From Software Elden Ring - From Software's new game with writing by GRRM

[Halfling Rodeo]

Isn't all this complicated even more knowing that the shattering war happened 5000 years before the events of the game? Like the world was in the state we find it in when we start the game for 5k years before us...

How does this complicate anything? For 5k or so years the world was in a cosntant state of war between demigods and their followers, whith everyone endlessly respawning and being unable to die. It's honestly the only way to make the setting have any kind of sense. All the buildings that are left are basically castles/military bases/capital cities and everything else is in ruins. With most people slowly being driven mad because they can't die.

The sky city falling to the earth probably didn't help matters.

 

[Skinwalker]

Isn't all this complicated even more knowing that the shattering war happened 5000 years before the events of the game? Like the world was in the state we find it in when we start the game for 5k years before us...

How do you know it's 5000 years?

 

[Nathir]

Who are the angels described in the Winged Scythe and what's the reasoning behind it dropping feathers in it's art? I thought there was no such thing as Angels in the Lands Between?

What came first, the Crucible people, the Nox people or the Dragons? All these seem (almost) extinct civilizations.

What's the difference between Destined and provoked Death ?

During Ranni quest, her followers seem to remotely, spiritually project while their bodies are alive (sleeping?) somewhere else. This suggest the Lands Between is indeed an afterlife of sorts. Right?

1. Does it matter? It's a one of description on this single item. And it even says "according to pagan belief", trying to say it might not be true, or it used to be true a long time ago. Why even think angels? Considering this game is norse/celtic inspired I thought it's talking about some sort of valkyries. But it doesn't matter, you are overthinking 1 random line.

2. Dragons and crucible first, then Nox.

3. What's provoked Death? You mean normal death? I think destined way is just a way to say you will kill someone for good, considering people respawn when they die destined death is a special term just to to say someone will truly stay dead I think.

4. Maybe the lands are an afterlife of sorts, it does feel that way at times. But personally I don't think that's the case. There is a clear divide between the spirit and the physical world in this game and I don't know exactly how it all works.

In the case of Ranni followers they could just be using magic though. As they are all Carians and sitting in their home turf anyway.

 

[Halfling Rodeo]

In the case of Ranni followers they could just be using magic though. As they are all Carians and sitting in their home turf anyway.

Or Elden Rings retarded and you can be in multiple places at once. As we see from many characters. You don't need special magic to have a phantom or even a flesh and blood clone of you be some where else.

 

[Nathir]

In the case of Ranni followers they could just be using magic though. As they are all Carians and sitting in their home turf anyway.

Or Elden Rings retarded and you can be in multiple places at once. As we see from many characters. You don't need special magic to have a phantom or even a flesh and blood clone of you be some where else.

Which characters?

 

[Silva]

Yeah it's not just Ranni and co. Other people also seem to spiritually project. See Milicent and Latena, for eg.

In the case of Ranni followers they could just be using magic though. As they are all Carians and sitting in their home turf anyway.

Or Elden Rings retarded and you can be in multiple places at once. As we see from many characters. You don't need special magic to have a phantom or even a flesh and blood clone of you be some where else.

Wait, what do you mean by flesh and bone clones?

 

[Child of Malkav]

Isn't all this complicated even more knowing that the shattering war happened 5000 years before the events of the game? Like the world was in the state we find it in when we start the game for 5k years before us...

How does this complicate anything? For 5k or so years the world was in a cosntant state of war between demigods and their followers, whith everyone endlessly respawning and being unable to die. It's honestly the only way to make the setting have any kind of sense. All the buildings that are left are basically castles/military bases/capital cities and everything else is in ruins. With most people slowly being driven mad because they can't die.

5000 years is...a long time. A lot of stuff happens in the meantime which can and does have repercussions when it comes to understanding the lore. Overlapping battles, victories, defeats, army concentrations, equipment used, battles between demigods, artillery used, date and time of building, strategic defenses and structural collapses archaeologically speaking creates a ton of issues when trying to clarify what the hell happened, in what order, by who, to whom, considering that either a bunch of rubble fell over other debris (important or not) or terrain alterations over time (or suddenly considering the universe an the setting) cover or change up the face of the world, thus hiding or destroying clues or evidence of various events that will no longer be known. All of this muddies the waters tremendously in an already vague enough world.

