Fallout 4 Pre-Announcement Bullshit Thread [GO TO NEW THREAD]

[shihonage]

At this point I've not seen a zombie RPG in Fallout vein implemented, so despite zombie setting being supposedly overused, it still feels fresher than generic Mad Max-style apocalypse.

 

[ZagorTeNej]

Whether New Vegas is an amazing Fallout game or not probably depends on what you consider the "core" of Fallout to be... factions in a post-apocalypse 50's future US or a turn-based isometric RPG game.

Either way New Vegas is amazing and fuck anyone who says otherwise.

I wouldn't say it's that simple really. For example, in my case while I prefer any Fallout game to be isometric and turn based, going first person/action RPG isn't a complete deal breaker to me in general (heck, some FPS/RPG hybrids like Deus Ex and VTM Bloodlines are among my favourite games) but I still have such low tolerance for Gamebryo abomination that I've only been able to stomach FNV for 6-7 hours at most despite liking some other elements of the game (dialogue & voice acting, abundance of skill checks, music etc.).

Of course I'll likely dive into it again in the near future but my point is that it's not as simple as, you like the setting and action RPG/FPS -> you'll think FNV is an amazing game. In my mind that would almost be akin to saying, you like isometric party based RPGs with turn based combat? Pool of Radiance: Ruins of Myth Dranor is the game for you then.

 

[Kem0sabe]

I dont think Bethesda is at all interested in diluting the brand even more with someonething that is not a Fallout 3 spawn. On the other hand, Zenimax seems to dont give a damn about brands, as their ill adivsed mmo proves.

 

[PorkyThePaladin]

Personally, I doubt the latter will ever happen because FFS people there are more original ideas for a game than that, what's with the obsession with post-apoc

Yeah, I agree. Post-apocalypse is gradually becoming the next Tolkienesque fantasy setting, where it's gonna be overdone to the death to the point where everyone will hate it. And there are so many awesome settings games can use instead. Different historical periods alone provide about 15-20 great untapped settings, not to mention modern times, exotic sci-fi, or completely different takes on fantasy.

 

[Zboj Lamignat]

Being overdone would only count if there were many post-apoc games that are actually good.

 

[shihonage]

And there are so many awesome settings games can use instead. Different historical periods alone provide about 15-20 great untapped settings, not to mention modern times, exotic sci-fi, or completely different takes on fantasy.

Not quite. Most historical or in-any-way-hinting-at-authenticity settings would result in immediate, what's the fancy word for it, ludonarrative dissonance. I.E. you can't set an RPG in World War 2 and then go around killing thousands of Germans who will drop weapons and gold.

You can, however, make a crazy arcade game where you do that. You can make an adventure puzzle game where you have to survive as a prisoner in concentration camp, but try combining that with traditional RPG formula where you have to "level" (while starving to death) and get stronger "equipment" (what, a rock?), not to mention the inevitable combat, and it all once again starts to fall apart.

Many other appealing settings have big problems. For instance, setting a game in a totalitarian regime ("Inhabited Island") would immediately pit you against the problem of escalating conflicts with law enforcement, and an even bigger logistical issue of not having real "factions" to juggle reputations between. Such a regime is just one oppressive monolith which smothers a lot of desired RPG mechanics.

Post-apocalyptic setting is unique in a sense that it can provide a sense of quasi-authenticity and yet get away with many RPG gameplay conventions without creating a searing hole in the fabric of its immersion. You can have your different factions that have no central command, you can be a homicidal sociopath for the sake of survival, etc etc.

 

[Horus]

How about POST APOCALYPSE IN THE AUSTRALIAN DESERT? I'd call it "The Fallout Wasteland of Arnhem"

Or "MAD MAX: THE GAME"

Nice strawman, man. Or do you think a company like Obsidian is completely incapable of coming up with new ideas?

I was just joking.

But now you mention that. Obsidian haven't done any original IP's except Alpha Protocol yet. So going by their track record. It would be better to reserve our judgement about their talent with creating original IP's until they release the Pillars of Eternity.

 

[Commissar Draco]

How about Steam Feudalism in Space Genre? WH40K, Dune or Emperor of the Rising Sun to name the few are great settings with many factions and huge potential for RP. Or just make RPG in Ancient Palestine, India or Rome for instant brand recognition from Rome-fags fans WWII is cliche seen in most of strategic and many FPS not to mention countless movies. Totalitarian Regimes are seldom monoliths as seen from outside, there's always some resistance and Party, Security Service and Military factions.

