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CD Projekt tackles The Witcher 3 downgrade issue head on - eurogamer article

Perkel

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whole article

Why did the graphics change?

"If you're looking at the development process," Iwinski begins, "we do a certain build for a tradeshow and you pack it, it works, it looks amazing. And you are extremely far away from completing the game. Then you put it in the open-world, regardless of the platform, and it's like 'oh shit, it doesn't really work'. We've already showed it, now we have to make it work. And then we try to make it work on a huge scale. This is the nature of games development."

It was captured PC footage, not pre-rendered, Badowski confirms, but a lot had to change. "I cannot argue - if people see changes, we cannot argue," Adam Badowski says, "but there are complex technical reasons behind it.

"Maybe it was our bad decision to change the rendering system," he mulls, "because the rendering system after VGX was changed." There were two possible rendering systems but one won out because it looked nicer across the whole world, in daytime and at night. The other would have required lots of dynamic lighting "and with such a huge world simply didn't work".

It's a similar story for environments, and their texture sizes and incidental objects. It was a trade-off between keeping that aspect of them or their unique, handmade design. And the team chose the latter. The data-streaming system couldn't handle everything while Geralt galloped around.

The billowing smoke and roaring fire from the trailer? "It's a global system and it will kill PC because transparencies - without DirectX 12 it does't work good in every game." So he killed it for the greater good, and he focused on making sure the 5000 doors in Novigrad worked instead.

"People are saying that 2013 was better but actually there's plenty of things that improved since 2013," Michal Platkow-Gilewski points out. "Size of the world, frames-per-second..."

"Yes!" realises Adam Badowski. "The game's performance: people say the game is well optimised. This is the first time for this company!" It's the first smile I've seen from him all interview.

Marcin Iwinski picks it up: "Maybe we shouldn't have shown that [trailer], I don't know, but we didn't know that it wasn't going to work, so it's not a lie or a bad will - that's why we didn't comment actively. We don't agree there is a downgrade but it's our opinion, and gamers' feeling can be different. If they made their purchasing decision based on the 2013 materials, I'm deeply sorry for that, and we are discussing how we can make it up to them because that's not fair.

"It's very important to stress: we are continuously working on the PC version, and we will be adding a lot of stuff, and there is more to come. We've proven it in the past that we support our games and we will be looking at the feedback and trying to make it better.
 

Perkel

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Read whole article.

Basically they had different type of renderer for VGX trailer and they changed it. He also confirms consoles are blame for most of that stuff. He also says that for example smoke from trailers is impossible due draw cals count and it is something that DX12 would only fix on PC.

Aside from that sent patch with almost 600 fixes ti cert and will be soon released where they will allow for more ini tweaking. Aside from that they will do something about downgrade as it eats into them and team.

Well that is CDPR for you, instead of hiding behind bushes they talk properly about it and decided to do something with it.
also lol eurogamer flew journalist to poland to talk about downgrade .......
 

Metro

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I guess admitting you lied when you get caught in a lie is now worthy of high praise.
 

Athelas

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I'm not sure how that interview is supposed to be indicative of goodwill towards gamers, though I suppose willful ignorance is still a step up from active malice.
 

WhiskeyWolf

RPG Codex Polish Car Thief
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I guess there was a MS and Sony army of lawyers standing behind CDP back and drawing straws to see who could sue first if they dared to admit the downgrade before release.
 

Perkel

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I guess admitting you lied when you get caught in a lie is now worthy of high praise.

Well it is better than nothing i guess. They could go UBI way and say deal with it. Now at least looks like they will reintroduce some of those earlier assets into game
 

prodigydancer

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Actually game is p.optimised considering other AAA+ releases excpet GTAV.
Don't tear it out of context. This AAA+ release doesn't have AAA+ graphics, it has foliage from 2007. Do you remember which CPUs and video cards were mainstream in 2007?

P.S. Also, ironically, it still runs like shit on consoles even now that it's downgraded all the way to hell.
 
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Cadmus

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hEhehe we made an area for the trailer and then we made a different game, it's because of complex technical reasons you guys heuhue
who woulda thunk?

there is no way around it, it's marketing a non-existent product, it's a false advertising or what do you call it. Like anybody gives a shit about their plight of feeling the need to show a gameplay trailer when they have no gameplay, the only benefit is for them to get more sales so fuck them. I don't know why I get so worked up about it, the game is still beautiful and my PC still can't run it.
 

Israfael

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Reminds me of this. Maybe they went bethesda or GSC (Stalker develeper) way and left some slivers of old glory hanging somewhere in the game resources.