Isn't all this complicated even more knowing that the shattering war happened 5000 years before the events of the game? Like the world was in the state we find it in when we start the game for 5k years before us...

How do you know it's 5000 years?

Read the link I posted.

 

[Nathir]

Isn't all this complicated even more knowing that the shattering war happened 5000 years before the events of the game? Like the world was in the state we find it in when we start the game for 5k years before us...

How does this complicate anything? For 5k or so years the world was in a cosntant state of war between demigods and their followers, whith everyone endlessly respawning and being unable to die. It's honestly the only way to make the setting have any kind of sense. All the buildings that are left are basically castles/military bases/capital cities and everything else is in ruins. With most people slowly being driven mad because they can't die.

5000 years is...a long time. A lot of stuff happens in the meantime which can and does have repercussions when it comes to understanding the lore. Overlapping battles, victories, defeats, army concentrations, equipment used, battles between demigods, artillery used, date and time of building, strategic defenses and structural collapses archaeologically speaking creates a ton of issues when trying to clarify what the hell happened, in what order, by who, to whom, considering that either a bunch of rubble fell over other debris (important or not) or terrain alterations over time (or suddenly considering the universe an the setting) cover or change up the face of the world, thus hiding or destroying clues or evidence of various events that will no longer be known. All of this muddies the waters tremendously in an already vague enough world.

I think you are just overthinking things for no reason. The game is pretty clear on which events happened before and after the Shattering. As for specific battles, armies, equipment, dates etc. Why do these specifics even matter? The game tells you Rykard and Morgott are fighting each other and you can see that when you climb up to Volcano Manor. Would the story be better if someone told you the fight started in year 2000 of the shattering? That regiment XVI succumbed to madness in year 2756 just before reaching the top? Or whatever else. Everything important enough to know is there, and chronologically you can either easily tell in what sequence events happen, or it doesn't really matter.

 

[Halfling Rodeo]

In the case of Ranni followers they could just be using magic though. As they are all Carians and sitting in their home turf anyway.

Or Elden Rings retarded and you can be in multiple places at once. As we see from many characters. You don't need special magic to have a phantom or even a flesh and blood clone of you be some where else.

Which characters?

Wait, what do you mean by flesh and bone clones?

The omens both have actual solid versions of themselves in 2 places. Even if the 'real' ones already dead. Mogh is in the sewer and in the palace at the same time. and Margott is at Stormveil/the capital and outside the capital gates disguised as a soldier. They're the exact same look as the real ones so they're not astral projections or fakes like the gold guy in the capital or Ranni's cast's projections. There's also the wizard woman but I don't recall how her double works.

 

[Caim]

The omens both have actual solid versions of themselves in 2 places. Even if the 'real' ones already dead. Mogh is in the sewer and in the palace at the same time. and Margott is at Stormveil/the capital and outside the capital gates disguised as a soldier. They're the exact same look as the real ones so they're not astral projections or fakes like the gold guy in the capital or Ranni's cast's projections. There's also the wizard woman but I don't recall how her double works.

The weaker copies of the Omen Twins are implied to be some sort of magical creations rather than them being there in the flesh. Morgott's a guard to keep the weaker Tarnished away from Godrick, while Mogh's is meant to keep people from finding the Three Fingers. The latter's an interesting case since there is also a barrier in place if you haven't killed Morgott yet, so the twins for all their differences must've agreed that keeping the Flame of Frenzy sealed away is more important than their political disagreements.

 

[Skinwalker]

This game has a lot of characters making use of spectral projection/illusions to justify reusing boss fights.

Morgott fights you twice as an astral projection before you fight him a third time in his real body (1st time as Margitt, 2nd time as a missable encounter in the outskirts of Leyndell).

There's an illusion of Mohg in Leyndell sewers guarding the entrance to Three Fingers (real Mohg is deep underground in his mausoleum). Also, the illusory Godfrey near the entrance to the Erdtree.

It seems like the real Mohg and Godfrey are not in a position to actively maintain their illusory copies in Leyndell, and that Morgott may have been the one who put those there and that they act autonomously.

