Putting the 'role' back in role-playing games since 2002.
Donate to Codex
Good Old Games
  • Welcome to rpgcodex.net, a site dedicated to discussing computer based role-playing games in a free and open fashion. We're less strict than other forums, but please refer to the rules.

    "This message is awaiting moderator approval": All new users must pass through our moderation queue before they will be able to post normally. Until your account has "passed" your posts will only be visible to yourself (and moderators) until they are approved. Give us a week to get around to approving / deleting / ignoring your mundane opinion on crap before hassling us about it. Once you have passed the moderation period (think of it as a test), you will be able to post normally, just like all the other retards.

Review Gamebanshee Reviews XCOM: Enemy Unknown

Repressed Homosexual
Joined
Mar 29, 2010
Messages
18,011
Location
Ottawa, Can.
Is there any game that sea doesn't like mildly but with many passive agressive dislikes about? He's certainly much more objective than most any other reviewer out there and much more articulate in his complaints but all of his reviews read the same "yeah, but..."

It's like he doesn't like games and only likes to fantasize about what his ideal game would play like, and he often disses games because they don't conform to his vision, like the time he dissed Avernum because it was cruel to attack Slitzerikai peasants.
 

Trojan_generic

Magister
Joined
Jul 21, 2007
Messages
1,566
Strap Yourselves In Codex Year of the Donut Codex+ Now Streaming!
Features have been removed, or streamlined, and there just is not the same amount of depth or replayability to be had as the original.

Replayability is not a goal anymore; they don't want us to play the same game over and over again because they want to sell us new shit every now and then.

BTW, does this thing have DLC planned?
 

Zboj Lamignat

Arcane
Joined
Feb 15, 2012
Messages
5,775
While the original game was very much targeted towards hardcore strategy fans
That's a rather, well, silly thing to write. I don't know why so many people like to pretend that well-known classics from the nineties were somehow hardcore titles for pro gamers. These games (you can put many titles in place of UFO here - General series or Fallout or whatever) were getting stellar reviews left and right and everybody and their dog loved them. Basically your definition of a casual game:troll:

It's just that there were much less people calling themselves "gamers" and so the "mass" audience aimed titles tended to actually be well designed and fun in more ways than "omg xplosions and tits, visceral, immersive, gritty!".
 

Grunker

RPG Codex Ghost
Patron
Joined
Oct 19, 2009
Messages
27,761
Location
Copenhagen
I couldn't play it because of the shitty minimalist console interface. Probably sucks.

Dishonored was kool.

You can't play this because of console interface but think Dishonored was cool? Nigga you should be shot :rpgcodex:
 

Minttunator

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Sep 26, 2012
Messages
1,651
Location
Estonia
Codex 2012 Codex 2013 Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 RPG Wokedex Strap Yourselves In Codex Year of the Donut Codex+ Now Streaming! Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Codex USB, 2014 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Pathfinder: Wrath
Very good review! As some good people have already stated, I'm not sure there were 'hardcore strategy fans' back in the 90s, as I'm inclined to think that anyone who played computer games seriously back then was probably pretty hardcore - at least by modern standards.

I do agree with the duality of this game, though, and what was stated in the conclusion also reflects what I've seen among the people I know. Most of my acquaintances who enjoy the new XCOM never played the original - and those that have played the original tend to prefer Xenonauts.
 

Grunker

RPG Codex Ghost
Patron
Joined
Oct 19, 2009
Messages
27,761
Location
Copenhagen
Most of my acquaintances who enjoy the new XCOM never played the original - and those that have played the original tend to prefer Xenonauts.

Well, I like the original, I like the new game, I think the review is pretty much spot on, and sadly I'm a bit sceptical as for Xenonauts right now, for the reasons Trash has been giving :(
 

Zed

Codex Staff
Patron
Staff Member
Joined
Oct 21, 2002
Messages
17,068
Codex USB, 2014
I couldn't play it because of the shitty minimalist console interface. Probably sucks.

Dishonored was kool.

You can't play this because of console interface but think Dishonored was cool? Nigga you should be shot :rpgcodex:
Why should I be shot?

