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Divinity: Original Sin Pre-Release Thread

Roguey

Codex Staff
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It's you that misunderstood me. DAEDALIC changed the difficulty of their game just because "press members" said it was frustratingly hard. What I'm saying is that Larian shouldn't take these popamoles opinions as "best feedback ever" and make big changes based on what they say.
The press and other beta testers.

Like that thing. That thing what'shisname talks about. Perhaps they should teach players how to play their complicated mess instead of taking a hatchet to difficulty, but only a crazy person would want to do that, right?

The game will be delayed obviously.
As I mentioned in the news post (repeating here for those who didn't bother), they literally can't do this because of the contracts they have with retailers. February 28 come hell or high water. :)
 

Mortmal

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Oh god... ForkTong , please don't listen to these feedback as THE TRUTH!!!111... I we just learned that Daedalic nerfed the dificulty in Blackguards to please "press people", and it was the dumbest thing they could ever do...

If they do the same thing i will completely lose interest into it, i dont give money to have games tailored to mainstream tastes.
 

felipepepe

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Like that thing. That thing what'shisname talks about. Perhaps they should teach players how to play their complicated mess instead of taking a hatchet to difficulty, but only a crazy person would want to do that, right?
Yeah, everyone should follow the example of the project director that is such a corporate bitch that he develops a dumb game for popamole causals and then makes a unofficial patch for his own game so it can be slightly challenging to play for someone who isn't brain dead.
 

felipepepe

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Why are Youtubers giving design advice to a fucking game developer?
Because those so called youtubers are actually gamers just like the rest of the people that pledge for original sin. You don't have to be a game designer to give feedback on a Alpha.
Problem is not the feedback per se, but the weight they have. They are already going into open alpha and beta, with thousand of people giving feedback... making changes based on what 2 people say, just because they are press seems foolish.
 

LeJosh

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Are they changing anything based on their feedback? Most of the time they talk nonsense, arsebiscuit and crew that is.
 

hoverdog

dog that is hovering, Wastelands Interactive
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Why are Youtubers giving design advice to a fucking game developer?

Because those so called youtubers are actually gamers just like the rest of the people that pledge for original sin. You don't have to be a game designer to give feedback on a Alpha.
Hey Scott, have you managed to understand how THAC0 and AC work yet?
 

Roguey

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Guys, chill. Trust Larian to deliver.
That'd be a first! :)

Yeah, everyone should follow the example of the project director that is such a corporate bitch that he develops a dumb game for popamole causals and then makes a unofficial patch for his own game so it can be slightly challenging to play for someone who isn't brain dead.
That was actually a great decision so I don't understand the sarcasm...?

There were quite a few people in the target demographic (Fallout 3 fans) who thought the base game was too hard. When your potential audience is in the millions there's no way you're going to make the perfect game for all of them so you have to find a middle ground that's acceptable to most of 'em (and he did).
 

Zed

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Codex USB, 2014
Divinity: Original Sin, even after all these months, still sounds like one of the most stupid titles ever. It will never roll off the tongue. They should rename it.
 

Athelas

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I imagine 'original sin' refers to the sin that was naming their previous game 'Divine Divinity'.
 
Last edited:

LeJosh

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Divinity: Original Sin, even after all these months, still sounds like one of the most stupid titles ever. It will never roll off the tongue. They should rename it.

'Divinity: Sins of the Divine using Divination'. Of course.

:troll:

I really hope they announce alpha today but I know better than that. :(
 

LeJosh

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If he said that, I didn't hear him.

That's cool though, got other games to get through whilst I wait, admittedly I didn't read all of the update. :oops:
 

Infinitron

I post news
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Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
There is no specific new date for the alpha, other than "before Christmas".
 

felipepepe

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That was actually a great decision so I don't understand the sarcasm...?

There were quite a few people in the target demographic (Fallout 3 fans) who thought the base game was too hard. When your potential audience is in the millions there's no way you're going to make the perfect game for all of them so you have to find a middle ground that's acceptable to most of 'em (and he did).
The patch came more than a year after the game was released, and required all DLCs to work. The game already had FIVE difficulty settings - and even a "Hardcore Mode" -, and yet it was dumb easy, with lazy difficulty changes that simply makes enemies bullet-sponges. And J.E. Sawyer A.K.A. PROJECT DIRECTOR of this mess, clearly aware that it wasn't challenging, chose to release it this way, so that even the most brain dead retard could finish it on HARDCORE MODE, get his achievemnts and tell mommy how aweshum he is.

