CKII is released.

[wwsd]

Overall, good fun so far, but it seems by this point there is little left in the way of balance.

Define balance.

For example, turning yourself into a god through hermetics is not viable anymore, because you can only have so many certain items equipped, no more being a god among men because you have a bunch of magical books written by your ancestors.

On the other hand, Warrior Lodges are the shit - train your entire family in warfare and shit-kick your way to victory. Kill dudes in duels, take the rest in ramsom or use for sacrifice, get your lodge buddies to help.

I do agree that the HRE is helluva powerful now. I think the ERE is also more stable, or at least that's what I see in my last Old Gods games.

Maybe "balance" is the wrong word. It's a kind of "balance" when half of the game is extremely easy, and the other half (i.e. the HRE conquering everything in sight) is hard to deal with.

Anyway, I figured some of the issues I've been having are my fault, since I also got Jade Dragon and didn't realise they added new CBs which I didn't disable. It seems to me that Force Vassalisation is very much a Holy Roman Awesome Button (or indeed an Awesome Button for any large kingdom or empire) since it lets you expend an easily attainable commodity (prestige) in order to ROFLstomp whoever you like. I was actually kind of surprised not to see England become Britannia during my games, since they do always conquer Wales very quickly with Force Vassalisation.

"De jure claim on duchy" and "Ducal conquest" make a bit more sense; I wish there was a way to leave those enabled but not the retarded blob-enabling ones, but I'll have to make do with just disabling all the Jade Dragon CBs.

 

[Higher Game]

Anyway, I figured some of the issues I've been having are my fault, since I also got Jade Dragon and didn't realise they added new CBs which I didn't disable. It seems to me that Force Vassalisation is very much a Holy Roman Awesome Button (or indeed an Awesome Button for any large kingdom or empire) since it lets you expend an easily attainable commodity (prestige) in order to ROFLstomp whoever you like. I was actually kind of surprised not to see England become Britannia during my games, since they do always conquer Wales very quickly with Force Vassalisation.

It's a lot easier to eat up a kingdom from within than expand organically as an independent duchy. Like, compare 769 Alemannia to Bavaria. Pathetic, marginal indies should be easy targets and swearing fealty to a true power shouldn't be shameful. I don't see any problems in this case.

What's truly too hard is for a mature realm to invade another one of the same religion, empire on empire expansion. It pretty much doesn't happen at all without either the "Heir to Alexander" bloodline or sanctioned invasions.

 

[The Brazilian Slaughter]

I was actually kind of surprised not to see England become Britannia during my games, since they do always conquer Wales very quickly with Force Vassalisation.

Funny you say that, my Ravenna/Romagna game has seen the growth of a GIANT Britannia. They rule all the British Isles + a nice chunk of northern France. They inherited France, and by France I mean a big chunk of Northern France. France in my game is a mess between a strong Aquitaine, a vestigial Crusader West France (Yes) and Britannia.
I got butthurt because I had relative with a claim on France.

Maybe "balance" is the wrong word. It's a kind of "balance" when half of the game is extremely easy, and the other half (i.e. the HRE conquering everything in sight) is hard to deal with.

Which date you play?

These days I generally play Old Gods start and the Karling Empire in my game got split apart in three Empires that kept unifying and breaking apart. I was actually butthurt the HRE broke, because my plan was to take it over from the inside after I took over my huge superduke overlord. So I had to pretty much make Romagna, because suddenly I was independent.

In my game, its the ERE that is the monster, but it alternates between civil war and kicking ass and taking names.

Are you playing Charlie start?

Honestly I think the Jade Dragon CBs are ok, because they scale. There's a point its too much hassle to use the border friction CBs, and at that point you're ready to play the Claim game with inviting Claimants and getting Claims from the Pope.

 

[wwsd]

I was actually kind of surprised not to see England become Britannia during my games, since they do always conquer Wales very quickly with Force Vassalisation.

Funny you say that, my Ravenna/Romagna game has seen the growth of a GIANT Britannia. They rule all the British Isles + a nice chunk of northern France. They inherited France, and by France I mean a big chunk of Northern France. France in my game is a mess between a strong Aquitaine, a vestigial Crusader West France (Yes) and Britannia.
I got butthurt because I had relative with a claim on France.

Maybe "balance" is the wrong word. It's a kind of "balance" when half of the game is extremely easy, and the other half (i.e. the HRE conquering everything in sight) is hard to deal with.

Which date you play?