But really, it's just an excuse to reuse content across this giant game.

 

[Skinwalker]

The real mystary is the reuse of a physical body between Irina and Hyetta. Why did they do that? What did they mean by this? Hyetta is a spirit who possesses Irina's dead body the same way Shabubu possesses the dead Yura? Isn't she too genuinely naive and innocent for that (at least, at first)?

And why is Irina's dead body still in Weeping Penisula even after we meet the very much alive and identical Hyetta? Intentional hint that these are identical twins, down to identical clothing and identical bloodstains?

Or a glaring oversight that FromSoft couldn't be arsed to fix, even though it should take about five seconds to program "despawn Irina's body on first encounter with Hyetta"?

What was the point? There's no meaningful connections between Irina and Hyetta. Irina is barely even a character, with barely any questline. Why not give them different character models and just be done with it?

Are FS quest designers insane? Are FS quest designers trying to drive the players insane?

Are they succeeding?

 

[Halfling Rodeo]

Also, the illusory Godfrey near the entrance to the Erdtree.

That's the only illusion we have a proper reason for. Morgott is creating him the same way he does his weapons. He has the same gold sheen.

The actual clones seem to lack a reason for existing.

Are FS quest designers insane? Are FS quest designers trying to drive the players insane?

Are they succeeding?

When your fanbase is so rabid and retarded they will try to read From's used toilet paper for lore theories they don't have to put much effort in. Lore in From games changes in the day 1 patch so they obviously don't have a grand plan.

I'm tempted to get a character to the capital. I have a feeling it's the capital or just before the land of the giants where the DLC will take place. I want to be excited for it but my memories of Elden Ring are mostly being bored on Torrent now. I've tried to replay the game 2 or 3 times and unless it's randomized so the loot you pick up actually matters it's an incredibly boring experience. Once you realize the open world is entirely filler and you're rushing through it to get to the actual content most of your play time is wasteful.

 

[Child of Malkav]

I think you are just overthinking things for no reason. The game is pretty clear on which events happened before and after the Shattering.

Yeah, you're right, I shouldn't apply real life thinking to a game that had its "story" or more correctly random string of characters that hopefully produces legible text that's supposed to pass as "lore", 5 minutes before the game launches.

Why do these specifics even matter?

IRL, they would. In-game, they don't.
If the lore was very detailed every bit of information (no matter how obscure) would have been another piece in the puzzle but then again this is From we're talking about here.

BTW, just for lulz, here you go, an absurd example of...dedication or maybe mental illness. Of course I don't expect anyone to actually watch these. 35.75 hours of fever.

 

[Barbarian]

To be fair most older console rpgs(read jrpgs) had similar levels of sparse worldbuilding and inconsistencies left to the players imagination.

Still Elden Ring's setting and characters are more interesting and original than 99% of what is out there. It is one of the reasons for the game's success and why autists make the above linked deep dives on the barely exposed story background and setting lore.

 

[Barbarian]

As an example I would mention Bethesda with Oblivion and then Skyrim.

Would you admit that despite the effort with documentation and worldbuilding on the part of Bethesda's devs, Elden Ring has better world building and is the better game?

Also I would be arsed to remember any of the generic and dumb bethesda npcs and factions. Elden Ring's characters are quite memorable im contrast, as are the mentioned and presented factions, even with their sparse content and inconsistencies.

 

[Halfling Rodeo]

Still Elden Ring's setting and characters are more interesting and original than 99% of what is out there. It is one of the reasons for the game's success and why autists make the above linked deep dives on the barely exposed story background and setting lore.

The Lore has nothing to do with Souls series success. Dark souls got extremely popular out of Demon's souls cult fan base and being around at the right time to be streamed and viraled on /v/. Same way Minecraft did. Dark souls had a lot of hype and once it hit PC it became the gaymen cultural icon it is now. Elden ring isn't Elden Ring, It's Dark souls 4/5 in most people's minds. Lore videos didn't kick into high gear until late DaS2/Early DaS3 when these long essay formats got popular on youtube. If anything Lore videos had cooled off a lot by the time Elden ring released and there's way less interest in Elden Ring lore than Dark souls.

