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Elite: Dangerous

Morkar Left

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Using the 1 instead of the i doesn't really help you with bringing across your message. Then again, perhaps you intended to make it look like a mindless raving rant. Then you did succeed.

Nah, DU is just on a roll replacing "it" with "Rich Homie Cloaked", therefore 1t for better readabilitiy.


Personally I thought an overall faction and economy system would be in place accounting the players actions together with semi-random generated events. And handcrafted FD events only coming into play when they like 1t but not being the only provided "system" in place. Unfortunately 1t doesn't seem to be like that. There doesn't even seem to be a framework in place to expand on 1t. If implemented in the future they would have to do it from scratch. A significally additional development time. I'm not expecting any new big gameplay additions like planetfall or entering spacebars and doing missions in fps-mode.

That makes their decision for "online play only" very questionable.
 

praetor

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That makes their decision for "online play only" very questionable.

yup. i used to think it was the usual forcing of always online DRM "scam", but now i'm pretty confident that it was because they knew their backbone of the "simulation" was worthless, pathetic and could be done in 10mins by any half-competent SQL dev, realized it too late and forced always online so that they could babysit and change stuff ad hoc manually because there's no actual "sim"
 

Bradylama

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It is actually impossible for them to make all of these changes automatically. I've seen the changes occurring all across the universe with the 1.05 patch. They would need an entire team of galactic babysitters going through each individual system and changing the values to reflect player and AI metrics.
 

DraQ

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i think i'm done. this game is (currently, with next to 0 hope of change), at it's core, a colossal piece of shit and a borderline scam. they've removed offline because of the background sim, but the only thing the background sim actually is, is 2 SQL jobs that update the CommodityToSystem and FactionToSystem tables every X minutes. all the rest is done manually by the devs, and it doesn't seem it will ever change considering the 2 next big updates. it's no the dearth of content, but the core concept of how players and NPCs influence the galaxy that is so idiotic that it's painful. and the exploring is not even half as cool as SE because it's not even half as accurate or half as pretty. and with the changes planned for 1.1 they've also shown they're so bad and literally fucking stupid at balancing, it killed all my hopes the ship progression will be something else than "bigger = better" and in a couple of months all the 50 players playing will all have just trading Anacondas and combat Pythons with beam lasers and multicannons because everything else is pointless. this game should've just had an Arena Commander module for combat and be done with it, 'cause PvP is the only fun to be had in this game. btw, this post on reddit (gasp! yeah i know, but it's the only way to keep up with what's going on 'cause the forums are even more of a fanboy hugbox circlejerk than reddit ever was, and i vomit every time i visit there), was what made me "snap" and finally realize how bad and rotten to the core this "game" actually truly is. here's the post in full if you don't want to visit that shithole:

it likely just means we'll basically be doing the same thing that has already been done in Lugh, Mikuun etc. That is grinding missions until a quota is met, but with nothing really changing. A faction getting a capital ships impacts the game very little, amounting to a random % chance that it will jump into a conflict zone and look intimidating. Beyond that, the capital ships don't really do anything, so why should players be working towards this goal if nothing interesting will happen? Since factions don't seem to have any resources/autonomy of their own, the results will always be predictable and boring. The entire background simulation is anemic to the point of being practically fictional at this point, since seemingly everything is done by Frontier manually, such as spawning ships, expanding into unexplored territory, wars, etc.

The game suffers from an identity crisis, resulting in a bizarrely curated Frankengame. The pitch was a sandbox but lacks the reactive environment that allows for player creativity which makes sandboxes worthwhile. A sandbox without sand. Okay. So what can we do? Grind. Grind cookie cutter missions, cookie cutter bounties, or cookie cutter trade routes for cookie cutter rewards and cookie cutter +/- 0.0000001 faction influence that has the cookie cutter result of spawning cookie cutter conflict zones until red is green or blue is yellow. And once red is green, or blue is yellow? Nothing. I guess you could do it again. But the sad truth of the matter appears to be that there is just no A.I beyond basic combat routines and them pretending that they're doing something (when in reality, a lot of the time they just fly around aimlessly and then jump out/sit still doing literally nothing), and the only way that the galaxy can change beyond basic color swaps and cookie cutter missions is that Frontier has to manually do it. And with that, the sandbox is approach is effectively neutered. The moment to moment gameplay? Meaningless. All that matters is that at the end, Frontier racks up a tally and implements a predictable result, where nothing unexpected, new, or creative could happen.

Take the planned method for human space expanding for example

One of the other community goals will be a more involved process enabling the expansion into an unpopulated system. This will be a three stage process. The first step is for us and the DDF to establish a short list of candidate systems. The aim for this initial colony is to support further exploration and to act as a hub for other expansion in the region. Once we have the shortlist players will be invited to map the candidate systems and whichever system has the most data about it sold will be the target system. A community goal will then start to gather the resources needed to build an Ocellus starport that will be deployed in the chosen star system.

I don't want to participate in expanding into unpopulated systems like you describe it, Frontier. An arbitrary list compiled completely outside of the actual game, which Frontier will then instruct us to grind exploration data on, taking the tally and making the system that received the most grind the next to be colonized. This entire method has no gameplay value, and boils down to casting a vote. it could be done entirely without the game by doing just that, and opening a poll on the forums. Unfortunately, Frontier doesn't seem interested in developing the sterile, static, and superficial background simulation that seems less and less relevant in favor of Frontier curating every event in the game. it's like playing a game of D&D in group of 300 thousand other players, with a GM that presents you with a handful of predetermined actions with predetermined results, and has the 300 thousand cast a vote to choose both action and result in one fell swoop.

And really, I'm starting to wonder, why is this game even multiplayer? They have had to sacrifice so much because of the multiplayer and have gained so little.