These days I generally play Old Gods start and the Karling Empire in my game got split apart in three Empires that kept unifying and breaking apart. I was actually butthurt the HRE broke, because my plan was to take it over from the inside after I took over my huge superduke overlord. So I had to pretty much make Romagna, because suddenly I was independent.

In my game, its the ERE that is the monster, but it alternates between civil war and kicking ass and taking names.

Are you playing Charlie start?

Honestly I think the Jade Dragon CBs are ok, because they scale. There's a point its too much hassle to use the border friction CBs, and at that point you're ready to play the Claim game with inviting Claimants and getting Claims from the Pope.

I usually start in 1066. Force of habit more than anything. CK to me has always been what's in the title, and the high Middle Ages are the most interesting to me. The only exception is when I specifically want to play Vikings or Anglo-Saxons or something. But in 1066 you do obviously get an established HRE that will usually expand. I now have the Jade Dragon CBs turned off, and that seems to prevent them from going insane too much. The border dispute claims I don't mind much since they're expensive enough to not be worthwhile, but I maintain that force vassalisation looks like an Imperial Awesome Button to me.

In my games, the Byzantines tend to hold it together pretty well with this patch. In earlier patches they were often crushed by multiple Seljuk invasions starting from 1066, but now they seem to win the first one more often than not, and that seems to guarantee their survival. It is however funny to observe the Eastern emprah trying to revoke titles, only to have the vassal call in most of the other vassals into a tyranny war that's >200% stronger than the emprah, so he always gets replaced. They don't expand monstrously though; they usually remain pretty balanced with the Seljuks to the east and Fatimids to the south.

So far I've only played two games into the 13th century, but in my first one, the ERE did get crushed completely by the equivalent of the 4th Crusade. In my current game, I worked my way up from Count of Naples to Despot of Sicily to Byzantine Emperor, and I ended up being invaded by the Catholics through a diverted crusade in the 1220s. Now that was truly entertaining, CKII at its best. I awaited the Frankish hordes with two big stacks of some 20k men each, supplemented by various attached Orthodox allies (there were some pretty strong Russian principalities by this point). One of my armies had an "Organiser" leader who could quickly march to any trouble spots. It got very hairy at times, with dozens of epic battles often involving >70,000 troops all around the Sea of Marmara. Eventually, as the first waves were broken, the battlegrounds moved westwards into Macedon, and that was the right time to put 10k troops in Rome with my 68-year-old infirm "Siege Leader" king, who was by now useless for actual fighting, but who obviously still knew how to build a mean siege tower. He got his triumph in Constantinople just a couple of months before his death.

In the midst of all this, the succession hung in the balance as well, which made for some nailbiting moments with this old fart. His oldest son and designated successor died of an infected wound. The second one was a leper. Otherwise there was nothing but bastard daughters not in matrilineal marriages and distant nephews and cousins in Sicily. The son with the infected wound had a baby girl just before his death, so I ended up building her up and getting her to support her own election. Defending against the Latin scum actually helped here, along with promoting some commanders who still owed me favours that made me realise how to game the current Byzantine succession system. This woman now sits on the throne but of course she happens to be a raging dyke, so I can't imagine succession getting any easier. In general I've had quite a few dykes, fags, lepers, harelips, club feet, and hunchbacks in my dynasty and I made it through by the skin of my teeth more than a few times. I will see if I can achieve a scenario where we take sweet revenge on the Catholics by converting to Hellenic Paganism and restoring the Empire, but that's a long-term concern.

 

[The Brazilian Slaughter]

but I maintain that force vassalisation looks like an Imperial Awesome Button to me.

In the short term yes, in the long-term, you will end up getting a bunch of vassals with horrible borders and far more dejure land than what they should have.

In my games, the Byzantines tend to hold it together pretty well with this patch. In earlier patches they were often crushed by multiple Seljuk invasions starting from 1066, but now they seem to win the first one more often than not, and that seems to guarantee their survival. It is however funny to observe the Eastern emprah trying to revoke titles, only to have the vassal call in most of the other vassals into a tyranny war that's >200% stronger than the emprah, so he always gets replaced. They don't expand monstrously though; they usually remain pretty balanced with the Seljuks to the east and Fatimids to the south.

ERE is a bit confusing, they went from OP-please-nerf, to totally weak and then back to OP-please-nerf tier. In my experience they always crush the Bulgarians and then start to wail on the big muslim blob.

Yes, their bizarre civil wars are deeply amusing. I think the ERE is so unstable because the top liege always seems to have a shit desmene, so he looks weak and then his vassals revolt.

I usually start in 1066.

Damn, HRE is a monster in that start.

