CD Projekt's Cyberpunk 2077 Update 2.0 + Phantom Liberty Expansion Thread

[Non-Edgy Gamer]

I think the game is actually more broken after all the updates. Seems slower and has more errors for me compared to release.

 

[gurugeorge]

You can see the Full Game Rebalance in this video and I highly suggest his mod list. Mods like FGR and Immersive Roleplay show that there is absolutely something worth salvaging here.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1LSlbfonhlGqt0tCg9O5ieuzTw_HHVVOs8gEJ1Q4T6mk/edit?usp=sharing

Yep, after a bit of experimentation in the past week, I settled on virtually the same modlist myself. It's good - well, actually it's the only collection of mods that does anything similar. It's the first true modding setup that improves the game as a whole.

Anybody out there who likes the setting and scenario but was disappointed by the gameplay should give this modlist a try, or at the very least install the FGR and crack open an old save to see what's what.

 

[AwesomeButton]

Right, well if you answered "they're all stoic types", you're right on the money.

I get what you mean, but I was going to answer "they're all someone's take on Batman, who is someone's take on the Man with No Name, who goes back to american folklore about the lone hero, and ultmately to the archetype of the knight-errant".

Personally, I've always felt a connection to "the cynical master thief", probably because I played the game in my teenage years and never tried to add my interpretation to his character as I played, if anything I was trying to roleplay to fit what I knew about his character.

Also, if comparing to Garrett specifically, don't overlook his expositions which reveal much about his character (I'm only talking about the first two games). He is way more developed than V. I don't know if the same can be said about JC. I don't remember anyone ever being particularly excited about JC as a character.

 

[Gargaune]

I get what you mean, but I was going to answer "they're all someone's take on Batman, who is someone's take on the Man with No Name, who goes back to american folklore about the lone hero, and ultmately to the archetype of the knight-errant".

Beats "they all speak in a gravelly tone", which is the first commonality I expect along that line of enquiry.

Also, if comparing to Garrett specifically, don't overlook his expositions which reveal much about his character (I'm only talking about the first two games). He is way more developed than V. I don't know if the same can be said about JC. I don't remember anyone ever being particularly excited about JC as a character.

And that's it, JC's not a particularly exciting character, but he's a great Player Character. He gives you that room to squeeze in behind his "too self-sufficient" facade and achieve a workable sense of identity in spite of being fully voice-acted. As for Garret, he's more of a stretch in my argument (which is why I prefaced him with "even"), but he does carry the point that the stoic character is more inviting for the player to project their own interpretations onto. In contrast to V, all heart-on-sleeve and whose behaviour can easily conflict with how the player's comfortable reading a given situation.

 

[tritosine2k]

https://www.gamesradar.com/ride-4-developers-viral-video/

<-- C2077 team sure saw this by now . Now the interesting question becomes if other weather states don't work this well (apparently not), yet this is working well, because overcast day has certain brightness/luminance profile (compressed?) that fits current crop of flatscreens better . Then next crop can do this with other weather (not to mention , the head movement stuff can be offset by other means).

In any case ,wouldn't hurt the '2077 franchise if it would be less of a "muh pampered car" thing than <insert preference> 'bike thing



...

 

[ADL]

Speaking of weather states I downloaded this weather probability rebalance mod today and in one hour of play with a couple time skips, I'm already seeing weather conditions that I never saw in my original 75 hour playthrough. Also I've already encountered three netrunners in the open world as a result of the AI Netrunners Enhanced mod. That's more netrunners than the entirety of my original playthrough where I only encountered two of them in the Maelstrom meat packing plant during the E3 playthrough quest at the start of the game with Jackie. That issue is particularly annoying because I spent a perk point on being able to see netrunners hacking into my cyberware in a game with no respec functionality and it was only used in one quest throughout the entire game. Now that perk is extremely valuable.
https://www.nexusmods.com/cyberpunk2077/mods/3196?tab=description
https://www.nexusmods.com/cyberpunk2077/mods/2468?tab=description

Something about this game is really fucked and calling it now there's one line of code that needs to be fixed and it'll fix the game Aliens Colonial Marines style.
https://archive.is/v5YNu

 

[AwesomeButton]

And that's it, JC's not a particularly exciting character, but he's a great Player Character. He gives you that room to squeeze in behind his "too self-sufficient" facade and achieve a workable sense of identity in spite of being fully voice-acted. As for Garret, he's more of a stretch in my argument (which is why I prefaced him with "even"), but he does carry the point that the stoic character is more inviting for the player to project their own interpretations onto. In contrast to V, all heart-on-sleeve and whose behaviour can easily conflict with how the player's comfortable reading a given situation.

