KickStarter Free Stars: Children of Infinity - upcoming Star Control 2 sequel from original creator Fred Ford

[Cael]

Definitely will put money into the fund.

Wardell is like frakking Clive Palmer, a bombastic, narcissistic, unethical, ruthless bully and asshole who uses lawfare as his preferred choice of destroying opposition. It was obvious early in the piece that he would go down this path, which was why I questioned him and his motives, to which he reacted in the predictable way that all egomaniacs respond when questioned. Other people's lives mean nothing to people like Wardell and Palmer, although they are not above making pretenses at "ethicality" when it suits their propaganda purposes. Palmer, too, was not badly thought of, even loved, until the scandals of Queensland Nickle and Coolum Resort blew up. I can only hope that this will be Bardell's Queensland Nickle.

As the Hokkiens would say: Fuck your mom's dirty, smelly cunt, Bardell (with a 10-foot rusty halberd; you don't want any part of yourself anywhere near that).

Nice dialect/language to swear in, Hokkien. I highly recommend it to anyone with an interest in swearing.

Did you do it?

I'm not Hokkien

 

[LESS T_T]

(He means honey, in case you're imagining something else.)

So what are Paul and Fred are up to these days? Well apparently their current Activision project is a "major" one, some kind of hero-based third person PvP/PvE action game:
https://careers.activision.com/job/R000822/Hero-Designer
https://careers.activision.com/job/R000798/Sr-Systems-Engineer

We are seeking an experienced and talented Hero Designer to work on a major, unannounced Activision project led by industry veterans Fred Ford and Paul Reiche. We are looking for a detail-oriented developer with hands-on Unreal 4 experience and, more broadly, experience with state system approaches to creating Hero powers for combat and platform traversal.

I guess we have to wait more to hear about Ghosts of the Precursors.

 

[Zombra]

Aren't they just making souped up multiplayer Pokemons these days? Sounds like this is another one.

 

[Trans-Financial-Man]

All that hubub over the lawsuit and Paul and Fred still can't get off their arses to actually make the game now the dust has settled.

 

[Irata]

I wish they'd hurry up and release this. It has been awhile that something I was looking forward to has disappointed me.

*I realized after I posted this that this might come across as optimistic. I'm expecting this to be crap even though I'd love for it to surprise me.

 

[Zombra]

I wish they'd hurry up and give us any reason to think any development whatsoever has ever or will ever be done on this concept and that it was not merely announced as some kind of leverage in a pointless legal battle.

Seriously, did we ever see anything but "were making a game to lol" ?

 

[Elestan]

All that hubub over the lawsuit and Paul and Fred still can't get off their arses to actually make the game now the dust has settled.

I can think of three good reasons that we're not hearing them talking about their next Ur-Quan game:

1. The money they had set aside to pay artists and musicians ended up paying lawyers instead, and it will take them time to rebuild their funds.
2. Activision was willing to let them go on leave for a while, but they spent all of that time fighting a lawsuit, so now they have to make games for Activision again before they can get permission to take more leave.
3. The settlement bars them from talking about it until mid-2021.

I know that #3 is true, and #1 and #2 seem quite plausible. Take your pick.

 

[Sordid MCA/Prosper Hybryd]

4. They were never going to do a new Ur-Quan game at all. The whole anouncement was just a part of their legal attack on Stardock.

 

[Elestan]

The whole anouncement was just a part of their legal attack on Stardock.

That seems unlikely given the court record; Stardock sued them, not the other way around. There's no indication that they had any ill-will toward Stardock prior to it threatening them in the Fall of 2017.

 

[Cael]

The whole anouncement was just a part of their legal attack on Stardock.

That seems unlikely given the court record; Stardock sued them, not the other way around. There's no indication that they had any ill-will toward Stardock prior to it threatening them in the Fall of 2017.

The truth is not a matter of importance to the suckers of wardell's cock. Just like their idol, they prefer lies, deceit and lawsuits.

 

[Sordid MCA/Prosper Hybryd]

Ok. Let's check who was the first to make a legal threat... oops! December 1, 2017.