 

[tuluse]

Not quite. Most historical or in-any-way-hinting-at-authenticity settings would result in immediate, what's the fancy word for it, ludonarrative dissonance. I.E. you can't set an RPG in World War 2 and then go around killing thousands of Germans who will drop weapons and gold.

You can, however, make a crazy arcade game where you do that. You can make an adventure puzzle game where you have to survive as a prisoner in concentration camp, but try combining that with traditional RPG formula where you have to "level" (while starving to death) and get stronger "equipment" (what, a rock?), not to mention the inevitable combat, and it all once again starts to fall apart.

It's not out fault RPG makers can't figure out a character system that doesn't lead to huge power increase over a game or game mechanics that don't involve killing things and looting their bodies


That said, think like an Inglourious Basterds rpg. You control a small squad of allied forces deep in Nazi controlled France. You get objectives from headquarters they want you to accomplish. You can get in touch with the resistance both for more support and side-quests. You can use sneaking, disguises, melee, shooting, hell even throw in some repair if you want to keep your guns working or drive cars around, and interrogation skills to get information from captured Nazis. So basically JA in Nazi occupied France, with more non-combat stuff, and none of the territorial control stuff.

Many other appealing settings have big problems. For instance, setting a game in a totalitarian regime ("Inhabited Island") would immediately pit you against the problem of escalating conflicts with law enforcement, and an even bigger logistical issue of not having real "factions" to juggle reputations between. Such a regime is just one oppressive monolith which smothers a lot of desired RPG mechanics.

There are factions in prisons. Different gangs that control a lot of what happens.

Post-apocalyptic setting is unique in a sense that it can provide a sense of quasi-authenticity and yet get away with many RPG gameplay conventions without creating a searing hole in the fabric of its immersion. You can have your different factions that have no central command, you can be a homicidal sociopath for the sake of survival, etc etc.

There are a lot of settings where a central authority is lacking.

 

[Jedi Master Radek]

- As a spin off taking place in the Fallout universe it would not have to have a Fallout as it title. It can be called: West Coast: A Post Nuclear Adventure in A Fallout Universe. All who would bought it will buy it nevertheless and those who wouldnt wont be confused.

In that case, who needs Bethesda anyway? All they have is the Fallout license. Anyone can create a post-apocalyptic isometric RPG and call it what they like.

Because it is Fallout. It's fucking Fallout!

Personally, I am tired of post-apoc wastelands in deserts. Would really like to see post-apoc in a jungle in Africa, or the Amazon, if you have mutants then you will miss deathclaws once the mutant jaguars and aligators come after you, and let's not get started on the ants. Jungle settings near rivers or coast are best, because you can them have greater variety of enviroments - Coast bogs and swamps, semi-florested plains (once-devastated areas slowly recovering?) inner jungles, riverside flooded jungles, urban ruins (being overrun by jungle?), you can even swing by to some mountanous areas if you set it in the right place.

Icy post-apoc might actually work as well, but it would have huge survivalist focus. Seems more of a eastern european trope.

And why almost all post-apoc games have to be in Kwa, or Russia? Imagine a post-apoc game in African Sahel, going with your negrobros packing AKs and machetes until the bullets run out through strife-torn radiated lands between jungle and desert, meeting Tuaregs, Yorubas, coastal traders descended from brazilian slave-traders, foreign peacekeeper remants, fighting and allying with warlords and surviving everyday going after food and water (possibly through ruthless means) in the freshly-nuked african lands as people starve and fight each other for scraps, the old civilization dies and the new one is born, tearing your way, helping or sabotaging, and generally surviving until you suceeded in your quest, find a safe place or die trying.

Add your appropriate spins to post-apoc to make it different, and you're done!

 

[imweasel]

Personally, I am tired of post-apoc wastelands in deserts. Would really like to see post-apoc in a jungle in Africa, or the Amazon, if you have mutants then you will miss deathclaws once the mutant jaguars and aligators come after you, and let's not get started on the ants. Jungle settings near rivers or coast are best, because you can them have greater variety of enviroments - Coast bogs and swamps, semi-florested plains (once-devastated areas slowly recovering?) inner jungles, riverside flooded jungles, urban ruins (being overrun by jungle?), you can even swing by to some mountanous areas if you set it in the right place.