Yeah, it's indisputable that a character who is predicated on being less emotional would serve best as a player character, as opposed to a character whose emotional response to situations the player would have to observe. This somewhat locks game writers into specific main characters and as a consequence specific plot lines that fit those main characters.

BTW, this is something I've been making fun of in Geralt's characterisation, usually in conversations I'm having with my wife, who is my main gaming buddy IRL. I was telling her, notice how traditional masculine values are taught through videogame characters - the protagonist is always as stoic as it gets. This is either as a feature of his character, or as a result of a surgical/"genetic"/"magical" intervention - Geralt "doesn't have emotions" because of the mutations, JC Denton cannot smile, because of the nanoaugmentations. Being a superhero is associated with controlling your emotions, when it comes to men. "Boys don't cry". Sometimes you have to explain these things to women.

Edit: Actually, I remember we were discussing specifically the similarities in the structure and the main characters in Witcher 3 and "The Mandalorian". Sidequests structured like a tv show episodes, but also the main plot being about tracking down a person. My point was that this isn't a case of the show copying from games (like Westworld was openly doing), but both the game and show are coming fom a common root.

One more difficulty for Cyberpunk to struggle with - you have to have a strong silent type male character and a somewhat more emotional female main character, both going through the same main story. I'd say this is a great opportunity, if the developer had the resources to spend on making them different.

 

[AwesomeButton]

usually in conversations I'm having with my wife, who is my main gaming buddy IRL.

I used to have my colleagues too, but they are too casual to hold a serious conversation.

 

[Alienman]

Living the dream.

 

[Cyberarmy]

I used to have my colleagues too, but they are too casual to hold a serious conversation.

Same here sadly. They all married to non gamer girls which led to their demise. At least I'm still here, holding the fort alone...

 

[Semiurge]

They all married to non gamer girls which led to their demise.

... or was it their salvation?

 

[Gargaune]

BTW, this is something I've been making fun of in Geralt's characterisation, usually in conversations I'm having with my wife, who is my main gaming buddy IRL. I was telling her, notice how traditional masculine values are taught through videogame characters - the protagonist is always as stoic as it gets. This is either as a feature of his character, or as a result of a surgical/"genetic"/"magical" intervention - Geralt "doesn't have emotions" because of the mutations, JC Denton cannot smile, because of the nanoaugmentations. Being a superhero is associated with controlling your emotions, when it comes to men. "Boys don't cry". Sometimes you have to explain these things to women.

Yeah, I get your general point, but I've never been onboard with this particular perspective that these archetypes are on some level meant to be instructional, rather than the result of market demand. I've recently gone through Ghost in the Shell again and Innocence puts forward the same idea in a comment, that the doll is meant to be educational to little girls, which always struck me as a reversal of cause and effect - i.e. stoic male protagonists appeal to men, so devs put stoic male protagonists in male-oriented videogames; dolls appeal to little girls, so parents get them dolls. But I'm getting off-track... Where JC Denton is concerned, I don't recall there being some sort of technical excuse for his character, is there? I thought that was just him. Paul (who's voiced by the same actor, in fact) has the same tech but a very different attitude. In fact, when you meet him on the docks and JC comments that he's "used to being on [his] own", Paul practically rebukes him, saying "One can be TOO self-sufficient, I'm coming to believe."

One more difficulty for Cyberpunk to struggle with - you have to have a strong silent type male character and a somewhat more emotional female main character, both going through the same main story. I'd say this is a great opportunity, if the developer had the resources to spend on making them different.

I'm not sure about that from where I'm sitting, with the stoic type being the better choice of fully-acted RPG protagonist. As a small counterpoint, I think Fallout 4 is an interesting example here. The female protagonist's VO is clearly better from an acting standpoint, she's a bit more passionate, more committed to the role, but that ironically makes her more sedate male counterpart work (marginally!) better as the player's avatar. In the end it doesn't amount to much, though, since the dialogue is horribly contextualised to the main plot so it all boils down to whatever.

But I don't think there's any hard lines against having a stoic female protagonist. In fact, if I think back to Deus Ex, the only other character there that could pull a good JC Denton would be Anna Navarre - she's even colder and a bit sadistic, clearly designed as an antagonist, but other than that she's posessed by a similar temperament and deadpan humour:

Anna Navarre: "We had such hopes for you and your brother. It would seem you are not as loyal as we expected."
JC Denton: "Loyalty to what Simons and agents like you have made of UNATCO - I would rather die."
Anna Navarre: "We are thinking the same thought."