(That dog actually exists in ESMs and you can, in prinicple, program the AI packages and make the NPCs to react in such way, at a huge cost to performance. )
 

Cyberarmy

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Actually game is p.optimised considering other AAA+ releases excpet GTAV.
Don't tear it out of context. This AAA+ release doesn't have AAA+ graphics, it has foliage from 2007. Do you remember which CPUs and video cards were mainstream in 2007?

P.S. Also, ironically, it still runs like shit on consoles even now that it's downgraded all the way to hell.

Follagefag is a new branch in graphicfag I guess. You guys should've quit playing looking at the grass.
 

Kem0sabe

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CD projekt, for all the kudos they get from the community, acted like cunts. They only admit the downgrade after the release, after milking the pre-orders, after having claimed for months that there was no downgrade.
 

Israfael

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Follagefag is a new branch in graphicfag I guess. You guys should've quit playing looking at the grass.
I didn't play W3 (yet), but seriously, grass and trees are really awful, on par with 3DMark 2001 trees and foliage from PS1.1 test. My brother, who is a Sapkowski fag and always buys CDP games, said that Oblivion looks better than this.
 
Self-Ejected

Ulminati

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Nevr forget
the-witcher-3-novigrad.jpg



Also this:
QcOH0nT.png


One of the entrances to Novigrad. Can confirm it still looks like this. Crack is slightly more visible due to SweetFX tweaks. But gras spouts from inside rock and corner asset is missing. Also, the textures ont he two sides of the tower don't line up properly now.


Grass then:
2504400-7932559264-23989.gif


Grass now:
image_the_witcher_3_wild_hunt-28293-2651_0004.jpg

Witcher-3-48.jpg


Grass in witcher 2:
2555381-8701918319-idzig.jpg


The reason people remark on the grass is tha tthey already had some really nice grass assets and swapped them for green blobs. It's baffling since there's very little extra work or texture memory being used in the old ones.
 
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Cyberarmy

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Follagefag is a new branch in graphicfag I guess. You guys should've quit playing looking at the grass.
I didn't play W3 (yet), but seriously, grass and trees are really awful, on par with 3DMark 2001 trees and foliage from PS1.1 test. My brother, who is a Sapkowski fag and always buys CDP games, said that Oblivion looks better than this.

For all I care, you guys and other graphic-whore gamers are getting what they deserve. Games being advertised for their graphics, FPS numbers and compainies fooling easy to hype customers with pre rendered screenshots, videos. Why do you guys even have faith in modern AAA+ gaming industry I don't know.

Also you brother is blind, my condolences. But at least he is not as bad as the guy saying Half Life 1 looks better than W3.
 
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Ulminati

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It's mostly funny because a lot of the codex potatoes kept insisting CDPR were the good goys. And now they've been caught lying, backtrackign and generlly showing themselves to be as big scumbags as EA/Beth/Activision
 

Israfael

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Why do you guys even have faith in modern AAA+ gaming industry I don't know.
Who said something about faith? They can't even do 'immershun' part anymore. If everything was that ACID-green and cranky like those trees no one would notice or complain - it's clear that those elements were changed mid-production. Simply put, it doesn't look organic - it screams 'i'm not of this world!'. That's what bothers many people, not exactly the graphics whores.

It's baffling since there's very little extra work or texture memory being used in the old ones.
Grass is mostly about CPU processing power since it requires a lot of calculations for shading and some rudimentary physics, iirc, and both consoles have a cpu that is akin to CASIO scientific calculator in its IPC. Also i suspect that CDPR cannot into tiled landscapes (akin to TES gems), so the load would probably be very high if the weed was not shit.
 
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Self-Ejected

Ulminati

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Grass is mostly about CPU processing power since it requires a lot of calculations for shading and some rudimentary physics, iirc, and both consoles have a cpu that is akin to CASIO scientific calculator in its IPC. Also i suspect that CDPR cannot into tiled landscapes (akin to TES gems), so the load would probably be very high if the weed was not shit.

The shading/rudementary physics are the same regardless of whether you're shading/moving a texture of grass or a texture of a green blob. The gain from switching from the pretty textures to the blurry ones is miniscule unless their engine is fuelled by potato logic.
 

Perkel

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Actually game is p.optimised considering other AAA+ releases excpet GTAV.
Don't tear it out of context. This AAA+ release doesn't have AAA+ graphics, it has foliage from 2007. Do you remember which CPUs and video cards were mainstream in 2007?

P.S. Also, ironically, it still runs like shit on consoles even now that it's downgraded all the way to hell.

It is still best looking RPG ever even with downgrades. For comparison i played DAI and that ran rather bad considering that it wasn't even open world game.
 

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