It has become pretty clear to me that all Danes have pretty unsophisticated taste, except for Ulminati but his good taste is restricted to food and board games. Maybe muslims are on to something when it comes to Denmark. But I'll lay it out for you, anyway:

Dishonored is not omfg-amazing, but good. I could set a decent FoV in options and the game was greatly optimized to run even on my shit computer. The game has a cool game world and is fun throughout. There are alternatives solutions to problems and the world is dynamic enough to create some pretty funny situations (such as knocking out a guard and then having him accidentally fall to his death as he falls unconscious). It has optional submissions for every main mission. It has non-linear paths to get to X. The game's menus are fast to navigate and are non-intrusive.
I have some complaints about Dishonored such as the ease of playing a stealth route thanks to blink, but other than that it's a good FPS.

Xcom? Casual "strategy" for scrubs. An Xcom for LoL-players. Extreme hand-holding and fucking horrible art direction. It's a god damn popamole simulator: GET BEHIND THE BOX AND POP SUM MOLZ IN ALL KINDS OF WAYS YOU CAN POP FROM ROOF OR POP FROM BOX WOW ISN'T THAT FUN? Gameplay wise this could be a fucking Mass Effect browser game.
The game has an extremely bad interface, directly taken from consoles without any consideration for PC players. Want to do some shit in the game? Expect to click 2x, 3x more times than in any other game. IIRC you even have to use arrows keys (or wasd) and press enter and shit like that. At the same time they try to keep the interface minimalist so tons of shit is hidden from you unless you actively look for it. Shitty fucking camera direction and "action sequences".
 

Grunker

RPG Codex Ghost
Patron
Joined
Oct 19, 2009
Messages
27,761
Location
Copenhagen
Dishonored was an easy, minimalist, consolized experience no matter how you look at it (oh look, it has a few extra settings in the options menu compared to other console games - that makes it Deus Ex, amirite?). It can be good or bad despite that - personally, I haven't played it that extensively.

X-COM is a great strategy-game, though nowhere near the depth of the old title. You can call it good or bad, but it is hilarious to accuse X-COM for hand-holding and hold up fucking Dishonored as a good game in the same breath. Dishonored has oceans of hand-holding compared to X-COM, and is both more linear and restrictive.

It makes little sense to compare the two games, but what you are accusing X-COM for is much worse in Dishonored.
 

sea

inXile Entertainment
Developer
Joined
May 3, 2011
Messages
5,698
Is there any game that sea doesn't like mildly but with many passive agressive dislikes about? He's certainly much more objective than most any other reviewer out there and much more articulate in his complaints but all of his reviews read the same "yeah, but..."

It's like he doesn't like games and only likes to fantasize about what his ideal game would play like, and he often disses games because they don't conform to his vision, like the time he dissed Avernum because it was cruel to attack Slitzerikai peasants.
I'm a chronic nitpicker. Usually the games complain about the most are also ones that I like the most (unless of course I outright say it sucks). Some people take that to mean I am an overly negative person... maybe that's true, I just think that, when doing critical analysis of something, nobody is served if I overlook or ignore things for the sake of maintaining a positive tone. The point of reviews is to be read by the end user so that they can decide more easily if a game is for them, and they can only do that if I provide as much detail on both the ups and downs as possible.

For what it's worth, I do think XCOM is a good game. It's just not really made for the old X-COM fans. That's kind of a problem considering it's, you know, a sequel that's based on the legacy of one of the best-remembered PC games of all time. Though, to be honest, I kind of think 2K and Firaxis took advantage of the fact that X-COM is one of those games many people have heard of, but very few have actually played... they have expectations about the series that cannot possibly be let down because they cannot reference the original directly. What do you mean, is it good? Of course it is, it's *XCOM*!
 
Joined
Feb 19, 2005
Messages
4,638
Strap Yourselves In Codex+ Now Streaming!
HHR takes issue with someone seeing not only black and white but actually trying to present an informative, objective analysis? Well, color me fucking surprised.
 

Zed

Codex Staff
Patron
Staff Member
Joined
Oct 21, 2002
Messages
17,068
Codex USB, 2014
Dishonored was an easy, minimalist, consolized experience no matter how you look at it (oh look, it has a few extra settings in the options menu compared to other console games - that makes it Deus Ex, amirite?). It can be good or bad despite that - personally, I haven't played it that extensively.

