Game News Deathfire Cancelled

[Blaine]

Well, I'm familiar with SMT2 (played through about a half of it, I think) - and it's nothing remotely close to a decent blobber. The story is typical convoluted anime shit, and random battles each two steps (kinda jrpg trademark too) make it just an enormous exercise in tedium.

Random battles every few steps and convoluted (or more likely, poorly translated) stories were JRPG trademarks back in the early 90s, yes.

I'd say that Strange Journey is the apex of the series, since the next SMT appears to be headed back toward trannies with wacky haircuts doing stupid shit in Tokyo, and inferior map design.

 

[V_K]

It's funny how everyone is fine with tons of games using Diablo's four stats, but D&D is such a sacred cow that a single (not even the first) game (that won't be released anyway) to copy its attributes causes such .

 

[Lady_Error]

It's funny how everyone is fine with tons of games using Diablo's four stats, but D&D is such a sacred cow that a single (not even the first) game (that won't be released anyway) to copy its attributes causes such .

It seems like people need to justify their personal dislike of Henkel with some seemingly rational arguments.

 

[Blaine]

It seems like people need to justify their personal dislike of Henkel with some seemingly rational arguments.

In most cases, you're confusing dislike of Guido Henkel with criticism of the way the project was conceived, handled, and/or presented. This is a textbook example of taking criticism personally, which he himself has been doing, and which you're doing right now by proxy.

You don't need to defend the man's honor at every turn during this postmortem. It's natural for people to think of ways in which this or that could have been handled better, presented better, pitched better, or improved upon hearing the news of the project's cancellation.

 

[theSavant]

I find it suspicious how intense Lady Error defends Guido every single time. Admit it, you're his wife!!

 

[Lady_Error]

It's very simple really: there is justified criticism and there is BS. I see nothing wrong in calling the BS for what it is.

True, his RPG's are among my favorites AND unlike people like D.W. Bradley he does recognize what today's RPG's are missing.

 

[GeorgesDimitrov]

The fact that it would have been Grimrock with NPC's, story and different locations is outstanding in itself. Tell me just one other game that does that.

Well, the game I'm developing is exactly that, and I'm not dropping it.

And I'm personally sad to see Deathfire go down the drain, it's a game I was looking forward to play, myself. But I agree he was asking too much and seeing too big for what is still a niche genre.

 

[Blaine]

...unlike people like D.W. Bradley he does recognize what today's RPG's are missing.

Sounds like BS to me.

Spoiler

What are they missing, dragons?

 

[InspectorRumpole]

The fact that it would have been Grimrock with NPC's, story and different locations is outstanding in itself. Tell me just one other game that does that.

The in-party banter is pretty outstanding too.

MMX?

Yeah, only MMX and Grimoire.

Let's not forget this one http://www.olderbytes.com/genre/swords-and-sorcery/sovereign

 

[Lady_Error]

...unlike people like D.W. Bradley he does recognize what today's RPG's are missing.

Sounds like BS to me.

Spoiler

What are they missing, dragons?

Seems like I have been talking to a troll all this time.

1. Fucking TB combat (D.W. Bradley said he is happy that the "limitations of TB combat" have been overcome by technology.)

2. Party-based RPG's.

3. Step-based engines. It's not everyone's cup of tea, but there are enough people who liked it in Grimrock and who support it in MMX.

 

[Lady_Error]

Let's not forget this one http://www.olderbytes.com/genre/swords-and-sorcery/sovereign

Did you play the first one - Swords & Sorcery: Underworld?

 

[Blaine]

Seems like I have been talking to a troll all this time.

Not exactly, but if you're going to blanket dismiss everything you disagree with as "BS," then there's no point having a discussion, is there?

You should call it "poppycock" by the way, it's much more monocled.

 

[Lady_Error]

Methinks you were the one who dismissed what I said as "BS", not the other way round...

 

[Blaine]

Methinks you were the one who dismissed what I said as "BS", not the other way round...

