KickStarter Darkest Dungeon AKA the Celerity Attention Whore Thread

[Got bored and left]

In before Celerity cuts his dick off/[...]/becomes a tranny...

Why, he'll fit in even more!

 

[<3sRichardSimmons]

New Kodex Kreative writing Kompetition:
I will give $50 (US) to the first Codexer that can successfully facilitate a flame war (Minimum half page back-and-forth shitposting) between Cleve and Celerity.

 

[PhantasmaNL]

Never read anything from Jim Sterling, but his review is eh, enthusiastic. 9/10? Unrelenting adventure as well as an intricately designed puzzle? One hell of an amazing ride?

What?

Or this guy was bought or he wants to spite Celerity.

 

[Bumvelcrow]

New Kodex Kreative writing Kompetition:
I will give $50 (US) to the first Codexer that can successfully facilitate a flame war (Minimum half page back-and-forth shitposting) between Cleve and Celerity.

Just pay for Celerity's access to Prosperland and let nature take its course. There - I've saved you $40. You can owe me.

 

[DramaticPopcorn]

What broke my mod for Derpest was various hardcoded imbalances that I couldn't fix even by rejecting the entire patch. At this point however I seen overwhelming, undeniable evidence of their corruption, of their aggressive mismarketing, etc and I could no longer support them, I could no longer make a company like that sales. So I cut support, because that patch was their final chance.

Uh, how was your obscure mod supposed to generate sales for them? Most games have "higher difficulty" mods or mechanic overhauls, but very very few of them actually generate attention to the game because they don't usually content actually attractive content.

 

[Neanderthal]

Hell even Jim Fucking Sterling is telling Celerity to fuck off in the comments section from his review on the game

I've never understood the fucking bit in Jim Sterling, after all hes probably not even seen is cock (or toes) in years, an even pros av got some standards.

 

[Lujo]

Lujo,

I'm neither young nor idealistic. What I did do was shelve my usual cynicism for a short time and get emotional about something. That of course was a horrible mistake, not only because I was wrong about the game but also wrong about the characters of those making it. Rest assured Early Access is a big ass 180 sign now no matter what's happening or how the game seems. Now I don't have a problem with modding, other companies can and do respect that effort but beta testing is right the fuck out.

As for the graphics, it's pretty much anti indie/Roguelike. Both Indies and Roguelikes are generally praised for solid ideas and mechanics while mocked for poor presentation, this is the opposite. It looks great but there's nothing beyond that. Kind of like mini triple A really, complete with mass advertisement. As for the optimization, see lazy talentless devs. This sold well because it said it was something it wasn't then marketed the shit out of itself, put that marketing campaign on a real game and it will sell millions.

What broke my mod for Derpest was various hardcoded imbalances that I couldn't fix even by rejecting the entire patch. At this point however I seen overwhelming, undeniable evidence of their corruption, of their aggressive mismarketing, etc and I could no longer support them, I could no longer make a company like that sales. So I cut support, because that patch was their final chance.

Celerity,

a lot of games which are remembered as legendary, groundbreaking or generation-defining are often hackjobs when you look at them with a bit of hindsight and perspective. I remember that as a kid it was a huge revelation to me when a buddy and I dug up files on the original Diablo disk which made it clear to us that what the devs of it did was abandon the idea for an RPG and just publish the combat as a standalone game. Fallout 1 was very much style over substance, and so was Planescape Torment, and Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines was a terrible buggy mess, and so on and so forth, and it goes even beyond RPGs. Even huge names like Sid Meyer did things like the artrocious Alpha Centuari interface, or the legendary Shandalar Magic the Gathering implementation - rememebered as the best MtG implementation ever, and it is, but the AI was coded by a guy who for a fact didn't know how to play MtG. It's how it works with games. You usually have to settle for guyss making them getting one aspect right, but rarely more than that.