X-COM is a great strategy-game, though nowhere near the depth of the old title. You can call it good or bad, but it is hilarious to accuse X-COM for hand-holding and hold up fucking Dishonored as a good game in the same breath. Dishonored has oceans of hand-holding compared to X-COM, and is both more linear and restrictive.

It makes little sense to compare the two games, but what you are accusing X-COM for is much worse in Dishonored.

It sounds like your impressions of Dishonored are as superficial as mine are with Xcom.
The reason why I even mentioned Dishonored was because Black said it would be either Xcom or Dishonored as codex GOTYs (two posts above mine). You brought on the comparison.

Dishonored uses a "4 hp system" and "12 ammo weapons", it hardly needs an interface in the first place. Xcom is a strategy/management game. To draw the "minimalist interface" complaint I had about Xcom and put it on a FPS action/stealth like Dishonored is balls-out retarded.

Everything about Dishonored in terms of hand-holding is optional. I don't know if the same applies to Xcom. If it does, then we both have no arguments on the matter.

That leaves that fact that Xcom has a shit PC interface and that my initial argument stands. Obviously if you think the interface is good, then I won't argue against you. Being Danish and all.
 

Mrowak

Arcane
Joined
Sep 26, 2008
Messages
3,952
Project: Eternity
Is there any game that sea doesn't like mildly but with many passive agressive dislikes about? He's certainly much more objective than most any other reviewer out there and much more articulate in his complaints but all of his reviews read the same "yeah, but..."

It's like he doesn't like games and only likes to fantasize about what his ideal game would play like, and he often disses games because they don't conform to his vision, like the time he dissed Avernum because it was cruel to attack Slitzerikai peasants.
I'm a chronic nitpicker. Usually the games complain about the most are also ones that I like the most (unless of course I outright say it sucks). Some people take that to mean I am an overly negative person... maybe that's true, I just think that, when doing critical analysis of something, nobody is served if I overlook or ignore things for the sake of maintaining a positive tone. The point of reviews is to be read by the end user so that they can decide more easily if a game is for them, and they can only do that if I provide as much detail on both the ups and downs as possible.

For what it's worth, I do think XCOM is a good game. It's just not really made for the old X-COM fans. That's kind of a problem considering it's, you know, a sequel that's based on the legacy of one of the best-remembered PC games of all time. Though, to be honest, I kind of think 2K and Firaxis took advantage of the fact that X-COM is one of those games many people have heard of, but very few have actually played... they have expectations about the series that cannot possibly be let down because they cannot reference the original directly. What do you mean, is it good? Of course it is, it's *XCOM*!

I think this chronic nitpicking actually a very good quality in an objective, professional reviewer (in before, there's no such thing as "objective review"). To my mind approaching each feature of the game, however small it is, looking at it from both sides and putting it into context before passing judgement is the mark of a quality review. Sure it does never make the article sound really positive or enthusiastic, even if the author holds the product in high regard, but at the same time it removes all the bias. Besides it's not the reviewer's job to offer free marketing for the publisher (which unfortunately happens in the gaming press) - his task is to provide his readers with essential info that could help them make the decision. Incidentally, that's why review scores have no place in an article, which is also the reason Codex never has had them.

Concerning the accusation that reviewers project their dream-game and mock the inadequacies of the product based on that: true that often happens. It is frequently difficult not to write how this or that feature could be fixed, especially in a negative review. However, reviewers are required to put items they asses into context: whole genres and previous installments of the game. This is what happened here: sea put the new XCOM into context of original iconic series and proved that the rendition pales in comparison to them. At the same time he also provided plenty of evidence that in the game could have stood strong on its own, provided that features weren't cut from it. The final judgment is fair and it does account for various ways this product can be viewed by gaming community, and groups who might be interested in it.

Overall, this is one hell of a review, and I wish mainstream media stuck to exactly this format.
 

Grunker

RPG Codex Ghost
Patron
Joined
Oct 19, 2009
Messages
27,761
Location
Copenhagen
It sounds like your impressions of Dishonored are as superficial as mine are with Xcom.

Of this, I have no doubt. When has superficial knowledge (i.e. talking out of your ass) ever stopped a meaningful discussion on the Codex?
 

ironyuri

Guest
Overall, this is one hell of a review, and I wish mainstream media stuck to exactly this format.
You do me too much honor, sir!

inb4
bree_kiss-320.gif
 

Grunker

RPG Codex Ghost
Patron
Joined
Oct 19, 2009
Messages
27,761
Location
Copenhagen
Overall, this is one hell of a review, and I wish mainstream media stuck to exactly this format.
You do me too much honor, sir!

