Hearthstone

[Zed]

The body is relevant though because it will clear a minion the next turn, thus effectively healing you further in the long term. After you recover 8 HP on turn 5, the Hunter likely won't be killing you Turn 6 unless you were AFK for the first 4 turns. Having a huge heal is more important vs a deck like Freeze Mage, but you aren't necessarily going to win that joust (high chance they pull an alex or something)

I should've been more clear on my curve point - I was preemptively explaining why this card being cheaper than healbot doesn't matter (not saying that's an issue you brought up)

The way I see this is

Healbot:
+ Always heals 8
+ Always leaves a 3/3 body which will likely effectively heal another ~3
+ Better in more matchups

Healing Wave
+ Can heal more versus one specific matchup (about 60% chance)
+ Is cheaper
- 40% chance it heals less than healbot and leaves no body
- Will usually just Heal 7 for a card against everyone else


(note: my joust percentages may be off. I was using the Mid Hunter stats from this chart https://www.reddit.com/r/CompetitiveHS/comments/3fwffh/joust_odds/ since Midrange Hunter has a comparable mana curve to Midrange Shaman, presuming you're playing the version with flametongues, creepers, mana tide, etc)

I don't really see why you'd run this card over healbot tbh.

it can heal a minion too. not that shamans really have any minions worth healing for 7 or 14. still.

 

[Metro]

Yes, they reveal a card from the deck.

The clue will be useless 99% of the time.

Yeah, the reveal in itself is pretty worthless. You can usually figure out the type of deck your playing within two turns.

 

[Phage]

If it revealed a card from hand Joust might actually be more viable since you'd have much more control over it.

Cards like healing wave bring me back to my MTG days pretty hard. There was a time when Wizards was printing some insanely powerful healing cards: we're talking, 2 mana, gain 7 life (out of 20 life, and you can go above your starting life in MTG) at instant speed (meaning you can play it during your opponent's turn) and it still only saw extremely marginal play in sideboards, brought in only against Red Deck Wins (MTG's face hunter).

The problem will always be that these cards are just complete trash against midrange and control decks. Especially since Healing Wave has to win a joust against those decks (ties = loss) in order to have the huge effect.

That said, people will play it - the reddit masses are already going apeshit over this card, and the Grinolfs of the world will appear out of nowhere and scream at me that they did. Doesn't change the fact that the card is bad, and after the pros tune their decks fully in October and everyone else copies them, Healing Wave will be quietly forgotten.

None of these Joust cards are particularly good enough aside from the Paladin 5/5 - and I dunno if he even makes it in (Midrange Paladin already has Quartermaster, Belcher, Loatheb, Harrison Jones and Healbot all as viable 5 drops)

The problem is the most of the time the payoff for wining the joust doesn't offset the chance of losing it.

 

[Cowboy Moment]

It doesn't increase over time - it increases at the mulligan (or decreases), pretty much like you said.

If X-deck get their minions to play on curve, they've dramatically increased their odds of winning the Joust vs. a face-deck.

You get two chances to land that curve. Comparing decks straight across the board makes no sense because it doesn't account for when these minions are being played. You can't equivocate 20 low-cost huntard minions with 4 low-cost minions in another deck, because the player in the latter deck will be trying to put them in their hand at the start and if that happens - which again, they have two shots at - then their odds for winning the Joust skyrockets well beyond what some baseline percentages would show. At the same time, Handlock has many large minions, but the player will be taking mulligans to have them in hand (I'm only going off of what legendary players do and show in their deck guides). So at a glance you could say, wow, the Warlock deck has an X-% chance to win those Jousts, except a large chunk of that percentage is actually lost in the player's attempt to put their biggest 'jousters' in hand.

Basically, I think the whole Jousting mechanic is going to bean facedecks upside the head and line-to-line comparisons between decks does not account for what minions each player wants in their starting hand. As the reddit post says: This is assuming both players have their entire deck unused. I think the Joust cards will be meh against a lot of decks, particularly since tying does nothing for you, but I really do think they will be smashing facedecks pretty badly and that the percentages vs. those decks are much worse (or better?) than they appear.

