KickStarter Grim Dawn

[deama]

I prefer POE's passive skill tree over Grim Dawn's.

 

[Renevent]

I haven't played PoE in a while, for me though I vastly prefer GD's "grind" over PoE. I never found any awesome loot in PoE while in GD it was balanced far more generously and with single players in mind. I've tried multiple times to get into PoE but never was able to get into the game. Item system was boring it felt like weapons and armor were merely shells designed to hold skills rather than epic artifacts with distinct character. GD's actual gameplay is better too, with the physics system and waaaaay better melee. Nothing against PoE though and I can see why people enjoy it.

What do you call "gameplay" here ? Better physics is nice but is mostly a gimmick without any real impact to actual gameplay. It affects the looks of the game but not how you play it. Show me where better "physics" in GD actually in a meaningful make its gameplay different or even superior to PoE ? Actual examples please. Don't get me wrong, I like when mobs when hit hard fly away in spectacular fashion and other fun effects like that but calling it "gameplay" ? Where the actual gameplay is in this genre is in my opinion in making/brainstorming builds and in that aspect actually PoE - arguably - has an advantage in variety over GD.
As to the fact that you need to grind more in PoE to get some items, it is technically true if you directly compare numbers of hours needed to grind if both games are played the same way. However, this is where the only major meaningful difference (in my opinion) between the 2 titles comes into play - they're not "meant" to be played the same way, so to speak. In PoE trading with other players is actually a crucial part of gameplay, an element absent in a game without dedicated servers like GD (otherwise you might as well cheat, same result). Whether one likes it or not, whether one finds it enjoyable or not is another matter but superiority of one over the other is in this case purely subjective.
In short: Comparing the 2 games directly in the only major area where they actually differ greatly from each other is in my opinion pointless. If one doesn't like the obligatory online element then sure, GD is "better" and vice versa but that's not an objective difference in quality but in types of entertainment offered.

Physics is not a gimmick, it directly impacts (har) how combat feels as well is an indicator of character power visually (ragdoll is effected by it). I think the melee combat in PoE is absolutely shit. I don't care about how either game is "meant to be played" and don't use it to determine which I find better. I don't find the online trading part even remotely fun, nor a feature.

Obviously this is all subjective, enjoy whatever game suits your tastes.

 

[Serus]

Physics is not a gimmick, it directly impacts (har) how combat feels as well is an indicator of character power visually (ragdoll is effected by it). I think the melee combat in PoE is absolutely shit. I don't care about how either game is "meant to be played" and don't use it to determine which I find better. I don't find the online trading part even remotely fun, nor a feature.

Obviously this is all subjective, enjoy whatever game suits your tastes.

Ok. Physics is not a "gimmick". Poor wording on my part. But you admitted yourself that it is a purely graphical element that doesn't impact HOW you play the game. As you wrote yourself, it only impacts "feels" and visuals. If physics in GD allowed to do things that you can't do in PoE then it would be a different story. If there were game mechanics based on the physics it would be a different story. But as it is now, from my experience only thing it does is adding "cool" factor. Which is nice but for a game that you might probably play dozens if not hundreds of hours, every "cool" element gets old sooner or later and in my opinion only the depth of mechanics (in case of arpg - ability to make different builds) is what matters long term. But that's also to some extent subjective I suppose.
You might not find on-line trading fun - and i understand it, believe me. Though myself I rather enjoy that aspect I also like playing arpg without this element, like Grim Dawn or Titan Quest or in the old days Diablo 2 with Median XL mod. However, in PoE, it is certainly a feature as I tried to explain. Even if you can play without it, the game is balanced around it. If you play without it, the game will be inevitably excessively grindy.

As to the rest, we are in agreement. In addition I enjoyed both Grim Dawn and PoE. I just think PoE has the potential to be enjoyed longer thanks to more varied options for possible builds. And more new content added over time.

 

[Renevent]

Physics is not a gimmick, it directly impacts (har) how combat feels as well is an indicator of character power visually (ragdoll is effected by it). I think the melee combat in PoE is absolutely shit. I don't care about how either game is "meant to be played" and don't use it to determine which I find better. I don't find the online trading part even remotely fun, nor a feature.

Obviously this is all subjective, enjoy whatever game suits your tastes.