“THERE WERE MANY GREAT BATTLES... AND SOME OF THEM INVOLVED LAWYERS.”

Unfortunately there appears to be a growing legal conflict between us and Stardock. We started out confused at what Stardock said and did. We tried to be reasonable and settle the problem quietly, but now after months of debate we are flat out mad! First, a little background information on just our side of the story:

• In 2013, Stardock bought a limited set of Atari’s assets at a bankruptcy auction -- primarily the name and trademark Star Control® and certain original aspects of Star Control III, like the space cows. It’s our opinion that Atari’s rights to publish our earlier games terminated over a decade before the auction and we contend that Stardock has zero rights to our games, including any code and other IP we created.
• As far as we can currently tell, we have no relationship with Stardock that lets them sell the three earlier Star Control games without our permission, either bundled with their other products or separately. That permission has not been given.
• Despite what Stardock's Brad Wardell has recently said, including in this Ars Technica article, our games’ universe has absolutely no connection, hyper-dimensional or otherwise, with Star Control®: Origins. (Note: We really don’t like other people putting our names in their diagrams without asking us first.)

Stardock now seems to think that not only can they use our aliens, ships and narrative without our permission, but thinks that we cannot make a sequel to The Ur-Quan Masters without their permission -- this is where we got really, really angry.

When we started Ghosts of the Precursors™ we were looking forward to spending our time on fun, creative work, not fighting a legal battle to protect ourselves and our work. We have nothing but respect for the talented, passionate developers working on Star Control: Origins, but we apparently have a BIG problem right now with Stardock’s management. We’ve been waiting 25 years to make Ghosts of the Precursors for our fans and we certainly won’t let this stop us. Go! Go! Go!

I am not sure if there is any sense to talk with Cael the Dumbfuck, but I am the last person to call Wardell an idol. I do not like any of Stardock's games.

 

[Cael]

Ok. Let's check who was the first to make a legal threat... oops! December 1, 2017.

“THERE WERE MANY GREAT BATTLES... AND SOME OF THEM INVOLVED LAWYERS.”

Unfortunately there appears to be a growing legal conflict between us and Stardock. We started out confused at what Stardock said and did. We tried to be reasonable and settle the problem quietly, but now after months of debate we are flat out mad! First, a little background information on just our side of the story:

• In 2013, Stardock bought a limited set of Atari’s assets at a bankruptcy auction -- primarily the name and trademark Star Control® and certain original aspects of Star Control III, like the space cows. It’s our opinion that Atari’s rights to publish our earlier games terminated over a decade before the auction and we contend that Stardock has zero rights to our games, including any code and other IP we created.
• As far as we can currently tell, we have no relationship with Stardock that lets them sell the three earlier Star Control games without our permission, either bundled with their other products or separately. That permission has not been given.
• Despite what Stardock's Brad Wardell has recently said, including in this Ars Technica article, our games’ universe has absolutely no connection, hyper-dimensional or otherwise, with Star Control®: Origins. (Note: We really don’t like other people putting our names in their diagrams without asking us first.)

Stardock now seems to think that not only can they use our aliens, ships and narrative without our permission, but thinks that we cannot make a sequel to The Ur-Quan Masters without their permission -- this is where we got really, really angry.

When we started Ghosts of the Precursors™ we were looking forward to spending our time on fun, creative work, not fighting a legal battle to protect ourselves and our work. We have nothing but respect for the talented, passionate developers working on Star Control: Origins, but we apparently have a BIG problem right now with Stardock’s management. We’ve been waiting 25 years to make Ghosts of the Precursors for our fans and we certainly won’t let this stop us. Go! Go! Go!

I am not sure if there is any sense to talk with Cael the Dumbfuck, but I am the last person to call Wardell an idol. I do not like any of Stardock's games.

One has to wonder who is the dumber one, dick sucker, since you keep doing it.

 

[Elestan]

Ok. Let's check who was the first to make a legal threat... oops! December 1, 2017.

That was the first time the public was told about the legal dispute, but the threats began in October. There is a full timeline here.