The mulligan only affects 3-4 cards though, and only in a roundabout fashion - you only get to pick what you don't want, not what you get as a replacement. I haven't actually done the maths, but intuitively, it doesn't seem like a significant difference.

 

[Andhaira]

Yes, they reveal a card from the deck.

The clue will be useless 99% of the time.

Dang you are right, here I was thinking Joust revealed a card each from Hand. This makes it even shittier

 

[Andhaira]

Holy Knight
3 Mana
4 Attack
3 Health

Effect:

">Battlecry: Silence a demon.

I was hoping for anti demon mechanics, but only for Paladin class, not for neutral cards.

Still, it's better than Scarlet Purifier; same stats but a much more useful battlecry. Mal'ganis! Justice Demands Retribution!

 

[Phage]

I wouldn't necessarily say it's better than Scarlet Purifier - SP flat out deals damage to a much larger number of targets.

Ultimately this card just isn't going to be used in constructed. It only targets a single deck out of 9, and it's a 4/3, which is okay, but not great since it'll trade with many 2 drops (and flame imp/cogmaster)

 

[Andhaira]

I wouldn't necessarily say it's better than Scarlet Purifier - SP flat out deals damage to a much larger number of targets.

Ultimately this card just isn't going to be used in constructed. It only targets a single deck out of 9, and it's a 4/3, which is okay, but not great since it'll trade with many 2 drops (and flame imp/cogmaster)

It will be good in arena though with the current Warlock domination there. This can take care of Imp Gang Bawss, VoidCaller and Voidterror, which each can really screw you over in arena.

 

[Andhaira]

Euro cucks, I hear this brawl is a repeat of a previous brawl.

 

[WhiteGuts]

Yeah, the Great Summoner brawl, my favorite.

 

[FeelTheRads]

Yeah, the Great Summoner brawl, my favorite.

Priest brofists this.

 

[Jozoz]

Warlock will probably keep being one of the most popular classes forever with that ridiculous hero power.

 

[WhiteGuts]

I'm playing mage I'm laughing ass off at the RNG

 

[Jozoz]

 

[Brotherman Bill]

p cool cards

 

[UglyBastard]

Varian is pretty sweet. Excellent finisher, will craft.

Rhonin is kinda eh, would make way more sense as a battlecry. He gives Antonidas and Flamewaker fodder, but is too slow for Tempo Mage. Freeze doesn't need him. It has decent value but I don't know where it would fit and be better than an existing option. Is he better than Boom in Tempo? I doubt it. Still not gonna write him off, 3 Missiles is decent. Maybe as an additional late game card besides Boom and Antonidas or in an ominous Control Mage deck.

Ram Wrangler is just retarded. This card will ruin so many games. Fuck this shit, seriously.

 

[Andhaira]

This is what I got from my brawl pack

Spoiler

She has been on my list of legends, like for most other ppl who don't have her yet I guess, so a very pleasant surprise. Also long overdue, haven't pulled a legend in a while. The last I pulled was a duplicate of one I already had, Illidian. Still wish this had been a Thalnos though, I want to complete my ultimate mage deck asap.

Varian is incredible. Really expensive, but that value! Unfortunately all warrior decks have plenty of spell cards in their decks, but even then it kinda gives you free draw and replenishes your hand.

Rhonin is unfortunate. It's not Flame Leviathan but come on MEN. If his ability was a Battlecry it could have synergy with Antonidas, Flame Walker and Malygos. With it being a Deathrattle it's worthless. And it's 8 mana too.

I guess Anotindas is so awesome they feel compelled to fuck Jaina over with shit legends.

