army NCR faces, just the main one in this part of the Republic, and one which happens to be dangerously close to taking a crucial piece of infrastructure.
- NCR is at an all-time weakpoint during NV, due to being bled dry by the efforts needed to push back the Legion from Hoover's Dam.
- also (and this is the main issue the game focuses on), simply overexpanding and occupying New Vegas has caused the NCR to decay internally. Vegas (and New Reno, as at least one NPC mentions) has corrupted the NCR culture, causing a former 'picket fences and green lawns' state to become economically centred around gambling, drugs and corruption.

Given that, the weaker weapons at the start of the game make some sense.

Also, try playing the game past the first few story points. The main NPC progression in NV isn't level-scaled but story-scaled, which I consider a massive incline. The sophistication of the weaponry packed by both NCR and Caesar's Legion increases dramatically as the main quest is progressed. In terms of 'internal lore logic' the idea is that at the start of the game the NCR's internal bureaucratic inefficiency is such that they can't actually get their weaponry out to the troops in an efficient manner. As the main quest progresses, the region moves closer to fullscale battle and both sides start deploying their heavier arms.

That's why in the early parts of the main quest, NCR squads will have all the same mid-strength assault rifle, with maybe one stronger rifle on the commanding officer, and Legion squads will all have swords or axes (apart from Legion Assassins, who always carry guns). Later on, NCR squads will have a full mix of miniguns, assault rifles, snipers and grenades, and Legion squads will have more firerams units as well as chainsaws and better armour.

Even so, yes it's blatantly silly to have chainsaws and power fists combatting gun-toting NCR troops. But that's always been part of FO. It was equally silly having viable melee and unarmed builds in FO1. Given that you''re playing a game series where unarmed and melee have always been viable (sometimes overpowered) builds, it does make sense to at least have that reflected in the game world.

And the fact you can't say that in one sentence exposes it for the shitty writing it is.

(a) Since when have I communicated anything in one sentence? (seriously, my inability to explain things concisely plagues my writing at work, not just my Codex posts).

(b) I can imagine quite a few reasons why someone might dislike the idea of having NPC equipment scale depending on where you are in the main quest (as opposed to level-scaling). But surely the complexity of the system isn't one of them - not in these parts of the internet, anyway. Since when did we start insisting that game mechanics have to be explainable in one sentence, so that illiterate kiddies can understand them? Can't wait to see you attempt to play JA2 or Wizardry 4-8 if New Vegas is too complex for you!

(again, I can certainly appreciate that folks may have good reasons for not liking story-scaling of equipment, or that they may not like the way in which it is tied into the game's lore and plot. It's just the 'oh my god it's too complex to be explained in one sentence' that baffles me as a complaint.)

 

[Twinkle]

I'm at Vegas now, kicking around the outside, doing quests for the NCR, the Caravan, and the Brotherhood. Most of the quests I have on my plate now seem shitty...should I keep going with this game? Have I gotten most of the good stuff, or is the best yet to come? And how would I best procede in a way to avoid the seemingly high amount of shit-content?

Have you discovered a mole in McCarran or uncovered the secrets of White Glove Society? It's pretty much the best I can think about this game in terms of questing. Oh, and Vault 11, in terms of atmosphere. Other than that, I doubt your gameplay experience will change much as you plough towards the finale.

 

[Clockwork Knight]

Since you're already in Vegas and still not sure whether to keep playing or not, just keep going. If after a while you cant take it anymore and think it's shit, you'll be able to say it with pride instead of forever relying on "some guy on the internet told me it was shit".

 

[ImmoralMechanic]

They lacked any particular depth and there was no real justification to siding with them outside of the odd reference to having wiped out the raiders and protected caravans in their lands. The NCR are - at worst - depicted as bullying, negligent and corrupt, whereas Caesar's Legion are remorseless monsters.

I thought the reason for siding with Caesars Legion was if you (or your character) think that authoritarian/militaristic social structures get stuff done. Especially when everything has gone to shit. 207 years of the Pax Romana and all that.

Sure some people suffer, but hey, politics is the art of the possible.

Or is that just me?

 

[Vaarna_Aarne]

The implication was that the Legion is held together only by the Caesar, and that without him as the Fuhrer figure the whole thing will collapse.

 

[Lee_Stavros]

Imagine New Vegas in the Fallout 2 Engine....

It would be the 2nd best Fallout game, instead of trapped within the fucking shit Fallout 3 engine...

No it wouldn't!
What made Fallout fantastic was the setting, choices and consequences, multiple quest outcomes.
Not that the music didn't contribute aswell.
The Fallout engine was never that great to begin with.

Nostialgia is overrated!
By todays standards, NV is better than the original.

 

[saenz]

About half the game's plot and lore centres around how/why NCR has degenerated from the strength it had in FO2:
- firstly, some folks mention that NCR is STILL much stronger, and more modern, in the area where it started, and that the New Vegas region is something of a wild frontier - Caesar's Legion aren't the only opposing army NCR faces, just the main one in this part of the Republic, and one which happens to be dangerously close to taking a crucial piece of infrastructure.
- NCR is at an all-time weakpoint during NV, due to being bled dry by the efforts needed to push back the Legion from Hoover's Dam.

Azrael did a good summary, but for me the real eye-opener was the end of the "Return to Sender" quest when you talk to Chief Hanlon. It was unexpectedly brilliant.

Spoiler

When you confront him about why he's been sabotaging the NCR war effort, he explains that the whole New Vegas campaign is one massive desert quagmire for the NCR, and losing now (rather than later) was the lesser evil.

The "cattle barons" are sending out "young kid" draftees to die in the desert. The best troops are being held back in California to tend to the interests of the rich. Also, president and senate don't want to pump the required resources into New Vegas because it would affect them in elections, because nobody in California really cares about the war. As a result, even if they do hold Hoover Dam, they'll never get the resources or authorization to go on an offensive to truly end the threat posed by the Legion. "So we'll just be sending more kids to die, what, for another five, ten years?" Even then, the people in New Vegas really don't even want the NCR there, and only begrudgingly accept them for security. Those that do accept them, are mocked as traitors and cowards (see Primm.)

Given how well this theme is reflected throughout all your interactions with the NCR, I'm surprised they had to balls to so thoroughly push a thinly veiled metaphor for the US involvement in Iraq/Afghanistan.

EDIT: Now with video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TdUCQRAHnfw

 

[ImmoralMechanic]

I thought the reason for siding with Caesars Legion was if you (or your character) think that authoritarian/militaristic social structures get stuff done. Especially when everything has gone to shit. 207 years of the Pax Romana and all that.

Sure some people suffer, but hey, politics is the art of the possible.

I get that this was meant to be the point, but if anything the game implies exactly the opposite about the Legion's stability.

Well, there's effectiveness, and there's future stability.

If the narrative you get from Caesar, and the hints from elsewhere, is all true, then CL is working as intended. They couldn't hold all that territory and provision their army and not be crippled by insurrections unless they were doing something right.

But I agree that once you finally meet Caesar, the future of the outfit doesn't look too bright. None of the lieutenants and probable successors seem to have Caesar's education or understanding of why they are doing wtf they are doing.

This is an obvious opening for the PC to step in, but I don't remember that being there.

 

[Clockwork Knight]

I thought Lanius was supposed to be very capable leader, even if way more violent.