They wanted this to be an MMO, but they didn't want to spend the money on servers. No servers and p2p matchmaking cripples the capability of what they can do. Want to prevent people from alt-f4ing? You can't, because it being p2p means that there is no server to track them and keep their character in the game world for 15 seconds to prevent combat logging. Want to have any sort of sophisticated A.I that is capable of pursuing its own objectives? Nope, no server to track that kind of behavior, instead we can only have a selection of randomly spawning events with randomly spawning npcs that appear out of nowhere, like how there's pirates hundreds of ly away in a system that only has a blackhole, saying the same tired selection of one liners that make no sense in context of what is happening, and where.

And what do we get in return? Grinding, with friends. Like killing trash mobs over and over again with a buddy on WoW. And we get meaningless flavor text updated every few days that describes conflicts that simply don't exist in game. The instancing, p2p, low bandwidth requirements, and the purely curated approach have neutered the game to the point where it still lacks a lot of the complexity that was present in FE2, FFE, Oolite etc. So what's up next? Wings? Doesn't address the core issue, only lets you experience it with friends. Planets and FPS? it will be flashy, but it will only allow us to experience a meaningless grind from a different point of view. Then we can kill 7 boars instead of 7 pirates for eternity. I just don't know anymore. The expansions and all the updates planned so far seem to be slated to add more flash, but little substance.
ITZ like this thing DraQ was expecting.
 

Mortmal

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I finally realized i got scammed too, its hard to admit you got scammed paying early access and an expansion pass, thinking it was a good deal. Worse i even convinced a friend to do same. Some of you guys here at the beggining of the thread are somewhat responsable of it too, if you reread the begining, things looks a lot brighter than the cold harsh truth. What we get today is cool as an alpha or a tech demo, but its nowhere near what was advertised.
Yes its a scam, and yes its worse in every way except graphics than the old elites. In those games missions were meaningless too but at least it never required such a grind , and it was new . I remember many more feature, planetary landing was one, even if it will be implemented , as of right its not . But there was also a story arc, the ability to bribe cops , many more ships to get.... The simple fact it doesnt immediately strike as superior to such old games is already a failure.
I am not even speaking of the multiplayer, ill speak of things that exists only.

The upcoming content is not exactly exciting either, grind a lot ,bring, material to spawn a new station. Iif you are lucky , the one who provided the most shit, you can name it .I have zero faith in them making anything worthwile .
 

Mortmal

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Now that was elite 2 on amiga, put it back in the context, 1993 your phone is probably 1000X more powerful than it, its just a plain better game .
 

DraQ

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Now that was elite 2 on amiga, put it back in the context, 1993 your phone is probably 1000X more powerful than it, its just a plain better game .

I've always found it puzzling that FE2 had intro that looked so much worse than the actual gameplay. There is no atmosphere or planet underneath in that anim, just a square patch of terrain and it's clearly visible.

(Also, the guy playing it is absolutely shit at combat.)
 
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Mortmal

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Yes probably the hardware limitations, it was 2 floppy disks only.Amiga demos takes one whole disk usually.
 

DraQ

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Yes probably the hardware limitations
Can't be hardware limitations if the actual gameplay has all this stuff on the exact same platform.

Anyway, the point should be that FE2 is also a simplistic little game by today's standards - ED is just unimpressive, largely for reasons related to the conscious concessions FD made to support multi, cinematic flight model and shit.
 
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Yes probably the hardware limitations, it was 2 floppy disks only.Amiga demos takes one whole disk usually.
single floppy. just one 736kb file iirc, a startup-sequence and an info. i'm sure about the single floppy anyway.
i was so excited about the cd-32 version, i thought "all this fit into just a disc, i can't imagine how they could fill an intire cd!". well, they just won't. it's the same game on a different support.
 

J_C

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Project: Eternity Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath
I'd like everyone to know that I've just sold my Elite Account for 40 dollars. While I enjoyed the game for a dozen or so hours, I got bored with the grinding and the lack of interesting missions.

Please, anyone who added me as a friend in Elite, delete my name, because it won't be me, who logs in next time.

How ironic that I was totally hyped both for Elite and Star Citizen, and I ended up selling both my accounts (for different reasons).
 
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Mortmal

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Hmm then the second floppy was maybe just the save disk. Its even more impressive then.
 

Bradylama

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Only Codexers could walk through a desert for 10 years and refuse to drink from the stream because it's not a river.
 

tuluse

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Serpent in the Staglands Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Shadorwun: Hong Kong
Only Codexers could walk through a desert for 10 years and refuse to drink from the stream because it's not a river.
It's kind of a fair point though. If you can't do better than a 15 year old game (other than graphically), what's the point?
 

Bradylama

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The game does quite a bit better than that 15 year old game from a gameplay standpoint. The fact that there's no deeper meaning to the game isn't actually much of an issue. More content will be developed and released over time through expansions, so crying BETRAYAL at this point and claiming that the game was an outright scam is just retarded.

If you don't like the state of the game right now then check it again later. I know that Draq's autism won't let him consider otherwise.
 

tuluse

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Serpent in the Staglands Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Shadorwun: Hong Kong
Yeah, I'm keeping an eye on the game. I haven't bought it yet because it seems like it would get boring after not too long and quite frankly I am suddenly inundated with quality games for the first time in probably 10 years.

It doesn't sound like the game is a scam (though the forced online comes close), but it does sound like the game isn't "done" yet. With a lack of both mid and end game content to do.
 

Bradylama

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It's not close to being done. You have to actually play this like it's an online game and cooperate with a Player group to get the most value out of the current state of the game. I know most people aren't into that at all and that's fine. Even saying that though, player groups can't come into their own until Wings are finished.
 

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