Ok. Physics is not a "gimmick". Poor wording on my part. But you admitted yourself that it is a purely graphical element that doesn't impact HOW you play the game. As you wrote yourself, it only impacts "feels" and visuals. If physics in GD allowed to do things that you can't do in PoE then it would be a different story. If there were game mechanics based on the physics it would be a different story. But as it is now, from my experience only thing it does is adding "cool" factor. Which is nice but for a game that you might probably play dozens if not hundreds of hours, every "cool" element gets old sooner or later and in my opinion only the depth of mechanics (in case of arpg - ability to make different builds) is what matters long term. But that's also to some extent subjective I suppose.
You might not find on-line trading fun - and i understand it, believe me. Though myself I rather enjoy that aspect I also like playing arpg without this element, like Grim Dawn or Titan Quest or in the old days Diablo 2 with Median XL mod. However, in PoE, it is certainly a feature as I tried to explain. Even if you can play without it, the game is balanced around it. If you play without it, the game will be inevitably excessively grindy.

As to the rest, we are in agreement. In addition I enjoyed both Grim Dawn and PoE. I just think PoE has the potential to be enjoyed longer thanks to more varied options for possible builds. And more new content added over time.

Well I would say how a game visualizes something like combat is something more than just feels and visuals. Afterall, video games are a visual medium. No it doesn't increase build diversity but it does directly impact the enjoyment of combat which is a huge part of these games. Anyways I actually do understand why people like PoE and I do admire what a small team was able to accomplish. I just prefer Grim Dawn since I like the combat a lot more and I don't like having to rely on trading. If I was to be completely fair I would say PoE probably has greater build diversity and is a little more complicated than GD. That's not to say GD is a simple game, I think the there is a huge variety of builds, a beefy skill system, and it's item system is really well developed. It's also possible for someone like me, who isn't going to look up guides and figure out what I need to trade for (end game builds/items), and just play, find cool loot, and come up with builds from that. PoE grind without trading is as you said insanely grindy.

 

[luj1]

I haven't played PoE in a while, for me though I vastly prefer GD's "grind" over PoE.

I never found any awesome loot in PoE while in GD it was balanced far more generously and with single players in mind.

Played both games... PoE for 2.5 years and albeit it was fun in the beginning, you just hit a brick wall after a while. In hindsight, I'll gladly take GD now because it's SP-viable and self found-viable.

PoE is designed as an MMO with a strong focus on economy. I know some people who literally lost their minds (and lives) playing PoE because you need to commit unhealthily to trading and grinding currencies to get past the hurdles.

 

[Sykar]

I prefer POE's passive skill tree over Grim Dawn's.

You could trim down PoE skill tree by probably 50% and nothing of value would be lost.

 

[ArchAngel]

I haven't played PoE in a while, for me though I vastly prefer GD's "grind" over PoE.

I never found any awesome loot in PoE while in GD it was balanced far more generously and with single players in mind.

Played both games... PoE for 2.5 years and albeit it was fun in the beginning, you just hit a brick wall after a while. In hindsight, I'll gladly take GD now because it's SP-viable and self found-viable.

PoE is designed as an MMO with a strong focus on economy. I know some people who literally lost their minds (and lives) playing PoE because you need to commit unhealthily to trading and grinding currencies to get past the hurdles.

Nah. I play new PoE leagues about 3h per day during weekdays and 4-6h during weekends and in 3-4 weeks I am more than rich enough to do almost any content in the game. And I don't play efficient and I don't do any item flipping or market manipulation. I also don't party and as a result don't do content that requires party for maximum return of investment. I am nowhere near losing my mind. I spent more time doing one Underrail run than playing one PoE league.

 

[ArchAngel]

Physics is not a gimmick, it directly impacts (har) how combat feels as well is an indicator of character power visually (ragdoll is effected by it). I think the melee combat in PoE is absolutely shit. I don't care about how either game is "meant to be played" and don't use it to determine which I find better. I don't find the online trading part even remotely fun, nor a feature.

Obviously this is all subjective, enjoy whatever game suits your tastes.

