Fallout 4 Pre-Announcement Bullshit Thread [GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Turisas]

Without seeing the game. Because Bethesda is my religion.

And it'll be cross-gen.

 

[Ninjerk]

Without seeing the game. Because Bethesda is my religion.

I NEED TO BE ENTERTAINED

I WANT TO HIKE WITH GUNS

I TRIED DOING THAT AT SCHOOL, THEY DIDNT LIKE IT

 

[2house2fly]

Bethesda fans are weird. "I've played Fallout 3 and Skyrim to death! Where is Fallout 4?! What am I going to play now??"

Maybe try one of the other hundred million video games which exist, idk

 

[FeelTheRads]

wut's this topic doing in RPG diskusion?

 

[tuluse]

wut's this topic doing in RPG diskusion?

We're playing the role of angry fucks being mad at retards.

 

[Clockwork Knight]

Because it's considered a RPG by everyone outside of the codex and the "what is a RPG" thing is getting old

 

[FeelTheRads]

Because it's considered a RPG by everyone outside of the codex

And yet, this, by nature of being the Codex, is not the outside of the Codex.

Also, how can it be considered RPG when it's not even released yet? I mean sure, you can totally say a game is awesome years away from its release, but how can you tell it will be an RPG?

 

[Lancehead]

Slippery slope that. We might then have to move many Kickstarter threads to General Gaming for the moment until they're released.

 

[FeelTheRads]

Nothing so extreme. I just want confirmation from Bethesda. Once they say it will be an RPG, I'll take their word for it because I trust them to make RPGs.

Spoiler

If anything, having these separated from actual RPGs meant I didn't see them. I hope you're happy.

 

[Seerix]

I doubt Fallout 4 will get released on 360 and PS3. No real official info so far and the suspicious shutdown of Skyrim development(which may be caused by Zenimax getting retardo and obsessed with Elder Scrolls MMO), they may be busy working on "next-gen" version of Creation Engine.

Fake edit: Skyrim Announcement Trailer was released December 12 2010 so there's still a possibility something like that will happen with Fallout 4 now, but I doubt it. Regardless, if they want to jump on the bandwagon of releasing their game on maximum number of platforms the 2014 is their only chance, after that the new next-gen will be settled in, I think.

 

[Onholyservicebound]

Because it's considered a RPG by everyone outside of the codex

Basically everyone besides the biggest and most forum dedicated to RPGs on the net.

Besides, if you compare Fallout 3 to Skyrim it's obvious that the trend is to get as far away as possible from the RPG genre as they can.

This gives me some(probably misplaced) hope however; "When asked to give hints as to the setting of the next Fallout game, Jason Bergman said , "You'll get no tips from me. But the Mojave Wasteland was a fun place to explore, wasn't it?"". Maybe they'll learn from New Vegas and Fallout 4 won't be a dumbed down action adventure with less rpg elements than Borderlands. Then again, maybe they'll fuck up the west coast as bad as they did with DC..

I have my fingers crossed, if Bethesda paid attention to reviews then they'd realize that NV was praised for it's story, characters, and RPG elements, and panned for it's shitty art, buggy engine, and being too similar to Fallout 3. Since those are the only things that Obsidian didn't change, it should be obvious to them how to Fallout 4. Not to mention Kickstarter's success may have opened their eyes to the amount of money people are willing to spend for real RPG's.

and the "what is a RPG" thing is getting old

But what IS an RPG?

 

[Clockwork Knight]

Also, how can it be considered RPG when it's not even released yet? I mean sure, you can totally say a game is awesome years away from its release, but how can you tell it will be an RPG?

Because that's what Beth makes, open world action-rpgs. Sure, it could be a kart racing game, but I think the odds of that are pretty low.

Basically everyone besides the biggest and most forum dedicated to RPGs on the net.

And still, we can't even agree on a definition of "RPG". I'd rather just call the game what everyone else calls it, then. Makes me look less butthurt.

But what IS an RPG?

Games where you ride on a horse killing stuff, didn't you get the memo?

 

[WhiteGuts]

I have my fingers crossed, if Bethesda paid attention to reviews then they'd realize that NV was praised for it's story, characters, and RPG elements, and panned for it's shitty art, buggy engine, and being too similar to Fallout 3. Since those are the only things that Obsidian didn't change, it should be obvious to them how to Fallout 4. Not to mention Kickstarter's success may have opened their eyes to the amount of money people are willing to spend for real RPG's.