So far I've only played two games into the 13th century, but in my first one, the ERE did get crushed completely by the equivalent of the 4th Crusade. In my current game, I worked my way up from Count of Naples to Despot of Sicily to Byzantine Emperor, and I ended up being invaded by the Catholics through a diverted crusade in the 1220s. Now that was truly entertaining, CKII at its best. I awaited the Frankish hordes with two big stacks of some 20k men each, supplemented by various attached Orthodox allies (there were some pretty strong Russian principalities by this point). One of my armies had an "Organiser" leader who could quickly march to any trouble spots. It got very hairy at times, with dozens of epic battles often involving >70,000 troops all around the Sea of Marmara. Eventually, as the first waves were broken, the battlegrounds moved westwards into Macedon, and that was the right time to put 10k troops in Rome with my 68-year-old infirm "Siege Leader" king, who was by now useless for actual fighting, but who obviously still knew how to build a mean siege tower. He got his triumph in Constantinople just a couple of months before his death.

Damn, that's fucking epic. This is what CKII is made for!
I didn't see any Fourth Crusade events so far. In my experience, Crusades always turn into giant Catholic vs Muslim thunderdrome across the world.

In the midst of all this, the succession hung in the balance as well

You think that's grim, wait until you end up marrying a daughter in normal marriage to some dude, all your sucessors die and all your heirs are non-dynastic.
Well, fuck.

I will see if I can achieve a scenario where we take sweet revenge on the Catholics by converting to Hellenic Paganism and restoring the Empire, but that's a long-term concern.

I would suggest you to mend the Schism, but Orthodoxy right now is the most boring religion in the game.
I gotta run a Hellenic game once.

 

[JarlFrank]

Bought the new DLC, went Viking Age scandinavians to form Scandinavia and try out the new warrior lodge mechanics, which are cool.

In this game, the first Crusade started against a Christian heresy that had taken over France in the 9th century, and by the mid 10th century the second crusade was declared...

...

... on Constantinople. Byzzies got crushed, Papal States received Constantinople and two Thracian provinces, Orthodox Byzantium collapsed into small duchies, and now it's 1100 and all of Anatolia has been gobbled up by Muslims.
The African pagans down south managed to reform and have a decent empire that is kinda stuck there since the Muslims surrounding it are strong.
Bulgaria has formed the Empire of Carpathia and is the biggest nation around.

France is a hilarious clusterfuck. Empire of Francia exists, but several emperor converted to heresies and became targets of crusades. Now there is an independent Kingdom of France surrounded by the Empire of Francia as a result of this crusade. It's hilarious.

Also southern Italy was conquered by Jewish Khazars. Kek.

Overall, good DLC with lots of new fun stuff that adds some more spice to the game, just what CK2 needed.

 

[fantadomat]

I never got what is with that stupid thing called Scandinavia,as a country i mean. Such a thing was never even a fantasy,let alone a real country. It is totally paradox's fanfiction shit. Even if some the countries managed to conquer all of it,they will still keep their original name. It is not like there is any reason to change it.

On this note. Does anyone here knows how Spain actually came to be Spain? I do know their brief history and all,but i never saw anything about the actual change of the name. There were two kingdoms,then some inbreed fuckary and the next thing you know is that it is Spain. I searched a little bit on google but couldn't find anything about. Any ideas or nice sources to read?

 

[wwsd]

I will see if I can achieve a scenario where we take sweet revenge on the Catholics by converting to Hellenic Paganism and restoring the Empire, but that's a long-term concern.

I would suggest you to mend the Schism, but Orthodoxy right now is the most boring religion in the game.
I gotta run a Hellenic game once.

I've mended the schism and restored Rome in previous games a few years ago, so it's kind of "been there, done that" territory. I haven't done much with Hellenism so far, other than sometimes having some rulers dabbling in the Classics to improve their attributes a little bit. I didn't really care for playable Hellenic pagans when they were announced for this patch. Supposedly it's only possible in exceptional conditions, but in fact the path is extremely easy to find. However, after having been on the receiving end of a "4th Crusade", I now find it tempting to LARP a Byzantine Empire turned pagan. Having defeated the Catholic crusade, the emperor on his death bed begs his granddaughter to take revenge, something like that. A revenge that's not going to consist of painstakingly fabricated claims on Rome, to put it mildly. Besides, in 1066 the Pisans usually make a beeline for Carthage, and then the Muslims never get it back because the Pope and the HRE always join the Pisans in any holy wars on Tunis. So just holy-warring the shit out of everyone with pagans seems like more fun than going about it province-by-province.