And you're right, but it's not just the marketing, so you don't have to get so worked up if that means anything to you. The art/sound style takes itself seriously, it has to. Horror doesn't really work if it doesn't. Lovecraft himself works that way, he's not the best ever writer, he's a naive ascended fanboy with a bunch of rather good ideas and he was well aware of this, but if you let the guy take himsef seriously his literature is enjoyable and atmoshperic despite it's obvious flaws. He's probably the best ever pulp author, but he's ultimately a pulp author if you look at it too hard. These guys, despite their lack of ideas and ambitions as game makers, had the good fortune of finding an artist and sticking to a general art direction (including sound) that manages to convey this. This worked for Lovecraft, and it worked for them, too. It can be infuriating to someone who sees the mechanics to be as lacking as they are, as the seriousness of the art direction is in contrast to what's actually there, that's easy to understand. The game sells itself as more hardcore than it is in-game, just because of it's genre and considerable execution in the art department.

What imbalances are you talking about precisely? I've played it recently without getting emotionally involved, I wonder if you could explain without getting worked up.

 

[Eyestabber]

Celerity

Lujo,

I'm neither young nor idealistic.

Celerity,

ITT: love letters

 

[Xor]

I wonder if you could explain without getting worked up.

I very much doubt that.

The reason people are repeatedly and mercilessly shitting on Celerity is because, while he valid points about the game design in Darkest Dungeon, he won't shut the fuck up about it until everyone acknowledges that those decisions make the game completely worthless. He's convinced there is absolutely no value to be found in the game, and so anyone who does enjoy it was just 'tricked', and if they played for more than two hours they'd realize how much it sucked. This is, of course, completely contrary to reality, where it seems like depending on your tolerance for grinding most people can get 15-50 hours out of the game before getting bored with it, which is more than enough for a $20 indie title in my opinion.

I'm sure Celerity's hate boner for Red Hook was born when he started criticizing their design decisions and they wouldn't immediately acquiesce to the changes he demanded, so he kept insisting in his forceful, arrogant style until they just got sick of it. After how he's acted here I have difficulty believing they are the assholes in this. If you were a game developer and some nutjob kept spamming about how much your game sucked not only on your own forum, but fucking everywhere the game was discussed, you'd probably get sick of his shit and ban him too.

Ultimately Darkest Dungeon could have been a better game, but that's not a crime. Lots of games could have been better. When deciding whether it was worth purchasing, the only question I'd ask is, did you have fun with it and for how long? And he put well over 1000 hours into it. So if it really sucks as much as he says it does, what does that say about him?

 

[Invictus]

The Jim Fucking Sterling bit was added by some butthurt developer of a shitty ass game called killing grounds or killing fields got a very unfavorable report and review from Jim and decided to start a flame war with him... It gave his game 5 seconda of notoriety and then his game got pulled out of Steam
And comparing Celerity to Mr Blakemore is beyond unfair; one is a glorified "modder" who all he did was mess to some text files and think he could do better than everybody else deciding what was best for the game (including the developers) while another has been devloping the greatest retro gaming rog by himself for almost 20 years...and has a pretty fucking good demo to prove it

 

[Lujo]

I don't actually mind folks shittalking devs, devs are very often hacks and they end up with money, fame and recognition for sub-par products all the time. And, well, Celerity might've made himself the joke of the internet but I find it refreshing to see someone at least be a proper nuisance here and there. Everybody's too positive about game development, every time something is not utter carp folks get into an asskissing frenzy over modest achievements. The way he's doing it is awful, granted, but it's not like I don't understand the impulse or can't admire it when someone goes full FML and says stuff like that. Since I've got problems with that myself I was curious if some kind of conversation could be struck up without bashing the person, I mean, he's done a suicide allready, yeah, I suppose everyone's exasperated with him by this point, but I was pretty let down by the game too. Since he's done way too much thinking about it I might as well pick his brain for some insights to help me form my own opinion better. I don't mind him not having manners, either, I'm from the Balkans, I find folks with manners dishonest instinctively, it's a cultural thing. it's just unhelpful to everbody occasionally, and getting this worked up about it is bad for your mental health (I do know I have a hard time listening to anyone who tells me that, though, but it's interesting to be on that side of the argument for once).