What's obvious to Bethesda is that they need to make a game that sells. And they just happened to make one that did just that. I for one have no pointless hopes about F4, it will be Skyrim in post-apo America. And that just makes sense from their point of view, it would be stupid from them NOT to ride the Skyrim wave.

 

[Ninjerk]

The gimmick will be a motorcycle.

 

[FeelTheRads]

Because that's what Beth makes, open world action-rpgs. Sure, it could be a kart racing game, but I think the odds of that are pretty low.

Or it could be a shooter with 3 stats. And everybody will call it an RPG and then it will have to be an RPG.

 

[Onholyservicebound]

it would be stupid for them NOT to ride the Skyrim wave.

I expect them to "ride the skyrim wave" where it counts, map size, explorability, and all that open world shit. The RPG elements, c&c, characters, and writing on the other hand, received no praise, and are generally disliked by reviewers(Whose opinions Bethesda values.). It would be stupid of them to implement badly received aspects of the game because it sold a lot.

 

[WhiteGuts]

Well Bethesda was also supposed to learn from their "mistakes" in Fallout 3. Skyrim clearly shows they didn't. Or rather, they don't consider those things as "mistakes". They simply don't value writing/RPG elements/C&C as they do the open world mechanics. And they have no reason to change that in the future games since it's working pretty damn good for them.

The only hope of having an actual good Fallout game in the future is if they allow Obsidian to make a Fallout [subtitle] after F4.

 

[tuluse]

I expect them to "ride the skyrim wave" where it counts, map size, explorability, and all that open world shit. The RPG elements, c&c, characters, and writing on the other hand, received no praise, and are generally disliked by reviewers(Whose opinions Bethesda values.). It would be stupid of them to implement badly received aspects of the game because it sold a lot.

Bethesda customers generally don't like c&c, or at least a good number of them don't. They don't like the game "preventing them from doing things". They believe a player should be able to experience the entire game in one playthrough.

They could upgrade the writing, and that would probably be well received, but if they were able to put forward good writing, would they already be doing it?

 

[Grunker]

I expect them to "ride the skyrim wave" where it counts, map size, explorability, and all that open world shit. The RPG elements, c&c, characters, and writing on the other hand, received no praise, and are generally disliked by reviewers(Whose opinions Bethesda values.). It would be stupid of them to implement badly received aspects of the game because it sold a lot.

Bethesda customers generally don't like c&c, or at least a good number of them don't. They don't like the game "preventing them from doing things". They believe a player should be able to experience the entire game in one playthrough.

They could upgrade the writing, and that would probably be well received, but if they were able to put forward good writing, would they already be doing it?

Thing is, limiting reactivity in an open world game also severely limits how well you could possible write the thing. Once you start giving people reasonable motivation and character, it soon follows that they need to react to how you're doing things. Think about how ridicoulously evil and sociopathic you can be in Skyrim without sensible companions reacting and how glaring that is. That's not the writing's fault, it's that you can't do good writing here without the companion actually reacting to you being a sociopathic mass murderer. In a way, companions being more writing-focused in Skyrim is way more destructive for that game's consistency that a silent companion without a character would have been.

Not a problem in a linear game where your choices are limited.

I can't really wrap my head around the concept of "good writing" existing in a Disneyland like that (Skyrim, for example). All dialogue is basically exposition and/or the guy who maintains a given ride presenting the ride to you. There's not much leeway for actual writing there.

 

[Lancehead]

If you try to write PS:T or MotB standard characters, then yeah, you'll fail badly. The better way is to deal in factions. In other words, treat factions as characters. When you let the player interact with those factions via some reputation mechanics, you can get some nice c&c going. You'd still want to flesh out some important npcs, though.

 

[Onholyservicebound]

Well Bethesda was also supposed to learn from their "mistakes" in Fallout 3. Skyrim clearly shows they didn't. Or rather, they don't consider those things as "mistakes". They simply don't value writing/RPG elements/C&C as they do the open world mechanics. And they have no reason to change that in the future games since it's working pretty damn good for them.

The only hope of having an actual good Fallout game in the future is if they allow Obsidian to make a Fallout [subtitle] after F4.