On that thought a post-apocalyptic setting which takes place during a nuclear winter would be pretty fucking awesome.

Spoiler

 

[Horus]

Personally, I am tired of post-apoc wastelands in deserts. Would really like to see post-apoc in a jungle in Africa, or the Amazon, if you have mutants then you will miss deathclaws once the mutant jaguars and aligators come after you, and let's not get started on the ants. Jungle settings near rivers or coast are best, because you can them have greater variety of enviroments - Coast bogs and swamps, semi-florested plains (once-devastated areas slowly recovering?) inner jungles, riverside flooded jungles, urban ruins (being overrun by jungle?), you can even swing by to some mountanous areas if you set it in the right place.

Indeed, post-apocalyptic game in south america would be interesting. Though it will undermine the survival aspect of the setting if there are too many jungles hence the liveable habitat in the world.

And why almost all post-apoc games have to be in Kwa, or Russia?

People want to see ruins of old civilizations. Especially if it's familiar to them. We want to see our how fucked up the world became after bombs hit. How normal people, our neighbors, our coworkers struggle with the grim reality. We want to see our loved brands, loved foodchains empty and desolate. And filled with looters if possible. So essentially, developers try to make the world familiar to their main audience.

Imagine a post-apoc game in African Sahel, going with your negrobros packing AKs and machetes until the bullets run out through strife-torn radiated lands between jungle and desert, meeting Tuaregs, Yorubas, coastal traders descended from brazilian slave-traders, foreign peacekeeper remants, fighting and allying with warlords and surviving everyday going after food and water (possibly through ruthless means) in the freshly-nuked african lands as people starve and fight each other for scraps, the old civilization dies and the new one is born, tearing your way, helping or sabotaging, and generally surviving until you suceeded in your quest, find a safe place or die trying.

Why would anyone nuke Africa if nothing's gonna change?:D

 

[undecaf]

Icy post-apoc might actually work as well, but it would have huge survivalist focus. Seems more of a eastern european trope.

There is some East-Europe vibe with the "ice" stuff, but I think it could well be turned into an American occurence if needed. Think about a semi realistic not too far future situation where Yellowstone finally erupts, the ambitious world of tomorrow is destroyed in the shockwave and the survivors start getting ready to the quickly forming new ice age, the desperation of the future brings about the best and most certainly the worst of human nature. Some scifi to the broth to give it some twist. Sounds a bit like a b-grade catastrophy movie, but there are definitely interesting themes there to explore for the right writers.

 

[Machocruz]

Post apocalypse = domain of the creatively bankrupt game designer, where they can once again warm up leftovers of George Miller and man's-inhumanity-to-man.

 

[Spectacle]

The great appeal of the post-apoc genre for RPGs is that it lets the designer combine guns and other modern technology with fantasy RPG staples like looting, isolated communities surrounded by hostile wilderness, exploring ancient ruins, hideous monsters, etc.

 

[Oesophagus]

Quite frankly, I think Obsidian should concentrate on PE, and then see what to do next. If it sells well, probablly focus on that franchise, or create a new setting. They've got Tim Cain and Avellone, they don't need to keep making Fallout spin offs.

 

[Night Goat]

Personally, I am tired of post-apoc wastelands in deserts. Would really like to see post-apoc in a jungle in Africa, or the Amazon, if you have mutants then you will miss deathclaws once the mutant jaguars and aligators come after you, and let's not get started on the ants. Jungle settings near rivers or coast are best, because you can them have greater variety of enviroments - Coast bogs and swamps, semi-florested plains (once-devastated areas slowly recovering?) inner jungles, riverside flooded jungles, urban ruins (being overrun by jungle?), you can even swing by to some mountanous areas if you set it in the right place.

Icy post-apoc might actually work as well, but it would have huge survivalist focus. Seems more of a eastern european trope.

For a really bleak game, you could have an icy apocalypse in the jungle. The rest of the world is completely uninhabitable, and with the jungles now dead, man's days are numbered. The game would be visually interesting - imagine huge trees coated in ice, frozen swamps and rivers, blizzards impairing your visibility in the deep jungle...snowblind in the dead forest, you slowly realize that you're not alone...