In summary, in early October 2017, when Brad Wardell (Stardock's CEO) learned that Reiche and Ford were planning to make a sequel to Star Control II, he insisted that a 1988 contract he bought from Atari (originally made with Accolade) gave him total control of any such effort, and that they could not proceed without his permission. But Accolade/Atari had stopped paying royalties on that contract long ago. Wardell appears to assert that revenue that was then being collected under a contract Reiche and Ford made with Atari in 2011 had reactivated the 1988 contract. However, he has never explained how he reaches this conclusion, given multiple clauses in the 1988 contract that would have terminated it.

I have thoroughly read every contract and court document relating to this case, and while I am not a lawyer, my opinion is that Brad was twisting the language of the 1988 contract far past the breaking point, for the purpose of strong-arming Reiche and Ford into working with him instead of doing the game independently. The fan community has compiled all of these documents onto the above-linked wiki page, and you are welcome to read them for yourself if you wish to form your own conclusions.

 

[Sordid MCA/Prosper Hybryd]

Ok. Your post has made me sligtly less confident in my judgment. But I'm still inclined to stay with my opinion. The announcement was lackluster at best: no details, no specifics, no art, no info about a dev.team, nothing but a name. It's hard to believe they thought they could interest people outside of the fan community with such an announcement. What is much easier to believe is that the announcement had a purely instrumental role to play in preparing for the upcoming legal battle.

I'm not going to lie, the final trust and respect for Reiche and Ford I've lost when they -- two very rich guys -- have decided to fight their legal battles with the money of their fans and launched a fundraiser (kickstopper as MRY wittily called it).

 

[Zombra]

I really mean it, did we ever see anything on this game? Even the vaguest dev blog? The "announcement" was over two years ago.

 

[MRY]

There is definitely an aschcan-copy vibe to "The Ghosts of the Precursors." I'm not sure the chronology helps Paul and Fred on that. Still, my hope is that whatever settlement was reached will mean that they'll provide guidance and support to what Wardell is doing, and it will work out for the best. I don't think anyone behaved particularly well in the process, but they all seem to love Star Control II, so hopefully it'll work out.

 

[Cael]

Ok. Your post has made me sligtly less confident in my judgment. But I'm still inclined to stay with my opinion. The announcement was lackluster at best: no details, no specifics, no art, no info about a dev.team, nothing but a name. It's hard to believe they thought they could interest people outside of the fan community with such an announcement. What is much easier to believe is that the announcement had a purely instrumental role to play in preparing for the upcoming legal battle.

I'm not going to lie, the final trust and respect for Reiche and Ford I've lost when they -- two very rich guys -- have decided to fight their legal battles with the money of their fans and launched a fundraiser (kickstopper as MRY wittily called it).

Ah, yes. "They are rich, so they shouldn't deserve anything." Nevermind the fuckhole wardell was the one who used despicable tactics to attack them. Oh no! Rich men! Riiiiich men!!!!

 

[Sordid MCA/Prosper Hybryd]

Man, you are really doing your best to justify your Dumbfuck tag. I do not have issues with rich people. I am not a socialist. But I have issues with people who beg for money and then spend it on dubious purposes. The fact that these people are rich and could have done without begging for money only aggravates the situation.

 

[Elestan]

Ok. Your post has made me sligtly less confident in my judgment. But I'm still inclined to stay with my opinion. The announcement was lackluster at best: no details, no specifics, no art, no info about a dev.team, nothing but a name. It's hard to believe they thought they could interest people outside of the fan community with such an announcement. What is much easier to believe is that the announcement had a purely instrumental role to play in preparing for the upcoming legal battle.

I think that their post was specifically directed at the fan community, since only a player of the original (25-year-old) game would understand half of what they were talking about. The fan community, though, had been after them for a sequel for twenty years, and they had never before given any indication of it actually happening beyond vague statements of intent to do it "someday". So when I read the post, I read it as the first "Hey, the stars are finally aligning, so we're going to do it" announcement, with future announcements to come as they put rest of the team together. But then Stuff Happened.