Another example might even be Motoko Kusanagi in Stand Alone Complex. Don't get me wrong, anyone can see through her Superhero-by-day/Waifu-by-night writing, but beyond that she's got that stoic lone wolf outlook while still displaying consistent femininity in her behaviour, she's not just Rambo in high heels. I could easily picture her as a more compelling Player Character than V.


On a completely different note, since I did broach GitS... I played Cyberpunk and I didn't get why the red crotch rocket was called the Kusanagi rather than the Kaneda or something. But I figured whatever, I'm not an anime connoisseur so I just thought they wanted to reference both Ghost in the Shell and Akira in the game. Except I just saw Ghost in the Shell: Arise and I get it now. And I'm disappointed. Now I like the motorcycle less.

Decline is real. Repent.

 

[cvv]

notice how traditional masculine values are taught through videogame characters - the protagonist is always as stoic as it gets.

That's because testosterone = stoicism. F to M trannies testify once they got on the T-needle their turbulent emotions calm down and they become less talkative. They also become way more horny and more interested in philosophy, science and politics.

All that sounds like some wild 4chan bullshit but it's actually true. Very much recommended reading on this: https://www.amazon.com/Story-Testosterone-Hormone-Dominates-Divides/dp/1250236061. That's a prominent Harvard endocrinologist AND a female saying this. Predictably some are trying to cancel her, as she says on Rogan or Weiss.

There are also a few comments about how testosterone changes behaviour in Douglas Murray: Madness of Crowds, also highly recommended.

 

[AwesomeButton]

Yeah, I get your general point, but I've never been onboard with this particular perspective that these archetypes are on some level meant to be instructional, rather than the result of market demand.

Oh, sure, I didn't mean they are being taught on purpose, rather as a side effect of what the market wants. Right now the agenda is changing, but from time to time we still get evidence that Nature finds a way. Like with The Mandalorian.

 

[Heroic Liberator]

All that sounds like some wild 4chan bullshit but it's actually true. Very much recommended reading on this: https://www.amazon.com/Story-Testosterone-Hormone-Dominates-Divides/dp/1250236061. That's a prominent Harvard endocrinologist AND a female saying this. Predictably some are trying to cancel her, as she says on Rogan or Weiss.

There are also a few comments about how testosterone changes behaviour in Douglas Murray: Madness of Crowds, also highly recommended.

It's a shame that getting testosterone boosters without prescription as an average Joe isn't legal in most places while female trannies get a free pass due to their mental illness. Although I guess that if you are a male with average testosterone levels, such shots wouldn't make too big of a difference since the excess testosterone would be converted into other stuff by the body?

 

[Avarize]

All that sounds like some wild 4chan bullshit but it's actually true. Very much recommended reading on this: https://www.amazon.com/Story-Testosterone-Hormone-Dominates-Divides/dp/1250236061. That's a prominent Harvard endocrinologist AND a female saying this. Predictably some are trying to cancel her, as she says on Rogan or Weiss.

There are also a few comments about how testosterone changes behaviour in Douglas Murray: Madness of Crowds, also highly recommended.

It's a shame that getting testosterone boosters without prescription as an average Joe isn't legal in most places while female trannies get a free pass due to their mental illness. Although I guess that if you are a male with average testosterone levels, such shots wouldn't make too big of a difference since the excess testosterone would be converted into other stuff by the body?

Using testosterone reduces your own production so if you used an average amount and you had average T before, there'd be very little change. But usually in replacement thereapy the dosage is on the high end of normal (like top 1-5%) so most guys have significant increase in muscle mass if they work out and the like. Personally I'm going on TRT the day I turn 50, earlier if my T starts dropping too much.

 

[Heroic Liberator]

But usually in replacement thereapy the dosage is on the high end of normal (like top 1-5%) so most guys have significant increase in muscle mass if they work out and the like.

That's what I'm wondering about. Do you get to that 1-5% percent of T levels with enough boosters or does your body flush out the excess and leave you with your natural baseline? Those with chronically low T that get boosters are probably suffering from some chronic condition that hampers their testosterone production, but otherwise they'd have a similar baseline to an average person (or to use an analogy, it's about the amount of water poured in the glass and not about the glass itself; low T guys probably have the same glass as average T guys, it's just that their bodies aren't filling it to the brim with water).

Personally I'm going on TRT the day I turn 50, earlier if my T starts dropping too much.

Yeah, that seems to be the wise choice if you don't mind having it as a habit. Hopefully your average endocrinologist won't give you some paternalistic "low T is normal at your age, you don't need to be prescribed boosters" sort of attitude if they don't have any money incentive to prescribe it to patients. Given how non-medical(ly warranted from an ill health perspective) steroid use is frowned upon, the pessimist in me could see that sort of scenario playing out.

