Game News Kickstarter Drama: Conquistador, Shadowrun and Eisenwald

[Charles-cgr]

I'm going to enjoy the inevitable Antharion rage. That's supposed to be out in July.

Paper Sorcerer was supposed to be out in August 2012. There's a beta out and intro videos being worked on. Updates are eratic to say the least.

Antharion, however, publishes updates on the 25th of each month and they're looking quite solid. I don't expect problems from them but could of course be wrong.

 

[evdk]

So. the only thing the Steam Free version doesn't get is future DLC?

why all the butthurt? When the Kickstarter was announced, future DLC wasn't even a part of the plan.

The editor.

If somebody makes a module using any of the DLC assets the owners of the DRM free versions will not be able to play it - there is even a clarification in the part of the update I didn't qote that states that due to the legal situation it will not be possible to use even legally purchased steam DLC in the DRM free version of the game.

 

[Excidium]

Why not present a proper budget for a core game and then upgrades showing proper and realistic estimates for extra features, instead of asking for x amount of dollars and hoping to get 3 times more and then attaching random amounts to different features?

Fuck if I know. Poor planning? Dishonesty? Hoping to get more money by being vague which actually seems to work, at least if you're a big name?

Thinking that if a publisher isn't involved and the scope small, they can work on pure creativity?

Perhaps good managers should be doing Kickstarters instead of the developers?

Maybe that's what makes Fargo attractive to doners, he comes across as a guy who can balance business and creativity.

Nah, it's more of a matter of name-dropping famous titles and having experienced developers involved. People donating to kickstarter usually don't put more thought into it than "SHUT UP AND TAKE MY MONEY".

 

[Curious_Tongue]

Especially if they retain full ownership of their game and can profit from the subsequent post-release sales increasing their income even further.

Post-release sales can be big income with digital distribution. Even if sales are considered poor post-release, that's still decent money for an independent studio.

Tim Schafer secured the rights to Psychonauts and BGaE I heard, and he said the income from those games was way more than he ever expected.

 

[evdk]

Schafer has rights to BGaE? He did not work on that, did he.

 

[tuluse]

Pretty shady for SRR to have limitations on what they could do with their license and not disclose it to their backers until so much later.

The problems with the upwell of kickstarter games is probably going to get worse. Some game developers shouldn't have been allowed to get games off the ground.

If people knew the license specified DRM would it really have changed contributions that much?

 

[Infinitron]

Huh? Beyond Good and Evil is 100% Ubisoft. Do you mean Brutal Legend?

 

[Excidium]

Pretty shady for SRR to have limitations on what they could do with their license and not disclose it to their backers until so much later.

The problems with the upwell of kickstarter games is probably going to get worse. Some game developers shouldn't have been allowed to get games off the ground.

If people knew the license specified DRM would it really have changed contributions that much?

Who knows? If people knew how watered down the game features will be, would they donate?

The point is they should be more clear about their limitations since the beginning.

 

[Jaesun]

Yeah I just checked. UBI owns Beyond Good and Evil. Tim does own Psychonauts though.

 

[Rivmusique]

When one of the KS's I have backed pulls some dodgy shit, I wonder how upset I will be? Can not wait to find out, Obsidian.

 

[Curious_Tongue]

Schafer has rights to BGaE? He did not work on that, did he.

Huh? Beyond Good and Evil is 100% Ubisoft. Do you mean Brutal Legend?

Yeah I just checked. UBI owns Beyond Good and Evil. Tim does own Psychonauts though.

Jaesun cleared that up for me. My mistake.

 

[Jaesun]

I would assume HBS approached M$ later after the KS and then learned of the DRM requirement. But yeah, they should have communicated that earlier. I personally don't give a shit as I will be using the STEAM version anyways.

 

[Curious_Tongue]

http://wegotthiscovered.com/gaming/double-fine-productions-confirmed-interested-bidder-thq-assets/

He even tried to secure costume quest. Not even on the radar to the big boys picking at THQ's, but possibly a very good investment for a small studio.

 

[almondblight]

About as interesting as you characterizing the differences to fit your argument. But by all means keep whining about it.

What's amusing is the only reasons you gave for why Banner Saga should not be included:

The F2P game is the same fucking game mechanically speaking and the single player game is still getting released.

...applies to all the games here. But please, continue with your "It's different! Because it's...different!" arguments.

 

[Kosmonaut]

Oh, so there goes another sumbarine/backalley deal 'tween a publisher/IP owner and an Kickstarter project.

It seems that you aren't the only backstabbing, liar, scamming developer Avonaeon .

 

[AC Sleighter]

So. the only thing the Steam Free version doesn't get is future DLC?

why all the butthurt? When the Kickstarter was announced, future DLC wasn't even a part of the plan.

The editor.

If somebody makes a module using any of the DLC assets the owners of the DRM free versions will not be able to play it - there is even a clarification in the part of the update I didn't qote that states that due to the legal situation it will not be possible to use even legally purchased steam DLC in the DRM free version of the game.