I'm not going to lie, the final trust and respect for Reiche and Ford I've lost when they -- two very rich guys -- have decided to fight their legal battles with the money of their fans and launched a fundraiser (kickstopper as MRY wittily called it).

There's "rich" and then there's "Rich". I don't doubt they were millionaires, but IP lawyers cost a million bucks or more a year, and they needed two or three of them for about a year and a half. Even if they had high six-figure salaries before going on leave, that would drain the bank fast. Keep in mind that Brad was fighting with Stardock's corporate resources, while Reiche and Ford had to use their personal savings. So, unless you have insight into their finances that I lack, I don't think we have the evidence to assert that the fundraiser was frivolous. And the money was all freely given, by people who were fully informed as to what their donations would be used for. The only thing that would have troubled me is if they misrepresented the purpose of the fund, or if they collected more than they needed. But their legal bills certainly exceeded the amount they collected by well over an order of magnitude.

I really mean it, did we ever see anything on this game? Even the vaguest dev blog? The "announcement" was over two years ago.

I think it would have been extremely foolish of them to hire anyone or to start putting any effort into the project whatsoever while their rights were under dispute. If they lost badly, they'd just have to hand it all over to Stardock. In the end, they appear to have kept most of their rights to the IP involved (Stardock won the right to non-exclusively use a few of the alien races), but they are barred from talking about the sequel for two years.

So no, I don't blame them for their silence, because Stardock has kept them under legal threat or constraint the whole time since their initial announcement.

 

[Cael]

Man, you are really doing your best to justify your Dumbfuck tag. I do not have issues with rich people. I am not a socialist. But I have issues with people who beg for money and then spend it on dubious purposes. The fact that these people are rich and could have done without begging for money only aggravates the situation.

Your repeated hammering of the "rich" tag proves otherwise.

You may not be a socialist, but you are an envious fuck.

 

[Unkillable Cat]

Thank you Elestan for keeping a sane, rational calm through this discussion - the mental image I'm getting of you each time you post, is the one of a facepalming Dnyarri.

I can only hope that the level of discussion rises when there will be actual news to talk about. So hang in there!

 

[MRY]

There is definitely an ashcan-copy vibe to "The Ghosts of the Precursors."

It's still kind of incredible to think that millionaire executives, promising to make a video game, crowdfunded a lawsuit that apparently had as its only purpose the extraction of a lucrative settlement from another millionaire. A year after settlement, not a single post on the ashcan game, and their social media presence stopped entirely. Not even any further nostalgia posts about the original games. It's a testament to how much we all love Star Control 2 that this regressive taxation was executed in plain view, through tactics that anti-intellectual-property types would probably call submarine IP litigation, and no one has even suggested that anything hinky went on. Color me a bit disappointed. I really believed we were going to see another Star Control game from PR and FF.

 

[CyberWhale]

Color me a bit disappointed. I really believed we were going to see another Star Control game from PR and FF.

Any minute now.

 

[urmom]

I tried playing SC2 but couldn't balance resource extraction with exploration and combat. IIRC, I was collecting resources and somehow fell behind everything else and was destroyed in combat. (I don't remember clearly.)

 

[Elestan]

It's still kind of incredible to think that millionaire executives, promising to make a video game, crowdfunded a lawsuit that apparently had as its only purpose the extraction of a lucrative settlement from another millionaire.

Sorry, but this conclusion contradicts the known facts in several ways:

First, Stardock was the one who sued them, not the other way around.

Second, when the initial settlement proposals were revealed, Stardock was the only one demanding money. All P&F wanted was for Stardock not to use anything from SCI&II in its games.

Third, IP litigation costs millions, and the crowdfunding netted less than 50k; there was never any prayer that it was going to cover their bills.

A year after settlement, not a single post on the ashcan game

That might have something to do with the fact that Stardock's settlement requirements banned them from talking about it for two years.

EDIT: I'm quite fascinated by the "FAKE NEWS" tags, since I specifically supplied links to evidence that backs up my statements. Yet none of the taggers has attempted to dispute that evidence, or to provide a counterclaim that could be debated. I suppose that they have the right to tag as they please, but the tags seem more like wishful thinking without any evidence to go with them.