Should we expect the same "great decision" on P:E as well? The game comes out with a Super-Duper-Aweshum-Hardcore mode, that every Kickstarter backer and their grandmother can beat on Max Difficulty; and maybe, after a year of so - if we buy all DLCs - Sawyer will release a unofficial patch to make it somewhat challenging.

Guess that also means you should bite your tongue and wait at least a year before talking about Blackguards for dumbing down the game... maybe a developer will make a unofficial patch to solve everything...
 

tuluse

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Jul 20, 2008
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Serpent in the Staglands Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Shadorwun: Hong Kong
Fallout New Vegas is made for the mainstream console crowd, PE isn't. The fact that he correctly identified the difficulty level of his target audience before is a good sign.
 

Gord

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Fallout New Vegas is made for the mainstream console crowd, PE isn't. The fact that he correctly identified the difficulty level of his target audience before is a good sign.

Quick! Quarantine him! He catched the Roguey, I think it might be contagious!
 

Commissar Draco

Codexia Comrade Colonel Commissar
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Insert Title Here Strap Yourselves In Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Divinity: Original Sin 2
To be fair FNV was game made under the specifications established by Bethpizda and we know they avoid any challenge to their player customer base; Fallout belongs to :hearnoevil::balance: now unlike whatever PE universe is (it is some usual Elves, Magic and shit so who cares) so I am ready to give Obsidian the chance to use their creative Freedom to full extent.
 

Roguey

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Yeah, he even managed to make all 5 difficulty settings AND the Hardcore Mode for the mainstream console crowd... such a good sign.
The difficulty settings were an inherited feature from Bethesda. No one at Obsidian touched them.
http://new.spring.me/#!/JESawyer/q/251429575664343670
http://new.spring.me/#!/JESawyer/q/251387678707157226
http://new.spring.me/#!/JESawyer/q/337684495043947002

Guess that also means you should bite your tongue and wait at least a year before talking about Blackguards for dumbing down the game... maybe a developer will make a unofficial patch to solve everything...
I will not.
http://new.spring.me/#!/JESawyer/q/332069220244288050
Frustration is a fundamental element of "real" games, with gamers pushing past the frustration to achieve a sense of triumph. As designers, our goal should always be to find the right balance point for our audience. If the argument is that the gaming audience is much larger and, therefore, less h4rdc0r3 because the pool has been diluted, okay, but it's still our job to find the right balance points and feature set for the audience and its different segments.

One of the reasons I really wanted to include Hardcore Mode in F:NV was because I recognized that there was a significant chunk of the audience that would likely want something a bit tougher than sliding HP and DAM values around. I don't think Hardcore Mode is "really" hard, but compared to the default mode, it does require more attention and a bit more care in combat.

I know there's a subset of that group that wants things even more brutal and survivalist-oriented, for whom even the JSawyer mod doesn't go far enough. I don't think we should try to make everyone happy, but I do think that as developers we should recognize and try to appeal to the major "chunks" of our audience. With 5 million+ players, I don't think it's realistic to think one play still will fit all. And I don't think that saying, "Well, it's hard," absolves us of responsibility. We get paid pretty good money to figure out how people will play games. We should probably put some effort into actually understanding the audience and designing things that will work for them.
http://new.spring.me/#!/JESawyer/q/1053454931
Does focus testing serve any real purpose in game design/balancing or does it stifle creativity?
It's a useful tool, but you have to weigh the feedback appropriately. If you really want everyone from grandmas to babies to enjoy playing your game, you have to be willing to really alter the experience a lot. If you're making Elitist Cool Guy Video Game 2010, then you're probably going to a) focus test a very specific group of people b) ignore a lot of negative feedback if it goes against a different goal than "making people happy". If you're really not interested in audience acceptance, focus testing probably isn't necessary/important at all.

I mean, would Duchamp's "Fountain" be more successful with focus testing? Who cares?

That part about the Elitist Cool Guy Video Game is pretty key. Daedalic and Larian have to ask themselves who they want their core audience to be (Obsidian already knows). Considering his desire to make a RPG to dwarf them all, it's clear that Vincke wants to sell millions. Well, that comes with costs unless he's willing to make it more likely that it'll be the last game he ever makes. Daedalic's actions are more puzzling, considering their budget. They got "This is great, keep it this tough" and "this is too difficult" and pretty much told the former audience they could fuck off because they didn't have the numbers to sustain them. Of course shovelware is all about maximizing the ROI. :)
 

abnaxus

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Daedalic games are shovelware now too?

:cmcc:
 

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