CD Projekt's Cyberpunk 2077 Update 2.0 + Phantom Liberty Expansion Thread

[Perkel]

yeah sure, dropping all work previously done, new studio, new game, new engine, filled with burgers and american management.

Surely they will make great game.



I said it multiple times even before TW3 came out that their head management are typical CEOs who look how to increase share price and not create pedigree or great games. Great games is just fluke on their journey to became next ubisoft. And the proof was in their mobile shovelware first, then secondwith release obviously unfinished C77 on consoles now creating separate studio in US because it will look nicer on their books for their investors that they are "international" company.

 

[Ibn Sina]

it has begun

The game being made in US Boston planet capital of wokeness this side of the solar system is not a good development.

 

[Gargaune]

I said it multiple times even before TW3 came out that their head management are typical CEOs who look how to increase share price and not create pedigree or great games. Great games is just fluke on their journey to became next ubisoft. And the proof was in their mobile shovelware first, then secondwith release obviously unfinished C77 on consoles now creating separate studio in US because it will look nicer on their books for their investors that they are "international" company.

What's even more bizarre to me is that, presumably, they're also giving up on a significant cost advantage they had in Poland. I'm well aware that the wage gap between America/Western Europe and Eastern Europe isn't as large as decades past, but you're not gonna tell me that a programmer or animator in Warsaw pulls the same salary as the equivalent in fucking Boston. I'm sure that the success of TW3 had to also be, at least in part, due to CDPR being able to just throw more labour at the product while addressing the same market as their US counterparts, basically getting more bang for their buck.

Shutting down their in-house engine development can have both ups and downs, but I don't see how "we're going to pay more for our staff" is meant to appeal to investors.

 

[StrongBelwas]

The Witcher 3 is almost ten years old at this point, and Cyberpunk cost $174M (Just development) vs. Witcher 3's $81M (Development and marketing). Seems like the cost advantage faded away.

 

[Infinitron]

US Boston planet capital of wokeness

Nah.

 

[Gargaune]

The Witcher 3 is almost ten years old at this point, and Cyberpunk cost $174M (Just development) vs. Witcher 3's $81M (Development and marketing). Seems like the cost advantage faded away.

Not too helpful without an image of the headcount across different departments. If we wanted to get rigorous, we'd have to compare average wages per position between TW3 and CBP, adjusted for inflation, and then to competing AAA products from the US, which is the more salient point. But I'm way too lazy to try and dig up that sort of info, I'm just going off general impressions on the IT labour market.

 

[don_tomaso]

The Witcher 3 is almost ten years old at this point, and Cyberpunk cost $174M (Just development) vs. Witcher 3's $81M (Development and marketing). Seems like the cost advantage faded away.

Not too helpful without an image of the headcount across different departments. If we wanted to get rigorous, we'd have to compare average wages per position between TW3 and CBP, adjusted for inflation, and then to competing AAA products from the US, which is the more salient point. But I'm way too lazy to try and dig up that sort of info, I'm just going off general impressions on the IT labour market.

I have no horse in this arse, but do we really need to know wages per position and such if we have the whole sum for what the games cost to create to get an idea if profit/no profit? If you have the whole cost of a product and the costs of creating it...

My assumptions is, let's say CP cost 300m including marketing, and W3 80m, that CP was hugely profitable because it seems like it sold so very, very much, basically everyone has an opinion on it. Everyone I know has played it. A lot of people I know have played W3 too but that was after a major discount. Who knows if it was more profitable, to assume it wasn't seems crazy.

And also, I'm drunk and haven't actually read what you guys talked about, if this is relevant at all, I dunno, and yes, I'm just rambling. d r u n k r a m b.

Edit: oh I did the anecdotal thingy :/

 

[Gargaune]

I have no horse in this arse, but do we really need to know wages per position and such if we have the whole sum for what the games cost to create to get an idea if profit/no profit? If you have the whole cost of a product and the costs of creating it...

My assumptions is, let's say CP cost 300m including marketing, and W3 80m, that CP was hugely profitable because it seems like it sold so very, very much, basically everyone has an opinion on it. Everyone I know has played it. A lot of people I know have played W3 too but that was after a major discount. Who knows if it was more profitable, to assume it wasn't seems crazy.

And also, I'm drunk and haven't actually read what you guys talked about, if this is relevant at all, I dunno, and yes, I'm just rambling. d r u n k r a m b.

Edit: oh I did the anecdotal thingy :/

The argument wasn't about bottom line profit on the product, but whether developing in Poland still presents a significant cost advantage to developing in the US. My guess is that yes, it does, based on what I know about the IT sector in the region, but I don't have any hard data on how CDPR's wages compare to US counterparts. On the assumption I'm correct, it's a bit puzzling that CDPR would forego that competitive advantage to open a new major studio in Boston, that was the gist of it.

 

[don_tomaso]

I have no horse in this arse, but do we really need to know wages per position and such if we have the whole sum for what the games cost to create to get an idea if profit/no profit? If you have the whole cost of a product and the costs of creating it...