 

[Ezekiel]

What was the name of that white guy who stopped making lore videos after he had a baby in Japan?

 

[Child of Malkav]

What was the name of that white guy who stopped making lore videos after he had a baby in Japan?

ENB. Don't know his real name.

 

[Ezekiel]

What was the name of that white guy who stopped making lore videos after he had a baby in Japan?

ENB. Don't know his real name.

Right. I don't care about his real name. The only one whose content I ever got into, but I mostly stopped caring about the lore after I realized that too much of it was lazily stapled together and got tired of going into menus and searching to read descriptions that should be readable at the point of acquisition (which the protagonist of course has no way to internalize and are therefore bullshit). Think Dark Souls II was the last one where I actually read them. Did not watch his Let's Play videos.

 

[Halfling Rodeo]

What was the name of that white guy who stopped making lore videos after he had a baby in Japan?

I feel sorry for any white guy tricked into having a hapa baby. Imagine waiting to see your first born's eyes open and realizing that's it, they're never going to fully open their eyes. I some times wonder if Asians evolved to not see the butchery and rape they constant commit to each other. I'd feel bad for them being half blind but they're all dog eating pedos and they would be even worse if they could see.

What was the name of that white guy who stopped making lore videos after he had a baby in Japan?

ENB. Don't know his real name.

Right. I don't care about his real name. The only one whose content I ever got into, but I mostly stopped caring about the lore after I realized that too much of it was lazily stapled together and got tired of going into menus and searching to read descriptions that should be readable at the point of acquisition (which the protagonist of course has no way to internalize and are therefore bullshit). Think Dark Souls II was the last one where I actually read them. Did not watch his Let's Play videos.

The fanbase did more for Souls lore than the creators ever did. It was a cheap way to write it into the game and one guy could do it in an afternoon and retcon bits as the game evolved/the deadline hit and From had to cut content. Isn't there an interview out there admitting this is why they do it that way and haven't adapted better story telling methods?

 

[Skinwalker]

I feel sorry for any white guy tricked into having a hapa baby. Imagine waiting to see your first born's eyes open and realizing that's it, they're never going to fully open their eyes.

Anyway, lorefag videos are almost always made by mincing soyfags or nasal nerds and are impossible to listen to because of the annoying narrator voice alone. I have developed a severe allergy to any guy's voice that sounds nasal or effeminate, and will ragequit a video in the first 10 seconds based on that factor alone.

 

[Silverfish]

Would you admit that despite the effort with documentation and worldbuilding on the part of Bethesda's devs, Elden Ring has better world building and is the better game?

No. Elder Scrolls worldbuilding isn't anything too special for medieval fantasy settings, but it's consistent, easy to follow, filled with tons of dialogue and books that flesh things out and, weirdly for Bethesda, isn't quite as prone to "wait, what happened?" moments. The From style of being vague and leaving things open to interpretation is fine for shorter, more linear experiences like Demon's Souls or Bloodborne, but sucks the life out of a fifty hour open world exploration game.

So far as which is the better game? Of course, that's subject to taste, but it's pretty telling that From tried to adopt elements of Bethesda's style, not the other way around.

 

[v1rus]

The fanbase did more for Souls lore than the creators ever did. It was a cheap way to write it into the game and one guy could do it in an afternoon and retcon bits as the game evolved/the deadline hit and From had to cut content. Isn't there an interview out there admitting this is why they do it that way and haven't adapted better story telling methods?

I'd love a source on this.

Fucking lorecels.

 

[Silva]

I think you are just overthinking things for no reason. The game is pretty clear on which events happened before and after the Shattering. As for specific battles, armies, equipment, dates etc. Why do these specifics even matter? The game tells you Rykard and Morgott are fighting each other and you can see that when you climb up to Volcano Manor. Would the story be better if someone told you the fight started in year 2000 of the shattering? That regiment XVI succumbed to madness in year 2756 just before reaching the top? Or whatever else. Everything important enough to know is there, and chronologically you can either easily tell in what sequence events happen, or it doesn't really matter.

I just think there's too much random/bloat lore-wise, which surprises me, cause From usually presents great cohesion in world-building.

But I may be overthinking, yeah. I need to play more and STFU until I finish it and have a better picture.