 

[eremita]

Quite frankly, I think Obsidian should concentrate on PE, and then see what to do next. If it sells well, probablly focus on that franchise, or create a new setting. They've got Tim Cain and Avellone, they don't need to keep making Fallout spin offs.

It's quite a big company, man! Not everyone is working on PE... Also, PE is PC only hardcore RPG, it's definetly NOT gonna sell well enough to keep company like Obsidian alive. They would have to fire a lot of people I guess...

Oh, and fuck you with that "working on PE only" bullshit anyway. I love CRPGs but gaming can be so much more, especially in case of RPGs. Obsidian is full of very talented people and I would love to see them experimenting and pushing boundaries of the genre (like with Alpha Protocol or probably that canceled Alien RPG game). There's gonna be PE, Torment, Wasteland, Banner Saga, Divinity and there is Shadowrun. I'm definetly occupied for couple next years.

 

[Machocruz]

I'm definitely tired of western vision of post-apocalypse, which is always some dreary thing copied from some Hollywood banality made by depressed and cynical people. Wouldn't mind something like Nausicaa: Valley of the Wind, which has pretty much every feature you can want in a RPG and then some, and is not just another piece of urban blight. Or Vampire Hunter D, which is a kind of silly mixture of gothic horror, fantasy, western, and post-apocalypse, but cool and interesting nonetheless.

 

[Invictus]

I love how the best apocalyptic setting game series is actually not apocalyptic...that would be Stalker with its awesome atompshere and bleak dystopian setting which feels so much realistic. Even Metro has a better setting than the modern Fallouts.
I like the Fallout setting but really it is not very fresh anymore and from the looks of Fallout Boston it is going to be a helping of the same...
There could be so many interesting apocalyptic scenarios (the jungle one sounds amazing with mutated flora and fauna, maybe a doc savage inspired civilization and evolved super apes) but it would be hoping too much

 

[hexer]

Bros, the reasons why the post apocalypse is appealing are almost palpable.
As our population is constantly increasing it is only a matter of time before we have our own post apocalypse. I cannot see humans reason over our planet's dwindling resources. Just skim through history books to see the reasons why people started wars. You know some stupid insecure leader will push THE button.

Wouldn't mind something like Nausicaa: Valley of the Wind, which has pretty much every feature you can want in a RPG and then some, and is not just another piece of urban blight.

I second that! That's my favorite animated movie :D

 

[shihonage]

For a really bleak game, you could have an icy apocalypse in the jungle. The rest of the world is completely uninhabitable, and with the jungles now dead, man's days are numbered. The game would be visually interesting - imagine huge trees coated in ice, frozen swamps and rivers, blizzards impairing your visibility in the deep jungle...snowblind in the dead forest, you slowly realize that you're not alone...

Sounds like another FPS, and I'm sure Todd Howard would jump all over it. Of course, the first town you encounter will be called Frost City, with huts built out of ice.

It will reside on top of a frozen lake, and its inhabitants are taught, from their very early days, to never jump.

 

[Oesophagus]

It's quite a big company, man! Not everyone is working on PE...

Financially they're not particularly big. If they have to do odd jobs for Todd and co then fine, but really, fuck the Fallout franchise, it's been milked to death

 

[Night Goat]

For a really bleak game, you could have an icy apocalypse in the jungle. The rest of the world is completely uninhabitable, and with the jungles now dead, man's days are numbered. The game would be visually interesting - imagine huge trees coated in ice, frozen swamps and rivers, blizzards impairing your visibility in the deep jungle...snowblind in the dead forest, you slowly realize that you're not alone...

Sounds like another FPS, and I'm sure Todd Howard would jump all over it. Of course, the first town you encounter will be called Frost City, with huts built out of ice.

It will reside on top of a frozen lake, and its inhabitants are taught, from their very early days, to never jump.

A first-person perspective probably would be best for the game I'm imagining, but that isn't necessarily a bad thing. I'm thinking of a survival-horror sort of game. Of course Todd would ruin it, with his insistence on overpowered protagonists and challenge-free gameplay.

Then again, Todd wouldn't really be interested in this setting, because a frozen jungle isn't the most generic thing imaginable.

 

[tuluse]

Hopefully Dead State will be a game in the Fallout vein(and a little of resource management and strategy too) about zombies, rather than a zombie made of vapor.

I get the impression that Dead State is going to be a personality management sim, not a Fallout style RPG.