I live in hope that Bethesda has the sense to realize that Fallout and Elder Scrolls aren't the same thing. Base Fallout 3(Before the shitty godmode add-on) was a cut above Oblivion in c&c and in character creation, you couldn't max out all skills and attributes like in Oblivion.(This, despite Oblivion's large success.) Even unmodded Skyrim gave you limited perks so that characters would be diverse, and you can't honestly tell me that their civil war wasn't a cute attempt at emulating faction choice a la FNV, c'mon, the factions themselves even, lol, legion vs stormcloaks under a bear banner.(Like I said, cute.)

But yes, even if Bethesda did decide to change their values up, I'm still skeptical at their actual ability to implement it. An Obsidian made Fallout [subtitle] would be a great way to cash in on the RPG crowd, that would be cool, hopefully with a better contract than before.

Bethesda customers generally don't like c&c, or at least a good number of them don't. They don't like the game "preventing them from doing things". They believe a player should be able to experience the entire game in one playthrough.

Then Skyrim should be to them, as it -attempted- to have more c&c than Oblivion. You can't progress with the blades without betraying the greybeards and killing Porthunax. You can't join both the legion and the stormcloaks, you can ruin the entire dark brotherhood quest line by raiding their lair and murdering them. And as for gameplay, the base game made it impossible to make a superman character like in Oblivion, perks were limited whereas Oblivion didn't stop until you were maxed.

 

[Space Satan]

Bethesda promised Radiant AI in Oblivion - where generic characters should act and react just like humans, with suspicion, fear, friendly etc. They promised Radiant AI that will emulate wasteland critters pack mentality in F3. They promised wonders with Skyrim. Every time it ends with mocking videos describing insane stupidity of AI, characters with pots on their heads and other fail stuff.
They don't need writing, their auditory is a sandbox players, who want to crawl the dungeons and explore N+1 x N+1 kilometer map. I must admit, Bethesda making steps to perfection of their sandbox mechanics and each game have more and more abilities to interact with the world. I bet NPCs in F4 would be a bit smarter and behave a bit mre reasonable then in Skyrim, but writing would be the same or even worse.

 

[DragoFireheart]

Bethesda promised Radiant AI in Oblivion - where generic characters should act and react just like humans, with suspicion, fear, friendly etc. They promised Radiant AI that will emulate wasteland critters pack mentality in F3. They promised wonders with Skyrim. Every time it ends with mocking videos describing insane stupidity of AI, characters with pots on their heads and other fail stuff.
They don't need writing, their auditory is a sandbox players, who want to crawl the dungeons and explore N+1 x N+1 kilometer map. I must admit, Bethesda making steps to perfection of their sandbox mechanics and each game have more and more abilities to interact with the world. I bet NPCs in F4 would be a bit smarter and behave a bit mre reasonable then in Skyrim, but writing would be the same or even worse.

Frankly, I've found their dungeon crawling to be getting worse since Morrowind.

Oblivion is shitty level scaled.
Fallout 3 had a couple note worthy places but lots of underground subways. Shitty.
Skyrim had almost no worthwhile things in it's dungeons. All of the neat rewards were, ironically, not in dungeons (Daedric Quests). Also, crafting broke the loot system.

 

[Space Satan]

Their main redeeming feature is extreme friendly approach to modders. From my experience only Paradox and Valve is more friendly. It is moders who fix 80% of bethesda shit

 

[Hirato]

I live in hope that Bethesda has the sense to realize that Fallout and Elder Scrolls aren't the same thing. Base Fallout 3(Before the shitty godmode add-on) was a cut above Oblivion in c&c and in character creation, you couldn't max out all skills and attributes like in Oblivion.(This, despite Oblivion's large success.)

False, with proper allocation of skill points, and perks, it is possible to reach 100 in every skill with some points to spare at level 20.
The main thing to achieving this is to retain your skill books, grab the comprehension perk (so you get 2 points instead of 1, or was it 3 and 2?) and to avoid investing too much in any of the sklills. There are 25 of each book, so you'd manage if you didn't foolishly invest beyond 50 for any of them.
If you wanted to max stats too, it is ideal to start with 9 INT, and to grab the INT bobblehead as soon as possible to maximise your skill point gain.

EDIT: Forgot about skill bobbleheads and the educated perk. you shouldn't need to invest beyond 40 for any of the skills.