I agree with Mrowak that your reviews blow major review sites completely out of the water. But honestly, as much as I give you credit sea, the praise you recieve is less of a cadeau to you and more of a serious kick in the balls for the reviewers of most of other sites, and certainly most major review sites.

Often I find that even untried people who do simple reviews for the Codex do a much better job than the reviews I read at major sites. And it's not even bad writing skills or lack of a proper critical angle and that stuff, our reviews can suffer from that too. It's the most basic shit they fail at, getting simple facts wrong, not knowing two fucks about gaming history or the history of the franchise they're reviewing, swallowing current gaming paradigms without even thinking, not doing basic research on what they're writing about. Basic stuff everyone should do in the first place to be able to call themselves reviewers in the first place.

:(
 

Israfael

Arcane
Joined
Sep 21, 2012
Messages
3,762
Well, if you liked Fallout 3 'for what it is' / without comparison to the OG (bannable action on 2k forums), then maybe its good... To me its a first class fraud case.. This game is created for those who dont mind their hands torn off and replaced with consolized manipulator (thats how i feel like playing ported popamole games)

PS If i wanted to buy an 'abibas', i'd go to the nearest chinese market... One of my pals compared the new game to the likes of HoMM and 'new' kings bounty, and i think he's right... Nevermore...
:killit:
 

thesheeep

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Mar 16, 2007
Messages
10,098
Location
Tampere, Finland
Codex 2012 Strap Yourselves In Codex Year of the Donut Codex+ Now Streaming! Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Torment: Tides of Numenera Codex USB, 2014 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 BattleTech Bubbles In Memoria A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
I agree with Mrowak that your reviews blow major review sites completely out of the water. But honestly, as much as I give you credit sea, the praise you recieve is less of a cadeau to you and more of a serious kick in the balls for the reviewers of most of other sites, and certainly most major review sites.

Often I find that even untried people who do simple reviews for the Codex do a much better job than the reviews I read at major sites. And it's not even bad writing skills or lack of a proper critical angle and that stuff, our reviews can suffer from that too. It's the most basic shit they fail at, getting simple facts wrong, not knowing two fucks about gaming history of the history of the franchise they're reviewing, swallowing current gaming paradigms without even thinking.

:(

Well, we are not only elitist, we actually are the elite.
 

Thane Solus

Arcane
Joined
Apr 29, 2012
Messages
1,687
Location
X-COM Base
Good review. I liked the game, but compared to the original it fails on so many points. Half of the interface is shit, no random maps, lack of more complex tactical doctrines, no tactical display (LOL?!), after you finished it a few times, you will probably never play it again, unless they fix lots of stuff in the expansion, which i doubt it. Still, its the best wannabe xcom so far, but the original is still the king, and not because i played it when i was young, last time i re played it, was 6 months ago and it was still fracking awesome.

Say thanks to consoles for ruining yet another IP.

7/10.
 

Mrowak

Arcane
Joined
Sep 26, 2008
Messages
3,952
Project: Eternity
Overall, this is one hell of a review, and I wish mainstream media stuck to exactly this format.
You do me too much honor, sir!

I agree with Mrowak that your reviews blow major review sites completely out of the water. But honestly, as much as I give you credit sea, the praise you recieve is less of a cadeau to you and more of a serious kick in the balls for the reviewers of most of other sites, and certainly most major review sites.

Often I find that even untried people who do simple reviews for the Codex do a much better job than the reviews I read at major sites. And it's not even bad writing skills or lack of a proper critical angle and that stuff, our reviews can suffer from that too. It's the most basic shit they fail at, getting simple facts wrong, not knowing two fucks about gaming history or the history of the franchise they're reviewing, swallowing current gaming paradigms without even thinking, not doing basic research on what they're writing about. Basic stuff everyone should do in the first place to be able to call themselves reviewers in the first place.

:(

Speaking of the Devil, Dexter brought these two articles to my attention:


I think they highlight well enough what we all find appalling.
 

As an Amazon Associate, rpgcodex.net earns from qualifying purchases.
Back
Top Bottom