I never got what is with that stupid thing called Scandinavia,as a country i mean. Such a thing was never even a fantasy,let alone a real country. It is totally paradox's fanfiction shit. Even if some the countries managed to conquer all of it,they will still keep their original name. It is not like there is any reason to change it.

That reminds me, I also tried a 769 game with Denmark, just to catch the start of the Viking Age. Only problem is that while I take modern Denmark, Scania, and the south coast of Norway, the damn Swedes take literally everything else. All of Norway, Lapland, Finland, etc. and they would probably subjugate me too if I were just another dumb AI. They haven't formed Scandinavia so far, but they could obviously try. I've also done it myself as Sweden in past games. Obviously it's rather easy with subjugations and such, and rather silly. I find it more fun to exercise some restraint instead of blob, anyway.

 

[Sranchammer]

I attempt to play but then uninstall once I see something completely ridiculous happen such as Jewish France or Cathar Holy Roman Emperor. Happens too often.

 

[ortucis]

I got this game for free and decided to try it out yesterday.

Worst fucking UI I've ever seen. Not only is it a blurry mess (when zoomed up) but it feels like a visual novel. I "played" (read = read) it for 48 mins and I felt like I was doing a real job.

Anyway, send people to cause riots in some Muslim guy's country, trying to plan a war. Got married and set up a goal to gain 500 gold? Seems like there is a hidden gem beneath the layers of novel you have to wade through. Maybe I'll give it another try.. I still haven't unlocked all cards (I can sell them), so until then.

 

[The Brazilian Slaughter]

I attempt to play but then uninstall once I see something completely ridiculous happen such as Jewish France or Cathar Holy Roman Emperor. Happens too often.

Jewish France doesn't happen as much now, that happened because the AI kept using event-generated Jewish Diplomats to tutor their children. Now it doesn't do that anymore.

The wacky shit is part of the appeal.
Remember - Reality is unrealistic.

 

[Vaarna_Aarne]

Yea usually things are just boring if something wacky doesn't happen to throw in a curveball.

 

[The Brazilian Slaughter]

Anyone getting annoyed at telling the Court Chaplain to hurt apostastes, and then he drags like half the kingdom and tells they're heretics, heathens or satanists?
I never know if its true or he's full of shit and dragging random niggas for lulz of playing the Holy Inquisition. Aparently my kingdom has more heretics than the Eye of Terror. I generally put them to the fire if I don't like them or they look suspect - heathens I don't want around, people with suspicion modifiers, black robes, too many sins, possessed and shit. It is a good way to put people to the fire without any disadvantages, tho.

The most bizarre is that he has been going after Orthodox courtiers too. Dude, its just a schism, Orthodoxes are not Satan worshippers, calm down!

 

[Vaarna_Aarne]

That just means the only solution is to just go with the flow and

 

[Fedora Master]

Anyone getting annoyed at telling the Court Chaplain to hurt apostastes, and then he drags like half the kingdom and tells they're heretics, heathens or satanists?
I never know if its true or he's full of shit and dragging random niggas for lulz of playing the Holy Inquisition. Aparently my kingdom has more heretics than the Eye of Terror. I generally put them to the fire if I don't like them or they look suspect - heathens I don't want around, people with suspicion modifiers, black robes, too many sins, possessed and shit. It is a good way to put people to the fire without any disadvantages, tho.

The most bizarre is that he has been going after Orthodox courtiers too. Dude, its just a schism, Orthodoxes are not Satan worshippers, calm down!

I think those waves of heretics are actually real. Court Chaplains usually have 20+ in Learning so the chance of them failing is pretty damn low and courtiers with nothing else to do LOVE to join plots and retarded societies. You could always double check with console commands.

 

[Norfleet]

I'm pretty sure they're just fingering random people, with the various traits they have making some more or less likely to be fingered, thus giving you an excuse to burn them. I get a lot of insane people fingered, and I'm thinking they cannot ALL be apostates, I think they're just legit insane which makes them easy targets. I suspect if you leave them to run they'll eventually finger absolutely everyone who doesn't have traits that make them ineligible.

 

[wwsd]

Anyone getting annoyed at telling the Court Chaplain to hurt apostastes, and then he drags like half the kingdom and tells they're heretics, heathens or satanists?
I never know if its true or he's full of shit and dragging random niggas for lulz of playing the Holy Inquisition. Aparently my kingdom has more heretics than the Eye of Terror. I generally put them to the fire if I don't like them or they look suspect - heathens I don't want around, people with suspicion modifiers, black robes, too many sins, possessed and shit. It is a good way to put people to the fire without any disadvantages, tho.