My assumptions is, let's say CP cost 300m including marketing, and W3 80m, that CP was hugely profitable because it seems like it sold so very, very much, basically everyone has an opinion on it. Everyone I know has played it. A lot of people I know have played W3 too but that was after a major discount. Who knows if it was more profitable, to assume it wasn't seems crazy.

And also, I'm drunk and haven't actually read what you guys talked about, if this is relevant at all, I dunno, and yes, I'm just rambling. d r u n k r a m b.

Edit: oh I did the anecdotal thingy :/

The argument wasn't about bottom line profit on the product, but whether developing in Poland still presents a significant cost advantage to developing in the US. My guess is that yes, it does, based on what I know about the IT sector in the region, but I don't have any hard data on how CDPR's wages compare to US counterparts. On the assumption I'm correct, it's a bit puzzling that CDPR would forego that competitive advantage to open a new major studio in Boston, that was the gist of it.

Ah, and therefor you should not just answer drunkenly on something you haven't read through thoroughly. I assume it's about aquring talent then. They understand it will cost them, but Poland just have so many people, and if you are going to hire a bunch of 1st worlders, you might as well move over there.

I think they just think they will get more talent in the us, that's it. I actually think money is a secondary issue. I work with vfx in Scandinavia and we have big time issues finding really good people, those we find are usually super expensive and from not Poland. Those Scandinavians we find already have an employment usually. Vfx and games are very different of course, but I can feel why they want to move to the/a country where there is still talent left.

Bla bla bla, still drunk

 

[don_tomaso]

I just said money is not the issue and then started talking about people being expensive......

 

[Lord_Potato]

Yes, probably in Boston they want to find more talent.

Polish pool of able coders willing to work in game design is most likely limited and CDPR burned through it in recent years due to high fluctuation of its teams. So now they want all hands on deck on Witcher 4 in Poland and a new team in US (managed by a skeleton crew sent from Poland) to make CP2078.

With CDPR board limited management skills it might end poorly.

 

[lukaszek]

Yes, probably in Boston they want to find more talent.

Polish pool of able coders willing to work in game design is most likely limited and CDPR burned through it in recent years due to high fluctuation of its teams. So now they want all hands on deck on Witcher 4 in Poland and a new team in US (managed by a skeleton crew sent from Poland) to make CP2078.

With CDPR board limited management skills it might end poorly.

they got both good and bad rep in industry.

Still the biggest issue is that any coding talent is being drained by banks and 'finance' industry in general

 

[ind33d]

Has anyone ever mentioned that the plot of 2077 is literally just "The Wolverine?" They just changed Mariko to Hanako and reversed immortality with dying in two weeks while leaving the other beats the same.

Cyberpunk 2077, The Movie

Who is credited as the writer of Cyberpunk?

 

[Jason Liang]

 

[ind33d]

LMAO

 

[Yosharian]

I am a fair bit through Phantom Liberty (finally) and honestly the game is even less of an RPG than it was before. It's just a very, very competent open world story-driven FPS.

 

[Infinitron]

89.7 Growl FM presents

Candy Shell
by
Spirit Machines

 

[Yosharian]

Yeah I haven't found a station I like better than Growl either

 

[General Disarray]

Been replaying Deus Ex: Human Revolution now and it got me thinking about where do we draw the line between hub-world games and open worlds games? I mean these categorisation must remain even if the hardware develops, otherwise they are just time locked genres. Modern SSDs allows a hub now days to be full city sized, but isn't it still a hub world game? Because if open world only means no loading screens then all games are gonna be open world. But I would say that an open world game requires a meaningful open world with gameplay systems that supports free roaming gameplay and multiple big locations. Modern craft survival games does open world integration the best now days.

Cyberpunk 2077 contains basically one area, one city, (the badlands really don't count), with areas acting as district in BG2. So you can not actually go to another big area like in Morrowind, Red Dead 2, Outward, BOTW, Witcher 3, ELEX, Elden Ring and Valhalla. It has no open world mechanics, no real resource extraction or repeatable activity, only quest in various ambition levels like gigs but these are custom made and limited. Compared to Red Dead 2 where you can larp about for in game weeks in the wilderness with ample game systems supporting this. Even Outward offers resource extraction and with the final DLC atleast an end game grind.

 

[KeAShizuku]

There's a reason why Ubisoft opened studios in Asia. Not only are salaries lower people also work more hours.

 

[KeAShizuku]

Yeah I haven't found a station I like better than Growl either

https://youtu.be/f1ZQi8biHFY

As a European I like techno. BOOM BOOM BOOM WHERE IS THE XTC OH SHIT IT'S 6 AM ALREADY

 

[gurugeorge]

There are only three music things worth a damn on the radio - Royal Blue Radio with its broad range of jazz, that track "Pain" by Le Destroy, and the latest addition, Idris Elba's toe-tapping playlist of retro-style mid 90s club music. The rest is eminently forgettable.

 

[Frozen]

I've stated elsewhere it is genuinely one of my absolute favourite games of all time now.

How old are you, 12?

 

[ind33d]

2077 is a rhythm game where instead of a plastic guitar you click on people's heads. you're supposed to play it in surround sound at maximum volume

 

[Jason Liang]