 

[Avarize]

You can take a gram of test a week and you'll still get the benefit (and at such high dosage also huge amounts of negatives), that's 10-15 times natural level for normal men. Now of course men have different reactions to test. For some the anabolic effects are stronger while for some the androgenic, but it will effect everyone.

 

[mkultra]

It's a shame that getting testosterone boosters without prescription as an average Joe isn't legal in most places while female trannies get a free pass due to their mental illness. Although I guess that if you are a male with average testosterone levels, such shots wouldn't make too big of a difference since the excess testosterone would be converted into other stuff by the body?

When you have excess testosterone you can feel it. I get more easily annoyed, i get hornier, i think of violence more, i feel more alert. There's testosterone in some food, of course this is nowhere near what you can get if you have synthetic booster, but yes you can elevate levels if you eat testo boosting foods daily. Working out helps too obviously - i'm awful at doing that consistently though. i'm 50, still almost as horny as when i was a teen i'm not sure how good of a testo level measurement that is but if you have a severe lack you're probably not even getting it up.

Fat is important (both in terms of food and body fat), insulin sensitivity also comes into play for testo production. I think you can fix it without synthetic boosters, being healthy overall fixes a ton of stuff, not just testosterone..

 

[cvv]

Personally I'm going on TRT the day I turn 50, earlier if my T starts dropping too much.

Not so simple bruh, it doesn't matter how much T you're getting during the therapy if your body is bad at absorbing it. Found out first hand. Tried TRT for about 4 months, at the end doctor said all that T is just uselessly circling in my bloodstream bc my body is bad at absorbing it (something about receptors being blocked or not enough of them, dunno). Apparently chads don't have this problem as often as beta nerds, sadge.

 

[Heroic Liberator]

Personally I'm going on TRT the day I turn 50, earlier if my T starts dropping too much.

Not so simple bruh, it doesn't matter how much T you're getting during the therapy if your body is bad at absorbing it. Found out first hand. Tried TRT for about 4 months, at the end doctor said all that T is just uselessly circling in my bloodstream bc my body is bad at absorbing it (something about receptors being blocked or not enough of them, dunno). Apparently chads don't have this problem as often as beta nerds, sadge.

Hopefully those 4 months didn't make your body dependent on injections to maintain your natural T levels afterwards.

 

[cvv]

Personally I'm going on TRT the day I turn 50, earlier if my T starts dropping too much.

Not so simple bruh, it doesn't matter how much T you're getting during the therapy if your body is bad at absorbing it. Found out first hand. Tried TRT for about 4 months, at the end doctor said all that T is just uselessly circling in my bloodstream bc my body is bad at absorbing it (something about receptors being blocked or not enough of them, dunno). Apparently chads don't have this problem as often as beta nerds, sadge.

Hopefully those 4 months didn't make your body dependent on injections to maintain your natural T levels afterwards.

Nope, it cost me a lot of money without having much of an effect at all, positive or negative. Well, it killed all my spammies lol, but natural production got back to normal within a week after stopping with this shit.

 

[Avarize]

Fat is important (both in terms of food and body fat)

Gotta also remember that high bodyfat lowers your test as well as low. So you don't want to go under 10-12% as a natty or much over 20%.

Not so simple bruh, it doesn't matter how much T you're getting during the therapy if your body is bad at absorbing it. Found out first hand. Tried TRT for about 4 months, at the end doctor said all that T is just uselessly circling in my bloodstream bc my body is bad at absorbing it (something about receptors being blocked or not enough of them, dunno). Apparently chads don't have this problem as often as beta nerds, sadge.

I've got much bigger and stronger in the gym than any of my friends I started with way back when (or most people going to the gym in general), so I should be a pretty good responder. But if the first compound I try doesn't work I'll beg the doctor for something else.
It's fairly far into the future for me as well so there'll probably be more information about TRT then. It's getting much more popular after all.

 

[AwesomeButton]

Where JC Denton is concerned, I don't recall there being some sort of technical excuse for his character, is there? I thought that was just him.

It was written somewhere in the beginning of the game, in the help information (your interface was so full of good stuff to read, what an age this was) that nano-augmented agents are generally indistinguishible from the general population (unlike the mechs), apart from two things - the eyes, and the fact they cannot smile. But yeah, the rest of the character must be coming from JC himself.

 

[Gargaune]

It was written somewhere in the beginning of the game, in the help information (your interface was so full of good stuff to read, what an age this was) that nano-augmented agents are generally indistinguishible from the general population (unlike the mechs), apart from two things - the eyes, and the fact they cannot smile. But yeah, the rest of the character must be coming from JC himself.

Yeah, that rings a bell, though I think I always read that as a joke. Could be, though.