Where's that?

 

[Lady_Error]

Sounds like BS to me.

 

[Mortmal]

I cant understand why people are happy to see this failing, sure the game could sucks, like everything its more likely than it being good of course.This wasnt worse looking than might and magic 10 , that doesnt bode well for rpgs future. Look on steam , there's nothing cheaper than rpgs nowadays (except bethesda blockbusters), and they get discounts very fast.
This means our hobby is not viewed as viable business , theres nothing going faster on -75% than rpgs. Conquistadore went on sale only a few months after release, blackguard get -50% before its even released! Theres rumor of a -75% on might and magic 10 soon . Those games are dirt cheap yet it seems they dont even sell.I am pretty sure underrail will follow the same path or end up in one of the humble bundle too.

 

[Blaine]

Sounds like BS to me.

I was quoting you blanket dismissing others' opinions and observations as BS. There's a troll icon in the same post. Are you really that dense?

Wait a minute, why am I still having this conversation?

I cant understand why people are happy to see this failing, sure the game could sucks, like everything its more likely than it being good of course.

Talk to the broke-ass and/or tightfisted old-school cRPG players who refuse buy any game for more than $10, after first pirating it and then playing it for three weeks to make absolutely sure they want it (some people live in countries with high exchange rates, etc.; obviously, there are exceptions to be made). The fine gentlemen of the Codex Diversity Squad Steam group, for example, are known to cheat the system in order to get Russian prices on Steam whenever possible/convenient. The Codex is full of these people. I pledged $100 to Deathfire, which I imagine places me squarely in the top 1% of Codexers where the aforementioned project is concerned.

Most of you are over 30. Get a real fucking job, and stop Scrooging on computer games so you can spend the savings on tobacco and liquor. I wasn't born yesterday, I know how people tend to operate. If it's a priority, they find a way, unless they're truly impoverished.

Die-hard old-schoolers pledging higher amounts of money likely wouldn't have saved Deathfire, but in general, it's a step in the right direction.

 

[Broseph]

Sounds like BS to me.

I was quoting you blanket dismissing others' opinions and observations as BS. There's a troll icon in the same post. Are you really that dense?

Wait a minute, why am I still having this conversation?.

Shitposter. Put him on ignore and be done with it.

 

[Davaris]

I cant understand why people are happy to see this failing, sure the game could sucks, like everything its more likely than it being good of course.This wasnt worse looking than might and magic 10 , that doesnt bode well for rpgs future. Look on steam , there's nothing cheaper than rpgs nowadays (except bethesda blockbusters), and they get discounts very fast.
This means our hobby is not viewed as viable business , theres nothing going faster on -75% than rpgs. Conquistadore went on sale only a few months after release, blackguard get -50% before its even released! Theres rumor of a -75% on might and magic 10 soon . Those games are dirt cheap yet it seems they dont even sell.I am pretty sure underrail will follow the same path or end up in one of the humble bundle too.

Yeah, that's capitalism for you. RPGS are harder to make than any other game, yet are valued the same as games made in 4 months.

At least developers have Kickstarter now, so they don't have to bet the farm to see what players want. Imagine if Guido and friends had taken out loans on their houses, to learn their game had hardly any paying customers. This is a better result than that.

 

[Infinitron]

Theres rumor of a -75% on might and magic 10 soon

Random retards in the Steam community hub are not credible sources of information

 

[FeelTheRads]

This wasnt worse looking than might and magic 10

But but I don't liek Guido he's asshole u see not like the very nice pppl here at NiceCodex. Ubisoft on the other hand.. oh, Ubisoooooooft

 

[Zboj Lamignat]

Oh look, another case of people wanting to see an old school crpg changed into another BG/Fallout, because they don't actually like crpgs as a genre. Gee, who would've thought. I guess it's high time to drop this "prestigious old school connoisseur" mask, no one falls for it any more.