So when this future content comes out (possibly) at some point in the future (if HBS makes enough money commercially from Shadowrun Returns), the non-steam version won't be able to buy said DLC and use it in other people's created content.

The Berlin campaign of course hasn't even been started to be worked on yet, however, so who knows how far off this DLC might be (if it ever comes).

In the meantime, Shadowrun Returns is perfectly playable Steam Free. The editor is perfectly usable Steam-Free and people's missions are completely playable Steam-Free. When Berlin is released that is also perfectly playable Steam-Free.

If the game becomes successful enough that they make future DLC for it, those backers that have the Steam-Free version can still switch to the Steam version free of charge and purchase the DLC if they want.

Sounds to me like everything promised in the Kickstarter is being delivered and they are releasing it surprisingly quickly. If they are commercially successful beyond the Kickstarter, their future projects aren't going to be DRM free and people are already butthurt about that.

 

[Irenaeus]

Lol, I have backed 47 games in kickstarter (among 18 other projects), but none of these three (though I intend to play them all eventually). I guess I have a kickstarter rabbit foot. :D

 

[evdk]

So when this future content comes out (possibly) at some point in the future (if HBS makes enough money commercially from Shadowrun Returns), the non-steam version won't be able to buy said DLC and use it in other people's created content.

The Berlin campaign of course hasn't even been started to be worked on yet, however, so who knows how far off this DLC might be (if it ever comes).

In the meantime, Shadowrun Returns is perfectly playable Steam Free. The editor is perfectly usable Steam-Free and people's missions are completely playable Steam-Free. When Berlin is released that is also perfectly playable Steam-Free.

If the game becomes successful enough that they make future DLC for it, those backers that have the Steam-Free version can still switch to the Steam version free of charge and purchase the DLC if they want.

Sounds to me like everything promised in the Kickstarter is being delivered and they are releasing it surprisingly quickly. If they are commercially successful beyond the Kickstarter, their future projects aren't going to be DRM free and people are already butthurt about that.

For good or ill.

 

[TalesfromtheCrypt]

I'm as anti-DRM as you can get, but I don't really see the problem with Shadowrun Returns. After all, all backers get a DRM-free version AND a steam-key, they don't have to choose. The DRM free version will only be missing out on DLCs. DLCs are as much decline as is DRM, so if you are a fan of DLC-decline you might as well just give into your urges, install the steam version and be done with it.

They promised a DRM-free version for all backers and they are delivering it, I don't see any deceit. Move on, nothing to see here.

 

[~RAGING BONER~]

it seems like the true Renaissance hinges on the successes of Fargo and Feargus...

oh god, please, have we not endured enough during these long years of the AAApocalypse?

 

[Brayko]

I'm as anti-DRM as you can get, but I don't really see the problem with Shadowrun Returns. After all, all backers get a DRM-free version AND a steam-key, they don't have to choose. The DRM free version will only be missing out on DLCs. DLCs are as much decline as is DRM, so if you are a fan of DLC-decline you might as well just give into your urges, install the steam version and be done with it.

They promised a DRM-free version for all backers and they are delivering it, I don't see any deceit. Move on, nothing to see here.

Yes but "DRM-free" was flaunted all over the pledge tiers so it is kind of misleading. Despite the fact that I also consider DLC pretty decline (though not so much DRM), I don't think such things should be over-looked or sugar coated.

 

[Curious_Tongue]

I'm as anti-DRM as you can get, but I don't really see the problem with Shadowrun Returns. After all, all backers get a DRM-free version AND a steam-key, they don't have to choose. The DRM free version will only be missing out on DLCs. DLCs are as much decline as is DRM, so if you are a fan of DLC-decline you might as well just give into your urges, install the steam version and be done with it.

They promised a DRM-free version for all backers and they are delivering it, I don't see any deceit. Move on, nothing to see here.

It seems unnecessarily complicated, and not the best way to release a crowdfunded game. They're treating it like a subscription service, trying milk money out of a game funded by backers who may have been interested in much more than the promise of a finished product, but a reversal of the rot that has infected gaming.

Ask for money, make the best game you can with that money, release it on the platforms that people want it to be released on and have faith in the many people who will buy the game legitimately instead of focusing on those who might pirate it. Seems simple enough.

 

[FeelTheRads]

Maybe that's what makes Fargo attractive to doners, he comes across as a guy who can balance business and creativity.

And yet apparently they spent "too much" on rewards, whatever the hell that means.

Perhaps good managers should be doing Kickstarters instead of the developers?

Yeah, well, I don't know. Don't really like that idea either (we're getting to market driven games again) and not everybody can afford to hire managers. Guess it will remain a risky game based only on trust to donate.

 

[Wizfall]

Infinitron obviously doesn't like Shadowrun.
Despite not behaving honestly about the DLC issue, HBS has respected all their obligations.
The supposed lack of core features never promised and not core at all is is quite ridiculous or at least very subjective.
I'm unhappy about the last update but misleading people about this project and comparing it with the 2 others kickstaters is dishonest.

 

[FeelTheRads]

lack of core features never promised

So these days you have to promise save games? Well, it's worse than I thought.