Ok. Physics is not a "gimmick". Poor wording on my part. But you admitted yourself that it is a purely graphical element that doesn't impact HOW you play the game. As you wrote yourself, it only impacts "feels" and visuals. If physics in GD allowed to do things that you can't do in PoE then it would be a different story. If there were game mechanics based on the physics it would be a different story. But as it is now, from my experience only thing it does is adding "cool" factor. Which is nice but for a game that you might probably play dozens if not hundreds of hours, every "cool" element gets old sooner or later and in my opinion only the depth of mechanics (in case of arpg - ability to make different builds) is what matters long term. But that's also to some extent subjective I suppose.
You might not find on-line trading fun - and i understand it, believe me. Though myself I rather enjoy that aspect I also like playing arpg without this element, like Grim Dawn or Titan Quest or in the old days Diablo 2 with Median XL mod. However, in PoE, it is certainly a feature as I tried to explain. Even if you can play without it, the game is balanced around it. If you play without it, the game will be inevitably excessively grindy.

As to the rest, we are in agreement. In addition I enjoyed both Grim Dawn and PoE. I just think PoE has the potential to be enjoyed longer thanks to more varied options for possible builds. And more new content added over time.

Well I would say how a game visualizes something like combat is something more than just feels and visuals. Afterall, video games are a visual medium. No it doesn't increase build diversity but it does directly impact the enjoyment of combat which is a huge part of these games. Anyways I actually do understand why people like PoE and I do admire what a small team was able to accomplish. I just prefer Grim Dawn since I like the combat a lot more and I don't like having to rely on trading. If I was to be completely fair I would say PoE probably has greater build diversity and is a little more complicated than GD. That's not to say GD is a simple game, I think the there is a huge variety of builds, a beefy skill system, and it's item system is really well developed. It's also possible for someone like me, who isn't going to look up guides and figure out what I need to trade for (end game builds/items), and just play, find cool loot, and come up with builds from that. PoE grind without trading is as you said insanely grindy.

While melee combat in GD has way more UMPH! because of rag dolls and fair amount of blood, most ranged attacks and magical combat in GD is terrible compared to PoE. Animations are bad, variety is worse and it is very unsatisfying.
Diablo 2 had really good ranged and magic combat and PoE at least equalled that and went beyond in some areas. GD stopped half way to D2.

 

[DakaSha V]

It is true that GD has horrible ranged combat, and that PoE is better in that regard.

Still prefer GD

 

[Zakhad]

I like GD ranged. Gunslinger builds are fun.

 

[PorkBarrellGuy]

I like GD ranged. Gunslinger builds are fun.

Agreed, the problem tends to be that most ranged builds quickly turn into "melee" builds and people mistakenly think "Well, I'm ranged, I can afford to skimp a bit on tankiness!"

Hahahaha no. You'll get absolutely fucking creamed by Nemesis mobs if you go total glass cannon without some kind of effective damage mitigation tools. Going full offense is a great way to get your shit pushed in by Fabius/Iron Maiden/etc.

 

[Tito Anic]

Ranged is just fine for me. My char(Primal Strike build) annihilates everything in the blink of an eye:

 

[PorkBarrellGuy]

Ranged is just fine for me. My char(Primal Strike build) annihilates everything in the blink of an eye:

Jesus you think they made Ascended Epaulets render big enough on character models? You could get fucking lift with those things.

Also, I know you're only 41 but what are the affixes on that Cronley ring? Cronley rings are fucking nice.

 

[Tito Anic]

Jesus you think they made Ascended Epaulets render big enough on character models? You could get fucking lift with those things.

Also, I know you're only 41 but what are the affixes on that Cronley ring? Cronley rings are fucking nice.

It is nothing special, took it because of elemental damage and attack speed mods. - to boost Primal Strike.

 

[Renevent]

http://www.grimdawn.com/forums/showthread.php?t=75476

New update, most interesting is detailing the Shattered Realm portals which is the new game mode.

 

[Emmanuel2]

New update, most interesting is detailing the Shattered Realm portals which is the new game mode.

They finally added some kind of mapping system or from what I've read of Diablo 3, similar to their Greater Rifts. I guess this will finally be a test for builds as to who could push higher and faster.

 

[Mastermind]

If the 2nd expansion sells well enough, they'll even consider a 3rd xpac, which might be a bit too much. But it's the best ARPG on the market right now, and it ain't close.

Fallen Gods isn't coming till Fall / Q4, so either get it now, play it and enjoy it, then do it all over again for the xpac, or wait till the 2nd one comes and rip through it all.

You are right, it is not even close to Path of Exile in quality or popularity.