I posted my opinion on a different forum with no clue of his suicidal spectacle and it boiled down to the game being "pretentious". It's a shame, it's got the style right, but as far as "christ, why did this have to be a hackjob, could've been so much more" goes it's quite a big one. Nothing you can do about it, though. Reason it didn't hit me emotionally was because I kinda spotted this on time thanks in part (indirectly) to his raving around, but I bought it looking for something grindy and shallow to replace Kinghts of Pen and paper on my tablet. It's ideal for that, except... Why wasn't it a mobile-only thing?

But I would like to see what he thinks made it impossible to mod right, because it's an interesting topic. I'm not sure anyone actually asked him that.

 

[Renevent]

Hell even Jim Fucking Sterling is telling Celerity to fuck off in the comments section from his review on the game

That's gotta cut deep considering how much he idolizes him...

 

[Neanderthal]

The Jim Fucking Sterling bit was added by some butthurt developer of a shitty ass game called killing grounds or killing fields got a very unfavorable report and review from Jim and decided to start a flame war with him... It gave his game 5 seconda of notoriety and then his game got pulled out of Steam
And comparing Celerity to Mr Blakemore is beyond unfair; one is a glorified "modder" who all he did was mess to some text files and think he could do better than everybody else deciding what was best for the game (including the developers) while another has been devloping the greatest retro gaming rog by himself for almost 20 years...and has a pretty fucking good demo to prove it

Cheers Invictus. Ere that Grimoire demo worth a gander then, ant eard much about this Cleve bloke since hearin about SirTech drama, so i've been wonderin?

 

[Ivan]

So I totally forgot about the Swine King and I killed Wilbur on the first round....he nearly annihilated my party. Then, at the end, he had my party on Death's Door, it was his turn again, he was about to use his melee move when all of a sudden the entire party DODGED.

 

[Jimmious]

So I totally forgot about the Swine King and I killed Wilbur on the first round....he nearly annihilated my party. Then, at the end, he had my party on Death's Door, it was his turn again, he was about to use his melee move when all of a sudden the entire party DODGED.

Haha I did this mistake back in EA... My party was not that lucky

 

[Invictus]

The Jim Fucking Sterling bit was added by some butthurt developer of a shitty ass game called killing grounds or killing fields got a very unfavorable report and review from Jim and decided to start a flame war with him... It gave his game 5 seconda of notoriety and then his game got pulled out of Steam
And comparing Celerity to Mr Blakemore is beyond unfair; one is a glorified "modder" who all he did was mess to some text files and think he could do better than everybody else deciding what was best for the game (including the developers) while another has been devloping the greatest retro gaming rog by himself for almost 20 years...and has a pretty fucking good demo to prove it

Cheers Invictus. Ere that Grimoire demo worth a gander then, ant eard much about this Cleve bloke since hearin about SirTech drama, so i've been wonderin?

It damn great demo, easily over 30 hours of gameplay and while it is a bit bare you inmediatly will know if you like it or not
You can find it right here in the Codex

 

[Invictus]

The swine king is the big ass pig with the little pig behind him? I thought you were supposed to kill the piggy first because he marks you and makes his attacks much more damaging
That fight was fucking brutal on mu first try
I kind of deslike that all bosses so far sit behind their summons or whatever so you have to have a good long range fighter and of course blight and bleed to danage them while you concentrate on their helpers

 

[Zombra]

I rest my case.

We should be so lucky.

What strategies are you guys using when leveling the hamlet?

I'm using terrible strategies.

* Only one of each hero class in the roster. If one dies, I replace him next opportunity. This is not a "strategy" so much as "how I like to play".

* Town upgrades, pretty much whenever I see I can afford one, I spend the relics, unless it's for something I never use. Even if my whole roster dies, town upgrades are forever.

* Skill buying, OK, I'm learning to only buy skills I actually want. Pumping up skills (that I use) to max level whenever I can, it's very cheap at low levels and makes a huge difference.

* Never removing bad Quirks at the asylum. More will appear later so why bother. Also as the heroes level up, this becomes astronomically expensive.