The most bizarre is that he has been going after Orthodox courtiers too. Dude, its just a schism, Orthodoxes are not Satan worshippers, calm down!

I find it pretty useful to hunt apostates as Byzantine emprah. The strategoi and doukes can be pretty conniving jerks at times. I get a free kill against the hotshot military commander who's more popular than my weak heir, or I can imprison some jerk who merged two dynasties while I wasn't looking. Sometimes they're actually heretics or schismatics, others are simply Orthodox, but I do sometimes see the "suspicious" modifiers on them once they're already rotting in my dungeon. Undoubtedly there are always a fair number of devil worshippers around, which becomes readily obvious when you join them yourself.

By the way, I wonder what happens if you let your chaplain hunt apostates while you yourself are a Satan worshipper and you make it a bit too obvious. I've never tried this because it seems really self-defeating, but do the priests ever hunt you down and burn you? I've had it happen to me once as a vassal count, but never as top liege. I wonder if this is even possible.

 

[Average Manatee]

Now that we have a kill counter I just like killing people. If they were heretics and killing them helps stabilize the realm, all the better.

 

[The Brazilian Slaughter]

By the way, I wonder what happens if you let your chaplain hunt apostates while you yourself are a Satan worshipper and you make it a bit too obvious. I've never tried this because it seems really self-defeating, but do the priests ever hunt you down and burn you? I've had it happen to me once as a vassal count, but never as top liege. I wonder if this is even possible.

You know, I'm curious about this.
I wonder what happens if the Chaplain is a Satanist too.
I'm also curious about this re: Secret Religions.

I think the Chaplain can't give you a little Auto da Fé because you have no top liege to be reported to, but dunno if he squeaks for a lot of reputation hurting or something.

I do know that when the black plague hits, there's an event where you can catch a bunch of satanists.

 

[Higher Game]

Hypocrisy is only wrong for Christians. In every other culture, being a blatant hypocrite just shows what you can get away with and it's a demonstration of power and in fact a good thing for an elite. It's almost like a peacock's tail as a demonstration of sexual fitness and women love it, which is why feminism is always satanism ("wiccan" paganism etc whatever) by the end.

Aside from Christianity, only the rare warrior-poet hero actually personally lives by the code of chivalry, rather than inflicting it on others and coldly calculating if their virtue outweighs his vice, planning his moves like a snake. Absolute aversion to hypocrisy starting in oneself is an eccentric trait in humans, no matter how obviously inspired, and it is never found in women. Truth is power to them, never beauty.

 

[vonAchdorf]

When dealing with heretics, the historical precedent says:

Caedite eos. Novit enim Dominus qui sunt eius.
("Kill them. For the Lord knows those that are His own.")

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caedite_eos._Novit_enim_Dominus_qui_sunt_eius.

 

[IDtenT]

Hypocrisy is only wrong for Christians. In every other culture, being a blatant hypocrite just shows what you can get away with and it's a demonstration of power and in fact a good thing for an elite. It's almost like a peacock's tail as a demonstration of sexual fitness and women love it, which is why feminism is always satanism ("wiccan" paganism etc whatever) by the end.

Aside from Christianity, only the rare warrior-poet hero actually personally lives by the code of chivalry, rather than inflicting it on others and coldly calculating if their virtue outweighs his vice, planning his moves like a snake. Absolute aversion to hypocrisy starting in oneself is an eccentric trait in humans, no matter how obviously inspired, and it is never found in women. Truth is power to them, never beauty.

It's not hypocrisy that gets you, it's the truth.

 

[HeroMarine]

So, anyone else playing a lot CK2 Random World (available with the Holy Fury DLC)? Because I am and I'm having a blast. I also heavily modify the game files to make it more realistic and fun.

 

[CreamyBlood]

So, anyone else playing a lot CK2 Random World (available with the Holy Fury DLC)? Because I am and I'm having a blast. I also heavily modify the game files to make it more realistic and fun.

Modding is fun. Is there a way to reduce the faggot spawn count?

 

[HeroMarine]

So, anyone else playing a lot CK2 Random World (available with the Holy Fury DLC)? Because I am and I'm having a blast. I also heavily modify the game files to make it more realistic and fun.

Modding is fun. Is there a way to reduce the faggot spawn count?

Go to \Steam\steamapps\common\Crusader Kings II\events and open this file in a notepad: ze_adolescence_events.txt

Ctrl+l to event ZE.13610 and change the following to reduce the number of lesbians:

For male adolescents, this is a more realistic number for the number of homos:

This should solve most of your problems with reducing the faggot spawn count.