I also enjoy the "no one likes blobbers, no market for them" statements. Apart from the fact that they should preferably see you get taken behind a shed and shot, there was never a better market for games like these on this side of 2000. I mean, Etrian Odyssey IV got 9 on goddamn IGN and it's a game that's more difficult and "inaccessible" than anything western "crpg" developers were able to put up in the last 15 years.

 

[mondblut]

I also enjoy the "no one likes blobbers, no market for them" statements. Apart from the fact that they should preferably see you get taken behind a shed and shot, there was never a better market for games like these on this side of 2000. I mean, Etrian Odyssey IV got 9 on goddamn IGN and it's a game that's more difficult and "inaccessible" than anything western "crpg" developers were able to put up in the last 15 years.

I dunno, bro. Sure, there must be more potential Wizardry fans than 15 years ago, if only by the virtue of more people growing up than dying, but production values on PC skyrocketed way steeper. Grimrock alone is a proof enough. And I guess an idea of resigning himself to an indie ghetto niche, abandoning any hope of attracting anybody who didn't grown playing Crusaders of Dark Savant back in the day and wallowing in obscurity alongside KOTC and Swords & Sorcery is hard to swallow for a career professional who used to be in the biggest industry magazines. He's no longer a 20 years old student coding his first game for fun. He desires money and fame, and is perfectly entitled to do so.

If he went handheld and mobile instead, where production values are as low as 15 years ago, would he really do any better? Perhaps, but I am not using iShit, so I am not gonna know nor care. Besides, pocket blobber devs don't seem particularly healthy either. Redshift is barely known and haven't released anything for a long while, Undercroft devs are long forgotten, and even Atlus, with all their popular animufag franchises, aren't inclined to risk more than a single blobber every couple of years. While "spiritual sequels" and "worked at X 20 years ago" don't really work without a marketing powerhouse and a stellar cast fueling them.

tl;dr: Grimrock was a lucky strike. Don't expect any new blobbers costing more than some $50k to make, ever. If MMX succeeds on riding that nostalgia wave, that might reanimate other franchises with a name loud enough. I wouldn't be surprised by a reboot of EOB or Lands of Lore, or western/PC release of those animufucked Wizardry games. But something brand new from somebody long forgotten? Not gonna happen.

 

[theSavant]

Leave Deathfire in peace, it's dead already.

Besides, there is a market for blobbers... if someone would just announce the next Wizardry 9 and show CryEngine visuals in a Kickstarter demo, I'm sure 500K funding could be achieved. That however is not much, and I'm slowly starting to agree that this type of game is so niche, that it wouldn't reach 1 Million

 

[DraQ]

It's very simple really: there is justified criticism and there is BS. I see nothing wrong in calling the BS for what it is.

Even oblivious would deserve defense from bullshit criticism, if only because they dilute legitimate arguments and legitimize blanket dismissal of all critique in people's eyes.

1. Fucking TB combat (D.W. Bradley said he is happy that the "limitations of TB combat" have been overcome by technology.)

2. Party-based RPG's.

Those two actually go hand in hand.
I may prefer single character + followers model with FPS style control and RT combat, but party based can be fun too, especially if you get to build the whole party (which sort of legitimizes full control over multiple characters in my eyes - it irks me in for example BG that you recruit pre-established characters with their own agendas and they suddenly become your unquestioning zombie slaves) and for party control ordinary RT or even RTWP is simply unwieldy and leads to clusterfuckery.
The technological limitations requiring TB are inherent to HID and partially humans themselves. The former haven't really changed much since computer mice became the norm and are unlikely to change until some sort of direct neural interfaces become one, while the latter won't change much barring transhumanism.
Anyone claiming that the need for TB has been overcome by technology is simply full of shit, just like anyone who, for example would propose doing away with overhead point&click interface for strategies, demanding that player controls every individual unit in FPP instead switching around as needed.

3. Step-based engines. It's not everyone's cup of tea, but there are enough people who liked it in Grimrock and who support it in MMX.

And this is actually something that has long since been overcome by technology.