 

[UglyBastard]

Rhonin is not worthless, it's a good card. The question is just if it is good enough. Deathrattle is not THAT huge of a problem, if your enemy doesn't remove him, he does 7 damage. The missiles are actually dangerous with spellpower or flamewaker.
The more I think about it, the more I would say it's a decently designed card that can be quite good in the right circumstances.

THIS bullshit on the other hand. I can't get over this. HOW SHITTY AND LAZY CAN YOUR DESIGN GET? Good old coinflip instagg cards.

I CANNOT WAIT FOR SOMEONE TO RAMWRANGLE A HIGHMANE FOR 100K $$ IN BLIZZCON FINALS! ESPORTS HYPE!

 

[Cowboy Moment]

The real question here as far as Constructed is concerned is whether Varian is better than Ysera for Control Warrior. Kinda hard to tell, to be honest. Ysera is played because she's difficult to kill and generates value without moving you closer to fatigue. Varian, on the other hand, is more like Dr. Boom, in that you get an immediate, powerful effect. Sure, he dies to BGH and SWD, but tons of minions Control Warrior plays do, and his ability to put stuff on the board can be useful against Aggro and Midrange, against which Ysera is more of a win more card. There's the fatigue factor, as he actually pulls cards from your deck, and also the potential to pull minions you'd like to use battlecries of, like Alex or Shieldmaidens.

In a fast meta, you'd play neither, but otherwise I don't think there's a clear winner here.

 

[Grinolf]

So Blizzard continues it's tradition of saving best cards for the end. Not sure why they are doing it, as one would thing that it better do the other way and announcing their expansion with Varian instead of Lowly Squire would boosts preorders significantly...

Is he better than Boom in Tempo? I doubt it.

I thing more fair comparison is Toshley, as the do a similiar thing. And I don't know which on is better.
Rhonin: Missiles better than most spare parts (except one in specific case) and you get 3 of them.
Toshley: Far better stats, you get one card right away, much faster, and possibility to get stealth for Antonidas.
So they look very close to me. And since Toshley is more of a flavor card and aren't seen that often, I don't think Ronnin would be different in that regard.

 

[UglyBastard]

I compared him to Boom because his position on the mana curve and not because of his effect. Antonidas is a given in this deck and the other curve topper is Dr. Boom. You won't play a 3rd huge finisher in aggressive Tempo Mage, so comparing him to Boom seems fair because he occupies the same card slot.

 

[Metro]

Both cards are good in isolation although Rhonin seems likely to fit into current decks. Varian could screw you in control warrior putting battlecry cards into play.

 

[UglyBastard]

You probably adjust your minion base with Varian in CW, for example playing Rag or Ysera alongside him instead of Alex.

 

[Grinolf]

You won't play a 3rd huge finisher in aggressive Tempo Mage, so comparing him to Boom seems fair because he occupies the same card slot.

I'm pretty sure that there are more slower versions of the deck that run 3rd huge finisher like Ragnaros, so lack of late game slots shouldn't be a problem.

 

[Andhaira]

Rhonin is not worthless, it's a good card. The question is just if it is good enough. Deathrattle is not THAT huge of a problem, if your enemy doesn't remove him, he does 7 damage. The missiles are actually dangerous with spellpower or flamewaker.
The more I think about it, the more I would say it's a decently designed card that can be quite good in the right circumstances.

THIS bullshit on the other hand. I can't get over this. HOW SHITTY AND LAZY CAN YOUR DESIGN GET? Good old coinflip instagg cards.

I CANNOT WAIT FOR SOMEONE TO RAMWRANGLE A HIGHMANE FOR 100K $$ IN BLIZZCON FINALS! ESPORTS HYPE!

Well I didn't mean totally worthless, but Battlecry effect would make it so much better. It would actually see play. Deathrattle is too easily dealt with via silence, polymoph or Hex. And if you are playing against a mage who plays this card you know right away you really shouldn't allow the rattle to activate, because Antonidas + 3 arcane missiles will be coming out next. (or flamewalkers)

Yeah Ram Wrangler...it could even pull a Malorne or Gahz'rilla.