* Always plow my highest stress heroes into the Abbey and the Tavern, as much as I can afford. With a small roster I need to maximize everyone's availability.

* Bail out of every dungeon run early if things start getting weird.

* Go in with minimum supplies since I'll probably bail out anyway. 4 food, ~4 torches, and maybe a shovel if I'm feeling flush. (That hand digging stress damage is horrible.)

I guess when I come back from a run the main question is "Where do I need to spend this gold?" I prioritize:
1) Set aside 1000 or so for next run supplies
2) Stress relief
3) Treat disease
4) Skill increase
5) Weapon/armor upgrades

 

[Jimmious]

Interesting, I think I have the exact opposite mindset as far as gold,supplies and runs go.
I always care to have at least 5-6k available for supplies because I hate not having the one thing that was necessary for more loot.
Also I try to finish every run as completely as possible, only if someone is on the verge of death I will run away!

But for the roster I have more or less the same idea, I must have one of each at least and the rest depends on who is the least gimped. Also at least 2 Vestals cause we need dat healing

 

[Zombra]

I always care to have at least 5-6k available for supplies because I hate not having the one thing that was necessary for more loot.

It's certainly an interesting balance. Any "leftovers" are sold back for 1/3 (?) of cost, so I consider anything unused to be money wasted (and every gp counts with my careless management skillz). Plus on my last run my inventory actually filled up so I was throwing stuff away. Travel light, that's my motto.

Also I try to finish every run as completely as possible, only if someone is on the verge of death I will run away!

This has been interesting for me too. As a gamer, my beginnings were very very "completionist" and I have those impulses to this day. In Wasteland 2 for example, before leaving Arizona I went back and revisited every location to make sure I opened every safe and fought every available static battle ... even though all the rewards were entirely disposable. In this game I only care about one thing: mission completion.* Once I hit that, it's "Party time at the tavern the fuck OUT of here!" I figure since all my "wandering" time has an equal chance of generating random loot, it makes the most sense to maximize the number of completion rewards per wandering hour.

*And secret rooms when I manage to scout them. The treasure in there is bomb. I may add a skeleton key to my standard provisions once gold inflates enough to make them cheap.

 

[Grampy_Bone]

The swine king is the big ass pig with the little pig behind him? I thought you were supposed to kill the piggy first because he marks you and makes his attacks much more damaging
That fight was fucking brutal on mu first try
I kind of deslike that all bosses so far sit behind their summons or whatever so you have to have a good long range fighter and of course blight and bleed to danage them while you concentrate on their helpers

Swine King tips:

Spoiler

If you damage Wilbur at all the Swine king retaliates with a very strong attack. You can stun Wilbur with a non-damaging attack and then the King is easy. You can also bring an Arbalest to dispel the marks, but stun is usually enough.

Or just wail on the king and he dies in a couple rounds... The game's whole schtick is tricking you into using stupid tactics against the bosses.

 

[Zombra]

Blah, spoiler tags would be good if you're going to ruin all the boss tricks.

 

[Grampy_Bone]

I always care to have at least 5-6k available for supplies because I hate not having the one thing that was necessary for more loot.

It's certainly an interesting balance. Any "leftovers" are sold back for 1/3 (?) of cost, so I consider anything unused to be money wasted (and every gp counts with my careless management skillz). Plus on my last run my inventory actually filled up so I was throwing stuff away. Travel light, that's my motto.

Sorry mate, never considered boss strats spoilers. Didn't you ever trade Metroid and Zelda tips in the lunchroom?

Anyway, I was going to say that unused item refunds are 5%, only slightly better than nothing, so being frugal is wise. However a Warrens or Cove run usually yields at least 1/2/3 curios (based on length) that removes negative quirks when the right item is used.

 

[Zombra]

Didn't you ever trade Metroid and Zelda tips in the lunchroom?

Yeah, but only after I got to some part I couldn't beat. Gotta give myself a chance to figure it out on my own first No big swig though.

 

[Ivan]

also,