Well, in terms of quality GD is far ahead of PoE.

Depends what you're looking for. Both D3 and PoE run more smoothly and consistently than GD, which is embarrassing considering they're both always online games. D3 and to a lesser extent PoE are simpler but that's fine with me since i'm not looking into making a game a full time job right now. Admittedly GD is more hardcore as a result if that's your cup of tea. GD's character system is pretty interesting but it's actually inferior to Titan Quest. All the bad parts of the Titan Quest system are amplified (IE: the fucking mastery points, maxing out both masteries doesn't leave you with a whole lot of points for a decent build in GD). There are also too many fucking elements which also hurts cross-mastery synergy. Admittedly TQ also hurt it with the attribute damage boosts but GD has managed to just replace that with even worse features. OTOH I'm not a fan of PoE's gem skills or clusterfuck of a stat system, and Diablo 3 is way too simplistic on this front. So GD isn't the only one that falls well short of the Platonic Ideal of an ARPG (that would be Chronicon)

 

[Perkel]

Tried several classes so far and i am currently playing with Blademaster focused on dual blades and passives, got some nice helm with barbarian skill and stacked few passive attacks to proc a lot. I focus on speed for those procs. Only skill i use beside that is that NB movement skill. Playing on veteran. LVL about 20.

So far early game melee is fun as hell. I really missed proper melee after POE shitting bed few years ago with moster pack size patch.
My only gripe so far is that i can't see anything interesting from system perspective. I got that helm with barbarian skill and this is pretty much only interesting skill i got. Overall despite choosing Blademaster class i feel limited a lot by classes.

Maybe it is just early game but i don't see how i can change a lot my build with items.
Either way i will keep playing it.
Itemization so far is fun, though i am yet to find interesting unique. I got some schematic for Travellers pants but they look meh as fuck.

Other class i tried was Necro. It was fun and my units AI was actually quite decent. I also liked how adding lvl to my skeletons changed how they look and behave.

Questions:

Will skeletons past max lvl change (with items to skill) ?
I mean it would be cool to have 16 max skill with tree which gives you those black skeleton warriors and then take 4 point up to 20 and get some uber skeleton lords or Liche or something.

Are there other skills that change like that with levels ?

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made some reshade because i didn't like standard washed out look of GD. It looked like D3 to me and back then i used also reshade to "fix" it at release and frankly considering it is "grim" dawn it didn't really feel like "grim" dawn.

MEGA

Instruction:
- copy contents to GD folder
- either set launch option in steam or make new shortcut and add /d3d9 at the end of it.
- play game, you can switch on/off with "End" button

Features:
- removed a lot of yellow banding present in game.
- desaturated a bit and reduced a bit gamma.
- slightly sharpened up because GD by default has pretty crappy post processing filter that makes everything blurry
- added slight experimental glow effect to extra bright objects. You can see it on rift gate in screenshots.
- added a notch of chromatic aberration to "smooth out" hard edges, though nothing crazy like some devs love to do


Comparison:

 

[Tito Anic]

Will skeletons past max lvl change (with items to skill) ?

I think so.

 

[Renevent]

There is also a chance on every summon to instead summon an elite skeleton. That one will be decked out in heavy armor with a nice weapon/shield and do more damage.

 

[MiX]

There are four types of skeletons:

Normal
Crossbow
Mage
Revenant

Going past 16 points in the skill will change the chances of which skeletons you get slightly but will not get you a new type of skeleton

 

[agentorange]

Been playing it for the past day and am enjoying it. The only other Diablo-like that I like is Diablo 1, and this is like the Diablo 2 that I wanted. I made a Demolitionist, and am focusing on firestrike + bombs. At first I couldn't figure out why anyone would use one handed guns over two-handed since the damage is so much lower and it seemed like I wasn't able to dual wield one handed guns, but apparently there is an item that lets you do that. I already took one of the skills focused on two-handed guns though so I suppose I will stick with rifles. The soundtrack is also really good.

 

[Perkel]

Yeah it definitely feels like D2/1. Though i wish i could change fonts and color coding, they look fucking gross.

 

[DakaSha V]

Neither diablo 2 nor this feels like diablo 1, nerds

 

[ArchAngel]

Neither diablo 2 nor this feels like diablo 1, nerds

Well GD feels more like D1 than D2 did. But PoE feels more like D2 than GD does.